Red White and Gray, Part 2

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Red White and Gray, Part 2

Postby Dreams End » Tue May 30, 2006 9:11 pm

I don't have much extensive to say, but I thought the post was so good it should have its own thread.<br><br>Jeff has hit the very nail I'm interested in on the head. On the one hand you have age-old reports of entities mucking about with people's lives and innards and on the other, evidence that some of these modern day entities are some kind of mind control op. <br><br>He hit the big theme that is being implanted as well...coming world collapse or destruction. Interestingly, the MEANS of that collapse don't necessarily agree from case to case, but the message of upcoming apocalypse is a common one. And I think that John Mack from Harvard was one of the first to put out the idea of this common theme...his last book was a more "spiritual" take on the whole thing...though I have yet to read it. Was Mack part of pushing this agenda or merely uncovering it.<br><br>Jacques Vallee of course liked to write about all the wierd versions of contactee experiences that get tossed out by nuts and bolts ufologists. Weird interactions that seem to be staged more for effect and are surreal and unclear in their purpose.<br><br>Then there is this same theme of impending collapse that shows up in various New Age mythologies and "peak oil" style analysis. Is the purpose just to keep us on edge? Disempowered by the inevitability of it all (why protest if there's nothing we can do about it?) I think the schemes...at least the ones involving humans, are far too elaborate for that simplistic of a scenario.<br><br>Another theme that the military mind control guys want out there is the idea of alien intervention in all of human history. I think of Linda Moulton Howe's trip to an Airforce base to be shown "secret" documents outlining the various alien interventions in human history. Without looking it up, I'm pretty sure that it was one of the aviary, specifically Richard Doty, who allowed her to see this document (correct this if I'm wrong please)..and since he was also (I think...sorry for my laziness) one of the ones leaking disinfo out to Paul Bennewitz about alien/human aliances and...naturally...an impending alien takeover or some such impending doom (sending Bennewitz into a psych ward) we must wonder. <br><br>On the other hand, is the rich tapestry of experiences that SORT of fit this scenario...but not really. <br><br>I have an ex-girlfriend I've written about who had an ongoing dreamlife, alternate reality in which some sorts of beings not of this world were really pissed at her for not bringing them more souls. They would fling her out into space as punishment, but she was never clear on exactly what her role was supposed to be. Also, a fatherly man in a gray suit would provide her "lesson" in things such as the various levels of reality or energy around a human personality and how they interact.<br><br>She also has seen those gray entities that suck out your soul and live on misery. They aren't "grays" but blob-like, according to her. I read reports in one of Mack's books of these entities a year or two after she mentioned them to me.<br><br>In addition, she had dreams of being in a metallic cubicle with one wall missing that allows the room to open into a huge, hivelike structure of similar such rooms. She would get up and the bed would withdraw from into the wall. I think she was naked and a shower sort of automatically came on. In the center of this hivelike structure was, and I don't say this for comic effect, a carousel like apparatus like the one they use to keep hot dogs on. Instead of hotdogs, however, were babies. And her job was to hold them. Only 15 minutes or so per baby as she was not to get too attached. <br><br>Remember, this was pre-internet..or at least pre-common access to it and I'm certain she wasn't reading books on this subject but of course "contamination" is possible. however, her story is quite unique...I've not read of the baby carousel before, the the idea of having to hold babies because "they" didn't know how to provide the needed affection.<br><br>Interestingly, she took a job on a "psychic hotline" and at the time most of the people there actually took their role seriously, though the company got bought out and quickly became the scam you imagine those 900 lines to be. Anyway, one woman called asking for information on the murder of her mother. My ex provided such detail that she was actually called by the Louisiana police. I was there when she received the call.<br><br>Some time after, another woman at this hotline who rarely spoke to her at work called her up and said the government had a program and they were interested in utilizing her. She said the program was specifically to heal AIDS but the story didn't make a lot of sense. Lynn had had a friend die of AIDS recently, however, so it would be a good "hook" to grab her with. They said they were interested not in her psychic powers...such as they might be, but in her ability to "communicate with animals" (which I never saw evidence of) and her ability with numbers.<br><br>This last is hard to explain. She could tell you instantly when you spoke how many syllables were in the sentence you had just said. She saw your sentence and that of any others on a "graph" in her brain with one dot for each syllable...rising and falling as your tone does and a number flashing on top with the number of syllables. Doesn't seem real useful for the government but that's what the woman said. Needless to say this woman from her work may have just been delusional but it sort of fit the "interest" in those with extraordinary experiences that Jeff mentions. <br><br>Anyway, hope this sparks some discussion. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Red White and Gray, Part 2

