Fox Grapes, Autumn Olive Fruit, Acorns, and Ginkgo Survival

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Postby Avalon » Tue Oct 02, 2007 1:04 pm

One primitive skills book I've seen mentioned that a pine needle tea would be a good source of vitamin C. That's something that might be easier to find in urban areas.

As for the rural Northeast if the shit hit the fan, I'd say the ultimate take-down might end up being Lyme disease, rather than starvation. It's a quiet epidemic, not easily diagnosed, and not easily vanquished if not caught in time.
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Self sufficiency is the survival goal: Very cool site here:

Postby Seventhsonjr » Fri Oct 05, 2007 2:57 pm

http://www.selfsufficientish.com/

Self sufficient 'ish'.com - The urban guide to almost self sufficiency. Please look on the columns either side to see our encyclopedia of self sufficiency articles. Don't forget if you want to chat to other self sufficiency folk, or share your ideas with us then please use our forum. News - We have signed with Hodder & Stoughton and will be releasing The selfsufficientish Bible in May 2008.
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Postby H_C_E » Fri Oct 05, 2007 3:46 pm

The best aphrodisiac I've found, though, is the tuliptree (green shoots and stems, flowers in the spring) Yowzah!


Question for you 7thsonjr: The tulip tree, so far as I know, is the only with that common name. But is this the plant I know as Liriodendron tulipifera? Has a bloom that resembles the Southern Magnolia? That plant grows wild here in Ga and I've often collected them by accident when hunting wild bonsai specimens.

So how do you prepare and use it. And what are the effects? I cannot use anything that raises blood pressure the way Yohimbe does.

Thanks,

HCE
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Postby Seventhsonjr » Fri Oct 05, 2007 4:11 pm

H_C_E wrote:
The best aphrodisiac I've found, though, is the tuliptree (green shoots and stems, flowers in the spring) Yowzah!


Question for you 7thsonjr: The tulip tree, so far as I know, is the only with that common name. But is this the plant I know as Liriodendron tulipifera? Has a bloom that resembles the Southern Magnolia? That plant grows wild here in Ga and I've often collected them by accident when hunting wild bonsai specimens.

So how do you prepare and use it. And what are the effects? I cannot use anything that raises blood pressure the way Yohimbe does.

Thanks,

HCE


It is the same plant.

According to what I can find it is considered a heart stimulant so I have no idea if it would be safe for your situation. I take valerian btw which is supposed to be good for the heart and high blood pressure.

The green bark and new branch shoots are chewed on in the spring, although I have collected and eaten/steeped the buds as well as made tea with the leaves. It is a little bitter but "stimulating". They seem to proliferate and keep growing out for season so the green branch shoots keep coming and I still use them as long as they last. One leaf in tea (fresh) is good but I think the early buds (while pretty strong tasting and bitter) might be the most powerful.

I could find almost no research on "blood pressure" excep[t that it is used traditionally as a heart medicine and stimulant s (as well as aphrodisiac) so it just may not be safe for you.

You might google ginkgo and check that out as it also has aphrodisiac proerties and is good for all vascular sytems (brain and reproductive) --- the nuts are served at Chinese weddings in a congee or other ways.

But I do not know if they have heart impact. (I imagine that anything which is good for the vascular system should help the heart.

I will search and get back to you...
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Ginkgo and blood pressure

Postby Seventhsonjr » Fri Oct 05, 2007 4:15 pm

Here's what I found on Ginkgo and blood pressure--- seems to be good but I'd suggest more research.

The ginkgo nuts are going wild this year and I collected a ton yesterday (well - maybe five-ten pounds of the fruits with nuts inside)


http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=I ... gle+Search


and as an aphrodisiac

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=U ... ac&spell=1

After researching ginkgo I HIGHLY recommend you check out its image and try to find one nearby to collect the nuts and leaves (altho leaves may be more problematic I cannot afford the supplements so collect and make tea with them despite some mild gastric side effects in higher doses.)

The nuts require, apparently, gloves to collect and clean altho I have suffered little problems and wash them in cold water barehanded then roast or dry and roast .

They are exceptionally good for all of us. And free if you can find these planted all over as ornamentals (and they also make great bonsai trees apparently)
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Postby H_C_E » Fri Oct 05, 2007 7:32 pm

Hey, thanks for the generous replies. I'll be doing some research as well. although the burning question this has stimulated in me is are there other species of Liriodendron? I've never come across any, but I've never looked to deeply. I learned of Liriodendron as a landscape\ornamental plant. But I'm fascinated by all of the plants in the Magnolia family.

But I'll certainly be looking into the question of the active constituents of Liriodendron and its biological effects.

thanks again!

