Scientist say: Humans And Machines Will Merge In Near Future

Moderators: Elvis, DrVolin, Jeff

Scientist say: Humans And Machines Will Merge In Near Future

Postby vigilant » Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:37 am

By the 2030s, Kurzweil said, humans will become more non-biological than biological, capable of uploading our minds onto the Internet, living in various virtual worlds and even avoiding aging and evading death.

In the 2040s, Kurzweil predicts that non-biological intelligence will be billions of times better than the biological intelligence humans have today, possibly rendering our present brains obsolete.

(entire article below)



source
Article from: http://edition.cnn.com/2008/TECH/07/15/ ... index.html




Scientists: Humans and machines will merge in future
2008 07 20

By Lara Farrar | cnn.com




A group of experts from around the world will hold a first of its kind conference Thursday on global catastrophic risks.

They will discuss what should be done to prevent these risks from becoming realities that could lead to the end of human life on Earth as we know it.

Speakers at the four-day event at Oxford University in Britain will talk about topics including nuclear terrorism and what to do if a large asteroid were to be on a collision course with our planet.

On the final day of the Global Catastrophic Risk Conference, experts will focus on what could be the unintended consequences of new technologies, such as superintelligent machines that, if ill-conceived, might cause the demise of Homo sapiens.

"Any entity which is radically smarter than human beings would also be very powerful," said Dr. Nick Bostrom, director of Oxford's Future of Humanity Institute, host of the symposium. "If we get something wrong, you could imagine the consequences would involve the extinction of the human species."

Bostrom is a philosopher and a leading thinker of transhumanism, a movement that advocates not only the study of the potential threats and promises that future technologies could pose to human life but also the ways in which emergent technologies could be used to make the very act of living better.

"We want to preserve the best of what it is to be human and maybe even amplify that," Bostrom said.

Transhumanists, according to Bostrom, anticipate an era in which biotechnology, molecular nanotechnologies, artificial intelligence and other new types of cognitive tools will be used to amplify our intellectual capacity, improve our physical capabilities and even enhance our emotional well-being.

The end result would be a new form of "posthuman" life with beings that possess qualities and skills so exceedingly advanced they no longer can be classified simply as humans.

"We will begin to use science and technology not just to manage the world around us but to manage our own human biology as well," Bostrom said. "The changes will be faster and more profound than the very, very slow changes that would occur over tens of thousands of years as a result of natural selection and biological evolution."

Bostrom declined to predict an exact time frame when this revolutionary biotechnological metamorphosis might occur. "Maybe it will take eight years or 200 years," he said. "It is very hard to predict."

Other experts are already getting ready for what they say could be a radical transformation of the human race in as little as two decades.

"This will happen faster than people realize," said Dr. Ray Kurzweil, an inventor and futurist who calculates technology trends using what he calls the law of accelerating returns, a mathematical concept that measures the exponential growth of technological evolution.

In the 1980s, Kurzweil predicted that a tiny handheld device would be invented early in the 21st century, allowing blind people to read documents from anywhere at anytime; this year, such a device was publicly unveiled. He also anticipated the explosive growth of the Internet in the 1990s.

Now, Kurzweil is predicting the arrival of something called the Singularity, which he defines in his book on the subject as "the culmination of the merger of our biological thinking and existence with our technology, resulting in a world that is still human but that transcends our biological roots."

"There will be no distinction, post-Singularity, between human and machine or between physical and virtual reality," he writes.

Singularity will approach at an accelerating rate as human-created technologies become exponentially smaller and increasingly powerful and as fields such as biology and medicine are understood more and more in terms of information processes that can be simulated with computers.

By the 2030s, Kurzweil said, humans will become more non-biological than biological, capable of uploading our minds onto the Internet, living in various virtual worlds and even avoiding aging and evading death.

In the 2040s, Kurzweil predicts that non-biological intelligence will be billions of times better than the biological intelligence humans have today, possibly rendering our present brains obsolete.

"Our brains are a million times slower than electronics," Kurzweil said. "We will increasingly become software entities if you go out enough decades."

This movement towards the merger of man and machine, according to Kurzweil, is already starting to happen and is most visible in the field of biotechnology.