Postby dude h homeslice ix » Tue May 30, 2006 10:28 pm

<!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.geocities.com/CollegePark/4885/mib.html">www.geocities.com/College...5/mib.html</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>god damn it, grey lodge occult review is gone. there were some really good articles there.<br><br>nonetheless, check this out:<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.noveltynet.org/content/paranormal/www.brotherblue.org/">www.noveltynet.org/conten...rblue.org/</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--> <p></p><i></i>
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I know Jeff does not believe

Postby yesferatu » Wed May 31, 2006 12:47 am

strange alien memories are all military psy-ops...he stated that in this last classic RI post.<br><br>I know it is not the case. <br><br>Take my example for instance.<br>I checked out Raymond Fowlers "The Watchers" from the library while living in Hannibal, Missouri around '89 or '90 during an odd part (what part hasn't been) of my life.<br><br>I read a chapter a day. The night previous to the chapter which I would read the following day, I dreamed a lucid dream wherein the dream played out to a "T" a part or parts of the chapter I would read...the next day BEFORE reading the chapter.. In the dreams I was the observer and the person which centered around events described by such persons in that chapter. I would read the chapter the following day and realize my dream was just like the events described. This was not all chapters...I can for certain say for sure 3 or 4 dreams were exact visual representations to events described in chapters. <br> <br>It culminated in a dream that I will never forget. I saw an alien baby/child/half-breed which seemed to be somehow part of me, but the emotional depth of seeing this thing was beyond anything I ever felt before or since. It's impact was with me when I woke that morning and it is with me now. That day I read the chapter that detailed the event and feelings towards the "child" which I felt....true reverence and complete emotional awe. <br><br>I only found out last year that "The Watchers" is on a list of books that are required reading among certain groups that are described as so-called "satanic" though the term is worthless because of its baggage. But I find that interesting. What is weird is I have a curiosity to read the book again, 16-17 yerars later to see what resonates, but so far have not gone to buy it or check it out. <br><br>My point is this: There were no military personnel who tracked me to a library in Hannibal, and then set up some elaborate mind-contorl experiment.<br>THAT is fucking paranoid in it's most spiritually stunting excess, to think like that. <br>What it tells me is there are elements to this that connot be explained by military black ops. It tells me there is a spirtitual dimension that needs to be explored. I don't know if Jeff believes it is more probable that the military followed me to a library in Hannibal and fucked with me.... BUT, if that is the more likely scenario for anyone, I really feel sorry for them. <br>People who have been so mentally fucked by xtianity that they think the black-op military is so fucking omnipotent to explain such things, rather than admit to a spiritual (NOT XTIAN!) component are just moonbats. <br><br><br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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Re: I know Jeff does not believe

Postby professorpan » Wed May 31, 2006 1:33 am

Damn, Homeslice. Maybe Grey Lodge is just temporarily down? I'd hate to see such a wealth of material just disappear. I suppose archive.org will be useful if it really is gone.<br><br>Ditto Blue Resonant Human, and old friend of mine from the halcyon days of Usenet. I may host his material on my blog. He was a groundreaker, and brilliant and funny. I still fantasize that one day he'll burst onto the scene again. This board, in particular, could use his wit and erudition.<br><br>As far as MILABS go, I think the jury is out. I witnessed a black helicopter fly over an abductee's house in broad daylight, hover for several minutes, then fly away. She (the abductee) took photos. And there have been too many accounts of experiencers seeing military people "behind the scenes" for me to dismiss the possibility.<br><br>But I'm not convinced it's all a military psyop. My own experiences, and those of people I've spoken to over the years, point to something much weirder. <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>Much</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> weirder. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: I know Jeff does not believe

