Johnny Gosch update

[FourthBase]

Turn on FOX News.<br>It'll be on in a minute or two.<br><br>edit: Wait, the teaser lied.<br>First they're doing a piece on the "Iran Showdown".<br>Interestingly, featuring the editor-at-large of UPI.<br><br>I don't expect the story to be revelatory or anything.<br>I'm just curious how Fox of all channels will present it.<br><br>edit: OK, next segment is definitely Gosch.<br>FYI, the show is called "The Lineup".<br><br>Looks like it'll be a "Can you help solve this" type story. <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=fourthbase>FourthBase</A> at: 9/3/06 11:49 pm<br></i>

[FourthBase]

It was an interview with Noreen.<br>Jesus, she looks frazzled and devastated.<br><br>Things of note:<br><br>- She said that the brand had been found on other victims, and she said it in a way that made it seem like <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>that particular brand</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> had been found on other victims.<br><br>- She very carefully chose her words describing the perps, calling them a "human trafficking ring" and it seemed like she'd been asked/forced by producers or whatever not to include any description that hinted at elite involvement.<br><br>- At one point, talking about getting the photos publicity, she said the hope is that a parent out there will say "I know who that boy is...or, the other child." i.e., The tiny cynic in me imagined a scenario where she knows that none of the three boys is Johnny (and perhaps not even the b&w photo) but is putting the photo out there in order to 1) raise awareness of Johnny and 2) geuinely help find who these boys are. <p></p><i></i>

[FourthBase]

That little cynical part of me: I remember that DeCamp said Bonacci confirmed that Gannon was Gosch, and Noreen said that Gunderson told her the same thing. And of course, there's no way in hell that Gannon is Gosch. So all that left a cynical taste in my mouth. <p></p><i></i>

[Avalon]

If you can find a vintage clothing dealer online who carries a lot of sport clothing (or know one locally), they might be able to discuss nuances of what they see in the photo. If you can narrow it down to a team and player, you could try the office of the marketing director for that team (or an online forum full of that team's most devoted fans), and see if any long-time employees or fans can give details.<br><br>Here's a website for MEARS, who do authentification on sporting collectibles. Somebody could ask them (let us know here that you're doing it) if they would make some observations that might be able to push this investigation along in more contructive ways. If they could narrow down the sporting shirt to what might possibly be a more likely time frame and geographic area the team shirt is from (not to mention that it might indicate someone's favorite player), it might prove to be enormously helpful.<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.mearsonline.com/news/newsArchivedHome.asp">www.mearsonline.com/news/...edHome.asp</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>They seem to have a discussion board, but they ask for real names and emails for accountability.<br><br>These are the choices on the sport shirt seen in the one photo:<br><br>1/ It belongs to the kid who was wearing it when kidnapped, and it might have meant something special to him<br><br>or<br><br>2/ It was picked out specially by the captor, and meant something special to the captor<br><br>or<br><br>3/ It's just a random shirt, picked up used at a thrift shop or yard sale, or at a store so mass-market as to not cater to individual team loyalties (K-Mart probably doesn't play favorites unless it's in their interest to do so)<br><br>I've seen a couple of comments recently on other sites suggesting that what we take to be a young boy in the group could be a young girl. What's more likely -- that a pedophile would be more likely to have only boys or only girls in this situation, or a mixed gender group?<br><br> <p></p><i></i>

[FourthBase]

Another thing I forgot: She was asked if she immediately brought the photos to police and she said that when she got the photos she'd already had a trip to see family planned, so she went on that trip. Then when she got back, she had "her people" check out the photos.<br><br>Having her people check them out is not weird.<br>But that whole trip thing is fishy.<br><br>Maybe the "family" she was going to see = Johnny in hiding? <p></p><i></i>

[Et in Arcadia ego]

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>and if Et gives me permission, I'd also like to post what he wrote about the mark on the arm.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Go for it.<br><br>Scary find about the other story. I grew up less than 10 minutes from Coconut Grove and would have been 3-4 years old at the time.<br><br>Plenty of stories down there about the Everglades' effortless means of disposing of bodies. I even heard stories about bodies dumped out there after Hurricane Andrew, which was waaayy nastier than Katrina sans the flooded dikes.<br><br>The white van sounds very familiar, like Finders familiar..<br><br>Let us know how that goes. <p>____________________<br>Some are born to sweet delight, some are born to endless night.</p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=etinarcadiaego@rigorousintuition>et in Arcadia ego</A>  <IMG HEIGHT=10 WIDTH=10 SRC="http://www.sickle666.com/images/Arcadia.jpg" BORDER=0> at: 9/4/06 1:26 am<br></i>

