John deCamp

[chiggerbit]

As it stands now, from an outsider's point of view, the discourse props the perception that, as Lbo said, Franklin is a LaRouche conspiracy

Project Willow, I'm sorry if you don't like the track this is taking, but I was starting to see sweeping statements, mingling information taken from deCamp's books, interviews, etc. and mingling it together with Bryant's book. My point, if I have one, isn't that Franklin is a LaRouche conspiracy, but rather that deCamp himself might be one. Bryants work needs to stand on it's own, not piggybacked onto deCamp's "work". This is too important an issue to be dismissed. I really don't think anyone is suggesting that the baby be thrown out with the bathwater. I just don't think it's wise for people to use deCamp as a foundation for other inormation that may be brought out, by Bryant or anyone else.

[Jeff]

I agree with what lbo said - as well as information gathering, I'm wondering what the purpose of this information gathering is?

It's no mystery to me. It's a reclamation project from dubious Patriot and LaRouche mouthpieces, and it's tremendously important.

My point, if I have one, isn't that Franklin is a LaRouche conspiracy, but rather that deCamp himself might be one. Bryants work needs to stand on it's own, not piggybacked onto deCamp's "work".

What I wish I'd said.

[Project Willow]

There are a couple of instances where his body language changed dramatically - one in particular was around the area of Johnny Gosch's father. That is worth checking out much more than the Larouche involvement.(*)

I had a thought actually after the questioning about Colby and his personality tests, or rather, his finding DeCamp through a review of soldiers' files of a slightly different angle. DeCamp is roughly my dad's age. For mc subjects of my dad's generation, they didn't get them as kids so much, but as young adults, pulling mostly out of military institutions. Phoenix project involved personnel with overlap in the mc programs. So, many possibilities for DeCamp being a tool, with different handles and his own desires and interests playing into the mix.

*

pretty amazing that.

[Project Willow]

Bryants work needs to stand on it's own, not piggybacked onto deCamp's "work".

It does stand on its own, demonstrably. That's the perception I would rather like to see fleshed out in 10-12 page long threads.

[Searcher08]

I agree with what lbo said - as well as information gathering, I'm wondering what the purpose of this information gathering is?

It's no mystery to me. It's a reclamation project from dubious Patriot and LaRouche mouthpieces, and it's tremendously important.

...

Jeff, what in particular is it about 'reclaiming Franklin' - that you see as being so very important? What difference will it make? (I'm assuming it isnt about traditional left v right?? )

[Jeff]

And perhaps there's a parallelism worth noting, in how the preeminent, breaking source on the Craig Spence WH callboy scandal was the Moonie Washington Times.

[chiggerbit]

Project Willow said:

It does stand on its own, demonstrably. That's the perception I would rather like to see fleshed out in 10-12 page long threads.

I don't get it. You seemed to be irritated that we were holding deCamp up to scrutiny. And now you want us to do the same thing to Bryant? Well, I don't think you're going to get any 10 or 12 pages. DeCamp has been all over this conspiracy for decades, with his books, videos, interviews. Bryant is a newbie. His book WILL stand up to scrutiny if it's good. But all these pages of discussion on deCamp isn't a good result for him--the high number is an indication that his story might be flawed. Be careful what you ask for.

[Project Willow]

I don't get it. You seemed to be irritated that we were holding deCamp up to scrutiny. And now you want us to do the same thing to Bryant?

If your baseline approach to every subject is to pry at its faults to dismantle it, then yes, I guess you wouldn't get it. No, actually it might be nice to have a good long discussion about what Byant's book proves, what he has established as unassailable, what that says about the state of institutions, pedophilia and nature of people who hold power.

[chiggerbit]

Cordelia said:

What if the Colbys meant that this isn't just about the Franklin players, but involves many states' corrupt money brokers and politicians, is business as usual (including the business of blackmail) at Washington's after party parties, involves both parties and all three branches of government. Maybe Franklin is just a tip of the iceberg.

Jeff said:

And perhaps there's a parallelism worth noting, in how the preeminent, breaking source on the Craig Spence WH callboy scandal was the Moonie Washington Times.

That's one of the problems with this one: what we may have are at least two (2) cults contributing to a story about cultsish use of children. Huh???
In addition, I keep noticing all the many, many connections of a number of the characters in the Phoenix project, Iran/contra, Franklin conspiracies. Don't forget the conjecture that the missing Franklin credit union funds may have found their way to Iran/Contra. AND THEN, we have one of the above-mentioned cults being (possibly) the first to describe several conspiracies, such as the October Surprise and Inslaw; and then we have operators in the other cult, if I remember right, implicated in being involved, actually personally involved, in Iran/contra. It's hard to keep all the dynamics straight.

[chiggerbit]

If your baseline approach to every subject is to pry at its faults to dismantle it, then yes, I guess you wouldn't get it.

You think that's what I do?

[Project Willow]

You think that's what I do?

No Chig., just arguing against your suggestion about a possible Bryant thread.

[Jeff]

I regard this thread as a continuation of Bryant's work: prying the Franklin story away from suspect storytellers.

BTW, FWIW, King was incarcerated with LaRouche at the US Medical Facility in Rochester, Minnesota while it was determined whether he was mentally fit to stand trial.

[chiggerbit]

just arguing against your suggestion about a possible Bryant thread.

Yes, but you see, you kind of squelched that when you nailed AD for a long Bryant quote.

[Project Willow]

That's one of the problems with this one: what we may have are at least two (2) cults contributing to a story about cultsish use of children. Huh???

Whenever I see LaRouche kids on a street corner I always throw some nonsensical version of that out at them such as:

"It's the cult that fights the cult."
"You can't use a cult to fight a cult."
"Yes, please indoctrinate me out of the other cult, thank you."

Terribly insensitive of me, I know.

[Project Willow]

just arguing against your suggestion about a possible Bryant thread.

Yes, but you see, you kind of squelched that when you nailed AD for a long Bryant quote.

Wah? where? I also started a Bryant thread that got locked because of wandering conflicts, so yeah I'm not a black and white character either.