Political practices repressed rather than acknowledged

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Re: the Matrix

Postby greencrow0 » Mon Oct 16, 2006 4:09 pm

Alice:<br><br>The serious [but identical] answer to your question is that 'Ray' probably has some job in the civil service or some profession that if he went missing there'd probably be a hue and cry from his co-workers, friends and family that would put some light on what he was doing and therefore...<br><br>...it's not worth the trouble.<br><br>gc <p></p><i></i>
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Soros

Postby robertdreed » Mon Oct 16, 2006 8:02 pm

I find George Soros to be an interesting character from a lot of angles. I still haven't decided whether he's a good guy or a bad guy.<br><br>One the one hand, he's undeniably intelligent. He's written articles that pretty much give away the game about the present lack of rules and responsibilities in international commerce, trade, and speculation, while simulataneously freely acknowledging that he's managed to play on that field and do quite well for himself. And he's said that there's an inherent unfairness to things in that regard, that the international market ceases to lead to benefit or progress when it simply comes down to being a game between profiteering buccaneers with sufficient liquid capital to play economic games of Go, of high-stakes bluff poker, or what have you. And his stated position is that he would welcome a common set of rules and regulations that would, he avers, ameliorate the inequalities and opportunities for exploitation that presently exist. <br><br>I haven't heard very many other successful international currency speculators complaining that the game is presently rigged in their favor, and calling for reform. <br><br>Also, Soros has not only given a lot of lip service to the ideals of open societies with political and cultural liberty, he has put out a lot of philanthropic money on behalf of efforts ostensibly intended to advance those ideals. <br><br>On the other hand, if he's a bad guy, he's a very bad one indeed. He's been accused of funding progressive movements in order to control them for his own ambitions- or, more likely, on behalf of a larger agenda suppported by other like-minded members of the plutocratic power elite. That's a serious allegation, because that's a really perfidious thing to do. <br><br>Interesting how so many conservative commentators for outlets like Fox News- and members of the Republican Party, including Congresspeople- call him out by name as though he were the principal mastermind behind the "extreme far-left Democrats." Soros is of course the principal sponsor of moveon.org., as the opponents of the issues supported by moveon seemingly never fail to mention.<br><br>The ironies in that abound. The American Republican and right wing demonization of George Soros always seems to me to have echoes of "Jewish international banker conspiracy" in it. He's continually posited to be <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>the</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> mastermind behind every proposal of the "extreme far liberal Left" fringe of the Democrats. <br><br>Perhaps the most controversial issue identified with Soros is of course "drug legalization." Official spokespersons for the US governments antidrug crusade, from Barry McCaffrey to Karen Tandy, have repeatedly brought up Soros by name, as if the entire drug law reform movement is a product of his personal inspiration. Additionally, there's often a tacit subtext that Soros is actually a drug profiteer who stands to gain from drug legalization- an absurd notion, considering the fact that it's Drug Prohibition that creates the conditions for clandestine monopoly and illicit money maneuvering, and that legalization would pull the plug on that entire game. <br><br>On the other hand, you have the complaints of various people in the drug law reform movement that Soros's Drug Policy Fpoundation is pretty much "clueless" and "ineffectual" about how they disburse the money at their disposal, and that they mire the movement in too much fund-raising bureaucracy associated with having to sign on to the ideas of the DPF on the best way to advance the ideas and initiatives of the drug law reform movement. And in a wider sense, there are similar complaints about moveon.org being subject to top-down ideas about what constitutes "acceptable" progressivism...<br><br>which in turn leads to considering the ideas of Dream's End, who- I gather- thinks that every social movement advanced by George Soros amounts to a Trojan Horse. <br><br>Dream's End, and some other people on the Left out there, seem to have a suspicion of Soros-as-mastermind that mirrors that of the Republican Right. <br><br>But I still haven't figured out whether Dream's End's antipathy toward Soros is primarily founded on a <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>per se</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> rejection and disdain directed at anything associated with capitalist philanthropy- especially when some of it has a record of being unapologetically targeted at states of the former Soviet bloc holding historic attachments to Marxist socialist economies and governments- or whether DE may be on to something more substantive. <br><br><br><br><br> <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=robertdreed>robertdreed</A> at: 10/16/06 7:17 pm<br></i>
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Re: Soros

