They hate us for our freedoms

by **Forgetting2** » Mon Jul 03, 2006 3:04 am

(This may be an old realization for the readers of this blog and if so, please forgive me.) Somewhere between 9/11 and the Afghanistan invasion I was sitting around at my brother’s house and my Mom said, it seemed a little out of the blue to me, “I guess they do hate us for our freedoms.” There was some resignation in her voice. It was as if she had thought about it all and could come to no reasonable conclusion as to the ‘why’ of the 9/11 attacks. I don’t think she was too happy about the idea of going to war with Afghanistan, but rather thought, perhaps, it must be. I should back up and say that my Mom is a devout Christian, an evangelical is I think the term her church likes. Most people I know would call them fundamentalists. Yet unlike most of the others at her church my Mom is a card carrying Democrat. She is pro-union, social programs, not our business if someone is gay (although they are damned), and so on: I’ve described her as an ‘old school’ Christian to my friends: ‘Old school’ as it is used today, meaning not really that old, but no longer the accepted standard. So to my mother, the Muslims are going to Hell, but there's no reason to kill them for it. God will judge them. But then they had attacked us. Or so it had seemed. And so she had, it also seemed, at that moment given in and decided to accept the line we were being fed over and over again, like ipecac syrup. But this time she would hold it down. ‘I guess we have no choice.’ I responded that I thought it had more to do with our foreign policy. I mean why would they care what we do here in America? I opposed the Afghanistan invasion as an even more brutal way to deal with a brutal crime. We were the people sitting in the darkness. After a lot of time and reading of materials on 9/11 and more, it was only recently that the phrase returned to me and I realized that my Mom was right and that the people telling us this phrase were telling us the truth, except about who “they” are. They do hate us for our freedoms. It gets in the way of their quest for power. This has led me to speculate about how self-aware or tongue in cheek or ‘in your face’ the people who run our country, and the ones who came up with that phrase, were being when they thought of it as a talking point. My Mom now tells me, in hushed tones, when my brother and sister aren’t around, that she believes Bush may in fact be the Anti-Christ, and that the end of times seem to be at hand. As someone who now calls himself an agnostic, I will neither confirm nor deny. As far as I can see, things are still pretty dark.

by **yesferatu** » Mon Jul 03, 2006 5:47 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>This has led me to speculate about how self-aware or tongue in cheek or ‘in your face’ the people who run our country, and the ones who came up with that phrase, were being when they thought of it as a talking point.<hr></blockquote> Just like Mission Accomplished. The Bush-Is-Incompetent crowd jeer it. Why? Mission was accomplished. AmeriKa now has it's footprint in the middle East. Once we were militarily inside Iraq, the mission had been accomplished. Of course the idiot Bush-Is-Incompetent crowd of liberals think Bush is incompetent cuz he can't win the war. How dense. How played.

by **LilyPatToo** » Mon Jul 03, 2006 9:21 pm

Huh? <blockquote>Quote:<hr>Of course the idiot Bush-Is-Incompetent crowd of liberals think Bush is incompetent cuz he can't win the war<hr></blockquote> No, actually, we think he's incompetent due to his many mind-bogglingly moronic remarks, his legislated rape of our environment and his general idiocy and lack of compassion for anyone who isn't rich. We were (mostly) against his war for a myriad of reasons and just want him to get our kids out of the country they've invaded before anymore of them are slaughtered. We deplore his treatment of the Iraqi people and consider him outstandingly incompetent to lead this nation, due to his complete disregard for the lives of poor or, gods forbid, poor AND foreign, people. I agree that many people are being played and that many are dense, just not the ones of whom you seem to be thinking<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/wink.gif ALT=";)"> LilyPat

by **sunny** » Mon Jul 03, 2006 9:54 pm

Bush is stupid, incompetent, and evil, a ffightening combination. And they do hate us for our freedoms-the freedom of mind lacking in the syncophantic boobs the elites are using, the ones who are collaborating in our demise. Those folks are just useless eaters, but helpful in tyranizing their fellow citizens (us) into following the party line, intimidating them(us) into shutting up about everything Dear Leader has in his tiny little mind to do, and creating the illusion of consent. How do they hate us? Let me count the ways. By killing us in wars, by lack of health care, hunger, unsafe working conditions, diseases they create, diseases they refuse to find a cure for, deadly pharmaceuticals, toxic pollution, and global warming. They drive us mad with propaganda, base and degrading entertainment, disinformation and psyops, mind control and ritual abuse, fear of nuclear war and rumors of wars, useless politicians ignoring the voters, stealing elections, calling them fair, and telling us to "get over it," and mind altering pharmaceuticals. Everyday in every way they show us how much they hate us, marginalizing even their supporters, tossing them aside when it is inconvenient to pander to them. Pushing peace loving people into making statements about violence they never thought they would make. Wouldn't that be the icing on the cake, giving them just the excuse they'll need to shoot us down in the street?

