by AnnaLivia » Tue Sep 20, 2005 3:06 pm
Yes, prophetlady, do hope you can report back to us about your experience at the conference. Sure WOULD be curious to see responses to you questioning them on die-off “provocateurs”. (but changes nothing for me, ultimately, as it doesn’t change the geologic facts….which I think prove the finite-ness of fossil fuels but not at all that “die-off is coming without fail”.)<br><br>Wintler, jowettknowit gave you my major reasons for not believing 6+ billion is too many people. (and the trend is always “better education, better quality of life = decreasing family sizes”.) Again, we’re talking distribution problems, not scarcity. Mis-distribution of food and of land and of populace…all traceable to people being deprived of their rightful earnings…which means deprived of their opportunities. And we are ignoring a myriad of alternate choices at present. Deserts ARE being re-modified by permaculturists, through means more akin to common sense than to rocket science. And, crickey, you ought to be able to see the amount of water needlessly wasted right there in Oz on growing cotton in the damdest places making irrigation essential. For what? Trying to meet the world shortage of cotton at all costs?? hah. And I’d think you’d be aware of the promise in stonedust to rejuvenate soils, increase food production, and even absorb carbon from the atmosphere. Some of the best research on that is from Oz (and Scotland). It even uses up tailings they don’t know where to put.<br><br>There is tremendous room for tremendous conservation and innovation in our cultures. You don’t have to go back to the stone age to re-direct the greywater from washing hands to be used to flush the toilet.<br><br>Incidentally, I’ll bet Americans would be surprised to hear about a step NZ took during water shortages. An official campaign on the theme of “if it’s yellow, let it mellow, if it’s brown, flush it down”. Kiwi’s are about the most practical, resourceful, capable people I’ve met. What’s that joke…about giving a kiwi bloke a hank of baling wire and sending him out to his shed, and in fifteen minutes he’ll build you an airplane? There’s still plenty of that spirit (more latent) in Americans, too, I believe. How can we measure that kind of resource? I always wonder how many einsteins and mozarts we starved to death in the “third world” before they were 5.<br><br>Getting’ back to the horses, I’m one who thinks we’ll maybe never actually run out of all oil. We’ll be pumping oil a hundred years from now, I’m sure. But not in the quantities that would allow us to stay based on King CONG (coal, oil, nat gas). As if we could anyway, what with the fact we need clean air to breathe. <br><br>The school of hard knocks teaches one to “use it up, wear it out, make it do, or do without”. “a penny saved is a penny earned”. Dickwad cheney is personally responsible for me having known (and I do not forget this, Dickwad…….) what it’s like to wonder where the next meal for my kids is coming from. And will it be rice again, or macaroni again tonight? And even at that, realizing there are millions if not billions who would trade places with you in a heartbeat! You look ahead and want to save every resource you can…just in case.<br><br>I’m sure that’s why I take the very long view that someday, due to a geological truth you just can’t argue with, things are going to be very different for future persons. Whether it’s going to be better or worse is up to us who are consuming cheap energy now, and I sure as shootin’ think we’re arrogant and cruel as all get out, if we don’t begin to attack the problem right this minute. it takes time to educate those entering the physical sciences, it takes time just to convince more young-uns to go that route. I keep saying it: we have time and there are solutions, but we don’t have time to squander. Dammit, the stakes are just too high to gamble. Where could the harm possibly be in having started to prepare too SOON??? did we learn nothing from katrina for goshsakes?<br><br>It ain’t good propaganda unless that kernal of truth is in there to manipulate, right? Oil shortages past were politically motivated, to be sure. The one coming is dictated by geology. Just my opinion? Have you any idea how I’d love to be wrong?<br><br>And lastly, dreamsend, you are right that some peak-oilers are convinced of die-off and doom. But by now you have to know that I slap them upside the head every time they need it and I’m available.<br><br>Did ANYONE watch that video I posted of Richard Smalley’s take on all this? Anyone??<br><br>Thought not. Since everything I want known about peak oil is in that sane-voiced video, I’ll now quit my own yakking on this issue, here at RI, anyway. (no applause, please… just throw money.)<br> <p></p><i></i>