Postby Dreams End » Mon Oct 16, 2006 9:52 pm

rdr..<br><br>I don't know...something about the Carlysle Corporation and Harken energy and bailing out Bush Jr. If you check his business life vs. his alleged belief system, they don't add up. Not saying he has to be all crunchy granola...but there that's a pretty big disconnect.<br><br><br>Every movement funded by him a trojan horse? Wonder where I said that. <br><br>RDR, even an organization I worked for got Soros money I just found out. Lots of worthwhile causes get money from him. Two levels to social control via foundations. One is to fund those things you like, and two is to fund those things you don't like and keep them in line. <br><br>So if he funds a group battling AIDS or whatever, that doesn't mean the group itself is necessarily a bunch of spybots. But he also funds a nexxus of progressive organizations like Moveon.org. So what is his vision, exactly? As I mentioned, the article I read said he was just thinking Bush was too militaristic and would upset the arrangements as he'd like to see them. <br><br>As for the Jewish banker thing. Yeah...he is Jewish. But he's not alone. He's doing what the Rockefeller foundation and Ford foundation and Carnegie etc all do. I was interested in him because he was so quick to move into Eastern Europe and other former Soviet countries and I think funded things like the Polish Solidarity Union...in other words, work very much along the lines that CIA is interested in, in the very places CIA is interested in. <br><br>Bottom line is, I think his network of funded organizations is too vast to be just about him wanting to remove Bush from power. So I'd suggest three ways to interpret that.<br><br>1. He really is progressive at heart.<br><br>2. He has particular interest in funding a few things for some agenda and funds the rest as a cover.<br><br>3. He wants to have a broader impact than just anti-Bush but not because he's some big progressive. <br><br>I'd say that given his business relationships, to argue that he is some kind of progressive would be naive. That leaves numbers 2 and 3. I vote for 3...and this is consistent with what foundations have done for a long time. I'm sorry I don't have the link handy of that one Ford foundation guy or whatever it was who explained why he funded radical organizations in order to bring them back to a less radical stance. <br><br>I don't know much about him yet...but that's what I'm interested in. <br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Soros

Postby sunny » Mon Oct 16, 2006 9:55 pm

I wish Soros would put some of his enormous wealth into media. A big enterprise like CNN, fielding leftish reporters like Robert Parry, Greg Palast, and other journalists of impeccable credentials and credibility, would go a long way in countering msm propaganda. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Soros

Postby Gouda » Tue Oct 17, 2006 7:38 am

Capitalist philanthropy. Wow, that's a topic for another thread. My humble opinion is that real capitalist philanthropy would involve rich fuckers ridding our world of themselves and/or tearing down the global capitalist system to live on equal footing with the rest of us. Francis of Assisi style. These are no Men Who Planted Trees. Gates, Buffet and Soros drop some crumbs here and there, the wealth system is strengthened, moralized even, and the imbalances continue to worsen. I shall sin as I like, but it's OK, because I can do penance, do some good works, and receive credit from the treasury of the church of capitalism. It's a neo-indulgence system. <br><br>Sins repressed rather than acknowledged. <br><br>Yet, I often daydream about all the wonderful things I could do to the capitalist system with a few hundred million bucks (that I would find in a large duffel bag in the park, of course.) Funding real journalism and media and education, as Sunny suggests, would be one. I'd also plant a hell of a lot of trees. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Soros

Postby terryintacoma » Tue Oct 17, 2006 8:12 am

George Soros inserted himself into the MSM before the 2004 elections with television interviews and anti-bush campaigning, saying all the things we were hoping someone with money and power would come out and say. I didn't know alot about him before that time.<br><br>I logged onto the Soros website as the election was being hijacked, thinking to myself, "Well, George Soros isn't going to let this happen." Mr. Soros had nothing to say except "Goodbye, I am going to Europe for a long vacation."<br><br>Screw you too Mr. Soros. <p></p><i></i>
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Governor of North Carolina To Be Called to Account for Tortu

