New photo up on The Johnny Gosch Foundation site

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Re: Good

Postby Et in Arcadia ego » Sat Mar 15, 2008 1:12 am

LilyPatToo wrote:I'm glad to hear that she's joined, actually. And as someone who's also experienced online excoriation (to the point of slander/character assassination) I want to hear her side of this in her own words. It's easy for people to anonymously toss around all sorts of opinions about a person's motives when she's not present.

LilyPat


There is no character assassination that I see taking place here; only objective discussion that doesn't make moral assumptions that are a fallacy to make.

If you are referring to things I have said in this thread, I'm not taking back any of it. I speculated and asked the board's opinion. I doubt that I am the first, and in the past this was probably done to a far greater extent than I applied as an outside observer. Ultimately, I want to see a resolution to this case and any other where a parent is deprived of a child, or a child is deprived of his/her life. I was a heavily abused child, so don't try telling me that parents aren't capable of monstrous acts. If Mrs Gosch is innocent(and of course, I honestly would want to believe that she is, I mean come on..), I hope fervently that she wreaks justice on whoever did this and if she isn't, well..

As outsiders, we're not in a position to make that determination at all one way or another, but I have a right to speak my thoughts. I would think that Mrs Gosch would realize and appreciate that. If my thoughts are incongruent with the flux of the board, I'll refrain in the future from contributing to discussion of the subject, and that's that.
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Postby Et in Arcadia ego » Sat Mar 15, 2008 1:14 am

LilyPatToo wrote:Just a (belated) comment on the fact that the kids in the photos weren't wildly disheveled--there would, in my opinion, be a huge difference between a photo taken shortly after a child's capture and imprisonment and one taken later. Even a few days later.


By the way, Lilypat, this is an excellent insight that I didn't take into consideration, so thanks for pointing that out.
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Postby stackdag » Sat Mar 15, 2008 4:06 am

Well I'm very much looking forward to what both Noreen and MASONICPLOT have to say about this recent development.
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Not what I meant

Postby LilyPatToo » Sat Mar 15, 2008 11:42 am

et, I said that I had been the victim of character assassination, not Ms. Gosch. And I'm sorry if you took my post to mean that I was criticizing you, personally, because that wasn't my intent at all. There's just an occasional tendency here to leap a little too quickly into suspicion of people's motives (and of course that's just my opinion, for what it's worth).

99% of the time, I find RI refreshingly willing to Question Authority. It's only very occasionally that I wonder if we don't go overboard a bit and enter paranoid-suspicious trash-talking territory. After hanging out for many years on another board where very few individuals ever questioned their chosen authority, I find RI to be much more to my taste, believe me!

Glad you're back, BTW :D

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Postby MASONIC PLOT » Sat Mar 15, 2008 12:34 pm

Whoaaa now wait a minute here. I have NEVER in my entire time online said ANYTHING badly about Mrs. Gosch, nor will I EVER.

I would be HAPPY to talk to Noreen here on RI and I welcome here presence to get this cleared up. Nothing I said was wrong or of ill intent!
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Postby Et in Arcadia ego » Sat Mar 15, 2008 1:16 pm

MASONIC PLOT wrote:Whoaaa now wait a minute here. I have NEVER in my entire time online said ANYTHING badly about Mrs. Gosch, nor will I EVER.


I was really hoping that she was not referring to you. Honestly, I don't recall anyone directly quoting her at all here, so maybe she's talking about a different board.

As far as her registering last night, we still don't even know if that's actually her or not.
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Postby shefner » Sat Mar 15, 2008 4:28 pm

I don't recall anyone directly quoting Noreen, but I do know that Masonic Plot claimed she had spoken to Noreen and asked her about the photos on her website. Some here didn't think the photos of Johnny should be displayed on his site, but I thought the greater good would be brought about by showing them....
Masonic Plot said that Noreen had indicated that there were 2 camps named "Caribou" --one in Maine and one in Canada. MP said Noreen had revealed that the camp in Canada had a connection to the Franklin Coverup. MP never revealed how, but I am very curious about it.
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Postby Crow » Sat Mar 15, 2008 10:44 pm

I looked again at the most recent photo today, and the name on the laundry bag did look clumsily doctored. It appears that the intent was to make the lettering more readable.
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Postby Et in Arcadia ego » Sun Mar 16, 2008 12:26 am

Ok, finally, my curiosity is getting the better of me, MP. You have been an active account here for over two years, and something is not adding up. If you would be kind enough to indulge me, I'd like to make an observation and gain some feedback from you.