by **chiggerbit** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 12:01 am

I'm convinced that Bush is a Narcissistic Personality Disorder, and is unable to see beyond his sick, self-centered, vengeful view of what the world should be. (If you don't think a Personality disorder is serious, remember that the young man who is now accused of raping and murdering a 15-year-old Iraqi girl and murdering three members of her family [one a child] was discharged because he has a Personality Disorder.) Take a look at this description, and then think about Bush. Fits, doesn't it? Scary thought that this may describe our President. <a href="http://www.operationdoubles.com/narc/index.htm?characteristicsofnpd.htm">www.operationdoubles.com/...sofnpd.htm</a> Characteristics of NPD Home NPD belongs to a class of personality disorders known as Cluster B, the "dramatic/emotional/erratic" personality disorders. This class includes Histrionic, Borderline, and Antisocial personality disorders. The most heavily researched personality disorders are two in this group, Borderline and Antisocial personality disorder. This is because people with these disorders appear for treatment in large numbers. Borderlines are often forced into treatment because of socially disruptive behavior. Antisocials often get into trouble with the law and are evaluated by court order, then forced into treatment. Current epidemiological research permits no reliable estimate of how prevalent NPD is in society. Officially, the principal characteristics of NPD are: • inflated self-esteem • lack of empathy for others • feeling entitled to special treatment and privileges • disagreeableness That says nothing about the all-consuming need for ALL available attention that bears fruit in these character traits. Since the real world conflicts with their view of themselves, narcissists live in a fantasy world of their own creation. This is like the fantasy world little children live in. If you think way back to your earliest memories, you can barely remember what this fantasy world was like. Imagine it persisting into adulthood! Little children are the stars of their fantasies and are preoccupied with them. Imagine an adult with that going on in her or his head! Like the fantasies of little children, these fantasies aggrandize the narcissist's importance, service, and accomplishments. (This is a child's way of coping with being so small and faulty and insignificant in a world of giants.) Their version of their participation in any endeavor leaves everybody else out of the picture. In fact, they may even drive another out of a picture to have the spotlight all to themselves. So, unlike the normal child who outgrows her imaginary friend, a narcissist's whole life is a tea party with her imaginary friends. It's a storyteller's fiction. Like a little child she lives in all day long. While doing so, she can even interact with you and seem to be "with it" — till she says or does something that let's you know she's not all there. Like when she asks you to set a place at the table for her imaginary friend. A narcissist is an adult who never relinquishes her preference for this fantasy over reality. And so, like a little child, she just erases reality whenever she wants by editing it into a new chapter in her autobiographical work of fiction. In fact, the best way to understand a narcissist is to picture them as a little child — a spoiled brat — doing whatever they're doing. You immediately see that what you're dealing with is an adult with the mentality of a spoiled child. And once you see that, you know where they're coming from and what they're up to. A fantasy, of course, is a lie. One must constantly lie to oneself to maintain a fantasy. It takes little thought to see why believing a known lie was the Original Sin. A preference for fantasy over Truth is natural in little children. What magic thinking a lie and then believing it does! Magical Thinking is natural in little children, too. But children choose to leave Never Never Land at the proverbial Age of Reason. Narcissists never do. Since they lie to themselves constantly, malignant narcissists are pathological liars who lie to everybody else too. Their sense of entitlement proceeds from these fantasies, these delusions of importance and grandeur. It exempts narcissists from rules that apply to others. This is common among the high and mighty who view themselves as superior: they need an inferior set of standards to live up to. (Their upside-down logic, not mine.) Narcissists are prone to rage when others don't behave in a way that reflects their grand specialness. In other words, at the drop of a hat. Sometimes this is a seething rage, sometimes a violent one. Rage is a primitive emotion, common in little children during a temper tantrum but rare in adults. Adults normally experience rage only in extreme situations like combat or when under attack by the severe abuse of some willful and wanton outrage. Even then, adults rarely let 'er rip. Like absolute dictators, narcissists feel no need to restrain themselves — unless the coast isn't clear and they might get a bad reputation or land in jail. In other words, they are as irresponsible as children, too. Nothing is so aggrandizing as power. Hence narcissists