[FourthBase]

Thanks Et.<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42834&page=5&pp=25">www.websleuths.com/forums...ge=5&pp=25</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42834&page=6&pp=25">www.websleuths.com/forums...ge=6&pp=25</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>I'm going to post there about Gosch for a little while.<br>I'm too busy to cross-post the same things.<br>If there's any epiphany, I'll alert the RI board.<br>But please check that thread out, too. <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=fourthbase>FourthBase</A> at: 9/4/06 2:21 am<br></i>

[sunny]

I remember the Billig piece from A&E. I'm sorry Amy's mother died before she knew what really happened. This customs chap looks good for it. <p></p><i></i>

[FourthBase]

Fucking christ...spend an hour browsing Websleuths...<br>I've never been more angry and disgusted with humanity.<br>I'm anti-death-penalty...but some of those stories...<br><br><!--EZCODE EMOTICON START :eek --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/eek.gif ALT=":eek"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START >: --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/mad.gif ALT=">:"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START :x --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/sick.gif ALT=":x"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START >: --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/mad.gif ALT=">:"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START :eek --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/eek.gif ALT=":eek"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START :x --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/sick.gif ALT=":x"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> <p></p><i></i>

[FourthBase]

<!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.radioiowa.com/gestalt/go.cfm?objectid=053026F8-C942-4142-BAA9D2C3754AF8AD&dbtranslator=local.cfm">www.radioiowa.com/gestalt...=local.cfm</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Reported pictures of Johnny Gosch under scrutiny<br><br>by Stella Shaffer<br><br>West Des Moines police confirm that they're checking the authenticity of photos that purport to be pictures of Johnny Gosch. Sergeant Jason Bryan says everyone on the force knows the story of the West Des Moines paperboy who vanished on his early-morning route in 1982. <br><br>He says the missing boy's mother, Noreen Gosch, came to police on Thursday. She brought them some photos and turned them over to the criminal-investigation unit. Bryan says the lead detective on the case is now researching their authenticity. A lot of claims by people who said they'd seen the boy, and some who said they were Johnny, over the years have been debunked, but the sergeant says this one will get the same attention as any case. <br><br>The same approach, he says -- any case that's open and active, and any new information regarding a case, is looked into to the fullest extent. "Then we go from there, basically," he says. <br><br>Detective Boyd is assigned to the case and will be working on the new photos. He isn't the original member of the force who handled it back in 1982, but currently is the detective on the case. It was September 5, 1982, when Johnny Gosch was last seen, picking up papers that had been dropped off for his regular route.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--> <p></p><i></i>

[Dreams End]

I'm not sure what the question is. Is there any question that the black and white photo is of Johnny? Though "Number 15" is blurry and doesn't look like the same kid, Noreen identified him as such. Meanwhile, if you look carefully, he is tied up in the exact same manner. So I feel very certain that it's the same perps.<br><br>There's a lot of gray area in this line of work. You have "ex-spooks" and the like involved for reasons that aren't clear but perhaps simply to muddy the waters. But the pics are there, and they are real.<br><br>Does anyone have a link to an article interviewing Noreen where she says that the FBI or someone showed her a "catalogue" of kids who were being trafficked? I'm pretty sure she's the one who talked about having been shown that as part of the investigation. <p></p><i></i>

[sunny]

<!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>Does anyone have a link to an article interviewing Noreen where she says that the FBI or someone showed her a "catalogue" of kids</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> <br><br><!--EZCODE LINK START--><a href="http://dragonkeypress.com/blog/?page_id=908" target="top">From here:</a><!--EZCODE LINK END--><br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>And then I got another eye-opener when I went to Washington D.C. in 1984, and I was called in to testify before the organized crime hearings. At that hearing, the FBI presented physical evidence as well as testimony. They had a table full of paraphernalia that had been confiscated from pedophiles. On the table were books on how to molest toddlers and leave no marks, how to lure a child to a car. <br>These were all bound books. Somebody went to the trouble of publishing them. And then there were sexual torture toys - that type of thing. <!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>But the book that startled me the most was a small book, it was kind of like a spiral bound thing, and in it there were lots of pictures of kids. But these were kids that had not been kidnapped yet. It was like a catalogue.</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--> And everyone there at the senate hearing, the press, everybody was shocked. And yet, after the presentation of this, our congress did nothing. It was like the senate hearing was just an exercise for the day. “Well, OK, let’s get all these parents, and let’s do something to make everybody feel good, make them think we’re gonna do something.” But they never did. Johnny was photographed before he was kidnapped. Johnny was photographed on his way home from school.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--> <p></p><i></i>

