Kicked off the DU???

[Dreams End]

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr> Well, when I used the word Jew I thought it was more PC than using the term Zionist.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>First of all, I'm pretty tired of the term "PC." Let me digress and give you the history of that term as I experienced it. Back in the mid eighties I attended Brown University (only lasted one year due to finances and had a small...okay, ten year...break before sophomore year at a school in L.A.) This was still during the cold war so there were plenty of "communist" threats out there for the right to get bothered over. At that time, "politically correct" was an insult meaning "you pretend you are politically aware and active and yet we know you are going out into corporate America as soon as you leave this school." In other words, it meant a politically insincere leftist.<br><br>Since the cold war, the right needed something to chew on, so before it could create enough terrorism to bark at, PC was the enemy of the day. It was simply code for "closet marxist". <br><br>So now I get tired of people complaining about being attacked because something is not "PC." Usually, it means they wish to use racial epithets of their own choosing and are offended that members of the race in question are unhappy about it.<br><br>Now, if I were Jewish, I would certainly take offense that my entire religion had just been considered responsible for 9/11. You wanna call that being worried about political correctness, go right ahead. But I think it is clear what's really going on.<br><br>Now, in case you are as unaware as your quote implies, I will let you know that Zionism is a political movement, not a race or a religion. It is one that, for the most part, I disagree with, as it has led to great suffering for the Palestinian people. <br><br>But Zionism can also be "code" for "Jewish conspiracy to rule the world". So, even when critiquing Zionism for its impact on Palestinians, I am uncomfortable with the term, because so many use it in that latter sense. <br><br>As for this:<br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>"I take hope in knowing that there are plenty of Jews actively opposed to their government's genocidal policies."<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>I'm just going to assume that you are really naive and simply don't understand how condescending that sounds. It also undermines your original point. If there are Jews working across the political spectrum, for and against various policies...then why single them out as a class in the first place? <br><br> <p></p><i></i>

[Qutb]

Jello has a way with words... <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START :lol --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> I love his lyrics.<br><br>I don't know about Clark. I prefer him to Hillary, but still, this man is former Supreme Allied Commander Europe and an investment banker with Jackson Stephens' firm. That's two data points which in conjunction gives you a general idea of where this guy is coming from. If only he wasn't so damn <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>sensible</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END-->. I couldn't help but cheer him when I heard his joint testimony with Richard Perle before Congress. And when he's on Fox he's a beacon of reason in the midst of a sea of idiocy. But of course, that's probably how I'm supposed to feel about him. I'm in the target group. <br><br>Clark is probably best summarized as "friendly globalist", of the "humanitarian intervention" type. He belongs to the faction in the military/intelligence apparatus that didn't support the war on Iraq, but he's still selling another justification of militaristic globalism elsewhere, of the soft and caring and human rights-concious type of course, militaristic globalism for leftists. He's on the same team as George Soros.<br><br>Remember General Michael Jackson's remark to him in the immediate aftermath of the war on Serbia: I'm not starting World War III for you! - Clarke wanted to confront the Russian forces that had rushed in and taken the Pristina airport. Hmm, that's not quite Clarke the multilateralist diplomat as he presents himself today now is it? It was forces under his command that bombed the Chinese embassy in Belgrade too...<br><br>On a more personal note, during that war I found myself in Croatia hanging out with Serbian expats. They were constantly trying to call home, of course, to make sure their relatives were ok. We watched Serbian tv for more detailed updates than CNN and EuroNews provided on what exactly was going on, and I remember the screen going black because Clark's NATO forces had bombed the tv station in the middle of a broadcast. I remember the NATO spokesman Jamie Shea justifying that bombing on the grounds that they were "spreading propaganda". That made me quite nauseous. <p></p><i></i>

[Qutb]