are control freaks. Like Katharina (the shrew) in Shakespeare's Taming of the Shrew, they cross people and disagree at every turn. They play Keep Away with things others want. In short, they deal in power plays. To feel their power, they domineer. Whenever they can get away with it, they boss people around to a ridiculous degree by issuing arbitrary and pointless orders, such as to sit in a different chair or to clean a different room first. Always testing their boundaries, they learn at a young age the art of "shock and awe" in using a sudden temper tantrum to blind-side and run a playmate over. Since power used to bash and destroy is spectacular, and power used to defend or build isn't so much fun, they bash and destroy. They get a big charge — almost erotic pleasure — out of bashing and destroying, because of the power rush they get. And they view others as objects to be powerful on. So, they have as much regard for others' feelings as we do for a nail we are hitting with a hammer. Which is why they have no compunctions about exploiting people. Narcissists are not the only people who have no humanity though. Neither do psychopaths. And neither do infants or toddlers, who will abuse smaller children and animals on a whim with nothing but keen interest in the victim's suffering. In fact, all people can turn off their human sensibilities like a light switch. This ability is adaptive. It enables us to function in ordeals such as combat or natural disaster. Unfortunately, it also enables us to watch a lynching or a burning at the stake or the Holocaust. Narcissists and psychopaths are unique in that they have that light switch permanently turned off for everyone but themselves. And I mean "everyone," even their own children. In fact, they don't know what humanity is. They think it's having hurt feelings — for themselves. They do try to pass for normal. It is well documented that they often (badly) imitate the normal human feelings they see in others by putting on melodramatic shows of "concern" and "sympathy" that are so overdone one sometimes wonders if it is parody. Since no one but the narcissist is worthy of any attention/regard in his version of the world, the narcissist hates it when reality intrudes on this delusion. He is typified by the wicked queen on the fairy tale of Sleeping Beauty: "Mirror, mirror on the wall, who is the fairest of them all?" Like her, the narcissist is consumed with pathological envy. He projects this distressing emotion off onto the one he envies. That is, he fantasizes that the victim envies him. That gives the narcissist all the excuse he needs to "protect" himself by attacking. We normally think of little children as sweet and innocent. But, when you think twice, you realize that it's a good thing they're so small, inexperienced, and controllable. Indeed, it is often (and truly) said that the most terrible thing in the world is a grown up child. Take Adolph Hitler, for example. Nero. Saddam Hussein. Stalin. Power without accountability. So, if you are dealing with a malignant narcissist, never forget for a moment that you are dealing with a mind that works exactly like a little child's. It is as impulsive as a little child's. And reason and morality will have no more influence on it than they have on a little child's. The official diagnostic criteria are of limited value to the lay person, because they but encapsulate reams of medical doctrine. But here they are: Diagnostic Criteria for NPD: "[NPD is] a pervasive pattern of grandiosity (in fantasy or behavior), need for admiration, and lack of empathy, beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by five (or more) of the following: • has a grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements) • is preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love • believes that he or she is "special" and unique and can only be understood by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions) • requires excessive admiration • has a sense of entitlement, i.e., unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with his or her expectations • is interpersonally exploitative, i.e., takes advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends • lacks empathy: is unwilling to recognize or identify with the feelings and needs of others • is often envious of others or believes that others are envious of him or her • shows arrogant, haughty behaviors or attitudes." Features associated with NPD are: • Depressed Mood • Dramatic/Erratic/Antisocial Personality It is a small step from malignantly narcissistic behavior to the aggressive-sadistic behavior of a sociopath. In fact, many authorities on the subject view Narcissistic Personality Disorder as a "milder" form of Antisocial Personality Disorder. Perhaps the root of it. They also believe that those severely affected are prone to psychotic breaks. Yet even those mildly affected are not harmless. Consider what hilarious Elizabeth on the British comedy Keeping Up Appearances does to the lives of those around her. She makes her husband dreary, her son pathetic, and her next-door neighbor a nervous wreck. Not really so funny. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=chiggerbit@rigorousintuition>chiggerbit</A> at: 7/3/06 10:27 pm