As scientists gain deeper insights into the genetic processes that underlie life, they are able to effectively reprogram human biology through the development of new forms of gene therapies and medications capable of turning on or off enzymes and RNA interference, or gene silencing.

"Biology and health and medicine used to be hit or miss," Kurzweil sad. "It wasn't based on any coherent theory about how it works."

The emerging biotechnology revolution will lead to at least a thousand new drugs that could do anything from slow down the process of aging to reverse the onset of diseases, like heart disease and cancer, Kurzweil said.

By 2020, Kurzweil predicts a second revolution in the area of nanotechnology. According to his calculations, it is already showing signs of exponential growth as scientists begin to test first generation nanobots that can cure Type 1 diabetes in rats or heal spinal cord injuries in mice.

One scientist is developing something called a respirocyte, a robotic red blood cell that, if injected into the bloodstream, would allow humans to do an Olympic sprint for 15 minutes without taking a breath or sit at the bottom of a swimming pool for hours at a time.

Other researchers are developing nanoparticles that can locate tumors and one day even eradicate them.

And some Parkinson's patients now have pea-sized computers implanted in their brains that replace neurons destroyed by the disease; new software can be downloaded to the mini computers from outside the human body.

"Nanotechnology will not just be used to reprogram but to transcend biology and go beyond its limitations by merging with non-biological systems," Kurzweil said. "If we rebuild biological systems with nanotechnology, we can go beyond its limits."

The final revolution leading to the advent of Singularity will be the creation of artificial intelligence, or superintelligence, which, according to Kurzweil, could be capable of solving many of our biggest threats, like environmental destruction, poverty and disease.

"A more intelligent process will inherently outcompete one that is less intelligent, making intelligence the most powerful force in the universe," Kurzweil writes.

Yet the invention of so many high-powered technologies and the possibility of merging these new technologies with humans may pose both peril and promise for the future of mankind.

"I think there are grave dangers," Kurzweil said. "Technology has always been a double-edged sword."
The whole world is a stage...will somebody turn the lights on please?....I have to go bang my head against the wall for a while and assimilate....
vigilant
 
Posts: 2210
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 9:53 pm
Location: Back stage...
Blog: View Blog (0)

Postby barracuda » Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:44 am

That's all great - but can we perfect the flying car first?

Image

Kurzweil seems to keep edging the singularity further and further away...
Last edited by barracuda on Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
The most dangerous traps are the ones you set for yourself. - Phillip Marlowe
User avatar
barracuda
 
Posts: 12890
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 5:58 pm
Location: Niles, California
Blog: View Blog (0)

Postby justdrew » Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:53 am

man if only that functioned as a boat too, it'd be perfect.

Kurzweil is a materialistic reductionist but probably correct, but 22 years away from uploading to the internet? I completely doubt that happening so soon...

some people think/suspect that we already have huge "brains" billions of times better than our biological brains... only problem is the downstream bandwidth just sucks.
User avatar
justdrew
 
Posts: 11966
Joined: Tue May 24, 2005 7:57 pm
Location: unknown
Blog: View Blog (11)

Postby beeline » Wed Jul 23, 2008 1:40 pm

"I am Locutus of Borg. Resistance is futile. Your life, as it has been, is over. From this time forward, you will service us."
User avatar
beeline
 
Posts: 2024
Joined: Wed May 21, 2008 4:10 pm
Location: Killadelphia, PA
Blog: View Blog (0)

Postby unaltered » Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:44 pm

Yes, I hope to merge with an ATM. YAHOO!!!!!
unaltered
 
Posts: 345
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2008 9:55 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Postby Occult Means Hidden » Wed Jul 23, 2008 5:32 pm

I think it is completely rational to expect trends to indicate a merging of man and machine. I'm not so sure it will completely happen however - for a specific reason.

I think there may be something in DNA that is more valuable. Not saying as a wild-eyed optomist - But as a concern of the consciousness hierarchy. If there are "trans-dimensional" entities abound who prey upon us, in what appears to us as ritual - than changing our makeup is going to sour our taste.

