Bolivian Could Be a 'Nightmare' for U.S.

Moderators: Elvis, DrVolin, Jeff

Bolivian Could Be a 'Nightmare' for U.S.

Postby nomo » Mon Dec 12, 2005 6:55 pm

Bolivian Could Be a 'Nightmare' for U.S.<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-5474749,00.html">www.guardian.co.uk/worldl...49,00.html</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>Monday December 12, 2005 8:16 PM<br>By FIONA SMITH<br>Associated Press Writer<br><br>CARACOLLO, Bolivia (AP) - As a little boy in Bolivia's bleak highlands, Evo Morales used to run behind buses to pick up the orange skins and banana peels passengers threw out the windows. Sometimes, he says, it was all he had to eat. Now, holding the lead ahead of Sunday's presidential election, he's threatening to be ``a nightmare for the government of the United States.''<br><br>It's not hard to see why. The 46-year-old candidate is a staunch leftist who counts Cuba's Fidel Castro and Venezuela's Hugo Chavez among his close friends. Moreover, he's a coca farmer, promising to reverse the U.S.-backed campaign to stamp out production of the leaf that is used to make cocaine.<br><br>With his Aymara Indian blood and a hatred for the free-market doctrines known to Latin Americans as neo-liberalism, Morales in power would not only shake up Bolivia's political elite, but strengthen the leftward tide rippling across South America.<br><br>``Something historic is happening in Bolivia,'' Morales told The Associated Press in an interview. ``The most scorned, hated, humiliated sector now has the capacity to organize.''<br><br>At a recent campaign stop in the western highland town of Caracollo, Morales and members of his Movement Toward Socialism party were mobbed by crowds who kissed them, showered them with confetti and draped necklaces of flowers and fruit around their necks.<br><br>The Movement Toward Socialism ``represents not only hope for the Bolivian people, but also a nightmare for the government of the United States,'' Morales told the supporters.<br><br>``I have no fear in saying - and saying loudly - that we're not just anti-neo-liberal, we're anti-imperialist in our blood.''<br><br>Morales, whose leather key chain sports a portrait of communist revolutionary Che Guevara, has already been involved in toppling two presidents, has come close to winning the presidency once before, and is now running strong against conservative former President Jorge Quiroga and several other candidates. If no one wins an outright majority on Sunday, Congress will choose between the top two vote-getters in mid-January.<br><br>The latest poll by Ipsos-Captura shows Morales with 32.8 percent, five percentage points above Quiroga, and gives a margin of error of two percentage points.<br><br>``Symbolically, he would represent a fundamental change,'' said Jimena Costa, a political science professor at Bolivia's Universidad Mayor de San Andres. ``It's not just the first time an Indian would win the presidential elections, but he would be doing it with the support of a sector of the white and mestizo community and urban populations.''<br><br>Morales has been a problem for Washington since he rose to prominence in the 1990s as the leader of the cocaleros, or coca farmers, in Bolivia's tropical Chapare region, leading their often violent resistance to U.S.-backed coca eradication efforts.<br><br>While the U.S. government insists that much of the Chapare's coca becomes cocaine, farmers say they supply a legal market. Coca leaves are sold in supermarkets and can be chewed, brewed for tea, and used in religious ceremonies.<br><br>During the last presidential election, then U.S. Ambassador Manuel Rocha criticized Morales, only to see him shoot up in the polls. This time Washington has kept silent, though a statement two weeks ago by the present ambassador, David Greenlee, urging Bolivia not to change course on coca, was widely interpreted as a jab at Morales.<br><br>``I hope there aren't changes, because if there are changes for the worse, the country that's going to suffer is Bolivia,'' Greenlee told anti-drug rally in El Alto, a slum city next to La Paz.<br><br>Morales, more comfortable in black Wrangler jeans and sneakers than suit and tie, still maintains coca fields and pledges an international campaign to legalize the leaf and industrialize its production. He insists he will fight drug trafficking, but maintains that the plant has been wrongly maligned in the world's mind.<br><br>As a boy, Morales' family struggled to survive. Of seven children, Evo was among only three who made it past infancy. He helped herd the family's llamas and harvest their potatoes, played trumpet in a traveling band and dropped out of high school. When he was 19 the family joined the highland migration to low-lying Chapare in the southeast. There he became a cocalero and in 1993 was elected president of the local coca farmers' federation.<br><br>Meanwhile, the nation of 8.5 million was emerging from decades of coups and dictatorships and joining the spread of democracy across the continent. Morales founded the Movement Toward Socialism in 1995, was later elected to congress, and in 2002 narrowly lost the presidential race to Gonzalo Sanchez de Lozada.<br><br>The free market policies that have failed to pull Bolivians out of poverty, coupled with the conflict over how best to exploit the continent's second largest natural gas reserves, has empowered the country's poor Indians to demand change. Morales became an important figure in waves of protest that brought down Sanchez de Lozada in 2003 and his successor, Carlos Mesa, in June. <p></p><i></i>
User avatar
nomo
 
Posts: 3388
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2005 1:48 pm
Location: New York City
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Bolivian Could Be a 'Nightmare' for U.S.

