The apology thread.

[barracuda]

I know I'm a dick sometimes, and I really don't usually mean to be, sometimes I write and post in a hurry before I think enough about shit, so, MacCruiskeen, OP ED, Rothbardian(?), whoever else, in advance, in absentia: sorry.

It'll prolly happen again, that's why I needed this thread. *sigh*

[OP ED]

no hurt feelings on my part brother. Though my ego is always gratified to see my name mentioned. So, thanks for that.

As far as I'm concerned you preempted any bad feelings on my part with Grand Funk Railroad.

I should probably personally apologize to anyone who takes me seriously.

If you're taking the time to do so, you've already put more thought into my posts than I have. Woo aside.

I likely owe Rothbardian one myself. So, next time we meet sir, drinks on me.

Love IS the Law,
SHCR
[Baalteshazaar]

[tKl]

Why does apologizing make a person a target?

Have you ever noticed this? People will say "I'm sorry because, and so on and so on," and it becomes a point of attack...

I hate that.

[Et in Arcadia ego]

I don't apologize for jack shit.

Ambrose Bierce's definition of 'Apologize', from the bitterly accurate Devil's Dictionary:

To lay the foundation for a future offense.

[compared2what?]

I apologize for what I regret, if expressing my understanding of whatever I did that was regrettable is part of what it takes to make amends for it. But most of the time, if I regret my behavior, I just go directly to amending it, if possible.

I'm always willing to take 100 percent of the responsibility for my 50 percent contibution to any conflict between me and another person. But that doesn't mean that I regret what I contributed. Just that I acknowledge my actions. I don't like to be left wondering what the hell happened in the course of any dispute, so try not to leave others feeling that way.

tkl is totally right that doing anything along these lines is like asking to be kicked. But I do it anyway. Because in my experience, kickers will find a reason to kick whether you give them one or not, It's a playa-hata's paradise out there, these days. So I figure I might as well suit myself.

[brainpanhandler]

I can't tell you how many posts I've composed and then deleted. Probably as many if not more than I actually post.

None of you know it (until now), but I have a vicious streak.

Why does apologizing make a person a target?

Have you ever noticed this? People will say "I'm sorry because, and so on and so on," and it becomes a point of attack...

I hate that.

Ain't that a fact and maybe C2W's right when she says if you're a target then you're a target, but having equivocated or apologized and then becoming a target has a greater poignancy and that pisses me off and I hate that too.

I'll apologize ahead of time for the following:

EIAE, You don't apologize often enough if you never apologize for anything. Truth be told though (to use a phrase that belongs on the Into the Dustbin thread) I suspect you are softer than you sound.

C2W, You apologize way too much.

Personally, I'm surprised there are not more eruptions on this board. Having said that, it's also true that the way the members divide themselves into little cliques get's a bit tiresome.

No one wants to believe they are disliked and yet I am convinced that a number of members dislike and/or fear me for no reason I can discern. Prudence in this context is a good idea; paranoia not necessarily a bad one. On the other hand cultivating some measure of trust based on one's own instincts seems to me not terribly risky when accompanied by the previously mentioned qualities.

It is hard for me to imagine that C2W, just for instance, has evil intentions. I just can't imagine it.

I know I'm a dick sometimes, and I really don't usually mean to be,...

I think you are more of an acerbic wit than a dick, or in other words a dick, but with the redeeming virtue of being funny and I usually enjoy your barbs and believe they are slung in appropriate directions, very generally speaking. On the other hand, there is no "I really don't usually mean to be" defense that holds any water at all. I don't post anything unless I have time to review it and make sure it really is what I want to say.

[sunny]

brainpanhandler, fwiw I don't fear or dislike you. What makes you feel others do?

Here on the board certain things trigger my usually latent excitability and I post in the heat of the moment because it's satisfying to do so. I'm sorry for the hurt feelings I've caused in those moments, but I gotta tell ya, besides any unnecessary personal assaults, what I've written I've meant.

In my personal life, I do wrong things, thoughtless things, get bitchy at times. I apologize because I want to be forgiven, and how can I deserve forgiveness if I'm not contrite?

[Seamus OBlimey]

Sorry, what have I missed?

[Et in Arcadia ego]

EIAE, You don't apologize often enough if you never apologize for anything. Truth be told though (to use a phrase that belongs on the Into the Dustbin thread) I suspect you are softer than you sound.

To be accurate, that's a yes and a no. I have a good friend I've known for 6 years who encapsulated me recently as the 'Sickest, Good-Hearted Person' he'd ever met.

I have soft spots, but they're tiny.

Like that tiny.

[barracuda]

Bierce is right as usual, et in Arcadia ego. When I do it again, I just wanna be able to have a thread to direct to.

Billy Eckstine - I Apologize

[orz]

I can claim some skill in the scrivener's trade, but I cannot guarantee to write a passage that will make someone physically ill.

Sorry. I'll keep trying tho!

[brainpanhandler]

brainpanhandler, fwiw I don't fear or dislike you. What makes you feel others do?