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This is the only one I know of

Postby Seventhsonjr » Fri Oct 05, 2007 7:51 pm

H_C_E wrote:Hey, thanks for the generous replies. I'll be doing some research as well. although the burning question this has stimulated in me is are there other species of Liriodendron? I've never come across any, but I've never looked to deeply. I learned of Liriodendron as a landscape\ornamental plant. But I'm fascinated by all of the plants in the Magnolia family.

But I'll certainly be looking into the question of the active constituents of Liriodendron and its biological effects.

thanks again!

HCE


It is the only one of this species that I have found and is the same where you are as here near New England/NYC.

It is a kind of magnolia though and so has many relatives. This is the only one I have read about which has the aphrodisiacal properties reported.

Southern Magnolia is reported to be used for reducing blood pressure, however, according to Peterson. (Magnolia Grandiflora}
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Postby chiggerbit » Fri Oct 12, 2007 12:09 pm

This would make a great topic for a forum on self sufficiency. :wink:

I think this article really highlights the impact of global warming, but it should also alert the reader to the necessity of adapting food sources in order to survive the coming changes, changes that seem to be coming about even faster that the experts predicted. If vinyards have already experienced this much impact, try to imagine the impact warming will eventually have on Midwestern grain crops (and beef production), or on the fruit and vegetable farming in California and Florida, on which this country is quite dependent. And since it's called GLOBAL warming, it's not like we could count on being able to get our food from other countries if we can't produce it ourselves. One of the things I'm considering doing is experimenting with fruit trees adapted to a less hardy zone, zone 6. They still may not make it, but I have the space to experiment. Remember global warming when you think about self-sufficiency.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 01360.html

In Northern France, Warming Presses Fall Grape Harvest Into Summertime

By Molly Moore
Washington Post Foreign Service
Sunday, September 2, 2007; A01



ROUFFACH, France -- On a cobweb-encrusted rafter above his giant steel grape pressers, Ren? Mur? is charting one of the world's most tangible barometers of global warming.

The evidence, scrawled in black ink, is the first day of the annual grape harvest for the past three decades. In 1978, it was Oct. 16. In 1998, the date was Sept. 14. This year, harvesting started Aug. 24 -- the earliest ever recorded, not only in Mur?'s vineyards, but also in the entire Alsace wine district of northeastern France.

"I noticed the harvest was getting earlier before anybody had a name for it," said 59-year-old Mur?, the 11th generation of his family to produce wine from the clay and limestone slopes of the Vosges Mountains near the German border. "When I was young, we were harvesting in October with snow on the mountaintops. Today we're harvesting in August."

Throughout the wine-producing world, from France to South Africa to California, vintners are in the vanguard of confronting the impact of climate change. Rising temperatures are forcing unprecedented early harvests, changing the tastes of the best-known varieties of wine and threatening the survival of centuries-old wine-growing regions.

In the hot Mediterranean vineyards -- the first to feel the effects of longer, drier summers -- vintners are harvesting grapes at night to protect the fragile fruit at the critical picking stage. Growers in Spain, Italy and southern France are buying land at higher terrains for future vineyards.

Some champagne producers in northern France -- whose grapes were ready for harvest in August, earlier than in any year on record -- are eyeing properties in southern England, the current beneficiary of planet warming. The British wine industry is reemerging for the first time in the 500 years since a mini-ice age cooled Europe.

While Provence and other southern regions of France have suffered through debilitating droughts and high temperatures for several seasons, scientists and growers have been stunned by the dramatic evolutions in the northernmost regions of Alsace and Champagne, long considered less susceptible to global warming.

"Usually Alsace is one of the last regions to harvest in France, and this year we were the first ones," said G?rard Boesch, president of the Alsace Wine Association. "That's astonishing. Vintners wonder how all this will turn out in a few years."

In a chain reaction of nature, climate change is also sending new insects and diseases north. The leafhopper is migrating north with warmer weather, spreading yellow leaf disease in Alsace vineyards for the first time, according to a regional research institute.

Scientists and vintners say wine grapes are the best agricultural measure of climate change because of their extraordinary sensitivity to weather and the meticulous data that have been kept concerning the long-lived vines.

"The link of wine to global warming is unique because the quality of wine is very dependent on the climate," said Bernard Seguin, an authority on the impact of global warming and viniculture at the French National Agronomy Institute. "For me, it is the ultimate expression of the consequences of climate change."

Nowhere is the impact more acute or better documented than in France. Here, the $13 billion wine industry is not only crucial to the economy but also more inextricably entwined in the culture and heritage of the people than in any wine-producing country on earth.

For centuries, the "vendange," or annual grape harvest, has been treated as a near-religious ritual, with parish churches maintaining meticulous records in dusty, crumbling ledgers.