Postby Sepka » Wed May 31, 2006 3:56 am

I'm open to the idea that the military may have an interest in faking UFO abductions, but that certainly can't account for what's been reported throughout history.<br><br>People in positions of power are interested primarily in being in positions of power. Other concerns are secondary. That's how they get to be where they are. While it's entirely true that they don't care about those they rule as individuals, the ruled are no less valuable to them for that. We're the source of their power. It's equally true that for those who wish to be in charge of tangible power, the United States is the sine qua non. <br><br>It's for that reason that I have trouble with the idea that the US government is maliciously plotting against its own citizens. There's simply nothing bigger to be in charge of. With rare exceptions, the generals, senators, president, et alia certainly place their own good above the interests of the Republic. At the same time, they have a proprietary interest in the health and strength of the Republic. It's the source of their power. That acts as a restraint upon their actions. The odd individual may be sacrificed here and there, but the masses are valuable, and to be protected, unless something a *lot* better comes along.<br><br>We could postulate that whatever's behind the UFO phenomenon is a source of such remarkable power that those already holding the reins of the United States are willing to throw away their bird in the hand for the chance to grab the two in the bush. It's a superficially attractive theory, but it's got some problems. <br><br>The foremost one is the nature of politics itself. There are bound to be factions within the 'inner circle' whose interests would be better served by the status quo. Those people aren't going to keep quiet and defer to the 'UFO faction' (for want of a better term). If a fight like that were taking place behind the scenery, we'd have seen at the very least real, substantial leakage that left a documentable paper trial by now, not just the apparent disinformation operations such as MJ-12. Actually I suspect that someone would have done the 'Deep Throat' thing by now, and blown the top right off, if such a fight were actually taking place.<br><br>The government just doesn't show signs of internal dissent over UFOs, though. Quite the opposite, really - the military and executive seem to be in strong agreement that the public needs to be diverted from looking too closely into the matter. Moreover, the attitude seems to be consistent across party lines, through different administrations, and between the different services. The topic seems to be one of intense interest to the government, but they'd prefer that the rest of us didn't pay too much attention.<br><br>Why would the military be interested in faking UFO abductions? I can think of several reasons, but have no real way to choose among them. The most benign explanation is that they just want the ability in reserve, in case they would ever need it for some unforseen reason. A more likely explanation is that the faked abductions are intended to accomplish something. Perhaps they're meant to counteract the UFO-based ones, or alternately to reinforce them. Both scenaria presuppose that the military knows (or think that they know) the intent and effect of the UFO abductions. It's also possible that the military versions are being done for study. Perhaps the abductions work some subtle effect upon society as a whole, and the army is still trying to get a handle on exactly what they do and how they do it. <br><br>Why would the military not want people to inquire too closely into the phenomenon? I can think of three reasons. First, perhaps whatever it is is so horrible that the public would panic. That seems unlikely to me. This all started in the wake of WWII, and persisted through the Cold war. People lived every day with the threat of complete obliteration hanging over them, yet got on with their lives. This is the same army, moreover, that drew up plans for the populace to calmly build makeshift shelters while the Russian bombers were already on the way. Whether they're correct or not, the military doesn't give credit to the idea that people panic easily when facing a known threat.<br><br>The second option is that the military just doesn't know what they're dealing with. That seems more likely to me. The fear of public panic in the face of an unknown threat seems more plausible. Also, it accords well with the military's obvious interest in UFOs.<br><br>The third option is that public interest somehow changes things in an unfavourable way. Perhaps the military are barely or almost in control of the situation, but are having to take unpalatable measures to get what measure of success they've had. <br>Perhaps the phenomenon is something similar to a tulpa, and can be contained so long as public expectations of it don't change. Perhaps something else altogether.<br><br>As I've said before, I think that what we today experience as flying saucers are what people of previous ages experienced as demons and angels. It seems signifigant to me that the messages of impending doom have remained a constant through the ages, although today we're warned of environmental catastrophe rather than the nuclear war that the 50s saucer occupants preached against, or the divine wrath of even earlier times.<br><br>The question that I feel is most important, and which often seems to be overlooked, is why did such a huge outbreak of saucers and 'weird' things occur in 1947? Prior to that year, the uncanny was in decline. People saw things, but rarely, to the point where tales of the supernatural were presented as prima facie evidence of the ignorance of earlier ages. Then suddenly, in midsummer 1947, it's like the dam broke. There are flying saucers, sasquatchs, thunderbirds, etc., just everywhere, and they're here to this day.<br><br>Something changed in 1947, and if we knew what it was, we could likely answer a whole slew of questions. I've heard it theorized that Parsons and his 'Babalon Working' were responsible, but I've got my doubts. I try to keep an open mind on that score, but I've never been all that impressed with Crowley and Parsons. They always struck me as being a bit too theatrical to be the real thing. Perhaps I've misjudged them.<br><br>My apologies if this rambled, but I'm feeling unfocussed tonight, for whatever reason.<br><br>-Sepka the Space Weasel <p></p><i></i>
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Re: I know Jeff does not believe

