Preparing for Persecution

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Preparing for Persecution

Postby NavnDansk » Fri Aug 10, 2007 7:15 pm


July 2007
IRAQ: Christian persecution in Iraq getting worse: "[Pastor] White says he was given some disturbing news at a congregational meeting this month. '...36 of my congregation in that past week had been kidnapped. None of them have been returned.'.... Christians in Iraq are facing severe persecution from Islamic radicals.... 'They have been, as we heard earlier, kidnapped, killed, tortured, massacred.'" See Suffering with Jesus

LIBYA: At least 500 Eritreans have been rounded up for forcible return: "...any Eritrean nationals deported would be at particular risk of torture and other serious human rights violations. At least 500 Eritrean nationals are reportedly detained in Libya.... The treatment has reportedly included beatings with iron rods, death threats and, in several cases, sexual abuse of women detainees."

Children arrested in dawn raid on Christians in Eritrea: "At least twenty Christians were arrested by Eritrean security forces on the morning of Sunday, May 27. Among those detained were young children. The raid... is a continuation of the extensive government crackdown on Christian activity....during the recent raid security forces expected to find Christians participating in a prayer meeting. However, when they failed to uncover such activity, they decided to detain everyone in the home they had raided as well as other people in the surrounding neighborhood." See Persecution

Persecution. 50 protest at Eritrean Embassy over detention of Christians: "There are currently around 2,000 Christians imprisoned without charge or trial for their faith in Eritrea. Many of these prisoners have faced severe mistreatment, including being held in solitary confinement in metal shipping containers in the desert." See Prayer

Preparing for Victory

Preparing for Persecution

Home | Persecution Index | Victory | Armor of God |

True stories for children: Index
God's Word: What the Bible Tells Us About Persecution
Victory in the midst of persecution: Polycarp | Heavenly Man
Day of No Return | Missionaries in China | Bonhoeffer

Links: Nazi Persecution


On a cold drizzly day in early 1998, I took a sobering tour through the Holocaust Museum in Washington DC. A picture of a Gestapo officer brought back memories of the Nazi soldiers that guarded our neighborhood in Norway during World War II. Young as I was -- I was born in Oslo early in the war -- I will never forget the piercing air raids, the thundering war planes, our hiding place in the basement, and the sounds of exploding bombs and fires around us.

My young father was part of the "Hjemme Fronten" (the Home Front) -- an underground army of loyal Norwegians who would rather die than submit to Nazi tyranny. Caught helping other brave soldiers escape into neutral Sweden, he endured hunger, torture, and the threat of death in three concentration camps before his release at the end of the war. Through the years of oppression, we all learned to treasure our freedom.

The Norwegian people hadn't known tyranny until the Nazi warships sailed up the Oslofjord on April 9, 1940. Overnight, Hitler's fascism replaced liberty, and trusted friends became foes. Resistance to the new ideology could cost our lives. Yet, how could we submit to evil and betray our king?

We couldn't! For most Norwegians, the choice was clear. Unlike Hitler's masses, we hadn't been weakened by years of ceaseless propaganda, slogans, service, and celebrations dedicated to the triumph of National Socialism.

My journey through the Holocaust museum began in the section dedicated to Nazi propaganda. Pausing by each display, I was startled by words that could so easily describe America today. The quotes brought stark reminders that, apart from God, human nature doesn't change with time. Nor do the aims of the spiritual mastermind behind the scenes who has always sought ways to stir hatred toward God's people. One tactic was simply to provide nice-sounding alternatives to biblical loyalty and service.

"Individuals were urged to sacrifice themselves for a greater 'People's Community,'" announced one of the displays. Such slogans must have sounded good to the masses, for few saw the cruel manipulation behind the noble words.

I thought of President Clinton's calls for "sacrifice", "service, "unity", "common values", "civil society," and "safe" communities. How many people today see the ominous new meanings behind these nice sounding words?

Another display stated that-

"elementary schools became forums of public indoctrination.

"The Gestapo gathered much of its information from private citizens. Even children were taught to report on their parents. The Gestapo's main sources, however, were Nazi party officials. who constantly monitored the activities of all citizens [and] used such information to track political opponents."

If you have read our articles, you know that America's leaders are using intrusive surveys, assessments, and classroom encounter groups to persuade children to divulge private information about their family's faith, values, disciplines, and church attendance. As in Nazi Germany, socialization, not academic learning, has become the primary goal of education. Children are learning the group thinking and socialist values needed for the envisioned 21st century communities and global workforce.

Do you find this hard to believe? Many do. That's why we urge you to read some of our articles that document the "paradigm shift" from American individualism and freedom to collectivism and control. Just go to our "articles" page and find the following reports that will help you and your loved ones understand and prepare for the growing hostility toward biblical Christianity:

* Clinton's War on Hate Bans Christian Values
* The Giver: Serving A Greater Whole
* The Enemy of The People?
* What Happened to Parents' Rights?
* The UN Plan For Global Control: A Report on Habitat II
* Local Agenda 21 - The U.N. Plan for Your Community
* The Nazi Model For Outcome-Based Education
* A National Information System: Executive Order #13011
* Character Training For Global Citizenship
* Workforce Development Means Life-Long Indoctrination

Remember, the new set of global values, based on a blend of earth-centered beliefs, socialist ideology, and globalist goals, rule out biblical boundaries and absolutes. Genuine Christianity simply won't fit.

Our political, legal and education systems have been infiltrated by leaders who have betrayed America for a hollow vision of a global village. Hollywood has taught our children to delight in evil, while schools immerse them in pagan rituals to other gods. Many church leaders are ashamed to mention sin and the cross, and most "Christians" are drifting with the trends, too distracted to know or care.

We shouldn't be surprised. Again and again, the Old Testament shows our natural inclination to drift toward apathy, compromise, rebellion, and paganism -- anything but God Himself. It's happening in America, and 1 Corinthians 10:1-11 tells us that we are not immune to consequences like those that destroyed ancient Israel. Did we forget?