In France, wine growers are subject to the world's most rigid cultivation restrictions: Vintners can grow only varieties authorized for their region, harvests are tightly regulated and, until this year, no irrigation was allowed. Year after year, the climate is the single greatest variable in France's wine production, making its vineyards the perfect climate-change laboratory for scientists.

Ren? Mur?'s family has been growing grapes and producing wine in the hills surrounding the picturesque village of Rouffach since 1648. The family tree, with its 12 generations of wine growers -- Ren?'s children, V?ronique, 31, and Thomas, 27, are the newest Mur? vintners -- is tacked to a wall in his cellars, which produce 350,000 bottles of wine a year.

The wines are aged in 100-year-old oak barrels personalized by Mur?'s grandmother with the names of famous French women, including Marie Antoinette and Joan of Arc.

In 1932, his grandfather bought the 37.5-acre Domaine du Clos St Landelin, named for the abbey whose monks tilled the vineyards in the 8th century. Its sunny, southern exposure on the steep mountain flanks made it one of the choicest vineyards in the area, and it produced the Mur? family's finest wines.

Mur? and other French vintners have tasted global warming in their wines for the last three decades. They liked what they tasted. Their red pinot noirs were more aromatic, and their white Gewurztraminers were sweeter with fragrances of litchi and roses.

All over France, vintners abandoned their forefathers' practice of adding sugar to the wines to improve their flavors and alcohol content. The sun and warmer summers were doing the job for them. Through the 1980s and 1990s, French wines won higher and higher ratings from domestic and international wine critics.

But the climate warming has accelerated faster than vintners or French scientists anticipated. That has forced sugar levels, and consequently alcohol levels, higher in the wines. Some producers in Provence are adding acidic compounds to their wines to keep them from becoming too sweet and undrinkable.

Vintners in Alsace are now facing similar problems. The average temperature in Alsace, which is bordered by the Rhine River and Germany, has risen 3.5 degrees in the last 30 years -- a dramatic increase for sensitive grapevines, according to the French National Agronomy Institute.

"For 10 years, our problem has been to keep the acidity," Mur? said. "Wines need to be balanced to have fresh, crisp flavor."

Mur? has already started changing the way he cultivates his grapes, growing some vines closer to the ground with fewer leaves in the style of southern grape growers, giving his vines less exposure to the sun.

He wants to experiment with growing southern Syrah grapes in Alsace. The way Mur? sees it, if the southern climate is moving north, he should be prepared to grow grapes that can withstand the heat.

"We have to stay in contact with the climate and the 'terroir,' " said Mur?, tromping between the rows of leafy vines heavy with the last of this year's purple pinot noir grapes. "We have to adapt. It's a question of survival."

"Terroir" is an ephemeral French description of the soil, slope, climate and locality that give each wine label its unique flavor and aroma.

But Mur? is discovering that the regimentation of the French wine production system that has allowed climate change to be documented so accurately is now threatening to undermine the very industry it was designed to protect.

Before he can plant the experimental grapes, Mur? must obtain the permission of the powerful Alsace Wine Association, watchdog of the region's viniculture reputation and tradition. Without its approval, said his daughter, V?ronique, planting different grapes would be "as illegal as planting marijuana" under French wine laws.

"Of course, we have to adapt to climate changes," said Boesch, the association president and a wine grower. But he added, "We have to preserve our identity. Our identity is not Syrah, it's Riesling.

Scientists warn that climate change is advancing too rapidly for the cumbersome French wine bureaucracy.

"Some vintners, like Ren? Thomas, are ahead of others," said Philippe Kuntzmann, a grapevine specialist at Interprofessional Technical Center for Vines and Wine in the Alsace regional capital of Colmar. "Others are more traditional; they want to wait and see. If you wait too long, it will be too late."

Mur?'s daughter, who studied agronomy and biology in college, said she sees change as the only way to pass the Mur? heritage on to her 2 1/2 -year-old daughter, Margaux (as in the wine), and the son she is expecting to deliver in November.

"Yes, it's a radical idea," she said. "We don't say tomorrow we'll get rid of pinot noir and replace it with Syrah. It takes years and years to see the results in winemaking. We think it will be investing in the future to have this experiment."
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Self - sufficiency and survival

Postby Seventhsonjr » Fri Oct 12, 2007 12:32 pm

Would be a great forum topic.

But I am afraid it would not get too much action --- (even this post didn't get that many responses)

I am totally impressed, however, with the autmn olive and its ability to thrive in very dry conditions and be prolific with fruit.

Also, I have been eating the roasted ginkgo nuts (about ten a day in accordance with Chinese medicine) and my energy levels are way up, my blood pressure is way down (I mean WAY down), and my tinnitus (which I have had since a serious head bump about ten years ago) has been reduced substantially.

Also the acorn coffee (a few roasted and leeched nuts every day) seems to be very fortifying as well.