Postby Dreams End » Wed May 31, 2006 10:33 am

Jeff most certainly does not believe that it's all military psyops. Neither do I. The very old cases such as he has discussed, eliminate that possibility. That some of these cases are military psyops also seems likely, due to stories of military figures in the background or even realizations mid experience that the "aliens" are just guys in masks or seeing alien costumes around. All have been reported.<br><br>But too many of the incidents are of such high strangeness that if they are military psyops the ends are way to enigmatic. I remember one time a woman had an experience that involved her car stopping (naturally) and talking to a guy in an oversized cowboy hat. Or the scientist who talked to the "glowing racoon" or whatever. It's possible that whatever is behind these experiences induces a sort of dream state, over which the abductors do not have full control and so such material is just produced by the abductee. Often the alien images they wish to impart stick, but sometimes they don't. I don't find that a very satisfying answer, though.<br><br>But the CIA has definitely messed around with this type of stuff. We know they've given LSD to unwitting volunteers, funded "psychic driving" and all kinds of things like that. In addition, there is strong evidence of CIA collusion in some cult situations, particularly the People's Temple. The ability to create small (or not so small) groups that will do one's bidding and also the ability to have all kinds of folks with implanted suggestions for various things would certainly come in handy. WE could simply take their word, after the Senate hearings in the seventies, that they don't do that stuff anymore. Yes...we could do that......<br><br>But of course, I don't buy that. It's too powerful. Even if the motivation is just to use these techniques on "the enemy". <br><br>Anyway, great discussion... <p></p><i></i>
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Brother Blue

Postby Avalon » Wed May 31, 2006 2:48 pm

I used to occasionally exchange emails with Brother Blue, but we've been out of touch for the last couple of years (my fault as much as his).<br><br>Last I'd seen of his Usenet postings he was doing a bit too much of the Trickster role, and not much of the connecting that he's in the past done better than just about anyone else. I hope that his personal life will straighten out one of these days. He's got a lot that he could offer, but I don't know that he cares any more. <sigh><br><br><br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Brother Blue

Postby bvonahsen » Wed May 31, 2006 3:22 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>All that remains of the old www.brotherblue.org site is this archive. Unfortunately, it is not available in live form due to legal threats and harassment from a religious organization opposed to the freedom of speech. However, a ZIP archive of the web site is available. This archive may be unzipped onto your own computer system and read using a web browser by opening the "index.html" file in the "www.brotherblue.org" directory created. <br><br>Click here to download the archive.<br><br>We are looking for volunteers to make this file available online at other locations. If you are able to do so, please e-mail webmaster@noveltynet.org and we will link to you. If you wish to deal with the harassment, you might place an unarchived version of this site online as well. Such hosts, particularly those outside the reach of the aforementioned religious organization, would be greatly appreciated.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--> <br><br>dowloading it now - what is it? (can't read everything you know) <p></p><i></i>
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Re: I know Jeff does not believe

Postby HMKGrey » Wed May 31, 2006 5:49 pm

It only takes one black helicopter caught in the act and the whole abduction mystery falls over forever. <br><br>Sad as it is, it's still a fact. <br><br>Remember when those two creepy old cider-botherers were caught faking crop circles? Give me 100 Brits and I'll guarantee that 99 of them will cite those two as the reason they <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>know</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> crop circles are total bollocks. <br><br>It's like embedded codes. <br><br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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FWIW