Jello has a way with words... <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START :lol --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> I love his lyrics.<br><br>I don't know about Clark. I prefer him to Hillary, but still, this man is former Supreme Allied Commander Europe and an investment banker with Jackson Stephens' firm. That's two data points which in conjunction gives you a general idea of where this guy is coming from. If only he wasn't so damn <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>sensible</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END-->. I couldn't help but cheer him when I heard his joint testimony with Richard Perle before Congress. And when he's on Fox he's a beacon of reason in the midst of a sea of idiocy. But of course, that's probably how I'm supposed to feel about him. I'm in the target group. <br><br>Clark is probably best summarized as "friendly globalist", of the "humanitarian intervention" type. He belongs to the faction in the military/intelligence apparatus that didn't support the war on Iraq, but he's still selling another justification of militaristic globalism elsewhere, of the soft and caring and human rights-concious type of course, militaristic globalism for leftists. He's on the same team as George Soros.<br><br>Remember General Michael Jackson's remark to him in the immediate aftermath of the war on Serbia: I'm not starting World War III for you! - Clarke wanted to confront the Russian forces that had rushed in and taken the Pristina airport. Hmm, that's not quite Clarke the multilateralist diplomat as he presents himself today now is it?<br><br>On a more personal note, during that war I found myself in Croatia hanging out with Serbian expats. They were constantly trying to call home, of course, to make sure their relatives were ok. We watched Serbian tv for more detailed updates than CNN and EuroNews provided, and I remember the screen going black because Clarke's NATO forces had bombed the tv station in the middle of a broadcast. I remember the NATO spokesman Jamie Shea justifying that bombing on the grounds that they were "spreading propaganda". That made me quite nauseous. <p></p><i></i>

[Starman]

Quite right, Dreams End;<br>Excellant points and comment;<br><br>I was less than clear or on-track or aware than I should have been -- Specifiying the neocon's Judaic heritage as a defining characteristic to account for their manipulating American Foreign Policy towards Israeli goals was terrifically flawed, perpetuating a gross stereotypal error that feeds oversimplistic generalization.<br><br>My bad.<br><br>Too true -- Calling and being aware of such errors IS very needful.<br>Good job.<br>Starman<br><br>And BTW: I admit, I'm ashamed (but at least I woke-up soon after), when Moore endorsed Clark I was taken-in -- and by-God I SHOULD have known better, since Clark played such a primary role in the horrible fraud and betrayal which was the joint US/NATO dismantling of Yugoslavia for economic and geopolitical purposes. I learned a lesson about *Thimking* before I jumped onboard what was marketted as a seemingly good-idea. I've since had the opportunity to reflect on where Moore's coming-from and beholden to. But I should have seen a major red-flag and discounted Clark's revised PR posture in light of which evident Masters he had faithfully served. As I recall, hadn't he stated he was willing to have been the GOP candidate but was rebuffed, so he took the next-best job-offer?<br><br>But cripes, I doubt than ANYBODY who the corporatocracy can't subvert would ever be allowed to become a viable pres. candidate. 'Land of the Free' is one of the biggest scams going.<br>-S <p></p><i></i>

[Al Gomas]

Well, this is a ridiculous mine field of terminology isn't it? Let's see if I have this straight, when critiquing the State of Israel and it's inhabitants one should refrain from using the words Jew or Zionist. <!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/eyes.gif">www.ezboard.com/images/em...s/eyes.gif</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br>That leaves Israeli as being the least racially loaded term I guess. Whatever the case, they seem to wield disproportionate power over my free speech rights. I wish they (oops, there I go again, painting with a broad brush) were as sensitive to Palestinian feelings as they expect us to be towards theirs.<br><br>Did you catch Democracy Now on Tuesday? The settlers are being compensated for all their inconveniences to the tune of 2 billion dollars. That 2 billion dollars is expected to come from us, the taxpayers of America. To top it off, the whole exercise is meant to distract from the increased settlement activity in the West Bank.<br>So, if I am reading you correctly, my outrage about that and other Israeli crimes may be appropriate but bitching about it in public is somehow inappropriate. <br>I also don't understand why my "taking hope in knowing there are Jews actively opposed to their government" is a condescending remark. After all, I am horrified at what is being done in my name as an American but I take hope in the resistance I see around me. <br>Maybe I am really naive but I believe the anti-Semitic stigma attached to criticism of Israel is a masterful tactic used to deflect any serious discussion of State crime. <p></p><i></i>

[slimmouse]

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Maybe I am really naive but I believe the anti-Semitic stigma attached to criticism of Israel is a masterful tactic used to deflect any serious discussion of State crime<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br> For a truly classical overview of the marriage of the murdering menaces, and the targetted ( and clearly )racist asphyxiation of everything that any true blooded human being would like our society to represent, one could do much worse than read the following article ;<br><br> <!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://censoringthought.org/massadresponsetoreport.html">censoringthought.org/mass...eport.html</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br> I would suggest that the following example, and the treatment of this man, could be broadly 'supersized' to illustrate the way that most of the MMS and the PTB in the US is currently working - Their attitudes, ignorances, and the concsious action of the selling of their souls.<br><br> Truly mindblowing, not to mention despicably disturbing. <p></p><i></i>