God told us repeatedly what would happen to a nation that that refuses to follow its Shepherd. Listen to this warning and see how it fits our times:

"When you have eaten and are satisfied, praise the Lord your God for the good land He has given you. Be careful that you do not forget... Otherwise... your heart will become proud.... You may say to yourself, 'My power and the strength of my hands have produced this wealth for me.' ... If you ever forget the Lord your God and follow other gods... you will surely be destroyed." Deuteronomy 8:10-20

Having left their Father's protection, God's beloved Israel faced famine, war, slavery, and oppression. When they cried out to God, He restored them, but their peace and prosperity didn't last long. Soon the cycle of apathy, compromise, rebellion and oppression began once again.

God may withdraw His protection from a nation that turns to other gods, but He never fails to guard and guide those who remain faithful to Him. He doesn't promise to save us from pain and persecution, but in the midst of suffering we can count on His strength and loving presence.

Remember, "the whole world is under the control of the evil one" [1 John 5:19]. Satan's subjects will always despise our King, twist His truth, and hate His people. Why should we not expect opposition?

Jesus described the normal Christian life: "If they persecute Me, they will also persecute you," He told His disciples, "for they do not know Him who sent me." John 15:20-21

We need to take His warning to heart, count the cost of discipleship, and pray to be prepared for inevitable battles. Prayerfully consider these steps -- as a family or as an individual believer:

1. Pray for His guidance.

2. Learn from those who suffered persecution because of their faith. (See "victory" at the top)
3. Memorize His Word, the victorious "Sword of the Spirit" in every battle we face. (See Clothed with Truth)

4. Memorize hymns and songs that enable you to keep praising Him and affirming His victory.
5. Silently practice singing to Him in the midst of all kinds of distractions.
6. Practice giving thanks in all circumstances.

7. By His wonderful grace, "love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you." Matthew 5:44-45[

"...let us run with endurance the race that is set before us, looking unto Jesus, Who for the joy that was set before Him endured the cross. For consider Him who endured such hostility from sinners against Himself, lest you become weary and discouraged." Hebrew 12:1-3

Those who choose uncompromising discipleship will find an unspeakable joy in His nearness. Stephen did. (See Acts 7) Remember how his face shone as his persecutors hurled the stones that crushed his body. Like him, we may demonstrate to a needy world the overcoming power of the majestic, heavenly King who reached down to earth to love us like a Father.

When I was little, I loved our Norwegian king. Like him, I wanted to be brave enough to die rather than surrender. Years later I learned that this wonderful leader was nothing compared to my heavenly King. Yet my earthly king and the years of war, danger, and deprivation gave me a vision of genuine Christianity that I continue to treasure. I saw that we, His bride and Church, are like a nation of loyal subjects -

* who love and obey their King
* who discover in their common devotion and warfare a fellowship that can rarely be found apart from persecution
* who refuse to compromise, and
* who persevere until death -- or until the war is won.

To sustain us through the battles ahead, our King gave us many precious promises. Few bring me more delight than the following words from our Master. May they fill you with joy at the unspeakable privilege of serving our sovereign King, following in His footsteps, and sharing His resurrection life for all eternity.

"Blessed are you when men hate you, and when they exclude you, and revile you, and cast out your name as evil, for the Son of Man's sake. Rejoice in that day and leap for joy! For indeed your reward is great in heaven." Luke 6:22-23

See also Persecution News and Persecution Scriptures

Home | Persecution Index | Victory | Armor of God | Pictures of Auschwitz
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Postby NavnDansk » Fri Aug 10, 2007 7:34 pm

Preparing for Victory


His Word
Topical Index of Scriptures
Encouraging Poems
Bible Studies
The Names of God

The Hand of God in History
The Armor of God
What it means to be a Christian

Sermons & Devotional Messages

Encouraging Stories & Testimonies

Missionary Stories
Preparing for Persecution

What the Bible tells us about Persecution

The Cross and the Resurrection
The Triumph of the Cross
Scriptures for our Times
The Invisible War
An Eternal Perspective

Oswald Chambers Topical Index
A Parable for Today

Offsite: Richardson's Pipes

Unequal Contenders in the Spiritual War

God and Satan are not two equal powers in a dualistic battle between good and evil. Our Lord reigns as the supreme Creator and King of the universe. His sovereign will is being accomplished in the world whether or not His creatures accept Him as Lord.

The relationship between God and His creation God's challenging questions go on and on... questions that only our all wise King would be able to answer. They served their purpose. God intended to restore all that He allowed Satan to steal from his faithful servant, Job. But first He chose to give Job an important lesson. He would leave no doubt as to who made the universe, ordered the cycles of water and vapor, ruled the winds and cared for the animals.

The eternal omnipotent God who knows all things and declared "the end from the beginning" has no equals. The fallen angel who has so arrogantly opposed his Maker has only limited time left to wield his finite weapons. He knows well -- and we would be wise to remember -- that our God, the source of all wisdom and power, is infinitely greater!

"Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and His ways past finding out! ... For of Him and through Him and to Him are all things, to Whom be glory forever." Romans 11:33-36


Barbed Wire Camps for American Citizens

By a Christian friend who prefers to remain anonymous

July 10, 2007

For background information, see WHO, UNESCO, Universal Forums of Culture and Enemy of the People

"The Master Arrest Warrant... directs the head of the FBI to: arrest persons whom I [the U.S. Attorney General] deem dangerous to the public peace and safety. These persons are to be detained and confined until further order.'"1

"[Y]ou could, in the name of stopping terrorism... evoke the military and arrest Americans and put them in detention camps." (U.S. Congressman Henry Gonzalez)2

"‘Intelligence Activities, Senate Resolution 21' exposed the covert agenda... to monitor, infiltrate, arrest and incarcerate a potentially large segment of American society."3.


America is building internment camps for civilians. President Reagan had a program for building these camps, and it has been reactivated by President Bush. A subsidiary of Halliburton has been given a five-year contract to build internment camps (each capable of holding 5,000 people) from 2006 through 2010.6

The stated purpose for these camps is "in the event of an emergency influx of immigrants into the U.S., or to support the rapid development of new programs."7 However, if a sudden influx of immigrants is really the reason, then why wasn't a fence built on the Mexican border years ago? And why isn't the fence being built now? (They were supposed to build a 700 mile fence, but only 2 miles were built.)