Postby sunny » Wed May 31, 2006 6:20 pm

My husband and I lived in the country with my grandparents for a few years after we married in 1982, in order for me to care for them and avoid having to put my grandmother in a nursing home.<br><br>Something happened to me in 1984 that I can't explain to this day. Around 2 am one summer morning, I hear my labrador going nuts outside. He just would not let up; try as I might, I could not wake my husband to go out and find out what the matter was.<br><br>So I go out, I'm chasing the dog around in the dark, he won't let me get near him, he just keeps snarling and barking at the sky. He <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>jumps the fence</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> and now he's near the road, still barking. I come out of the gate and before I know what's happened, I'm <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>struck</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> by what I can only describe as a beam of light and fall down, paralyzed, beside the gate.<br><br>The next thing I know, I'm in bed. It's 5 am. and I don't remember coming back into the house. At first, I'm convinced it was all real- I felt the grass on my feet, the light breeze stirring up the heat, I smelled the hedge-rose. Then I rememberd that beam of light. Such a thing could not possibly have happened, could it? About a year later, something else happened, after my husband and I had moved to town. I dreamt that he came home for lunch as I lay napping on the couch with our nine-month old daughter.He spoke to me, made a sandwich and a pot of coffee,ate and left. When I woke up, I was astonished that the coffee pot was stone cold and empty. It had seemed so real. I called him at work-no, he had not come home.<br><br>I put the earlier experience behind me, convinced now beyond doubt it had been a waking dream.<br><br>But I can't forget it. It truly was terrifying, so I can sympathize with those who have had such experiences. To me, it is still hard to believe that it wasn't; my dog Tanner was strange and spooked for three days after the dream.<br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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Re: FWIW

Postby NewKid » Wed May 31, 2006 6:28 pm

Your dog had sleep paralysis. He may have also been suffering from a feeling of "agency panic" or a need to make sense of an otherwise random world. <p></p><i></i>
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My apologies if Jeff covered any of this before, but....