[Et in Arcadia ego]

Locals in Des Moines comment on the Johhny Gosh case:<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://blogs.dmregister.com/?p=2317#comments">blogs.dmregister.com/?p=2317#comments</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>[there's three pages, and there's a few comments that strike close to home for us here that appear to be edited out, as per 'sick and disgusted']<br><br>edit: full comments page:<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://blogs.dmregister.com/?p=2317&cp=all#comments">blogs.dmregister.com/?p=2...l#comments</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--> <p>____________________<br>Some are born to sweet delight, some are born to endless night.</p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=etinarcadiaego@rigorousintuition>et in Arcadia ego</A>  <IMG HEIGHT=10 WIDTH=10 SRC="http://www.sickle666.com/images/Arcadia.jpg" BORDER=0> at: 9/4/06 4:22 pm<br></i>

[Kris Millegan]

Well, gee and my ears weren't even burning. <br><br>The Web is one thing and book is something else. <br><br>Books don't get burned and banned for no reason. <br><br>The pen is mightier than the sword. <br><br>The money is for investigation and promotion and because this story is bigger than TrineDay. <br><br>So many folks have been trying for years to "address this issue," and they have all been stopped, one way or another. The FBI and others run interference. <br><br>And I have been thinking about this for sometime, how can I succeed, where others, much larger and with way more money have failed. <br><br>The answer, I believe is to make this book a public process, including raising money. Books do not just happen. I have no money, never have, just ideas and hard work. I am in more debt than I ever thought and taking on more, I generally work 10-12 hrs, 7 days a week, wear seveal hats, to keep TrineDay going, because there are very valid authors and journalist out there that nobody will publish. <br><br>We have an author who has already spent four years and tens of thousands of dollars researching and verifying this material. We have substainial leads that still need verification. Yes, we could just dump the magazine article on the net, but you know what we would rather see some of our media step up and do their job. If they don't, we will tell you they won't. With the release of these Gosch pictures, there has been some "renewed interest." Will NY get some "cajones." Quien sabe? We will see.<br><br>Let me remind you folks about, James Norman, a courageous man, who released a story he had written for Forbes onto the Net. Created a storm on the net but never really crossed over to print. We got to see Orlin Grabbe on CBS, but the amazing story was still "spiked." <br><br>We urge you to call Vanity Fair, Harpers, Playboy and Rolling Stone and asked them why they will not cover the Franklin/Boy's Town pedophile story.<br><br>This is not an end run but a direct frontal assault by all of us, for all of us and … the kids.<br><br>Going public with the whole process and all profits going to a foundation for the kids is the way to be succesfull, with this project.<br><br>MHO<br>Peace, <br>Om<br>Kris Millegan <p></p><i></i>

[chiggerbit]

Interesting, I didn't know this. From one of the comments in the Des Moines Register:<br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>The messed up thing about the book,The Franklin Coverup, is that the preface was written by William Colby who was the CIA director in the mid to late sixties.He was involved with a lot of unethical mind control projects that was buried when the Church hearings of the mid 70’s exposed them.He encouraged Sen DeCamp to write that book.Guess what happened to him!? He was subpoened in 1996 to testify in a civil suit involving Frank Olsen’s family.Olsen was a biochemist that died mysteriously when he was dosed with LSD by the CIA in 1953 and fell/jumped/was pushed from a tall building.The morning he was to testify he was found drowned near his home.The people who did that must be in power to knock off an exCIA director.Conspiracy of Silence(dvd), The Franklin Coverup,Tranceformation of America, rituals at Bohemia Grove etc are valid and our current Vice President has been involved according to others since 1988 at least. Michael Aquino is no joke either…or Jack Parsons for that matter.I wonder how many DesMoines register paperboys were surveiled or followed that weren’t snatched.And we should always without exception support a mother who hasn’t forgotten about her son.Obviouslly,whoever sent the photos decided to release them on the JonBenetRamsey media attention coat tails for a reason.It is a message to someone other than Noreen most likely.I think we know who the real evil doers are dont we.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--> <p></p><i></i>