In addition, there is that troubling phrase "to support the rapid development of new programs." That is so open-ended that it could include almost anything. Could it include incarcerating American citizens who value our liberty and our national sovereignty, and try to warn the public about things that endanger our freedom? [See Homeland Security and the transformation of America and The Enemy of the People].

..The 1975 Senate report also exposed the existence of the Master Search Warrant and the Master Arrest Warrant. These were never terminated. They are still in force. The Master Arrest Warrant authorizes the U.S. Attorney General to give the head of the FBI instructions to "Arrest persons whom I deem dangerous to the public peace and safety. These persons are to be detained and confined until further order."

("...whom I deem" -- so there is no accountability and no basis for appealing the incarceration.) The Master Search Warrant authorizes the head of the FBI to search premises where "it is believe that there may be found" certain items. ("...may be found" -- so no probable cause is needed; searches can be done for any reason.) The items to be searched for are anything that violates "the Proclamation of the President" and they include "firearms, shortwave radio receiving sets, cameras, propaganda materials, printing presses, mimeograph machines..." ("Propaganda materials" would be writings that are not considered to be politically correct.) (The 1975 Senate report mentioned "printing presses" and "mimeograph machines." Today, items searched for would probably include computers, fax machines, and copiers.)The Army recently released information about the Pentagon's Civilian Inmate Labor Program. It gives guidelines for "civilian inmate labor programs and civilian prison camps on Army installations."10

When you put that together with the building program for detention camps, it looks as if civilian prisoners will be an involuntary labor force in military detention camps. Journalist Peter Dale Scott believes that these "detention centers could be used to detain American citizens if the Bush administration were to declare martial law."11 (Future administrations could do the same thing.)

Following Hurricane Katrina, President Bush asked Congress to give him the power to use the military in law enforcement for emergencies such as a bird flu epidemic or a national disaster like Hurricane Katrina.

Some political commentators see this as being "akin to introducing martial law."12 We need to remember Lord Acton's warning that "Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely."9..If there is a wide-spread protest against amnesty for illegal aliens, could the President declare martial law and put the protestors in those camps? Could Americans who object to things that undermine the freedoms guaranteed by the First Amendment be imprisoned there? Could U.S. citizens be incarcerated in those camps for objecting to things that compromise our national sovereignty?
It looks as if these will be military work camps for civilian prisoners. If so, then their similarity to concentration camps is strong enough to be very disturbing. All that is lacking is guards who are hardened enough to abuse American citizens. And we are creating those hardened military personnel. According to the ACLU, 44 prisoners died in Afghanistan and Iraq while being tortured by Navy SEALs, Military Intelligence, and other governmental agencies.14

What has that done to the American men and women who had to torture them? It must have traumatized them and hardened them. That could provide the core for a tough, hardened military group to run the internment camps.

The purpose of torture is to get information, not to kill people. If 44 prisoners died while being tortured, then how many hundreds (or thousands) survived? That sounds like a large-scale operation that must be impacting and hardening a lot of American military personnel.

And there are probably other sources of hardened men and women who could man the camps. For example, after Hurricane Katrina, the streets of New Orleans were patrolled by "heavily armed paramilitary mercenaries from the Blackwater private security firm, infamous for its work in Iraq." These mercenaries have a reputation for being "some of the most feared professional killers in the world."15

I've read that hundreds of these camps already exist, and that some of them are under the jurisdiction of the United Nations. I suspect that some reports are accurate and others may mix facts with speculation or inaccurate information. Some concerns are valid fears, while others may be paranoia. The valid fears need to be investigated. And history demonstrates that sometimes even fears that seem to be paranoid are worth investigating. In Nazi Germany, Hitler intended to do things that were unthinkable and incomprehensible. Some people recognized the danger signs and tried to warn others, but they were dismissed as being paranoid. Unfortunately, their fears proved to be realistic and well founded...According to the Cato Institute, President Bush has significantly expanded the powers of the Federal Government.17 However, I don't know whether or not the President would be able to suspend the Constitution if he declared martial law.

The combination of building these camps, developing plans for declaring martial law, increased federal power, and the question of whether or not the Constitution can be suspended, is worrisome. However, as Christians, we need to remember that our true citizenship is in Heaven.

The Bible is not politically correct. Therefore, whatever the present purposes for these camps may be, eventually they could be used for people who follow God's standards instead of political correctness. Bible-believing Christians, who disturb the "public peace" by warning others about the UN guidelines for "tolerance" and "unity" and "community," could wind up in those camps.

However, God makes ALL things work out for good for people who love Him. (Romans 8:Twenty-Eight) His grace is sufficient for us. (2 Corinthians 12:9) And He is able to keep us from falling. (Jude 1:24) "I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee," He promises us. "In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world." (John 16:33)

"Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid." (John 14:27)

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Postby H_C_E » Wed Aug 29, 2007 4:57 pm

So is it just me, or is this forum sort of an odd place for Christian folk to be hanging out?

Not that it matters to me, it just seems to be showing up frequently if irregularly and seems a bit counter-intuitive.
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Postby Penguin » Thu Aug 30, 2007 12:25 pm

Yes, excuse me for being a blatant non-believer in any "Christs" or "gods". I have yet to see a day when these beliefs made the world any better. This is not to say im a materialist, far from it.

Spiritual and religious are two different things. Weve had far too many religions and religious people, as human kind, and far too little spirituality. Not to put anyone down, this is my view.

Spirituality I see as the intuitive link with the uni/multiverse and its energies. Perceived by the mind of man in either subconscious or conscious way, with reverence and no malice.

Religion I see as bowing down to other beings, real or imagined, and doing their bidding. Giving oneself up to these beings, in my view, is dangerous...As theres no guarantee they wont be malicious, or just hungry for you. Even more, when they happen to be imaginary, the religious institutions still have very real power over their supporters - of which we have plenty of bloody, terrible examples in almost every religion, everywhere.
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Postby NavnDansk » Thu Aug 30, 2007 2:40 pm

How bloody and terrible was the Russian Revolution and the reign of Stalin and even after de-Stalinization? The Russians and/or the elite international bankers did everything possible to stamp out religion and ban the Bible. What kind of shining example was the Soviet Union? I am a left-wing Christian and there are several political parties in Europe that bear that name. Solzhenitzen is a right-wing Christian but has some very interesting things to say about Christian spirituality and oppression.