Postby marykmusic » Mon Dec 12, 2005 7:00 pm

I've been to Bolivia, and have seen the market days in the small town of Arquipa. Everybody chews coca leaves and they are a primary part of their culture and lifestyle.<br><br>In the old legend, Mannco-Kopec was the god who took pity on the people because their work was so hard and the high-altitude air so low on oxygen. He gave them coca, to help them to have the energy to do what had to be done. <br><br>It is certainly not a recreational drug for them! --MaryK <p></p><i></i>
marykmusic
 
Posts: 1502
Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 12:23 am
Location: Central Arizona
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Chewing coca leaves.

Postby Hugh Manatee Wins » Mon Dec 12, 2005 8:12 pm

Instead of chewing coca leaves, most over-worked and sleep-deprived Americans live on caffeine from Starbucks and 1 in 5 smoke tobacco.<br><br>Not much difference. Coca leaves are very mild, nothing like cocaine or crack. Probably more like the stimulant effect of caffeine or nicotine.<br><br>We primates love our stimulants and depressents. Always will.<br>That's why the CIA has a permanent black budget from controlling the drug supply coming into the US.<br><br>There is a horrible fungus being used by the American 'drug warriors' as a bioweapon to wipe out some coca crops but is dangerous to other crops and humans with weakened immunity systems which is many of the poor farmers. Typical.<br><br>This is probably to keep production down to keep coke prices up since there is a glut coming north. Pentagon/CIA just wipes out their drug smuggling competition and calls that 'enforcement' as a cover story.<br><br>A photojournalist named Jeremy Bigwood who was in El Salvador in the 80s found out the CIA was looking at his photos submitted for publishing and began to learn quite alot about the so-called war on drugs meshed with US counterinsurgency support for Central and South American dictatorships.<br><br>He also filed many FOIA requests, some of which produced results.<br><br>Check out <!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://jeremybigwood.net/FOIAs/FOIA.htm">jeremybigwood.net/FOIAs/FOIA.htm</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>There is also documentation of the CIA-NED working against Hugo Chavez in Venezuela.<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.venezuelafoia.info/english.html">www.venezuelafoia.info/english.html</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.vcrisis.com/index-USAID2.html">www.vcrisis.com/index-USAID2.html</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--> <p></p><i></i>
User avatar
Hugh Manatee Wins
 
Posts: 9869
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2005 6:51 pm
Location: in context
Blog: View Blog (0)

Bolivia

Postby robertdreed » Mon Dec 12, 2005 10:44 pm

Whether Evo Morales realizes it or not, there's no way a nation can officially organize its economy around an illegal commodity. He was better off as the head of the coca grower's union. <br><br>I think coca leaves ought to be legal, myself, as long as they're packaged and sold in carefully controlled quantities. <br><br>But as of this moment, it's an illegal crop. <br><br>That means that from Capitol Hill to the UN, Morales is bound to be set up as a dope peddler, and his administration as a "narcostate"- a Left-socialist one, at that. In other words, a dream come true for the "drug warriors", and the Right Wing.<br><br>Morales thinks that he's going to be a nightmare for the USA. The USA is going to be a nightmare for him- or, at any rate, for the nation of Bolivia. <br><br> <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=robertdreed>robertdreed</A> at: 12/12/05 7:52 pm<br></i>
robertdreed
 
Posts: 1560
Joined: Wed May 18, 2005 11:14 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

As long as they don't make Coca Cola...

Postby banned » Mon Dec 12, 2005 10:58 pm

...illegal. I'm so addicted it isn't funny. I've always thought it's the infinitesimal traces of coca leaves they use for flavor. <p></p><i></i>
banned
 
Posts: 912
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2005 5:18 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Socialist running in Chile too

Postby lilorphant » Tue Dec 13, 2005 12:58 am

<!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/news/13386320.htm">www.miami.com/mld/miamihe...386320.htm</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>I tend to think the swing toward socialism worldwide is a backlash effect, fears that Bush's brand of neocapitalism, Laissez-faire, trickle down economics. I wonder why Milton Freedman never accomodated for the social implications of capitalism? Unfettered and unregulated capitalism tends to result in such things as revolution, riots, terror, and beheadings. <p></p><i></i>
lilorphant
 
Posts: 105
Joined: Thu May 19, 2005 11:23 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Socialist running in Chile too

Postby scollon » Tue Dec 13, 2005 2:47 am

"I tend to think the swing toward socialism worldwide "<br><br>Only in South America as far as I am aware. Friedman/Thatcher/Reagan/Bush/Neoliberals/Neocons don't care about negative social consequences. Socialism was eradicated by force before and will be again. People are literally for sale, you just have to pay the right ones.<br><br>There was even a left wing in the United States at one time but enough workers were hired and armed to put the rest in their place. <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=scollon>scollon</A> at: 12/12/05 11:50 pm<br></i>
scollon
 
Posts: 355
Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2005 4:45 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Socialist running in Chile too

