What should you do in an earthquake?

by **marykmusic** » Wed Oct 12, 2005 6:25 pm

This is the best advice I've ever heard, so I'm passing it on. --MaryK “TRIANGLE OF LIFE" My name is Doug Copp. I am the Rescue Chief and Disaster Manager of The American Rescue Team International (ARTI), the world's most experienced Rescue team. The information in this article will save lives in an earthquake. I have crawled inside 875 collapsed buildings, worked with rescue teams from 60 countries, founded rescue teams in several countries, and I am a member of many rescue teams from many countries. I was the United Nations expert in Disaster Mitigation for two years. I have worked at every major disaster in the world since 1985, except for simultaneous disasters. In 1996 we made a film which proved my survival methodology to be correct. The Turkish Federal Government, City of Istanbul, University of Istanbul Case Productions and ARTI cooperated to film this practical, scientific test. We collapsed a school and a home with 20 mannequins inside. Ten mannequins did "duck and cover," and ten mannequins I used in my "triangle of life" survival method. After the simulated earthquake collapse we crawled through the rubble and entered the building to film and document the results. The film, in which I practiced my survival techniques under directly observable, scientific conditions, relevant to building collapse, showed there would have been zero percent survival for those doing duck and cover. There would likely have been 100 percent survivability for people using my method of the "Triangle of Life" This film has been seen by millions of viewers on television in Turkey and the rest of Europe, and it was seen in the USA, Canada and Latin America on the TV program Real TV. The first building I ever crawled inside of was a school in Mexico City during the 1985 earthquake. Every child was under their desk. Every child was crushed to the thickness of their bones. They could have survived by lying down next to their desks in the aisles. It was obscene, unnecessary and I wondered why the children were not in the aisles. I didn't at the time know that the children were told to hide under something. Simply stated, when buildings collapse, the weight of the ceilings falling upon the objects or furniture inside crushes these objects, leaving a space or void next to them. This space is what I call the "triangle of life". The larger the object, the stronger, and the less it will compact. The less the object compacts, the larger the void, the greater the Probability that the person who is using this void for safety will not be injured. The next time you watch collapsed buildings on television, count the "triangles" you see formed. They are everywhere. It is the most common shape, you will see, in a collapsed building. They are everywhere. TEN TIPS FOR EARTHQUAKE SAFETY 1) Most everyone who simply "ducks and covers" when buildings collapse are crushed to death. People who get under objects, like desks or cars, are crushed. 2) Cats, dogs and babies often naturally curl up in the fetal position. You should too in an earthquake. It is a natural safety/survival instinct. You can survive in a smaller void. Get next to an object, next to a sofa, next to a large bulky object that will compress slightly but leave a void next to it. 3) Wooden buildings are the safest type of construction to be in during an earthquake. Wood is flexible and moves with the force of the earthquake. If the wooden building does collapse, large survival voids are created. Also, the wooden building has less concentrated, crushing weight. Brick Buildings will break into individual bricks. Bricks will cause many injuries but less squashed bodies than concrete slabs. 4) If you are in bed during the night and an earthquake occurs, simply roll off the bed. A safe void will exist around the bed. Hotels can achieve a much greater survival rate in earthquakes, simply by posting a sign on the back of the door of every room telling occupants to lie down on the floor, next to the bottom of the bed during an earthquake. 5) If an earthquake happens and you cannot easily escape by getting out the door or window, then lie down and curl up in the fetal position next to a sofa, or large chair. 6) Most everyone who gets under a doorway when buildings collapse is killed. How? If you stand under a doorway and the doorjamb falls forward or backward you will be crushed by the ceiling above. If the door jam falls sideways you will be cut in half by the doorway. In either case, you will be killed! 7) Never go to the stairs. The stairs have a different "moment of frequency" (they swing separately from the main part of the building). The stairs and remainder of the building continuously bump into each other until structural failure of the stairs takes place. The people who get on stairs before they fail are chopped up by the stair treads - horribly mutilated. Even if the building doesn't collapse, stay away from the stairs. The stairs are a likely part of the building to be damaged. Even if the stairs are not collapsed by the earthquake, they may collapse later when overloaded by fleeing people. They should always be checked for safety, even when the rest of the building is not damaged. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/glasses.gif ALT="8)"> Get Near the Outer Walls Of Buildings Or Outside Of Them If Possible. It is much better to be near the outside of the building rather than the interior. The farther inside you are from the outside perimeter of the building the greater the probability that your escape route will be blocked. 9) People inside of their vehicles are crushed when the road above falls in an earthquake and crushes their vehicles; which is exactly what happened with the slabs between the decks of the Nimitz Freeway. The victims of the San Francisco earthquake all stayed inside of their vehicles. They were all killed. They could have easily survived by getting out and sitting or lying next to their vehicles. Everyone killed would have survived if they had been able to get out of their cars and sit or lie next to them. All the crushed cars had voids 3 feet high next to them, except for the cars that had columns fall directly across them. 10) I discovered, while crawling inside of collapsed newspaper offices and other offices with a lot of paper, that paper does not compact. Large voids are found surrounding stacks of paper. Spread the word to everyone YOU care about and save someone's life! Jon A. Havelock, CSP, CHMM Med-Tox Northwest 2020 A Street Southeast, Suite 102 Auburn, Washington 98002 253-351-0677 Phone 253-351-0688 Fax 206-730-0610 Cellular havelockj@medtoxnw.com