To a point, perhaps the lower classes are indeed allowed to be artificially mechanized, but perhaps this is actually to their detriment and disempowerment - despite the dangling enticement of vitality and superhuman skill - in that, they would forever lose the benefit of their deeper DNA's potential - whatever that potential may be.
Rage against the ever vicious downward spiral.
Time to get back to basics. [url=http://zmag.org/zmi/readlabor.htm]Worker Control of Industry![/url]
User avatar
Occult Means Hidden
 
Posts: 1403
Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2006 1:34 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Postby Occult Means Hidden » Wed Jul 23, 2008 5:41 pm

Just ask the nearest Star Wars nerd. They all know that Anakin Skywalker was destined to be the most powerful Jedi, like, ever. Than he became more machine than man and lost much of his "feel of the force" and so didn't live to his potential. If we suppose the story is an occultic revealing of what the "life force" is.

if you know what I mean. :wink:
Rage against the ever vicious downward spiral.
Time to get back to basics. [url=http://zmag.org/zmi/readlabor.htm]Worker Control of Industry![/url]
User avatar
Occult Means Hidden
 
Posts: 1403
Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2006 1:34 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Postby Occult Means Hidden » Wed Jul 23, 2008 6:27 pm

July 22, 2008
Does DNA Have Telepathic Properties?-A Galaxy Classic

DNA has been found to have a bizarre ability to put itself together, even at a distance, when according to known science it shouldn't be able to. Explanation: None, at least not yet.

Scientists are reporting evidence that contrary to our current beliefs about what is possible, intact double-stranded DNA has the “amazing” ability to recognize similarities in other DNA strands from a distance. Somehow they are able to identify one another, and the tiny bits of genetic material tend to congregate with similar DNA. The recognition of similar sequences in DNA’s chemical subunits, occurs in a way unrecognized by science. There is no known reason why the DNA is able to combine the way it does, and from a current theoretical standpoint this feat should be chemically impossible.

Even so, the research published in ACS’ Journal of Physical Chemistry B, shows very clearly that homology recognition between sequences of several hundred nucleotides occurs without physical contact or presence of proteins. Double helixes of DNA can recognize matching molecules from a distance and then gather together, all seemingly without help from any other molecules or chemical signals.

In the study, scientists observed the behavior of fluorescently tagged DNA strands placed in water that contained no proteins or other material that could interfere with the experiment. Strands with identical nucleotide sequences were about twice as likely to gather together as DNA strands with different sequences. No one knows how individual DNA strands could possibly be communicating in this way, yet somehow they do. The “telepathic” effect is a source of wonder and amazement for scientists.

“Amazingly, the forces responsible for the sequence recognition can reach across more than one nanometer of water separating the surfaces of the nearest neighbor DNA,” said the authors Geoff S. Baldwin, Sergey Leikin, John M. Seddon, and Alexei A. Kornyshev and colleagues.

This recognition effect may help increase the accuracy and efficiency of the homologous recombination of genes, which is a process responsible for DNA repair, evolution, and genetic diversity. The new findings may also shed light on ways to avoid recombination errors, which are factors in cancer, aging, and other health issues.



Image

It's all about the Checkerboard game, baby.

http://www.dailygalaxy.com/my_weblog/20 ... ave-t.html
Rage against the ever vicious downward spiral.
Time to get back to basics. [url=http://zmag.org/zmi/readlabor.htm]Worker Control of Industry![/url]
User avatar
Occult Means Hidden
 
Posts: 1403
Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2006 1:34 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

the tragedy of toaster-man

Postby norton ash » Wed Jul 23, 2008 9:50 pm

I...don't...want to be... TOASTER-MAN...anymore. Please... KILL ME.
Zen horse
User avatar
norton ash
 
Posts: 4067
Joined: Wed Nov 08, 2006 5:46 pm
Location: Canada
Blog: View Blog (0)

Postby vigilant » Wed Jul 23, 2008 10:36 pm

Putting these two concepts together could produce some interesting results.




Self-Assembling Tissues
Living Legos can be directed to form tissue-like structures.
http://www.technologyreview.com/Nanotech/21080/?a=f

<snip>
Khademhosseini is trying to re-create complex tissue structures by carefully controlling cell organization from the bottom up. He mixes cells into a solution of a biocompatible polymer called polyethylene glycol, then pours the mixture into molds shaped like blocks, stars, spheres, or any other shape. When exposed to a flash of light, the polymer blocks solidify. The living Legos can then be built up into more-complex structures and exposed to another flash of light that bonds them together. But assembly is painstaking: each block is only about a hundred micrometers across.