When the entirety of a post from you is analyzed, one finds themselves embedded in a Liar's Paradox.

To wit:

MASONIC PLOT wrote:Whoaaa now wait a minute here. I have NEVER in my entire time online said ANYTHING badly about Mrs. Gosch, nor will I EVER.

I would be HAPPY to talk to Noreen here on RI and I welcome here presence to get this cleared up. Nothing I said was wrong or of ill intent!


I can quote you and this seems okey dokey. However, when I quote you in entirety, a totally different picture emerges:

MASONIC PLOT wrote:Whoaaa now wait a minute here. I have NEVER in my entire time online said ANYTHING badly about Mrs. Gosch, nor will I EVER.

I would be HAPPY to talk to Noreen here on RI and I welcome here presence to get this cleared up. Nothing I said was wrong or of ill intent!
_________________________
The above post is intended for entertainment purposes only and in no way reflects the opinions of the flesh and blood person writing the text. All writings under the screen name "MASONIC PLOT" are merely a characterization of this created persona.


As you can see, this makes for a certain difficulty. Please walk me through the discrepancy as it appears here, because in all honesty, since you employed this signature you have invalidated the integrity of every single post you have made since.
Last edited by Et in Arcadia ego on Sun Mar 16, 2008 1:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Crow » Sun Mar 16, 2008 1:12 am

That signature has been there for as long as I remember.
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Postby brainpanhandler » Sun Mar 16, 2008 1:24 am

Anonymous Coward wrote:un-godlike tin foil crowd is blaming the mother. Nice.

[link to www.rigorousintuition.ca]

and the "severed foot" on your board was addicted to crack right Jeff Wells?

money hungry "PUBLISH MY BOOK" freak.


http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum ... 510406/pg2
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Postby Et in Arcadia ego » Sun Mar 16, 2008 1:40 am

GLP, eh?
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Postby Et in Arcadia ego » Sun Mar 16, 2008 1:43 am

Crow wrote:That signature has been there for as long as I remember.


Yes, it has. I'm just curious if its intended to be taken literally at face value. Stranger things have happened.

I'd be really happy to simply have Noreen Gosch make a post here if/when she can and clear the matter up the easiest way by confirming what MP has said.
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Postby Jeff » Sun Mar 16, 2008 10:26 am

brainpanhandler wrote:
Anonymous Coward wrote:un-godlike tin foil crowd is blaming the mother. Nice.

[link to www.rigorousintuition.ca]

and the "severed foot" on your board was addicted to crack right Jeff Wells?

money hungry "PUBLISH MY BOOK" freak.


http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum ... 510406/pg2


Well...interesting. Without comment, here's MASONIC PLOT's first post, 05 Jan 2006 without the "The above post is intended for entertainment purposes" sig line:

I have always enjoyed the work of Jeff Wells. I think he does a great job of getting people to think in ways that they may not be used to. I am quite disapointed, however, that he has decided to take the hard line against any discussion of alternative views regarding Holocaust history. While I certainly understand this is a hot button topic, I think it is extremely important that it remain a topic that people continue to discuss for many reasons. I think all topics, no matter how taboo or hot button, should be open for honest discussion and debate.

In an attempt to understand why Jeff would decide to take such a hard line I did a little research. I looked into the Publishing company of his novel "Anxious Gravity." I found an article by a man whose book was rejected by a Jewish faction within this publishing group because they were offended by it. I am just wondering if there is any connection to Jeffs stance and the fact that the company that publsihes and markets his novel doesnt like Holocaust revisionaist dialogue.