Postby johnny nemo » Wed May 31, 2006 6:31 pm

..<!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>I wanted to add a few UFO/creatures near glowing lights stories/weird creatures that cause EMF interference and/or "buzzing"/MIB encounters that I've found in my research.<br><br>The first is the story of the Flatwoods monster</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END-->.<br> <br>On 12 September 1952, three boys in the tiny West Virginia town of Flatwoods saw a<!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong> reddish sphere move slowly around a hill, hover briefly, and drop behind another hill. From the other side a bright glow shone as if from a landed object.</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--> On their way to investigate, the boys were joined by Kathleen May, her two young sons, their friend Tommy Hyer, 17-year-old Eugene Lemon, and Lemon's dog. <br><br>The dog ran ahead of the group and was briefly out of sight. Suddenly it was heard barking furiously and, moments later, seen fleeing with its tail tucked between its legs. A foul-smelling mist covered the ground and caused the searchers' eyes to water. The two leading the group, Lemon and Neil Nunley, who got to the top first, looked down and observed a 'big ball of fire' 50 feet to their right. Another of the witnesses reported it was the size of a house.<br> To the group's left, on the hilltop and just under the branch of an oak tree, were two small lights. At Mrs. May's suggestion, Lemon turned his flashlight on them. To everyone's considerable astonishment, the beam highlighted<!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong> a grotesque-looking creature with a head shaped like the 'ace of spades,' as several of the observers independently described it. Inside the head was a circular 'window,' dark except for the two lights from which pale blue beams extended straight ahead. In their short observation of the creature, the group saw nothing that looked like arms or legs.<br> The creature, which appeared to be over six feet tall, moved toward the witnesses; it seemed to be gliding rather than walking. Seconds later it changed direction, turning toward the glowing ball down the hill</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END-->.<br> All of this allegedly took place in a matter of seconds, during which Lemon fainted. The others dragged him away as they ran from the scene. <br> A reporter went to the site with one of the youths about half an hour later. He noticed an unusual odour in the grass that irritated his nose and throat. Returning to the site alone the next morning, he found 'skid marks' going down the hill towards an area of matted grass, indicating the recent presence of a large object.<!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong> This encounter with what the press dubbed the 'Flatwoods monster' took place during a flurry of sightings of unusual flying objects in the area. One man told of seeing a bright orange ball circling over the area where the monster was reported.</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--> The object was visible for 15 minutes before shooting towards the airport at Sutton, where it was also seen. <br><br>In Strange and Unexplained Phenomena, (Clark and Pear, 1997) we find a concise discussion of Mothman,appearing in West Virginia in 1966. He was first reported to have been seen, apparently, by two young married couples who were driving by an abandoned dynamite factory in Point Pleasant late in the evening. What they saw first were two large eyes, (glowing red, I understand) two inches wide and six inches apart, attached to something that was sort of figured like a man, only bigger, and which had huge wings folded against its back!<br><br>The four young people panicked and sped away but saw the creature again on a hillside next to the road! It then spread its "bat like" wings, rose into the air and followed their car. It seemed to be keeping up with them quite easily even though they accelerated to 100 mph in an effort to "lose" the creature. One of the witnesses said that it was keeping up with them without even flapping its wings! <br><br>The same night, however, it seems that someone else had seen Mothman even earlier. A Mr. Newell Partridge, living outside of Salem, West Virginia (90 miles from Point Pleasant), was watching television<!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong> when the screen suddenly went blank and a "fine herringbone pattern appeared on the tube, and ... the set started a loud whining noise, winding up to a high pitch, peaking and breaking off... It sounded like a generator winding up</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END-->."<br><br>Mr. Partridge's dog began to howl and continued to do so even after the noisy television was turned off. Partridge went outside and saw his dog facing the barn about 150 yards away, so he shined a flashlight in that direction and saw "two red circles, or eyes, which looked like bicycle reflectors." <br><br>The dog took off after the creature but Partridge tried to call him back without success. Mr. Partridge went in after his gun, but was so unnerved by the "eyes" he had seen, he decided that the better part of valor was the discretion of remaining indoors! He spent the night with his gun at his side. <br><br>In the morning, the dog was still missing and it was only two days later that Partridge read the report about the two couples sighting Mothman at the dynamite factory. One of the details in that account was that one of the witnesses said that, as they entered the city limits of Point Pleasant they had seen the body of a large dog by the side of the road and, a few minutes later, as they were leaving, the dog was gone. <br><br>Mr. Partridge immediately connected this dead dog to his missing animal who was, in fact, never seen again! <br><br>Another strange anomaly was that when the Sheriff's deputy who investigated the report by the two couples went out to the dynamite plant,<!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong> he experienced interference on his police radio. He said it was loud and sounded rather like a record or tape being played at high speed. It was so loud that he had to turn the radio off</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END-->.<br><br>From that time until November of 1967, numerous other sightings of "Mothman" were reported. One of them described Mothman as something that rose slowly from the ground, that it was a "big gray thing, bigger than a man," and that it had no head! It DID have the two large glowing red circles at the top of its torso. <br><br>According to John Keel, at least a hundred people saw the creature and he gathered the reports to come up with a general description as follows: it stood between five and seven feet tall, was broader than a man, and walked in a clumsy and shuffling manner on humanlike legs. It made a squeaky sound and the eyes were set near the top of the shoulders. Its wings were bat like but did not flap when it flew. When it took off from the ground, it went "straight up, like a helicopter." The skin color was gray or brown, and<!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong> two witnesses said that they heard a mechanical humming as it flew above them</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END-->.<br><br><!