Growing Neural Implants
New approaches could more seamlessly integrate medical devices into the body.
http://www.technologyreview.com/Biotech/21087/?a=f

<snip>
Martin and his collaborators coat the electrodes with an electrically conductive polymer originally developed for electronic devices, such as organic LEDs and photovoltaics for solar cells. The polymer coating increases the surface area of the metal-biological interface, which in turn boosts performance of the electrode. "If you have lots of surface area, you can inject current more efficiently," says Douglas McCreery, director of the Neural Engineering Program at the Huntington Medical Research Institute, in Pasadena, CA. "That means less demand on batteries, but, probably more importantly, you're not recruiting the nasty electrochemical reactions that might be hazardous to surrounding tissue."

The Michigan scientists electrochemically deposit the polymer onto the electrode, much like chroming a car bumper. By peppering the material with small amounts of another polymer, they can coax the conductive polymer to form a hairy texture along the metal shaft. Martin says that the approach mimics nature: the numerous tiny alveoli of the lungs, for example, increase the surface area available for the oxygen exchange between air and blood. Scientists can also tack on nanofibers loaded with controlled-release drugs to inhibit the inflammatory reaction.
The whole world is a stage...will somebody turn the lights on please?....I have to go bang my head against the wall for a while and assimilate....
vigilant
 
Posts: 2210
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2007 9:53 pm
Location: Back stage...
Blog: View Blog (0)

Postby §ê¢rꆧ » Wed Jul 23, 2008 11:15 pm

I find Kurzweil's predictions very exciting and inspiring, and a big reason to go on living when I'm very depressed. Underneath all the gloom, there's a bit of a techno-optimist there. Maybe I will see superintelligence in my lifetime. Maybe the alien other won't prove to be in the stars or in the grimoires; it's silently emerging at our desktops.

The most interesting lecture I've heard from Terrence Mckenna (also one of his last, I believe) was "Psychedelics in the Age of Intelligent Machines." In it, Terence questions what we think of intelligence, and suggests we are already living in a machine-human symbiosis.

Flying cars? Do you want drunk drivers crashing into your house? I don't think it is the state of tech holding back the dream of flying cars, just the insanity of coordinating it, regulating it, insuring it, ad nauseum...
User avatar
§ê¢rꆧ
 
Posts: 1197
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2007 4:12 pm
Location: Region X
Blog: View Blog (0)

Postby barracuda » Wed Jul 23, 2008 11:45 pm

By the 2030s, Kurzweil said, humans will become more non-biological than biological, capable of uploading our minds onto the Internet, living in various virtual worlds and even avoiding aging and evading death.

Well, the small part of my brain already uploaded onto the internet finds the experience holds pluses and minuses. The main problem with this scenario is how utterly elitist it ultimately is. Only about one-sixth of humankind has any internet access today, and that ratio looks destined to fall, not rise. If the highest-end of technological access turns out to be the key to species transcendence, consider yourself shit outta luck, along with most everyone else who can't afford the mental lamborgini apparatus which is bound to price 99.9% of the world out - forever.

In the 2040s, Kurzweil predicts that non-biological intelligence will be billions of times better than the biological intelligence humans have today, possibly rendering our present brains obsolete.

Now correct me if I'm wrong but this is dystopian in the extreme, and reeks of skynet. Is this supposed to be the happy? Sounds to me like a sad. I don't see this particular flavor of singularity juice as being all that appealing. First of all, it is designed to make me feel inadequate. Some cyborgian uploaded mess will be "billions of times better"? Fuck you. How do you know how good I am now? Or, more to the point, how good I could be given the proper training and opportunities for self-actualization. Why can't we create a smart enough computer to give me concise instructions on the ultimate optimization of my own brain function and leave it at that? Presumably, then I could levitate, disappear, have major ninja powers, be like Jesus, etc., without all the squishy implants/cyborg stuff/surgery which seems destined to accompany this "uploaded" version of the singularity.

§ê¢rꆧ wrote:Terence questions what we think of intelligence, and suggests we are already living in a machine-human symbiosis.