The hungry ghosts exist with or without religion as the Soviets found out and faith and Christianity offer spiritual protection but even there you are right it takes humility and watchfulness and knowledge to discern the spirits.

Despite the Bible being banned and terrible torture and murder of Christians for 80 years in Russia and their sattelite states at least 2 generations grew up in a totally secular society with little if any access to the Bible or Christian or other spiritual writings or churches there is an explosion of building of churches (many enormous for the crowds but with simple, inexpensive box architecture) of all denominations in Russia. After the fall of the Soviet Union many churches shipped in Bibles in vast numbers so I was surprised to read in the Washington Post Book World just a few years ago that the Bible remains the best selling book in Russia year after year since it was "legalized".

Jeff Wells was an evangelical Christian as he has said in the comments on his blog and, I believe, in an interview about his novel which sounds like it is a satire on religious practices but in the vein of Flannery O'Connor. Though Jeff stated recently that he wasn't "that kind of Christian." in response to something written on a thread in this forum, you can see the influence of his Christian reading (and experiences?) in his acknowledgment in much of his writing that there is something beyond the physical, esp. as involved in the terrible violence that is, has been and will be executed by the "elites" until they are stopped by the Second Coming of Christ but we still need to try to do our part in stopping the exploitation, murder and torture.

Many of the titles of Jeff's posts in the articles he writes on his blog either reference or quote the Bible or Christian writers. He is saturated with it. :o

Dr. Spock, the baby doctor, said on a talk show in the 1970s that though he was not a Christian, he thought that the Bible should be taught in school because most of Western art and thought is based on the Bible and there are references and ideas that are incomprehensible if people do not have this foundation. Looks like no one took his advice and the Rockefeller agenda was allowed to proceed.

Maybe you should do some reading about Christianity. There has been a concerted effort to badjacket Christianity including using insane Freemasons like Pat Robertson, so if you are younger, maybe you should look outside the box that the controlled education system and mass media has placed you in. The right-wing Christians were the first to warn about the NWO, the detention camps in red states and black heliocopters and they hate the feds. Don't know where the FReepers came from, they don't know the recent history of the right-wing or about APFN or other right-wing Paul Reveres but now call the left "conspiracy theorists".

For centuries most charities have been Christian and an immense amount of suffering has been allieviated by Christians sacrificing their comfort to actually do something and not just talk about it. Though as Sojourners writes in their article about abolitionists, that current day evangelists are not know for the concern for the poor and the courage of the English abolitionists or the American Underground Railroad which was created by the evangelical Christians of the time. I think the current churches are heavily infiltrated and expensive material is produced and much given away by CFRers like Tim LeHaye and the one who wrote THE PURPOSE DRIVEN life has been outed as a long-time CFR.

And most of Western art, up until about a hundred years ago, not only refers to Christianity but the painters, sculptors, composers, novelists and other writers were deeply devout Christians.
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Postby NavnDansk » Thu Aug 30, 2007 3:40 pm

The Transfiguration of Christ light an online candle with prayers and wishes

And everyone that hath this hope within himself, purifyeth himself.

The world is very evil
The times are waxing late
Be sober and keep vigil
The Judge is at the gate:
The Judge that comes in mercy
The Judge that comes with might
To terminate the evil
To diadem the right.

Arise, arise, good Christian
Let right to wrong succeed
Let penitential sorrow
To heavenly gladness lead:
To the home of fadeless splendor
Of flowers that bear no thorn
Where they shall dwell as children
Who here as exiles mourn.

Mid power that knows no limit
And wisdom free from bound
The beatific vision
Shall glad the saints around:
The peace of all the faithful
The calm of all the blest
Inviolate, unvaried
Divinest, sweetest, best.

That peace—but who shall claim it?
The guileless in their way
Who keep the ranks of battle
Who mean the things they say:

The peace that is for heaven
And shall be for the earth:
The palace that re-echoes
With festal song and mirth.

O happy, holy portion
Reflection for the blest
True vision of true beauty
The cure for all distrest!

Strive, man to win that glory
Toil, man, to gain that light
Send hope before to grasp it
Till hope be lost in sight.

St. Bernard of Cluny 1145, Tr. John Mason Neale, 1858

Last lines of Dante’s Paradiso

High fantasy lost power and here broke off:
My will and my desire were turned by love
Yet as a wheel moves smooth from jars
The love that moves the sun and other stars.
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Postby Penguin » Fri Aug 31, 2007 2:59 am

Yes, im very familiar with Christianity. I was a believer until age 16. My family was very religious, my grandparents missionaries for their whole life. My upbringing was also evangelical Christian.
Im not as young as you think, and im not from USA..School system here, while not good, is not as bad as over there. Still, the aims are the same - good citizens for the state, critical thinking? No...And yes we did have classes on religion, meaning mostly we were taught christianity at school as well. Other religions were mostly taught about in somewhat discrediting terms.

And I do know about the issues you mention, christians vs. NWO and so on. I just see it a little differently - it makes no difference what you call yourself, if you are an enlightened
human being, willing to self-sacrifice in order to help others. These kinds of people have come from all philosophies and cultures, and its in no way a Christian thing only. Theres kernels of truth in all religions, amidst all the waste. I believe there are as many ways as there are people, a way for each person.

You could equally well use Jesus Camp and other such militant brainwashing mostrosities as evidence about christianitys role in the world...
"At the camp, Fischer stresses the need for children to purify themselves in order to be part of the "army of God." She strongly believes that children need to be in the forefront of turning America toward conservative Christian values. She also feels that Christians need to focus on training kids in religious warfare since "the enemy" are focused on training theirs."