by **chiggerbit** » Wed Oct 12, 2005 9:00 pm

This is great information, marykmusic. I'm sharing it friends and family. I live in an outer ring of potential damage if there is another New Madrid quake, so this is good to know.

by **AnnaLivia** » Wed Oct 12, 2005 9:43 pm

echo that. great to know! glad to spread the word!

by **banned** » Wed Oct 12, 2005 10:08 pm

Miscellaneous tips from living near the San Andreas for several decades: Whatever you decide to do, drill with your family so everyone is on the same page, and try to do the same at work. Last thing you want is people panicking and others having to calm them down. The worst hazard is unreinforced masonry. For anything up to about a 7, wood buildings do 'give.' AMEN to stay out of the doorways. That's a myth that unfortunately a lot of people still believe. Make sure you have a shovel and a very bright industrial size flashlight in your emergency kit(s) in case you have to dig someone out. The high end kits have hard-hats with lights on them. Turn off the gas outside if you smell gas in or around your house. I used to keep a wrench right by the shut off valve--unfortunately I left it behind when I moved. Be sure you have a battery powered radio. (And lots of batteries, for the flashlights too.) Have lots of bottled water AND water purification tablets to get everyone in the household through 72 hours at least. Be sure you have comfortable walking shoes in your car in case you have to leave it and walk. I have one large kit now in my truck because I park right behind my back door, used to have two, one large at home one small in the truck. Some people put their emergency supplies in a plastic garbage can, seal it, and chain it to a tree in the yard. Those NASA space blankets are great and take up little space, otherwise have a sleeping bag in case your house is so damaged you can't sleep inside. I have a little camp stove and an army type mess kit, a first aid kit, a 3 day supply of all my medications. Have a plan how to rendezvous if your family isn't together when it happens, including an out of state relative to check in with. My philosophy is, most 5s and below are just fun, they rock n roll a bit <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/happy.gif ALT=":D"> . Anything below a 7 is likely survivable unless you're in a high risk situation like the Cypress Structure freeway collapse or live on soil that's subject to liquefaction as in the Marina. Your house may fall off its foundation though, and anything not secured can fall over and break (and pictures or mirrors on the wal can fall on your head). Over 7--totally luck of the draw, where you are when it happens. If you're in a 1 story wood frame house on bedrock you're better off than if you're walking past a brick building in a landfill area. If you're really serious about security, find a book or web site that walks you through a total earthquake-safety program for your home, down to cupboard latches and 'mini kits' in each room. Most people, I've found here in CA, do nothing and live in denial, or do a few things (bottled water, batteries) and hope for the best. People who are really freaked out at the possibility of quakes don't move here, or if they do the first little 3 point roller and they call the movers <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/happy.gif ALT=":D"> . Long-time residents who have made it through a variety of magnitudes over the years tend to get blase and even joke about 'the Big One' without actually doing anything to increase their survival odds.

by **Avalon** » Wed Oct 12, 2005 11:22 pm

I remember being impressed by this when I first read it a couple of years ago. But in looking for a link to what Maryk posted, I came across some disturbing information. Doug Copp is being investigated for fraud by the Department of Justice. Evidently his grandiose claims cannot be corroborated. After substantial investigation he has been shown to be a bullshit artist.  This pdf tells more of the story, and gives some analysis of Copp's claims about his theory that raise a lot of good questions. <a href="http://www.cert-la.com/RejoinderToDougCopp.pdf">www.cert-la.com/RejoinderToDougCopp.pdf</a> Other information on Copp: <a href="http://www.abqjournal.com/terror/199912fire07-18-04.htm">www.abqjournal.com/terror...-18-04.htm</a> <a href="http://www.abqjournal.com/terror/199911fire07-18-04.htm">www.abqjournal.com/terror...-18-04.htm</a> <a href="http://www2.bpaonline.org/Emergencyprep/arc-on-doug-copp.html">www2.bpaonline.org/Emerge...-copp.html</a> <a href="http://www.snopes.com/crime/warnings/triangle.asp">www.snopes.com/crime/warn...iangle.asp</a> <a href="http://www.kahl.net/action/triangle_of_life.htm">www.kahl.net/action/triangle_of_life.htm</a>

by **chiggerbit** » Thu Oct 13, 2005 12:02 am

Arrrgh, where do these people come from????

by **AnnaLivia** » Thu Oct 13, 2005 12:14 am

a friend was here yesterday and her kid was on my machine and ever since then, i can't open pdf files. until i get fixed up again, Avalon, could you post the info that contradicts what copp is advising? that first link you put up? 'cause after reading a couple of the other links, i can believe he's a shyster, but i still don't know what to make of his advice versus the red cross saying to get under a desk. hope i never need to know, but i'd like to be able to file away in my head the correct choice!

by **Avalon** » Thu Oct 13, 2005 12:25 am

Sorry, I tried to copy some of it to paste in here, but it wouldn't let me highlight. Perhaps it might work for someone running something newer than Windows 95?

by **AnnaLivia** » Thu Oct 13, 2005 1:32 am

thanks for trying, A. i'll figure out what's the deal with the pdf files and my machine, and come back and check your link then. only time i ever felt a tremor was in New Zealand, but since i'm heading back down there soonish, it seems like a good thing to have sorted before i go. plus i'd hate to pass bad advice. but dang if the airpockets don't sound like they make great sense. sheesh, the research never ends...

by **israelirealities** » Thu Oct 13, 2005 2:22 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>New Zealand, but since i'm heading back down there soonish,<hr></blockquote> oh, i envy you ! This is for tourism ? one of the places I would have wanted to visit, just rent a trailer and roam around for a year or so. Perhaps you know of a MAori justice center looking for a lawyer with experience in indigenous people's rights...I'll help them for a nice cabin and a used pick up truck. :-) Well, i am probably going to be jailed here, in the Hell of a place, for what is left of my life. So, send pictures to the board, i'll try not to drool on them. bon voyage, and don't think about earthquakes...

by **banned** » Thu Oct 13, 2005 4:01 am

...I've been through dozens of quakes from 3 pointers up through Loma Prieta, and while I can't guarantee the advice I gave will save your life, I can guarantee if you don't follow any of it you're going to be hungry, thirsty, and might blow up due to a gas leak if you do survive <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/wink.gif ALT=";)"> . I opened the PDF, here it is: Copp likes to base his evidence on the Turkish "experiment" that he was involved with. Unfortunately, unbeknownst to all involved, this was not an experiment at all, but rather a voluntary organization's search and rescue exercise. My colleagues in Turkey corroborate that a building scheduled for demolition was used as a search and rescue training opportunity. They did decide to put the mannequins in different spots to see what would happen. And indeed they reported finding mannequins unharmed next to large and heavy objects. What is the problem with this? Simply this: To collapse the building, they tied ropes around the columns and yanked them out, causing the building to pancake. They did NOT simulate an earthquake. Earthquakes come in waves. They cause lateral shaking. They cause a variety of different kinds of damage. Since this experiment didn't produce anything resembling shaking it really doesn't tell us anything at all about what would happen during an earthquake. It could be that the large and heavy furniture would end up at the other end of the room, nowhere near where it began. Assuming even for a moment that an experiment could be done to support the hypothesis, the reality is th at the particular re sults from a pancake collapse , while certainly the most fatal, represents the least common type of reinforced concrete building collapse. There are at least 4 other major types of collapse. Less than 3% of damaged buildings in the Kocaeli earthquake were pancaked. So these results would te ll us precious litt le about what might happen to people in all the other buildings... the other 97% of damaged buildings as well as the many undamaged buildings. Formulating the questions in order to advise EVERYONE about what to do when the shaking starts is much more complex than the evidence in front of Copp's eyes.