Postby Sepka » Tue Dec 13, 2005 2:52 am

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>I tend to think the swing toward socialism worldwide<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Europe seems to be moving steadily rightward.<br><br>-Sepka the Space Weasel <p></p><i></i>
User avatar
Sepka
 
Posts: 1983
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2005 2:56 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Socialist running in Chile too

Postby scollon » Tue Dec 13, 2005 2:58 am

"Europe seems to be moving steadily rightward"<br><br>Yes under the leadership of Reichsfuehrer Blair, the (supposed) Fabian Socialist. <p></p><i></i>
scollon
 
Posts: 355
Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2005 4:45 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Morales and his options

Postby firstimer » Tue Dec 13, 2005 6:52 pm

I think you assume/propose Morales would center Bolivia's economy on Coca. I think you have it wrong. That is where he comes from, and it is unquestionably their greatest actual export, but these new socialists in SA are smarter than that. Look for the Natural gas to drive their economy for the next decade as LNG facilities pop up along Pac. Coast USA. Here is the ace in the hole. I bet he will trade natural gas access to the US for exclusive rights to supply coca to a newly legitmized softdrink/tea market in the US.<br><br>He could simultaneously get out of the negative relationship with the US by supplying a legal coca to take the wind out of the largest illegal drug market in revenue (cocaine) in the US<br><br>BTW the Nat Gas shortage in the US is much bigger than the Oil shortage, especially in California. Calpine (who is going under) has leveraged itself to the hilt building environmentally safer natural gas turbine and co-generation plants. The price of Nat Gas rose higher than the threshold of their debt limit and they had to sell off alot of U.S. and Canadian wells. (whice were supposed to vertically integrate energy production and and Energy extraction in the most modern fleet of power generators and electronic trading/managment infrastructure the world has ever seen) BTW they had little or no involvement in the California energy crisis/scam, but they got thrown out with the bathwater for Bush's coal and oil burning buddies who gambled that they wouldn't have to follow the Clean Air act after Bush got elected. Cheney saw to it with the Energy task force which wasn't only about oil and Iraq, you know.<br><br>So now they are about to get picked apart, but if LNG works out on the West coast and CA sticks to its State Laws to encourage gas over oil look for somebody to win big with those brand spankin new gas generators, and the LNG. <br><br>The smartest one was Buffet, he bought up all of the pipes and wires (oil, gas, and transmission wires) from the power producers as they went bankrupt.<br><br>Here's my guess, if the Bush Tragedy is almost over, Fresh Smart ideas Like Calpine's can get a toehold, if not prepare to pay the highest price ever paid for a polluted sky in thr US. Still, either way Buffet straddles the gas or oil bet and even profits if it changes from one to the other later on. I do believe that he sits at the center of the US financial universe. He makes Bill Gates look like a lemonade salesman on a lucky corner. He's the kind of guy that buys red ink heading into a depression.<br><br>oops, I digress- I like watching the new Bolivarian Socialist Thing going on in SA.though<br><br>firstimer <p></p><i></i>
firstimer
 
Posts: 91
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2005 12:33 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Bolivian politics

Postby robertdreed » Wed Dec 14, 2005 3:14 am

I've studied Bolivian politics for a long time. I still don't claim to understand all of the complexities. Not even close. Rest assured, however, that there's a lot more to it than simply Left-labor-populists vs. Rightist oligarchs. <br><br> <p></p><i></i>
robertdreed
 
Posts: 1560
Joined: Wed May 18, 2005 11:14 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

...

Postby Ted the dog » Wed Dec 14, 2005 3:00 pm

"That means that from Capitol Hill to the UN, Morales is bound to be set up as a dope peddler, and his administration as a "narcostate"- a Left-socialist one, at that. In other words, a dream come true for the "drug warriors", and the Right Wing."<br><br><br><br>yeah...that's what I was thinking as well. the whole thing sounds like a mess for them. This is gonna be bread and butter bullshit for all the neocons to start rubbing their hands over in glee. <p></p><i></i>
Ted the dog
 
Posts: 275
Joined: Mon May 16, 2005 6:06 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: ...

Postby Reikimg » Thu Dec 15, 2005 4:29 am

I went to Bolivia in spring of 2003, the same time that bush was rattling sabres over Iraq.When i arrived in La Paz the firsts things i saw were writing on the walls:<br> EVO= mas muerte<br>EVO= mas crisis<br> I have to admit it had the desired affect on me.So i began to question what was going on. I found out that the upper classes hire the few that they can to spray paint walls, throw rocks on roads and start any kind of civil disruption to diminish the camposinos uprising.<br> Just goes to show you that what appears to be true isn't always the truth. Boliva has been historicaly jerked around and with Amerikan involvement will continue to be jerked around.<br>I see Bolivia going in the direction of Haiti. Which saddens my heart, becuase Boliva is the most awesome place in the world IMO. <p></p><i></i>
Reikimg
 
Posts: 24
Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2005 5:52 am
Blog: View Blog (0)


Return to Latin America

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest