I called the cops today on a Grandma

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I called the cops today on a Grandma

Postby Novem5er » Sat Apr 30, 2016 7:47 pm

I brought my girls to the city pier today, a concrete structure with a roof and large viewing platform that stretches out over the lake. Some guys were fishing there without any luck and others came and went. There's a public beach and a marked swimming area a hundred yards away, but by city ordinance there is no swimming outside the marked area and no diving off the pier. It's clearly marked with a big sign.

Soon a group of pre-teens (and younger) kids came up to the pier and prepared to dive off. The water is pitch black here, murky, and filled with deep holes. A kid drowned in this exact same spot not two years back. Again, there's a big sign warning not to do this. Again, there were no parents around. I told the kids that they weren't allowed to dive off, that it was dangerous, that there was a SIGN, and that a kid died there a few years back. They shrugged and ran back to the beach.

A few minutes later, they kids come back, more of them, with an adult in tow. The climb right over the barrier with their grandma egging them on "Go. Jump!". Very politely, I inform the lady that they aren't supposed to dive out her, nor swim, and that there was a SIGN, and that a kid died right there not long back. She shrugged, "I know, don't care. Go. Jump!" she continued. One of the girls she was egging into the water was smaller than my 8 year old.

I asked her if she'll care when I call the police and she said "We'll see when the cops get here." Well, she called my bluff so I called the cops. The kids dived off and swam slowly back to shore, laughing, and grandma walked back down the pier. The dispatcher took my name and number and said an officer would arrive shortly.

Before any officer came, the mother took the long walk down the pier. "Did you call the cops on my kids?!" she asked.

"No, ma'am, I called the cops on the adult that was with your children."

Well, she got mad and went off on me. To her credit, she didn't curse, but she game me a long list of why it wasn't dangerous for her daughters to dive off the pier into dark and murky water, 300' from shore, with no lifeguards, and despite the SIGN and the fact that a kid died there not two years back. I didn't insult her. I stayed classy. My kids were right there watching. She was mostly mad that anyone would hassle her kids that way, to which my repeated response was "Public safety, ma'am".

I stayed at the pier with my kids and watched the cops show up on the distant shore. I watched the mother in her black shirt walk right up to the cops, have a discussion, and point my direction out on the pier. She walked off and the cops approached. They were nice, and professional, and took my statement. They advised that, in the future, I not directly talk to any kids and to just go ahead and call the police if I ever saw it again. They explained the mom was upset that I talked to her kids. I explained that I only spoke to the kids when there were no adults present, and to warn them of the danger, of the giant SIGN, and the fact that a kid died right there not two years back. They agreed that it was ridiculous, but to avoid drama with parents, it was just best to call the cops directly, BUT they said that I was right to be concerned and to alert authorities - after all, there's a big sign and some kid drowned, you know.

We left a few minutes later, and passed the mom giving holy-hell to those cops for hassling her kids. I heard her get loud and an officer say "MA'AM, what's your name? Do you have ID?" to which she loudly replied "No, I DON'T HAVE ID!". We just kept walking, eyes glued to the ground, and made it home safely without further incident.

Later, I got to thinking. Was I right to call the police? I mean, I warned the kids first, and then I warned the grandma, and they not only didn't listen, but laughed in the face of danger, city ordinance, and my concern. Still, was I participating in the Nanny State? Should parents be allowed to endanger their children? I think I did the right thing, still, but I'm not positive.
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Re: I called the cops today on a Grandma

Postby Iamwhomiam » Sat Apr 30, 2016 9:28 pm

I think you did the right thing too, considering she egged you on to make the call, but even if she hadn't, you were right to warn the children of the present danger. It's what any concerned adult would do, especially because they were unchaperoned. Don't let it eat at you. In another place, that woman would have been arrested for negligence or child endangerment for allowing the kids to jump from the pier in violation of the law.
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Re: I called the cops today on a Grandma

Postby Novem5er » Sat Apr 30, 2016 10:01 pm

Thanks. I re-told the story to my wife when she got home. Of course she was on my side, but retelling it made me feel a little better about it. In the end, it wasn't me who started by calling the police - I warned the kids and then warned the adult. If she was cooperative with the police, she'd probably get nothing but a warning, but she made the decision to get loud and start arguing with them. I don't know the outcome, but she made it a lot more stressful on herself than anything I did.

It made me wonder, though. What kind of parent thinks that their kid is invincible? I asked the woman if SHE was going to swim 300 ft out to her daughter if she bumped her head on the dive. He response was simply "She wouldn't bump her head." A flat denial of any possibility that her child could suffer an accident. Not to mention there were three to five kids all jumping off in unison, which anyone would know is the most dangerous scenario - legs kick out, people crash into each other, heads pump, and then it's down down into the drink.

Funnily enough, one of the boys that was there who was mocking me by scoffing "public safety, hah!" dove in and yelped "Ow! I hurt my wrist!". A minute later, one of the kids warned the group "be careful, there's a deep sinkhole right over here." Yes, kids, yes . . . thus the SIGN and the fact a kid drowned right there not two years ago. SMH.
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Re: I called the cops today on a Grandma

Postby DrEvil » Sun May 01, 2016 8:37 am

I think you did the right thing. Some people are just idiots and need a wake-up call every now and then.
I don't hold out much hope for the adults, but maybe the kids will think twice next time.
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Re: I called the cops today on a Grandma

Postby Novem5er » Sun May 01, 2016 11:42 am

The littlest girl in the group was smaller than my 8 year old and she was hesitant the whole time. When it was just the kids on the pier, the older girl was showing her how to climb the rails and telling her to jump. When the grandma came back with them, again the little girl hesitated and the old lady was egging her on "Go! Jump!"

Who knows, maybe I saved that little girl's life from a future jump. Maybe they are back there right now diving in. I can only hope for the best :)

But people disgust me. I've worked for years in the local schools and I've seen over and over again the damage that parents do to their kids.

As an additional comment about America and race: the crazy family in question? They were white. The cool guys fishing on the pier at the start of my story? They were black and they were concerned about kids diving off the pier. "In OUR day we KNEW not to go around water without an adult around. Not a lake, not a crick, and not a pool".

I only bring it up because I still don't see how people can be truly racist anymore. Trashy people come in all colors and great, compassionate people come in all colors.
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Re: I called the cops today on a Grandma

Postby 82_28 » Mon May 02, 2016 1:48 am

Brings up a likewise story of me as a kid which of course I have told elsewhere. We were on a fieldtrip camping thing in NM and the trail ended right at the banks of the Rio Grande. Our teachers prodded us to swim across it. So we did. Nobody died. It was fun, but yes I would have called the police/ranger had I witnessed such a thing today with youths. Believe me it was hella dangerous and absolutely totally stupid for our teachers to allow us to do it.
There is no me. There is no you. There is all. There is no you. There is no me. And that is all. A profound acceptance of an enormous pageantry. A haunting certainty that the unifying principle of this universe is love. -- Propagandhi
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Re: I called the cops today on a Grandma

Postby Novem5er » Mon May 02, 2016 8:40 am

Yeah, that's crazy for a teacher of any time to prod kids to do. I can't imagine a teacher or camp counselor doing that now, in the era of social media, outrage, and lawsuits.

But there is a difference between adults letting kids do stupid things and then prodding them to actually do it. It's also another thing entirely to flout city ordinance that is posted explaining the danger and the law. "Thou Shalt Not Swim Here - DANGER - a kid drowned right here!" . . . . "Oh yeah? Fuck you, sign! Kids, jump in!"

The impression I got from the adults in the family is that they were "fuck you" rednecks; sovereign citizens of the non-political kind, where they do what they want and wont take lip from anyone; not a sign, not a stranger, and certainly not the cops when they showed up.

What galls me, though, is what would happen if a kid DID call for help in the murky water, with the mom/grandma sitting on shore 300 feet away and me standing on the pier next to their kid? Of course it'd be my duty to try and save them (mindful that rescuers OFTEN turn drowning victim themselves), but somehow it's NOT my duty to warn them not to dive in before the fact? Fucking cracker-ass rednecks of Florida.
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Re: I called the cops today on a Grandma

Postby 82_28 » Mon May 02, 2016 9:15 am

I think the thing was is that the teachers were very permissive. We didn't follow no rules. All of us smoked, drank etc and the teachers accepted our rebellion and that was the point of the class. We were "at risk". Funny though. Everybody but me is now either dead, in jail or a fundie Christian.

And so it goes.
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Re: I called the cops today on a Grandma

Postby brainpanhandler » Mon May 02, 2016 11:38 am

She was upset because you talked to her kids.


I was gonna say maybe she was a follower of the free-range kids movement:



but if she was then it's sort of contradictory to be upset when an adult, in your absence, proactively engages with your kids to keep them from possibly DROWNING.

You did the right thing. But there is never any purely "right thing", is there?
"Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." - Martin Luther King Jr.
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Re: I called the cops today on a Grandma

Postby Cordelia » Mon May 02, 2016 12:12 pm

Stereotypes aside, it's pretty sad, children being raised by dangerous acting-out adults. There are a lot of them. And no doubt you'll figure into the family lore of 'us against them'. An upside could be that maybe, due to your efforts to protect them, a seed is planted in one kid's developing brain that will germinate and someday pop out to break the crazy cycle and protect him/her & progeny. Good on you. :thumbsup
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Re: I called the cops today on a Grandma

Postby Novem5er » Mon May 02, 2016 2:38 pm

brainpanhandler » Mon May 02, 2016 11:38 am wrote:She was upset because you talked to her kids.


I was gonna say maybe she was a follower of the free-range kids movement:



but if she was then it's sort of contradictory to be upset when an adult, in your absence, proactively engages with your kids to keep them from possibly DROWNING.

You did the right thing. But there is never any purely "right thing", is there?


That first video is so true. People are scared of kids these days, or really, are scared of parents who are scared for their kids. Thankfully the lady didn't seem concerned that I was inappropriate with the kids, but rather that I had the nerve to CORRECT them. You're right that she was a contradiction, free-range enough to sit 300ft away while her kids jumped into a murky lake with shifting sandbars and sink holes . . . but helicopter enough to march that same 300ft to tell off some stranger who dared to stop her kids having fun. In her words:

"It's people like YOU who make kids want to do drugs in this town! Always stopping them from just having fun and being kids!" Oh, my! I didn't realize the choice was between jumping off a pier and smocking pot. Truthfully, the pot would be safer :)

Cordelia » Mon May 02, 2016 12:12 pm wrote:Stereotypes aside, it's pretty sad, children being raised by dangerous acting-out adults. There are a lot of them. And no doubt you'll figure into the family lore of 'us against them'. An upside could be that maybe, due to your efforts to protect them, a seed is planted in one kid's developing brain that will germinate and someday pop out to break the crazy cycle and protect him/her & progeny. Good on you. :thumbsup


Thanks! The littlest kid there DID have a seed of doubt. She hesitated and didn't want to jump, but her grandma was prodding her along "Go 'ern! Jyump!" (that's my attempt to duplicate cracker accent in text).
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Re: I called the cops today on a Grandma

Postby Burnt Hill » Mon May 02, 2016 6:35 pm

I think you did the right thing,
But I would not have called the cops myself.
If I felt the kids were in danger I would have stayed around to help if necessary.
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Re: I called the cops today on a Grandma

Postby Iamwhomiam » Tue May 03, 2016 12:32 am

^^^ I understand how you feel, BH, but would you leave your own very young children alone, on a pier 300' out over the water? I'm not sure I would, though having been an EMT, I might have. I think the only way to help would be to jump in.
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Re: I called the cops today on a Grandma

Postby Cordelia » Tue May 03, 2016 11:48 am

If people involved were black I'd have to agree (unfortunately) best not to call the police. But, when child endangerment (even with 'rednecks and 'cracker' adults :roll: ) is a possibility, yeah, call them. Also, it starts a paper trail on concerns raised and, as above, protection for Novem5er and his own kids in case there was an accident.
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Re: I called the cops today on a Grandma

Postby Novem5er » Tue May 03, 2016 3:07 pm

Other than child endangerment, one of my big problems with rednecks and crackers around here is their eager readiness to flout public safety laws. Fireworks during dry season, drinking and driving, rifle practice in a residential zone, and now jumping off the city pier! These are ordinances or laws that are designed to keep them safe, but also the people around them safe. A lot of these people just don't care; again they are the sovereign citizen type.

If they stayed out in the rural parts of the county, then nobody would really care - but when they move "in town" and have the same attitude in a crowded area, it's a problem. Then add danger to kids on top of it... Yeesh.

The term "cracker" actually comes from Central Florida, btw. There's a historic Cracker Trail marked with government signs, where early Florida pioneers would drive their cattle from the inland areas to the coast for market. They would drive their cattle through the brush using bullwhips, and thus earned the name "crackers" for the cracking sound that heralded their arrival at market. The more you know :)
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