by **banned** » Thu Oct 13, 2005 4:06 am

...I just picked out what seemed to be the gravamen of the author's objection to Copp. The entire PDF file is 7 pages. I don't know if we're supposed to copy something that long into a post but I will if it's OK with Jeff, for the people who can't access it. In addition to the critique of Copp here are the author's suggestions for things to do: #7. SO WHAT SHOULD YOU DO? •• Think through personal scenarios in the places you live and work. What spots seem safer than others? •• Make your environment safer by fastening tall and heavy furniture and audiovisual equipment, Move heavy objects down low. •• Keep shoes and flashlight by your bed. •• During the shaking, drop down to the ground. Cover your head and neck. Hold on to your cover or something stable. Why do we persist in saying these things? What is the proof? Research into the causes of deaths and injuries in several countries has now shown several important patterns: a) Fatalities are almost always associated with head, neck and chest injuries. These are the most vulnerable areas of the body that need to be protected. b) Many injuries are caused by falling. If you get down yourself, or brace yourself, you can avoid falling. c) A huge proportion of night time injuries a re to feet and legs... even in places with minor damage.... picture frame on floor, no shoes, no lights, parents/children trying to find each other in the dark.... d) At least half of all injuries are from non-structural objects. Many of these injuries are serious, made more so by the intense demand on limited medical resources. We can't be complacent about any unnecessary injuries when limited medical resources will be needed to save lives. e) The smaller target you present to falling objects the less chance there is of something hitting you. #8. AND NOW THAT YOU'RE THINKING ABOUT IT... Urban earthquake mitigation requires all of us to be involved in three major activities: assessment and planning, reducing our physical risks, and developing our ability to respond. ASSESS & PLAN (Think and act now.) - Sit down with your family and discuss possible scenarios - Decide on meeting places inside and outside of your neighborhood - Identify an "out-of-area contact" for quicker communication and peace of mind. - Designate others nearby to pick up your child from school in case of emergency, and make a meeting plan with them. PROTECT YOURSELF PHYSICALLY (Take measures to reduce your physical risks.) - If you aren't sure about the structural soundness of you home, workplace or school, have it assessed by a qualified engineer. - Retrofit where possible. Move out, and tear down where not possible. - Fasten large and heavy furniture - Secure water heaters - Have a fire extinguisher on each floor and have it serviced regularly. DEVELOP YOUR ABILITY TO RESPOND (Be ready to be part of the solution.) - Have enough water, food, and prescription medications for a week. - Keep a first aid kit - Check your "Go Bag" in your car and by your door. Disaster preparedness is not accomplished overnight. It takes place in a series of small ste ps taken at home, at work, at school, in your neighborhood and in your region. It is accomplished by actions by individuals, families, organizations, institutions, and government. The 100th anniversary of the 1906 San Francisco earthquake is not far away. This is a good time to make yourself a promise, and take one of these small steps today. Marla Petal, Ph.D. is Director of Community Mitigation Programs for GeoHazards International and Director of Bogaziççi University, Kandilli Observatory and Earthquake Research Institute's Disaster Preparedness Education Program. Her doctoral research is on the causes of deaths in the 1999 Kocaeli Earthquake and implications of these findings for public education. References: Albuquerque Journal (2004) July 11, 12, 13, 14. Online at <a href="http://www.abqjournal.com/terror/">www.abqjournal.com/terror/</a> 196540nm07-11-04.htm American Red Cross (2004) American Red Cross response to "Triangle of Life" by Doug Copp. Online at <a href="http://www2.bpaonline.org/Emergencyprep/arc-on-doug-">www2.bpaonline.org/Emerge...c-on-doug-</a> copp.html). Associated Press (2004) July 12. Online at <a href="http://cms.firehouse.com/content/article/article.jsp?sectionId=41&id=32725">cms.firehouse.com/content...1&id=32725</a> and <a href="http://news.bostonherald.com/national/view.bg?articleid=35319&format=">news.bostonherald.com/nat...19&format=</a> Petal, Marla (2004) Urban Disaster Mitigation and Preparedness: The 1999 Kocaeli Earthquake, doctoral dissertation, Department of Urban Planning, UCLA. State of California, Governor's Office of Emergency Services, (2004) Sept. 7. Memorandum to Operational Area Coordinators. Subject: Duck, Cover and Hold Procedure.