Postby NavnDansk » Wed Oct 18, 2006 5:21 am

I remember Soros' message that he was going to Europe, MoveOn, Michael Moore had nothing for a very long time on the very suspicious election fraud and Kerry took down his site and erased all negative bush material and his blog while people were frantic at the obvious cheating and changing of the exit poll information by the media at 3am, 12 hours before he conceded. The message on Kerry's site when the very active blog on election night was taken down was that the moderators were taking a break but aside from 45 minutes around 9am the day after the "election" kerry's blog was permanently erased.<br><br>Aero Torture Taxi Flies from Kinston, NC<br><br>We arrived this morning at Global TransPark in Kinston, NC, where we wrapped yellow crime scene tape around the hangar owned by Aero Contractors. Aero houses its Boeing 737 Business Jet in Kinston and flies "extraordinary rendition" missions across the globe.<br><br>We were met by Lenoir County sheriff deputies, but they did not interfere with our attempts to deliver a copy of the indictment to Aero. There were no arrests. We spent the rest of the afternoon delivering copies of the indictment to other members of the Global TransPark board and making inquiries at the airport.<br><br>Our actions raised awareness in Lenoir County and generated a fair amount of interest among the local press. Read this story that appeared in the Kinston Free Press.<br><br>Return Visit to Aero at Johnston County Airport<br><br>Immediately after being found guilty by District Court in Johnston County, we returned to the gate of Aero Contractors where we sought access in order to inspect flight logs and to take depositions from employees. We received no response from inside but gathered at the gate to call for an end to Aero's illegal activities.<br><br>Read the Raleigh News & Observer story about our trial.Read the Smithfield Herald story about our trial and return to Aero.<br><br>=Trial and Press Conference in Johnston County, NC<br><br>Governor of North Carolina To Be Called to Account for Torture FlightsThe group of 14 arrested in November while delivering an indictment to Aero Contractors' offices and hangar at the Johnston County, NC, airport will stand trial Thursday, January 5, in Johnston County court on charges of second-degree trespass.<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.stoptorturenow.org/site/weblog.php">www.stoptorturenow.org/site/weblog.php</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br>good photos of the demonstrations<br><br>=OUR SOUL IS DYING AT GUANTÁNAMO<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.stoptorturenow.org/site/weblog.php">www.stoptorturenow.org/site/weblog.php</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>=Patrick O'Neill of Garner, NC, discusses trial strategy with other defendants on Wednesday evening, including Stephanie Erickson of Raleigh and Gerald Surh of Carrboro, and Mark Chmiel of St. Louis and Kathy Kelly of Chicago.<br><br>Back in November we also delivered copies of the indictment to members of the Johnston County Board of Commissioners and the airport manager, calling on them to take action against Aero's for its involvement in the CIA program of "extraordinary rendition."<br><br>Immediately after the court appearance on Thursday, members of Stop Torture Now and others from North Carolina will return to Aero's hangar in order to seek access to Aero's premises to carry out our own investigation of their flight logs and to take depositions from their employees.<br><br>Throughout the day on Thursday, other members of our group will deliver copies of the indictment to Michael Easley, the governor of North Carolina, and to other state officials in Raleigh. Earley chairs the board of Global TransPark Authority, a state airport in Kinston,<br>NC, that is the site of a second Aero Contractors hangar. Aero uses its hangar in Kinston to house its Boeing business jet, a plane that has been linked to extraordinary rendition flights.<br><br>==Hub Europe? -- The Extent of US Gulag and Torture Taxi Routes<br><br>There is mounting pressure from the EU for the United States to acknowledge the extent of its network of secret prisons and to end the practice of "extraordinary rendition." Click on this map to see details of the locations and routes as published recently in Germany in Der Spiegel.<br><br>=You Can Stop the CIA Torture Taxi<br><br>Read about our action on November 18 in Johnston County. Read the indictment we delivered. After you know the fact, we really encourage you to take your own action to shut down the CIA Torture Taxi.<br><br>We have delivered an indictment to Aero Contractors charging them with violations of US and international laws prohibiting torture and have visited members of the Johnston County Commissioners and the Airport Manager asking them to take action. Follow up with them.<br><br>Let's haunt the county officials by email, phone, or personal visit if you're in the area.<br>Here's how to email them.<br>Here's how to phone them.<br><br>We would also greatly appreciate any financial help you can offer to defray the costs of the action on the 18th and help us get ready for our upcoming trial and the Peoples Tribunal being planned to coincide with it. Here's info about who we are and how to donate. <br><br>===Here is a brief summary of both international law and U.S. criminal law relating to extraordinary rendition.<br><br>Here are some of the people who are taking part in Friday morning's action in North Carolina.<br><br>Read an account of the action and some of our thoughts about the United States and Torture<br>Uncrucify Them: An Exercise of the Imagination<br><br>=AOL Blog had reprinted Village Voice article on Ray the Planewatcher- he was wearing a t-shirt that read DEMOCRACY IS NOT A SPECTATOR SPORT <p></p><i></i>
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