by **chiggerbit** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 12:08 am

And the people who surround bush--Cheny, Rove, and the rest--understand at some level that Bush is disturbed, and manipulate that disturbance for their own ends. Easy to do so long as they pander to the Prince's ego. I'm just remembering something that I read about Rove, about how obseqious he is in Bush's presence. Interesting. Basically, what we end up with is a person who is " interpersonally exploitative, i.e., takes advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends" being exploited and manipulated by others much more exploitive than himself. The difference is that those who exploit Bush are much more competent at exploitation because they have had more practice being competent in other spheres of their lives, but Bushie has been spoiled and surrounded with cushioning from the results of his incompetence. He has never, ever been forced to grow up. In other words, we have a child in charge. And, no, I'm not a mental health professional, just a decent googler. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=chiggerbit@rigorousintuition>chiggerbit</A> at: 7/4/06 12:13 am

by **yesferatu** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 12:59 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr> Huh? Quote:Of course the idiot Bush-Is-Incompetent crowd of liberals think Bush is incompetent cuz he can't win the war No, actually, we think he's incompetent due to his many mind-bogglingly moronic remarks<hr></blockquote> There are faaaaaar too many liberals who buy into the ongoing criminal atrocity as a "war" that ought to be "won" ...."since we are there". And so blame Bush's "incompetence" for the "bad news" coming out of there. Too many quote marks? Intended.

by **LilyPatToo** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 1:05 am

I couldn't agree more. And if you have any doubt at all that $hrub's childhood was hell, read Kitty Kelley's book "The Bush Clan" and Tarpley and Chaitkin's great unauthorized bio of his father, evil ol' GHW Bu$h here -- <a href="http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm">www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm</a> one of the very best free reads online, IMHO. For over half of my life, I went from the clutches of one narcissist to another, then to sociopaths who made me appreciate how lucky I'd been to only have had to survive narcissists up until then. Anyone like me should be able to spot an obvious narcissist like $hrub and many did, myself among them. But a surprising number did not. They're charming as hell, for one thing. And they frequently are also extremely charismatic, surrounding themselves with a chorus of worshippers who serve to shield them from scrutiny that gets to be too acute. Some of the "W" quotes in Kelley's book will (or at least *should*) set off lots of alarm bells for sane folks. He's a foul-mouthed, ignorant bully and a mean drunk and has been one all his life, whenever a handler wasn't nearby to muzzle him. But, with GHW for a Daddy, there's usually been such a person riding herd on the reprobate, so he can project that folksy charm and wow the adoring morons whenever necessary. Actually, his father is a lot scarier to me, personally, but sonny boy has done an appallling amount of damage in the brief time he's been in office. How much of it was no more than marrionette work by his handlers, we may not learn for a long time, but there's no doubt in my mind that when it comes to sheer meanness and total lack of empathy or conscience, he's capable of appalling cruelty all on his own. LilyPat

by **chiggerbit** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 1:07 am

No, yesferatu, the incompetence is that we are in the Middle East at all, which most of us understood from the beginning to be a no-win situation. At least here, we did.

by **chiggerbit** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 1:20 am

They're charming as hell, for one thing. And they frequently are also extremely charismatic, The charm is only skin deep for the discerning, LilyPatToo. Have you ever noticed how much the Bush's public mannerisms resemble Pat Robertson's, almost as a parody of Robertson? Probably with the intent to appeal to the religious reicht. But, the Bush can't even be original. Skin deep and done before.

by **LilyPatToo** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 1:27 am

OMG, you noticed that too--?! I've even seen photos where they resembled each other amazingly....scary, huh?<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/eek.gif ALT=":eek"> LilyPat

by **Forgetting2** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 1:33 am

That NPD definition fits him perfectly. What a friggin' nightmare. <img src="http:///Volumes/Storage A/Storage A/Political/Dubya Pix/Bush Family fotos/HS551.jpg" style="border:0;"/>

by **chiggerbit** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 1:47 am

Remember Bush's USS Abraham Lincoln "Mission Accomplished" tailhook landing? Ego, childish play costume-dressup, drama? preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love requires excessive admiration Dramatic/Erratic/Antisocial Personality Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=chiggerbit@rigorousintuition>chiggerbit</A> at: 7/3/06 11:51 pm

by **chiggerbit** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 1:56 am

has a sense of entitlement, i.e., unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with his or her expectations Remember Bush's "you're with us or against us" position with regards to the rest of the world in trying to unite his "coalition of the willing", the "willing" having to be bribed?

by **chiggerbit** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 1:59 am

This is where "They hate our freedoms" comes from: is often envious of others or believes that others are envious of him or her

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