by **AnnaLivia** » Sun Oct 16, 2005 5:38 pm

Hey thanks, banned. I got my pdf problem fixed, and read more of the other stuff, too. Thanks to all of you for this thread and the impetus to look into this. My take on it: What Avalon’s links clarified is that there’s no universal answer or advice. Many variables intrude, which fact Copp ignores, thereby making his advice dangerous in some/many cases. The good advice seems to be that, in any case or location, stay away from stairs and glass, and doorways, too. Know how to turn off the gas if applicable, and have shoes at hand, along with first aid kit. Whether you get under something sturdy or get next to something big would depend on the building codes for that area or country, what floor of a building you’re on, what the building is made of, what surrounds you, and more. The more likely the building will collapse, the more sense it makes to look for the void-space. There’s more to identifying a likely void space than just getting next to a big thing though, so preplanning is essential, but not taught much. (how sad) All say plain old good or back luck really trumps all in a big earthquake, which is stating the obvious. You’re not likely to get far trying to move while shaking goes on, so seems the safest option is going to have to be chosen from your fairly immediate surrounding space. this Copp dude is self-serving indeed, again his real danger seems to be from his suggesting the same strategy should be applied in all cases, when the ‘drop, cover, and hold on’ advice which he says gets you killed, is actually what saves most people in the US. And the safest people of all, both here and in turkey, were those who just STAYED IN BED when it hit! Now there’s an easy-to-remember decision! Sorry I took so long getting back in here. To isrealrealities, (really sorry to leave you hanging!…I have SO many irons in the fire these days!) ...this trip is to Australia first, where I’ll be living, and over to "my old stomping grounds" in NZ at some point. If all goes as planned, I’ll return to USA after a few months to wrap up all loose ends here, and when I’ve met all responsibilities on this end as best I can, the return to Australia will be a permanent move. I won’t leave here for a few more weeks, and I’ll be online again once I get settled in Oz, so you’ll know how I’m going while I’m downunder. Just cannot do it right now, but I promise to post more about Aotearoa (say it: ay – oh – tay – ar – oh – uh) (it means “land of the long white cloud” in Maori …for the way the clouds top the mountain spine down the middle of the country, the Southern Alps, they’re called…south island) …NZ also called Godzone (say it: God’s Own, as in god’s own place or home) Even I, the world’s worst photo taker, have gorgeous shots of the place, but I don’t know how to post photos, dang it. anyway, if one thing in the world is true, it’s that New Zealand does NOT disappoint. (but don’t tell anybody. Last thing I want to see is more filthy-rich Americans and others going there buying up their land…grrrr…) You are very right that the old disputes between the indigenous Maori and the more recent Europeans, continue. All I’ll say for now is I got in on a conversation once at a café about it all, and the Maori man got up and hugged me for saying the racial card was being played on everyone and the real divide was economic. NZ and my friends there are too wonderful for words, but I’ll find some. (gotta find time!) the memories are so close always... There’s a forest surrounds the Oparara arch that is pure magic the sunsets? also magic. excruciatingly beautiful to the point of tears sometimes for me. you can see other galaxies with the naked eye from where i stayed. the milky way...the night sky astonishing The buller river gorge…utterly beautiful drive hot mineral springs up in the mountains...ooh, heaven! stunning waterfalls "hidden" just steps off the road Kiwi's houses spalshed with bright colors and trims, and lacey curtains in so many windows the union hall at Runanga, proudly proclaiming "the world's wealth for the world's workers" (you can bet i took a pic of THAT!) the jade carvers...the braided rivers…golden bay…christchurch buskers festival…the birds singing near charming creek walkway…the sense of community…the arts…the music…ah so much I’d love to share! And then there’s that one thing they leave out of the tourist guide: the rassin-frassin SANDFLIES. Evil demons straight from hell and I swear they can smell “new blood” for miles. Take yor bugger repellant!! the bites itch for weeks!! More another time, but bottom line is, if you get the chance to: GO!

What should you do in an earthquake?

What should you do in an earthquake?

Re: What should you do in an earthquake?

Re: What should you do in an earthquake?

I remember reading that article!

Doug Copp investigated for fraud

Re: Doug Copp investigated for fraud

Re: Doug Copp investigated for fraud

Sorry, couldn't copy it

Re: Sorry, couldn't copy it

Re: Sorry, couldn't copy it

Regardless of what Copp said...

That's not the entire PDF file...

been running behind but didn't forget

Who is online