Richard Heinberg Openly Supports White Separatist

[Homeless Halo]

Utter balderdash. Human beings are animals, and we show no "evil" tendencies that aren't rampant among other species on this planet. We're just more efficient at doing terribly aggressive animal things. We're better at being animals.<br><br>But seriously. Mankind is on a slow process towards a general betterment of his condition. 100 years ago, I'd be middle aged, already on my way down. Today, I have 3/4 of my life still ahead of me, on average. Less sickness and death, and wars are smaller, with lower casualties (per capita) than at any point in our history. An objective look at the human condition, in context, would show that we've been gradually improving our lot for millions of years.<br><br>Secondly, any "alien", of whatever sort, is likely to be the same as us. That is, the most evolved and/or effienctly well-rounded PREDATOR (Dyson) in the area. The "peace and love" hippie aliens is a wonderful fantasy, but highly unlikely. We got to the point we are, as much from our combative traits as from our cooperative traits, and its likely that other "entities" would evolve in (at least) a somewhat similar manner.<br><br>So, bullshit I say. Humans ARE animals. Animals are not "nice" or "good" while humans are "evil". Try explaining the moral basis for veganism to a tiger, see how far you get. <p></p><i></i>

[anotherdrew]

yeah, probably, ya never know tho. I ask all nice spacemen I meet on the internet for a ride on principle.<br><br>Dyson's talk of predator species is a scary concept and possibly accurate. Makes me want to go and hollow out the moon (if nessesary) build some big emdrives inside, paint it black, setup some great provisions and cities inside, move everyone up there who will go and take off to hide in an intersellar dust cloud. In fact one explanation for why we don't see any other species (according to mainstream science) is that they are all in hiding too. Perhaps some kind of cosmic locusts sweep thru the local galactic cluser every couple million years or more often perhaps.<br><br>what are you having for dinner shem? would I like it?<br><br>hey, just trying to be funny shem, actually save the earth if you can or need too please! <p></p><i></i>

[Rigorous Intuition]

today: <!--EZCODE LINK START--><a href="http://rigorousintuition.blogspot.com/2005/11/peak-fascism.html">Peak Fascism</a><!--EZCODE LINK END-->.<br><br>Thanks to everyone who's contributed to the subject, especially proldic and veritas. <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=rigorousintuition>Rigorous Intuition</A> at: 11/3/05 8:19 am<br></i>

[wintler]

Veritas: thanks for persisting. Shocked i am, running to deepening concern. Thats quite a case you've got there.<br><br>Richard Heinberg deserves right of reply, just as well i wired the thread link to his museletter e.addr. y'day. Does he "pointedly refused to locate the sources of alienation, rootlessness and environmental destruction in social structures, laying the blame instead to rationalism, cosmopolitanism, and urban civilization."? I didn't think so, but will have to reread everything to be sure. On all other fronts .. wow. I plead ignorance. <br><br>Suggestion V. - yoda is cute and irritated me enough to read but this is not something to toy with, not 'where i come from' anyway. Could (preferably) you or someone who thinks they have the tale of it, in plain unvarnished english, post us 50-500words? I know they're not themes really suited to subediting, nor are the extracts, but otherwise many may never read on it and it will be much harder for us to talk of it to others. <br><br>Since i see RH as a modern populariser of ideas of EF Schumacher & HT Odum would be interested in views on them, but this prob not the place or time. <p></p><i></i>

[veritas]

It is sad to see you come here<br><br>only in time<br><br>to help kill this thread.<br><br>You are intelligent. Yes.<br><br>But wise?<br><br><br> <p></p><i></i>

[hmm]

to lose focus.<br><br>enjoy your way with words.<br><br>you do understand the effect of those in your previous post.<br><br>back to the topic on hand..<br>just because you know the planet is big enough for all of us regardless of race colour or creed,and just because you know if we just shared fairly we would have heaven on earth, and just because "you" are a good person and dont want "bad things" TM to happen doesnt mean:<br><br>1. The current system of unequality isnt set to collapse dramatically if nothing is done YESTERDAY.<br><br>2. Those in control now dont know and are not prepared/preparing for this.<br><br>3. The fascist dont know and are not prepared for this.<br><br>so to conclude:<br><br>It doesnt matter one bit if anyone believes peak oil or population reduction or the war on terror but change must come and population reduction is the fascist's answer.<br>ours is? <p></p><i></i>

[starroute]