The modern christianity has very little to do with original teaching of Jesus. The religion was hijacked early on by the Roman Empire, and most of its teachings come from there...Sin, Hell, Satan, Virginal Birth, death and resurrection etc.. The place of woman..It should more correctly be called Roman-Paulianity after Paul who mangled most of what Jesus actually taught when alive. ... ground.htm ... y/Paul.htm

"For Jesus, that people discover the Kingdom of God within themselves was the central issue in his teaching; for Paul it was the person of Jesus, not his life and teaching but his death and resurrection that was of primary significance. Those who followed Jesus before he died were drawn to him because of his life and teaching, not because they saw him as their salvation in the way Paul saw him (remember, Paul only knew the resurrected Christ)"

I can certainly feel for the original teachings...But I most certainly cannot identify with the religion as a whole. As is said in the Bible too, study everything, see what is good and keep it, throw away the rest.
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Postby NavnDansk » Fri Sep 28, 2007 2:43 am

Penguin, some of what you say about St. Paul is true, but you need to read the Gospels again for what Jesus really said. You have a Convention Wisdom idea of what Jesus actually said and need to read the Gospels as an adult, not the abridged version. The Gospels, St. Mark, St. Luke, St. John and St. Matthew are just 10% of the Bible and the most important to read and try to understand. St. John is the most beautiful, IMO, and is sometimes called the gnostic gospel and certainly contains many mystical ideas of who Jesus was and is and His Mission. For getting through the coming hard times the long section in St. John at the Last Supper esp. the High Priestly prayer in John 18 are very important and even a glance at these chapters will show that what you remember and what you have been told about Jesus' sayings and mission is very lightweight.

Someone on FireDogLake recently quoted a poll of young people and the majority believe that Germany and the US fought side by side in World War II against Russia and people on the thread started asking kids in their family what they were studying and most were not taking any history in high school. The comments about Jesus message should come from someone who has actually read the Gospels which is not as onerous as reading the whole Bible as they are very short.

Corrie Ten Boom spent the rest of her life warning Christians that the rapture would not be pre-Tribulation and that Christians were not preparing to help themselves and others when the Tribulaion period begins. Her writings and speeches are very important and she went to very violent places in Africa and elsewhere to try to help Christians who were being murdered in massive numbers.

Corrie ten Boom’s house is now the Corrie ten Boom Museum! It is located at 19 Barteljorisstraat, in the center of Haarlem, Holland. Taking a tour of the Ten Boom home is like stepping back in time. This is a home of love and laughter, prayer and praise, compassion and ultimate sacrifice. Listening to Corrie's story in her own home is a life-changing experience!

The museum displays many rare family photographs. From pictures of Corrie’s grandparents to pictures spanning Corrie’s entire life, visitors gain new insight into this family. Below are several of these treasured photographs:


For their crime of helping Jews, the Ten Boom family was sent to prison. Papa died within ten days of his arrest. He had said it would be a privilege to give his life for the Jews. Willem and his son Christiaan also died due to their imprisonments. Corrie and Betsie spent a total of ten months in three different prisons. The last was Ravensbruck Concentration Camp, located near Berlin, Germany. Betsie died there, but through a clerical error (God’s miracle), Corrie was released. Starting at age 53, she spent the next 33 years sharing what she and Betsie had learned in Ravensbruck. “There is no pit so deep that God’s love is not deeper still" and “God will enable you to forgive your enemies.”


Corrie Ten Boom


"Never be afraid to trust an unknown future to a known God."

"Joy runs deeper than despair"

"The measure of a life, after all, is not its duration, but its donation."

"Let God's promises shine on your problems."

"Worry does not empty tomorrow of its sorrow; it empties today of its strength."

"Worry is a cycle of inefficient thoughts whirling around a center of fear."


The family members were devout Christians, active members of the Dutch Reformed church, and ten Boom followed in the footsteps of one of her aunts and participated in several charitable aid projects in Haarlem. The ten Boom home and business served as a hub of activity in their neighborhood, and they regularly provided a meal to beggars and took in foster children. All the local children were especially fond of ten Boom's pious but genial father, Casper, nicknamed "Opa," or grandfather.


Anti - Semitism Alarmed Them

The ten Booms knew many Jewish families in their neighborhood; Corrie's brother, Willem, had become a minister and even ran the Dutch Reformed church's outreach program for Jews. Chancellor Adolf Hitler's rise to power in next - door Germany in 1933 alarmed them, as did subsequent reports of the harassment of Jews there. Their first clue that German Jews were simply disappearing came when business correspondence with some longtime watch - part suppliers in Germany began returning with the envelope marked "Address Unknown."

On May 10, 1940, Nazi armies invaded the Netherlands. German soldiers, having overtaken the country, inundated ten Boom's Haarlem. New laws included a requirement that every Dutch person carry an identity card at all times, and another that forced Jews to wear a yellow star on their clothing. Then, customers with Jewish surnames who had left watches for repair never came back to pick them up. Ten Boom was aware that her brother was taking in Jewish refugees, first from Germany and then from the Netherlands, France, and other places occupied by the Nazis, at the nursing home he ran in nearby Hilversum.

Ten Boom's participation in Haarlem's underground resistance movement evolved from the community social work she had done for many years. Her entrance into the this covert, civil - disobedience network came not long after the ten Booms' neighbor, a Jewish furrier named Weil, was visited by German soldiers and his store and living quarters above ransacked before him. Weil stood on the street, immobilized by shock, and ten Boom urged him to come into her shop. He said his wife was visiting relatives in Amsterdam, and wanted to warn her not to return. The ten Booms agreed to help, and found a place for him in Hilversum.


Called in Favors

Throughout the rest of 1942 and 1943, ten Boom became a key figure in the Haarlem underground movement, and the quarters above the watch shop a refuge for dozens who came and went undetected. Though in her early 50s, ten Boom irelessly helped others. The numerous contacts she had made through her church social work repaid her many times over through favors large and small. Someone introduced her to an architect, who designed a secret room behind her own bedroom at the top of the house, where the refugees could hide during a raid. Once she was even summoned to the police station, just a block away, but the chief confided that he knew of her activities and was working with the underground as well.

The household installed a secret buzzer alarm system, and regularly held practice drills. The danger loomed closer when Nollie ten Boom, who with her husband had also sheltered Jews, was taken away. But ten Boom, whose father had insisted she learn German and English as a child, approached a German doctor at the detention facility, and convinced him to get her sister a medical - related release. But in January of 1944, the ten Boom watchmaking apprentice volunteered to go on a courier mission for the resistance network when no one else was available that day. The Gestapo detained him, and the ten Booms began to worry for their safety and that of their guests. Since the young man was not an "official" member of the underground, he had not been trained to evade police questions to protect others in the network.