The wild grapes are prolific this year as well but seemed to be drying out earlier than usual which jibes with the article you mentioned.

I heartily support a self-sufficiency and survival forum -- Jeff?

You could start by sending this there and and keeping a link for it on the GD forum for starts.

I rarely stray off the GD forum at all so I'd hate to see this topic submerged completely til the regulars get into it...
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Astragalus is really good

Postby Seventhsonjr » Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:09 pm

Having some in my tea now. Very inexpensive at oriental markets comapred to natural food stores ($6.00 a pound vs $60.00 a pound)

Check out the studies on it for heart, stress, viruses, cancer etc.:

http://www.herbmed.org/Herbs/Herb26.htm#Category1Herb26
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Postby H_C_E » Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:30 pm

Well, Ginko grows all over the damn place here, and I'm intimately familiar with it. I learned the plant when I was working on my horticulture degree, and it is planted all along the streets of downtown Athens. So much so, that this time of year the downtown area is fairly malodorous.
It's amusing to me that females clones still sneak through the nursery trade. There is a "male only" rule in effect because of the stinky fruit.

So does roasting them eliminate the odor? I'll go downtown this weekend to collect fallen fruits, but I wonder at what temperature and length of time to roast them for.

You've already covered that I bet.

HCE
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Postby H_C_E » Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:39 pm

and they also make great bonsai trees apparently


Unsure on this one. I collected about thirty seedlings from a patch where someone planted them and then apparently forgot them. And I have a few that are about six years old that are getting close to being trained.
Problem is the leaf size. I think they fell into bonsai use only as a result of their being a conifer. Bonsaiists tend to favor conifers it seems. That's been my experience.

HCE
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Simple

Postby Seventhsonjr » Fri Oct 12, 2007 7:03 pm

H_C_E wrote:Well, Ginko grows all over the damn place here, and I'm intimately familiar with it. I learned the plant when I was working on my horticulture degree, and it is planted all along the streets of downtown Athens. So much so, that this time of year the downtown area is fairly malodorous.
It's amusing to me that females clones still sneak through the nursery trade. There is a "male only" rule in effect because of the stinky fruit.

So does roasting them eliminate the odor? I'll go downtown this weekend to collect fallen fruits, but I wonder at what temperature and length of time to roast them for.

You've already covered that I bet.

HCE


Since the fruity stinky outer shell causes dermatitis in some (doesn't bother me much at all - I wash them under cold water and picked them barehanded) gloves are recommended.


I let them sit for awhile to soften up the outer fruit (in a bowl or plastic bag - maybe outsoors if the smell bothers you) and then simply scrape the outer fruit off in cold water with my fingers (nails) or a knife. When they get stinky and orange they are ripe --- you jyst mash the outer fruit off the inner nut.

I roast them in the shell at 350 degrees for about ten minutes and then use pliers or a nutcracker to get the nuts out of the shell (they are a lot like in size and color and the nut is a little hard to crack.

They actually roast better if you crack them first or take them out of the shell (no smell btw for inner nuts which are safe to handle) but I tended to crush the nut if they were fresh and they crack easier and stay whole better for me if I roat them first.

I eat them like this or maybe with a little salt and olive oil. Not a strong taste and in chinese medicine no maore than ten nuts a day (I have eaten more with no ill effect but the traditionalists warn against it)

I have read that boining the nuts gives them a better taste: nutty and a little sweet and kinda like macadamias but "greenier" (like a cross between macadamia and pistachio)


No that I have mastered this really simple food I will collect as many as I can and try to eat them year round --- though fresh roasted is the best...


Let me know how they turn out.

Lots of recipes online too.
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Postby populistindependent » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:22 pm

There is desperate labor shortage on the thousands of surviving small family farms, at all levels including owners. You won't go hungry, living is cheap, there are opportunities for getting off the grid, and you will become a part of a cooperative community. The only downside is that you give up the trinkets, glamor and status of the suburban lifestyle and will be hanging with folks who dress and live differently from upscale folks in the suburbs, corporate cubicles, and academic communities and who don't speak in new age jargon.

In addition, it could be argued that the cutting edge of the expanding empire is represented best by the ongoing global destruction of sustainable, cooperative, rural agricultural communities. They stand in the way of total corporate domination of the world's resources and control over the people.

One other downside - it requires becoming a humble student rather than an enlightened teacher, and sacrificing for others rather than pursuing self-actualization.
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When will the gingko nuts fall?

Postby Pazdispenser » Sun Oct 21, 2007 1:18 pm

Hi Seventh -

I live in NYC, and there are three "Stinko Gingkos" right outside my window. Historically, the fruit doesnt fall from these trees until late November. Im thinking these must be a different variety of gingko than those that you have already harvested. Do you know if all varieties of gingko are safe (and healthy!) for consumption?
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