You can read that story here.
www.michaelbradley.info/g...eltov.html

I also looked at the books Dundrum group markets and found that one of their top sellers is one of the foremost authorities on anti semitism, you can see that book here:
www.dundurn.com/bookid/0404

Also I think it is worth mentioning that there are hate crimes laws in place in Canada where Jeff lives that make it a pretty heafty crime to question the holocaust.

In light of all of these interesting little tidbits I think it is safe to say that Jeff is looking out for number one. As much as I enjoy his work and understand that he has to feed his kids I have to say shame on you Jeff if this is indeed the case. I look forward to reading your work in the future Jeff, nothing has changed for me, but this does make me wonder. If this were simply about tolerance it seems unlikely you would slam Scientologists and Moonies as often as you do. It has to be about more than just tolerance Jeff. What we have found is a weak spot, and in the end, as always, it is likely all about THE CASH. I want to be wrong, believe me, I do. All I am doing is connecting the dots. Isnt that what Jeff has taught us all to do? =)
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Postby MASONIC PLOT » Sun Mar 16, 2008 11:04 am

Yes I am aware of what is going on here. I have had a change of heart, Jeff. When I first came here I used to argue the other side of that issue, after having spent more time on the internet on other forums as well and seen how ignorant the white supremacist, racist, nazi types are, I decided to distance myself from that and begin to look at the other side, and i did so, often, with your help, having sent you questions on the matter and asked for things to read so that I could learn who was really behind the pushing of such filth. Recently, I came back to RI and started to speak out against some of what I felt was in fact real antisemiticsm, since then I have been under attack, both on the board and in PMs, and now from you and ET as well.

It is no problem and it is completely understandable, but I did in fact, sincerely, have a change of heart on the matter. You can believe what you want.

As for Noreen, I was merely defending her from those who were questioning her integrity. Do they have the right to do that? Absolutely, the forum is called Rigorous Intuition, and accordingly we should all be rigorous with our intuition, but for my part, when it comes to the broken heart of a mother, I am not willing to say some of the things or ask some of the questions others are. I believe Mrs. Gosch is telling the truth and I do my best to try and defend what I feel is the truth. It is not personal at all, but since I have decided to stand up to those on here who I feel are hiding their antisemitism behind popular and politically correct issues, and dancing around the rules here at RI, I have come under attack from all sides, perhaps rightfully so, but I stand for what I believe in and I will never sacrifice my principle for popularity.

People do change, Jeff, what I once believed I have come to see as ugly, it really is as simple as that.


I wont be addressing this further because it is obviously becoming a game of cat and mouse and I dont care much for playing such games. I said what I said and that is the end of it as far as I am concerned. The thread was started about a new picture on the JG Foundation site, people started to suggest it might be doctored and asked why it was titled in the JPF file as "Camp Caribou" but had no mention of such in the comments by Mrs Gosch, and it was further suggested that she was playing some sort of game and that her site had become a place some people dont want to visit because certain pictures were posted so liberally and prominently. The information was relayed to Mrs Gosch, she can easily be contacted, as her contact information is right on her site, she explianed the situation and I relayed that back to the best of my understanding, all the while trying to defend her from those who tried to question her motives and integrity. I will say it again, I meant no harm to anyone and I was merely trying to defend a mother who has lost her son from those who very obviously have her spinning in circles with all kinds of crazy and nutty conspiracy theories.

At the same time all of this took place, I had decided to make a stand against what I felt was real antisemitism rearing its head and showing its ugly face on this board, after having a change of heart on issues regarding Holocaust denial and the idea that Zionists are behind all the worlds problems, I have begun to speak out against such filth and make it known to those who push such that their ideas will not go unchallenged. In doing so, I have come under attack from all sides, both on the forum and in private messages. I have to believe there is a connection here. If I am wrong please tell me otherwise, but really, I dont want to play games, I have better things to do and a lot of new things to learn. Life is too short for bullshit like this.

If you dont want me here simply ban me, there is no reason to play games and turn this in to something that it isnt.
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