Ten Boom and her sister were moved to a concentration camp in Holland and then later to Ravensbruck in Germany, where they lived under conditions of near - starvation, backbreaking manual labor, and vermin infestation. Still, they held Bible study groups in the knitting room to which they were assigned because of their age. Her sister Betsie, 59, was in the camp. By what was likely a clerical error, ten Boom was released on Christmas Day of 1944 and put aboard a train to Berlin. At the badly bombed station, an elderly janitor helped her find the train bound for the Dutch border. The meager bread and ration coupons she had received upon her discharge had either been stolen or lost, and she had nothing to eat for several days. Starving and bedraggled, she made it to a hospital in Groningen once she crossed the border, where the staff nursed her back to health.


Ten Boom and her sister were moved to a concentration camp in Holland and then later to Ravensbruck in Germany, where they lived under conditions of near - starvation, backbreaking manual labor, and vermin infestation. Still, they held Bible study groups in the knitting room to which they were assigned because of their age. Her sister Betsie, 59, was in the camp. By what was likely a clerical error, ten Boom was released on Christmas Day of 1944 and put aboard a train to Berlin. At the badly bombed station, an elderly janitor helped her find the train bound for the Dutch border. The meager bread and ration coupons she had received upon her discharge had either been stolen or lost, and she had nothing to eat for several days. Starving and bedraggled, she made it to a hospital in Groningen once she crossed the border, where the staff nursed her back to health.

In the photo, Papa’s Bible is open to Psalm 91. The Alpina watch company sign (the underground's signal) is in the window.

The Ten Boom family were devoted Christians who dedicated their lives in service to their fellow man. Their home was always an "open house" for anyone in need. Through the decades the Ten Booms were very active in social work in Haarlem, and their faith inspired them to serve the religious community and society at large.

During the Second World War, the Ten Boom home became a refuge, a hiding place, for fugitives and those hunted by the Nazis. By protecting these people, Casper and his daughters, Corrie and Betsie, risked their lives. This non-violent resistance against the Nazi-oppressors was the Ten Booms' way of living out their Christian faith. This faith led them to hide Jews, students who refused to cooperate with the Nazis, and members of the Dutch underground resistance movement.

During 1943 and into 1944, there were usually 6-7 people illegally living in this home: 4 Jews and 2 or 3 members of the Dutch underground. Additional refugees would stay with the Ten Booms for a few hours or a few days until another "safe house" could be located for them. Corrie became a ringleader within the network of the Haarlem underground. Corrie and "the Beje group" would search for courageous Dutch families who would take in refugees, and much of Corrie's time was spent caring for these people once they were in hiding. Through these activities, the Ten Boom family and their many friends saved the lives of an estimated 800 Jews, and protected many Dutch underground workers.

_Because underground materials and extra ration cards were found in their home, the Ten Boom family was imprisoned. Casper (84 years old) died after only 10 days in Scheveningen Prison. When Casper was asked if he knew he could die for helping Jews, he replied, "It would be an honor to give my life for God's ancient people." Corrie and Betsie spent 10 months in three different prisons, the last was the infamous Ravensbruck Concentration Camp located near Berlin, Germany. Life in the camp was almost unbearable, but Corrie and Betsie spent their time sharing Jesus' love with their fellow prisoners. Many women became Christians in that terrible place because of Corrie and Betsie's witness to them. Betsie (59) died in Ravensbruck, but Corrie survived. Corrie’s nephew, Christiaan (24), had been sent to Bergen Belsen for his work in the underground, and never returned. Corrie’s brother, Willem (60), was also a ring leader in the Dutch underground. While in prison for this "crime," he contracted spinal tuberculosis and died shortly after the war.

Four Ten Booms gave their lives for this family’s commitment, but Corrie came home from the death camp. She realized her life was a gift from God, and she needed to share what she and Betsy had learned in Ravensbruck: "There is no pit so deep that God’s love is not deeper still" and "God will give us the love to be able to forgive our enemies." At age 53, Corrie began a world-wide ministry which took her into more than 60 countries in the next 33 years! She testified to God’s love and encouraged all she met with the message that "Jesus is Victor."

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Postby NavnDansk » Fri Sep 28, 2007 2:57 am

The experiment of getting rid of the Bible, churches and any religious instruction has already been done! For at least 80 years in Russia, the Soviet Union – a number of countries besides Russian call the Union of Soviet Republic and a billion Chinese – Christians tortured, murdered Chrisitians and Buddist monks, Churches, the Bible all religious works all destroyed.

So for 80 years you can see the “purity” of several generations and over a billion people with no knowledge WHATEVER of the corrupting influence of religion and of course the Chinese and the Russians created Paradise on earth. The state withered away and no laws or government is needed in China or the Soviet states because without religions, every person treated their neighbor with scruplous fairness so laws, police forces, courts were not needed.

Without the Bible and Christians there is no murder, no exploitation, no torture (once they got rid of those devilish Christians to creat the new man and a pure society), no slavery, no corruption – the only reason many people betrayed their countrymen for money was the influence of the Bible, once that was stamped out – people became so utterly pure as they always would have been if not for religion that there is no need for any laws at all (other than those killing Christians) so that the glorious and perfect Supreme Soviet and the Thousand Flowers Could Continue to Bloom.

Think of what a shining example the Russian and Chinese atheists created – all human failings and horrors were only due to the Bible and one that was gotten rid of people could be as pure, perfect without any kind of vice or sadism as they are naturally and you can see 80 years of the perfect society you are recommending just by looking at recent history in the countries of the Soviet Union and China.

Religions are the response to the death that everyone faces and the horror of the many ways people murder, exploit and steal from others. Religion can be perverted to provide an excuse, people like Karl Rove would use anything that’s available but religion does not cause the evil in human hearts which manifests in all the horrors that we talk about on this board.