I have a pair of eyeglasses which make this assertion frightfully obvious.

Flying cars? Do you want drunk drivers crashing into your house? I don't think it is the state of tech holding back the dream of flying cars, just the insanity of coordinating it, regulating it, insuring it, ad nauseum...

I don't care where they crash. I want one. Fucking cars crash into people's yards all the time, so what? My point was that these types of futuristic propositions never gel the way they are sold in the beginning. They usually wind up militarized after everyone gets used to the concept. So instead of flying cars we get pilotless hover drones with smart weapons over Sadr City. I have exactly the same expectations for the mind/machine interface which is seeing first applications in the field already by the military.

Listen to me, now I sound like someone who has been successully propagndized into a sense of technological entitlement which I neither deserve, require, want nor wish for.

Image
The most dangerous traps are the ones you set for yourself. - Phillip Marlowe
User avatar
barracuda
 
Posts: 12890
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 5:58 pm
Location: Niles, California
Blog: View Blog (0)

Postby JackRiddler » Thu Jul 24, 2008 12:27 am

.

Nope, not into the post-human stuff. Been reading Kurzweil for a while, and his thinking strikes me as decidedly anti-human. He hates us, hates himself, thinks if he becomes something else the something else that's no longer him will magically be happier, better, more worthwhile.

It's hard to draw distinctions between people and their machines, I know, but it can still be done today. Machine-human melds will still be humans, fooling themselves that they have magical extensions.

However, when entirely non-human machines truly become smarter than humans and possess their own individual consciousnesses and wills, it will be the duty of the humans to their own survival to immediately destroy these machines and kill those who want to make more of them. Sorry, my idea of progress is not to go extinct on behalf of superior beings because they'll have faster processing times. The fish and the ants and the baboons don't think that way either, insofar as they think.

Analogously, when humans find the way to achieve physical immortality, another of Kurzweil's obsessions (and he is not alone), it will become the duty of all rock-throwing teenagers of whatever age on the planet to kill all of the immortals. Just look ahead to the year 2100, and Bill Gates and Madonna and Richard Branson and Carly Fiorina and the DeVos family and a bunch of Bushes and Moons and Kurzweil and Craig Ventner and Murdoch's son and 10,000,000 other ruling class non-entities are still there, quasi-zombies because there's no way they'll maintain intact the identities or memories or passions over the centuries that actually make a person, but still there: in charge: owning it all: eating up the air and the opportunities: being glorified by the celebrity worshipping media they still own: dowsing the least spark of new life. Now imagine those who are born into this world, or sprout from the proverbial test-tube, or however it's done by then. Youth will have been robbed of all life, they will have no higher duty than to kill all immortals and reduce the civilization back to a state of semi-creative barbarism. Seriously.
User avatar
JackRiddler
 
Posts: 16007
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 2:59 pm
Location: New York City
Blog: View Blog (0)

Postby barracuda » Thu Jul 24, 2008 12:51 am

JackRiddler, you have painted a wondrously hideous picture of mankind's oldest dream. Kill all Immortals! I want to raid a cryogenic head-suspension facility right now and roll ol' Walt Disney's frozen cabeza into the nearest runoff canal.

Image
Last edited by barracuda on Thu Jul 24, 2008 12:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The most dangerous traps are the ones you set for yourself. - Phillip Marlowe
User avatar
barracuda
 
Posts: 12890
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 5:58 pm
Location: Niles, California
Blog: View Blog (0)

Postby OP ED » Thu Jul 24, 2008 4:21 am

they already have flying cars, dude. they're just, like, really expensive.

(Detroit has the best auto shows)

there have been several concepts in recent years, a few of which may finally be into the (less limited) production stages.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/6970031.stm

http://blog.wired.com/gadgets/2007/07/l ... r-lik.html

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... g-car.html

http://www.unitedbimmer.com/forums/bimm ... world.html

(off topic, I know, but I had to respond)

Fuck the machines. AIA beats AI any day.

Love is the Law,
SHCR
(still mostly fleshy)
User avatar
OP ED
 
Posts: 4673
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2008 10:04 pm
Location: Detroit
Blog: View Blog (0)

Next

Return to General Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 158 guests