I'd like to be forthright with my posts here, but I really don't feel I can be. I feel a stronger attachment to this board and it's participants than I would have ever predicted. These two facts of my experience here lead me to play my cards pretty close to my vest. If I were to answer your question it would be like tipping my cards, which feels uncomfortable to me. It's entirely possible that in reality what I am perceiving from certain members is more a product of being seen as a bore or a boor, as the case may be. Hell, maybe I've given a few members reasonable cause to dislike me. I can be pretty combative. Nothing to be too concerned about and it's good to know that you neither fear nor dislike me. I had no reason to believe you did, but I had no reason to believe you didn't either.

I suppose the meanest thing I did was mock Isachar on a 9/11 thread. It was really rather cruel and Jeff, soft hearted as he is, took pity on him and clued him into the green text protocol and it's meaning. I think maybe his intent was also to clue in other readers who might otherwise have loathed me if they did not understand I was being sarcastic. Anyhow... sorry Isachar.

In my personal life, I do wrong things, thoughtless things, get bitchy at times. I apologize because I want to be forgiven, and how can I deserve forgiveness if I'm not contrite?

Genuine contrition is rare in my experience. Our egos get in the way. I'll take you at your word though and I can't argue with your reasoning.

[compared2what?]

No one wants to believe they are disliked and yet I am convinced that a number of members dislike and/or fear me for no reason I can discern. Prudence in this context is a good idea; paranoia not necessarily a bad one. On the other hand cultivating some measure of trust based on one's own instincts seems to me not terribly risky when accompanied by the previously mentioned qualities.

I like you and do not fear you, as I think you know. What's more pertinent to me in this context is that I admire and enjoy your reasoning and writing.

Personally I don't want to believe I am disliked any more passionately than I don't want to disbelieve that I am disliked. And I am now going to wait here quietly for a few moments while you wrestle that triple-negative into comprehensibility.

Ready? Then let's continue!

I'd far prefer not to be disliked whenever possible, naturally. But if it's a question of what I want to believe, I'm much more alarmed by the prospect of being liked than I am of being disliked. And therefore much more reluctant to believe it.

So I say: speak for yourself, honey. I'll still like you, I promise.

[barracuda]

On the other hand, there is no "I really don't usually mean to be" defense that holds any water at all. I don't post anything unless I have time to review it and make sure it really is what I want to say.

Wow, I don't think I've ever composed then deleted a post. Yeah, I have no defense here, except to say that I really am usually posting in a huge hurry whilst on my way, or in between off-line exigencies which are literally tugging at my sleeve as I type. Probably no different than everyone else here. And I feel uncomfortable over-editing myself, partly becouse of these time constraints and partly because I want as much of the real person to come through in the post as I can get without too much second guessing. It's just my way. It took me a long lurk period to get into the swing of writing here at all. I guess everyone has there reasons for remaining cloaked, but once I decided to uncover, it was for reasons of 1) passion about the topic that goaded my revealation, and 2) wanting to really talk to some of the minds I was seeing in print on my screen, minds that seemed to be talking about things which I had had decided opinions upon, but frankly, I didn't have any outlet for amongst my real life circle of friends, because of those looks you get when you call the president a mass murderer, or that the CIA is the world's largest drug dealer, or especially that everything you read has an agenda and you have to look hard for the meta-text to even begin to know cui bono, yeah stuff I was taught in school (way over-educated, to the point of uselessness and jaundice) and stuff I wasn't you know, stuff that is really just taken for granted as de facto around here. Some this stuff is pretty complex and it is in the nature of this kind of conversation that brevity and curtness can cut through the chatter and failed logic sometimes; I mean look at somebody like orz - his posts are rarely longer than ten words but often his point of view just shines through, and ouch, his point can really have a pointy end on it. Or et in arcadia ego, sometimes he posts and you can fucking hear the door slam on your bullshit. Or compared, well she's not really brief but the sincerity and intelligence just curls off the screen like smoke, and I wanna slink away and reassess my processed bull someplace quiet. And my feeling has always been that under the skin is where the real meat of the matter is, yet too, that is where the pain originates. So the truth hurts and really I do feel sorry when it does, 'cause I have that anxiety wherein I know that my truth-of-the-moment is not necessarily what's right or correct (instead, it's just top of the head: I hit SUBMIT but never submit), and then BANG, someone here slams my sloppy thinking with a point of view that hadn't occurred to me and I have the new layer or thought process shown to me - and that's why I'm here, for that new stuff, not to pretend I've got the answers, which I sure don't. Wow, I guess I'm pretty defensive. Shit, I need to work on that. And that's why I started this thread, too, cause I need to work on my shit and surrendering is part of it and admitting that I'm proud of bei ng such a dick sometimes is part of it, and getting past just getting past it is part too, I guess. Fuck it, I rest my case full of nonsense. Arghh! Thank god for the lounge.

[Et in Arcadia ego]

Hoo-Whee, I think we got a live one, guys..