Jesus as Son and God as Father are hard to understand and the following example is not perfect but gives some kind of explanation of the true meaning of the Trinity in terms of what we all can experience in our roles and relationships.

A child says to her mother after relatives leave from visit. You are my mother, you are Aunt Jane’s sister and you are Granddaddy’s daughter. Every woman can be a daughter, a mother, an aunt, a niece. It is about relationship – you stay the same person even if your role at the same time in your life is as a son, as a father, as a brother, as a nephew and an uncle and a cousin.

St. Thomas Aquinas, never finished Summa Theologica because he had a spiritual experience during a Eucharist and said that that the Presence of Love he felt was so overwhelmingly real that all of his writings on it “were as straw.” And spent the rest of his life writing hymns of love instead of apologetics.

First Tune
Unitas Fratrum

Plainsong Sequence, 12th Century

Sion, praise thy Saviour singing
Hymns with exultation ringing
Praise thy King and Shepherd true.
Honor him, they voice upraising
Who surpasseth all they praising
Never canst thou reach his due.

Let the Bread, life-giving, living
Be our theme of glad thanksgiving
Now indeed before thee set.
As of old, the Lord provided
When the twelve, divinely guided
At the holy table met.

What he did at supper seated
Christ ordained to be repeated
His memorial ne’er to cease
His command for guidance taking
Bread and wine we hallow, making
Thus our sacrifice of peace.

Full and clear ring out thy chanting
Joy nor sweetest grace be wanting
To thy heart and soul today:
For today the new oblation
Of the new King’s revelation
Bids us feast in glad array.

Very Bread, good Shepherd, tend us
Jesus, of thy love befriend us
Thou refresh us, thou defend us
Thine eternal goodness send us
In the land of life to see:

Thou, who all things canst and knowest
Who on earth such food bestowest
Grant u, with thy saints though lowest
Where the heavenly feast thou showest
Fellow heirs and guests to be.


St. Thomas Aquinas, 1263

Sarum Plainsong
Cantus Diversi, 1751 J.F. Wade

Now, my tongue, the mystery telling
Of the glorious Body sing
And the Blood, all price excelling
Which the Gentiles’ Lord and King
Once on earth among us dwelling
Shed for this world’s ransoming.

Given for us and condescending
To be born for us below
He with men in converse blending
Dwelt, the seed of truth to sow
Till he closed with wondrous ending
His most patient life of woe.

That last night at supper lying
Mid the twelve, his chosen band
Jesus, with the Law complying
Keeps the feast its rites demand
Then, more precious food supplying
Gives himself with his own hand.

Word-made-flesh, true bread he maketh
By his word his Flesh to be
Wine his Blood, when man partaketh
Though his senses fail to see
Faith alone, when sight forsaketh
Shows true hearts the mystery.

Therefore we, before him bending
This great Sacrament revere
Types and shadows have their ending
For the newer rite is here
Faith, our outward sense befriending
Makes our inward vision clear.

Glory let us give and blessing
To the Father and the Son.
Honor, thanks, and praise addressing
While eternal ages run
Ever too his love confessing
Who from both with both is One.

St. Thomas Aquinas, 1263

“I and my Father, are one and the same.”

The gnostic Gospel of St. John.
High Priestly Prayer ... along.html
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Postby NavnDansk » Fri Sep 28, 2007 3:30 am ... version=31

John 12

Jesus Anointed at Bethany

1Six days before the Passover, Jesus arrived at Bethany, where Lazarus lived, whom Jesus had raised from the dead. 2Here a dinner was given in Jesus' honor. Martha served, while Lazarus was among those reclining at the table with him. 3Then Mary took about a pint[a] of pure nard, an expensive perfume; she poured it on Jesus' feet and wiped his feet with her hair. And the house was filled with the fragrance of the perfume.

4But one of his disciples, Judas Iscariot, who was later to betray him, objected, 5"Why wasn't this perfume sold and the money given to the poor? It was worth a year's wages.[b]" 6He did not say this because he cared about the poor but because he was a thief; as keeper of the money bag, he used to help himself to what was put into it.

7"Leave her alone," Jesus replied. " It was intended that she should save this perfume for the day of my burial. 8You will always have the poor among you, but you will not always have me."

9Meanwhile a large crowd of Jews found out that Jesus was there and came, not only because of him but also to see Lazarus, whom he had raised from the dead. 10So the chief priests made plans to kill Lazarus as well, 11for on account of him many of the Jews were going over to Jesus and putting their faith in him.

The Triumphal Entry

12The next day the great crowd that had come for the Feast heard that Jesus was on his way to Jerusalem. 13They took palm branches and went out to meet him, shouting,

"Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord!"[d]
"Blessed is the King of Israel!" 14Jesus found a young donkey and sat upon it, as it is written,
15"Do not be afraid, O Daughter of Zion;
see, your king is coming,
seated on a donkey's colt."[e]

16At first his disciples did not understand all this. Only after Jesus was glorified did they realize that these things had been written about him and that they had done these things to him.

17Now the crowd that was with him when he called Lazarus from the tomb and raised him from the dead continued to spread the word. 18Many people, because they had heard that he had given this miraculous sign, went out to meet him. 19So the Pharisees said to one another, "See, this is getting us nowhere. Look how the whole world has gone after him!"

Jesus Predicts His Death

20Now there were some Greeks among those who went up to worship at the Feast. 21They came to Philip, who was from Bethsaida in Galilee, with a request. "Sir," they said, "we would like to see Jesus." 22Philip went to tell Andrew; Andrew and Philip in turn told Jesus.

23Jesus replied, "The hour has come for the Son of Man to be glorified. 24I tell you the truth, unless a kernel of wheat falls to the ground and dies, it remains only a single seed. But if it dies, it produces many seeds. 25The man who loves his life will lose it, while the man who hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life. 26Whoever serves me must follow me; and where I am, my servant also will be. My Father will honor the one who serves me.

27"Now my heart is troubled, and what shall I say? 'Father, save me from this hour'? No, it was for this very reason I came into the world. 28Father, glorify your name!"

Then a voice came from heaven, "I have glorified it, and will glorify it again." 29The crowd that was there and heard it said it had thundered; others said an angel had spoken to him.