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>And there seems to have been a sighting in Kent, England in 1963. Four young people saw a "star" shoot across the night sky and disappear behind trees not far from them. They were scared and started to run but then stopped to observe a golden, oval-shaped light floating a few feet above a field about 80 yards from them. This then disappeared into a wooded area. Suddenly, the witnesses saw a dark shape shuffling toward them from across this field. It was black and human sized, headless and had wings like a bat! At this point, they panicked and ran away! <br><br>A similar UFO was seen by others during the next few nights. On November 23, two men who had come to investigate found a "vast expanse of bracken that had been flattened." They also claimed to have seen three huge footprints, two feet long and nine inches wide, impressed deeply into the soil.</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--> <br><br>After 1967, the sightings died away, but prior to that. <br><br>A "winged human form" was seen over Brooklyn, New York, on September 18, 1877 and reported in the New York Sun. Interestingly, this is about the time of some of the "Spring-Heel Jack" reports in England. <br><br>On September 12, 1880, there was a report of a "Man with bat's wings and improved frog's legs... at least a thousand feet in the air... flying toward the New Jersey coast... [with] a cruel and determined expression." Now, I don't know how a judgment about the expression could be made, but maybe it just meant that it was "frightening" to the witness and this was their subjective interpretation of that fright.<br><br>V.K. Arsenyev, a Russian writer, reported the following about an incident that occurred on July 11, 1908 in the Sikhote Mountains near Vladivostok:<br><br>The rain stopped, the temperature of the air remainded low and the mist appeared over the water. It was then that I saw the mark on the path that was very similar to a man's footprint. My dog Alpha bristled up, snarled, and then something rushed about nearby trampling among the bushes. However, it didn't go away.<br>Arsenyev then threw a stone "towards the unknown animal... something happened that was quite unexpected." He "heard the beating of wings. Something large and dark emerged from the fog and flew over the river. A moment later it disappeared in the dense mist." <br><br>Arsenyev later told some of the locals about his experience and they shared with him a story about a "man who could fly in the air. Hunters often saw his tracks, tracks that appeared suddenly and vanished suddenly in a way that could only result if the 'man' alighted on the ground, then took off again into the air."<br><br>In 1952 at Camp Okubo, Kyoto, Japan, U.S. Air Force Private Sinclair Taylor, on guard duty, said he heard a loud flapping noise. When he looked up he saw a huge "bird" in the moonlight. When it approached him, he became frightened and put a round of ammunition into his gun. The "bird" had stopped its flight and was hovering close by, staring at Private Taylor. He said:<br><br>The thing, which now had started to descend again, had the body of a man. It was well over seven feet from head to feet, and its wingspread was almost equal to its height. I started to fire and emptied my carbine where the thing hit the ground. But when I looked... to see if my bullets had found home, there was nothing there.<br>When the sergeant of the guard came to investigate the gunshots and heard the story, he told Taylor that he believed him - because a year earlier another guard had seen the same thing!<br><br>In August, 1969, Vietnam, near Da Nang, soldier Earl Morrison with the First Marine Division and two other guards were sitting on top of a bunker talking when they noticed something approaching them in the sky. Morrison said:<br><br>We saw what looked like wings, like a bat's, only it was gigantic compared to what a regular bat would be. After it got close enough so we could see what it was, it looked like a woman. A naked woman. She was black. Her skin was black, her body was black.<!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong> But it glowed. It glowed in the night - kind of a greenish cast to it</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END-->.<br>The soldiers watched the creature move about in the sky. At one point she was right above their heads, just six or seven feet up. She moved silently, without flapping her wings. Morrison said that she blocked the moon once, but despite the increased darkness, they could still see her because she glowed brightly. It was only when the creature started to fly away that the men heard a flapping sound.<br><br>Morrison thought that the covering on her skin was more like fur than feathers. He said "The skin on her wings looked like it was molded onto her hands." He also remarked that the movement of her arms suggested that they had no bones in them!<br><br><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>And I thought I'd finish up with an MIB sighting during the Mothman sightings in West Virginia</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--><br><br>One night in January 1967, Mary Hyre, a reporter who had written extensively about the local Mothman sightings, was working late in her office when a man walked in the door. He was about four feet six inches tall. Although the outside temperature was well below freezing, he was wearing nothing but a short-sleeved blue shirt and thin blue trousers. His eyes were dark and deep-set, and he wore thick-lensed glasses. He had long, black hair that was cut squarely. He spoke in a hard-to-understand singsong manner, 'like a recording', and asked for directions to Welsh, West Virginia. Hyre found him terrifying. 'He kept getting closer and closer to me,' she said, 'his funny eyes staring at me almost hypnotically.' Alarmed, she summoned the newspaper's circulation manager to her office and together they spoke to the strange man, who seemed to know more about West Virginia than they did. At one point, the telephone rang and while Hyre was answering it the little man picked up a pen from her desk and looked at it in amazement as if he had never seen one before. When Hyre told him he could have it, he gave a loud peculiar laugh, ran outside and disappeared round a corner. <br><br>Several weeks later, Hyre was crossing the street near her office and saw the same little man. He seemed startled when he realized that she was watching him, turned away quickly and ran for a large black car that suddenly came around the corner. He climbed in and it quickly drove away. <br><br>During Christmas week, a short, dark-skinned man entered Mary Hyre's office. He was dressed in a black suit, with a black tie, and looked vaguely Oriental. He had high cheekbones, narrow eyes, and an unidentified accent. He was not interested in the bridge disaster, but wanted to know about local UFO sightings. Hyre was too busy to talk with him and handed him a file of related press clippings. He was not interested in them and insisted on speaking with her. She finally dismissed him from her office. That same night, an identical-looking man visited the homes of several witnesses in the area who had reported seeing lights in the sky. He made all of them very uneasy and uncomfortable and while he claimed to be a reporter from Cambridge, Ohio, he inadvertently admitted that he did not know where Columbus, Ohio, was even though the two towns are just a few miles apart. <br> <p></p><i></i>
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harassment