This whole "humans are the dominant species because we're the top predators" line of argument makes me really nervous -- not least because it's flat wrong.<br><br>As nearly as anyone call tell, our ancestors spent millions of years as fruit-and-root eaters, then moved to the seashore and took to grubbing for clams. We only got into the hunting racket a few tens of thousands of years ago, and we're still not very good at it. Basically, we're a bunch of bunny rabbits pretending to be wolves and shaking in our socks as we do it. <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START :lol --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> <br><br>This in itself is responsible for a lot of our problems. When cats go out to catch mice, it's simply what they do. But humans can't seem to do anything aggressive without getting themselves all worked up and into a fighting frenzy first. This is true of going out and hunting large, aggressive mammals with simple stone-tipped spears, and it is equally true of modern war.<br><br>But it's no coincidence that some large percentage of soldiers who have actually participated in combat and killed their fellow humans come back functionally insane. We're not equipped to handle it, and it totally messes us up. <p></p><i></i>

[slimmouse]

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>But it's no coincidence that some large percentage of soldiers who have actually participated in combat and killed their fellow humans come back functionally insane. We're not equipped to handle it, and it totally messes us up.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--> <br><br> Possibly because, quite simply, this is not who we are, or who we were ever meant to be, or indeed what we will ever ultimately become ?<br><br> Possibly because ,Its a self inflicted circuitry manipulation by others amongst us who have themselves completely forgotten who they truly are ? I would actually suggest much more than possibly here.<br><br> One thing is also for sure. It registers big on the "experience" monitor of both the participant, and the observer. <br><br> Meanwhile,If we dont like what we see, or what we have been manipulated to be, then perhaps theres no time like the present for us to change this ? <p></p><i></i>

[RollickHooper]

Someone please answer "hmm's" question <p></p><i></i>

[veritas]

This thread has lost its focus.<br><br>But for wintler:<br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Suggestion V. - yoda is cute and irritated me enough to read but this is not something to toy with, not 'where i come from' anyway... Could (preferably) you or someone who thinks they have the tale of it, in plain unvarnished english, post us 50-500words?<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>My style is purposeful. Avoiding attacks and flames and bullies. Yes!<br><br>Keep my words minimum. Let the sources talk for themselves. Yes.<br><br>You have the links. You are a supporter. You are the one to write more. Your opinion will be respected.<br><br>Heinberg's response will be welcome. It is wise and just to ask him. <br><br><br><br> <p></p><i></i>

[jenz]

a style which makes ad hominem attacks thinly veiled in ambiguity is one well known tactic of control freaks. <p></p><i></i>

[veritas]

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr> a style which makes ad hominem attacks thinly veiled in ambiguity is one well known tactic of control freaks.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Ah. Sadness.<br><br>It has started. <br><br>So this thread has ended. <br><br>At least for me. <p></p><i></i>

[shem]

<br>just being a bit philosophical here - weve had the going-home party and everyone on board is abed - its very quiet - im a little bit drunk - its been pretty tough on the crew, this assignment, and there was lots of relief after my decision - i hadnt realised how hard it was on them, but they kindof kept it from me a bit - <br><br>in a way, i dont know why i didnt come to this decision a long time ago - but i had to give you the benefit of the doubt as long as there was any -<br> <br>i was just thinking - its not just that you humans cant make sense out of sense, and that you cant make sense out of nonsense, but that you make nonsense out of sense - with almost infallible touch - night -<br><br>ps dont worry - there wont be any spaceships firing deathrays or anything scary like that - at most youll just hear a sort of ffft!<br><br><br><br> <p></p><i></i>

[jenz]

Hmm's question about change - and 'our' answer to it.<br><br>I think it is really a lot of questions rolled into one. <br><br>extreme politics sell the notion of a catastrophe waiting in the wings. Do we have an aswer to this predicted scenario? Do we believe it anyway, and if we did have we the power to do anything about it and do we want that power, or anyone to have that power?<br><br>There is so much negativity running through this thread, that it looks like a good job has been done on convincing many people that the situation is hopeless. I don't think so, but neither do I believe in a grand plan. <br><br><br><br><br> <p></p><i></i>

[RollickHooper]

Thanks jenz<br>I only got sucked in by Jeff's blog-post because I started a thread on a different discussion board about the same thing; I had only recently heard the term "eco-fascist" used for the first time, and was reading up on the subject myself. Oh, the synchronicities--THAT's what gives me the willies, how people on the internet begin to all think alike, after a while. It's all "mainstream media," in the end.<br>Since none of the "Peak Oil Is A Scam" crowd have stepped up to answer "hmm's" question I'm gonna go ahead and bounce. Take care jenz <p></p><i></i>