30Jesus said, "This voice was for your benefit, not mine. 31Now is the time for judgment on this world; now the prince of this world will be driven out. 32But I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to myself." 33He said this to show the kind of death he was going to die.

34The crowd spoke up, "We have heard from the Law that the Christ[f] will remain forever, so how can you say, 'The Son of Man must be lifted up'? Who is this 'Son of Man'?"


Then Jesus told them, "You are going to have the light just a little while longer. Walk while you have the light, before darkness overtakes you. The man who walks in the dark does not know where he is going. 36Put your trust in the light while you have it, so that you may become sons of light."

When he had finished speaking, Jesus left and hid himself from them.
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Postby NavnDansk » Sat Sep 29, 2007 9:20 am

Jimmy Breslin and Pat Donahue

Morning - Lauds and Matins


Sarum Plainsong, Mode I

O Splendor of God’s glory bright
O thou that bringest light from light
O Light of Light, light’s living spring
O Day, all days illumining.

O thou true Sun, on us thy glance
Let fall in royal radiance
The Spirit’s sanctifying beam
Upon our earthly senses stream.

The Father, too, our prayers implore
Father of glory evermore
The Father of all grace and might
To banish sin from our delight:

To guide whatever we nobly do
With love all envy t subdue
To make ill-fortune turn to fair
And give us grace our wrongs to bear.

All laud to God the Father be
All praise, eternal Son, to thee
All glory as is ever meet
To God the holy Paraclete.

St. Ambrose, 340-397, Tr. Robert Bridges 1899
Evening – Office Hymn, Vespers
Sing the Hours til Jesus Comes

Satan can only copy and try to counterfeit what he sees God doing.

With serenity
Sarum Plainsong

O blest Creator of the light
Who makest the day with radiance bright
And o’er the forming world didst call
The light from chaos first of all.

Whose wisdom joined in meet array
The morn and even and named them day
Night comes with all its darkling fears
Regard thy people’s prayers and tears.

Lest, sunk in sin, and whelmed with strife
They lose the gift of endless life
While thinking but the thoughts of time
They weave new chains of woe and crime.

But grant them grace that they may strain
The heavenly gate and prize to gain:
Each harmful lure aside to cast
And purge away each error past.

O Father, that we ask be done
Through Jesus Christ, thine only Son
Who, with the Holy Ghost and thee
Doth live and reign eternally. Amen
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Postby NavnDansk » Mon Oct 01, 2007 8:55 pm

Kenneth Clark The Nude: A Study in Ideal Form – about 1/3 of the book is titled The Alternate Convention and is about the meaning of the crucifixion in art.

Faithful Lord Jesus,
grant them rest.

O tu, Deus maiestatis,
alme candor Trinitatis,
nos coniunge cum beatis. Amen.

O Thou, God of Majesty,
nourishing brillance of the Trinity,
join us with the Blessed. Amen.

Dies Irae, Day of Wrath
Wikipedia ... sirae.html

Saints’ Days and Holy Days

St. Bartholomew
August 24
135 - Blessed feasts of blessed martyrs
St. Matthew
Sept 21
134 - Come, pure hearts, in sweetest measure

St. Michael and All Angels
September 29

Italian Melody, 14th Centur

Blessed feast of blessed martyrs
Holy days of holy men

With affection’s recollections
Greet we your return again
Worthy deeds they wrought and wonders
Worthy of the Name they bore
We, with meetest praise and sweetest
Honor them forevermore

Faith prevailing, hope unfailing
Loving Christ with single heart
Thus they glorious and victorious
Bravely bore the martyr’s part
By contempt of every anguish
By unyielding battle done
Victors at the last, they triumph
With the host of angels one.

Therefore, ye that reign in glory
Fellow heirs with Christ on high
Join to ours your supplication
When before Him we draw nigh
Praying that, this life completed
All its fleeting moments past
By His grace we may be worth
Of eternal bliss at last.

Latin 12 cent, Tr. John Mason Neale, 1851




O valiant hearts, who to your glory came
Through dust of conflict and through battle flame
Tranquil you lie, your knightly virtue proved
Your memory hallowed in the land you loved.

Proudly you gathered, rank on rank, to war
As who had heard God’s message from afar
All you had hoped for, all you had, you gave
To save mankind—yourself you scorned to save.

Splendid you passed, the great surrender made
Into the light that nevermore shall fade
Deep your contentment in that blest abode
Who wait the last clear trumpet call of God.

Long years ago, as earth lay dark and still
Rose a loud cry upon a lonely hill
While in the frailty of our human clay
Christ our Redeemer passed the self-same way.

Still stands his cross from that dread hour to this
Like some bright star above the dark abyss
Still through the veil, the victor’s pitying eyes
Look down to bless our lesser Calvaries.

These were his servants; in his steps they trod
Following through death the martyred Son of God:
Victor he rose, victorious to shall rise
They who have drunk his cup of sacrifice.

O risen Lord, O Shepherd of our dead
Whose cross has bought them an whose staff has led
In glorious hope their proud and sorrowing land
Commits her children to thy gracious hand.

John Stanhope Arkwright, 1919

Father eternal, Ruler of creation
Spirit of life, which moved ere form was made
Through the thick darkness covering every nation
Light to man’s blindness, O be thou our aid:

Thy kingdom come, O Lord, thy will be done.

Races and peoples, lo, we stand divided
And, sharing not our griefs, no joy can share
By wars and tumults love is mocked, derided
His conquering cross no kingdom wills to bear:

Thy kingdom come, O Lord, thy will be done.

Envious of heart, blind-eyed, with tongues confounded
Nation by nation still goes unforgiven
In wrath and fear, by jealousies surrounded
Building proud towers which shall not reach to heaven:

Thy kingdom come, O Lord, thy will be done.

Lust of possession worketh desolations
There is no meekness in the sons of earth

Led by no star, the rulers of the nations
Still fail to bring us to the blissful birth:

Thy kingdom come, O Lord, thy will be done.

How shall we love thee, holy hidden Being
If we love not the world which thou has made?
O give us brother-love for better seeing.
Thy Word made flesh, and in a manger laid.

Laurence Houseman 1919
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