Postby Avalon » Wed May 31, 2006 8:21 pm

<!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>Unfortunately, it is not available in live form due to legal threats and harassment from a religious organization opposed to the freedom of speech</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--><br><br>Would that be the religious organization that is a bit touchy about clams, or the one that wears special underwear?<br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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Bennewitz and Project Beta

Postby yesferatu » Mon Jun 05, 2006 2:07 am

I found one mention on RI of Bennewitz and thought there was a lot more to this to add in regards to this.<br>I am not promoting a book (since I have not read it yet myself), but it is called "Project Beta : The Story of Paul Bennewitz, National Security, and the Creation of a Modern UFO Myth" by Greg Bishop <br> <p></p><i></i>
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Bennewitz and Project Beta

Postby yesferatu » Mon Jun 05, 2006 2:15 am

Meant to add this review form amazon to the last post.<br><br><<Reviewer:        Stuart Miller (Manchester UK)<br><br>Unfortunately, Greg Bishop's book has already been misinterpreted. It has been claimed in other reviews here and indeed elsewhere that the book alleges that the entire UFO story is one that has been made up by various US intelligence agencies. This is quite simply not true and not only does the book state this clearly but quotes the chief protaganist, Richard Doty as saying that he accepted there were real ETs, real UFOs, and that we have been visited. Please read the book carefully.<br><br>And what you will read, if you do, is a masterful treatise on exactly how the US intelligence agencies have historically used the UFO phenomena for their own advantage in order to plant false information in the minds of those they want to target. And why would they do this? To lead them away from black budget activities that they would rather people didn't look at.<br><br>It does mean though that as a result of the activities of AFOSI, some of the tennets of modern ufology are false. It is extremely unlikely for example that there ever was an underground base at Dulce and that means no firefight and no large jars of embryonic humans etc.. The book also strongly suggests that cattle mutilations and the way they were carried out are comfortably within the scope of human ability.<br><br>This isn't a novel, it's a factual account of historical events with the main character already passed on at the time of writing and given these circumstances and the background this all falls into, Greg has done a marvelous job in bringing the personalities to light. Bennewitz is portrayed as brilliant, nay a genius, and yet at the same time deeply flawed by naivete. Bill Moore comes over as much a victim as anyone else and even Richard Doty is portrayed as having some humanity. What may indeed surprise some folk is that Greg does not paint the intelligence agencies as disgustingly evil. He demonstrates how they did their job and what their motivations were. There is an underlying level of respect shown towards them. In the end, it came down to one man's life against the potential loss of a great many other lives and while no normal people like to play god, in this case the choice was clear.<br><br>There are unintended lighter moments in the book and these can be found in the spying activities of Doty and his colleagues. A picture is painted of Bennewitz stepping out of his front door to go somewhere while almost simultaneously the spooks are stepping in through the back. It comes over as some neo British stage farce and all that appeared to be missing was Brian Rix dropping his trousers. Furthermore, Kirtland AFB seemed at the time to be like a three ringed circus with "dozens" of different intelligence agencies stationed at the base, all carrying out their own black projects with no one knowing what the other was doing.<br><br>This is a masterful account that needed to be written and the UFO community has nothing to fear from it. It will take one hell of a book to be published this year that betters this from a Ufological perspective.>><br><br>Any RIers read this book? If so, some thoughts and reviews of the subject? Bennewitz' tale is still kind of new to me. <br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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