What is the nature of the Saucer menace?

[8bitagent]

Long before Avatar was even being written, I wondered very seriously if some forms of consciousness might be capable of placing themselves within the "avatar bodies" of certain chosen humans.

And, on the outside chance this might be possible, how widespread might this be?

Yeah its an interesting thought. I definitely believe dark forces "work through" people with a religious fervor(politicians, leaders, Islamic jihadists, African genocide, dictators, imperialist capitalists, etc)
Aboriginals would call this "catching the Wendigo". Others would call it possession. Still, the use of humans as a kind of vessel to push through an agenda we don't fully understand is an intriguing prospect.

It makes you wonder

1) Who or what is behind the "PTB"
2) To what extent is the PTB aware of the evil and misery they are perpetuating, and to what aim?

8bitagent wrote:
After looking at the story of "The Nine", it seems like some of the "aliens" are rather racist. Though perhaps these are the same "aliens" the Nazis seemed drawn too.

I find "The Nine" and their surprisingly racist alien "teachings" interesting too. For some background pertaining to them (and particularly to Andrija Puharich's ringmaster role), here's The Stargate Conundrum and also the postscript on Reactions to its revelations.

LilyPat

I definitely remember a really stellar thread on the "Nine". My take was that this kind of exposes that these arent exactly terrestrial "aliens" from some planet. I recall reading about the Nazis interest in channeling "aliens"...perhaps they were the same racist beings.

[8bitagent]

Uh, Sim... Isn't that the family's umbrella over their picnic table?

Man, when I saw this live on tv...



I knew that we as a society had come full circle.

No surprise it landed near DIA and in somewhat of a parralel line to the Roswell event in New Mexico

[elfismiles]

Thanks for those blimp/missile/manta vids VK. Gotta add them to the Utah Mystery Missile thread:

Crop Circles Caused by Microwave Weapons?
viewtopic.php?p=326772#p326772

And the "hyperblimp" search term yields the Utah Mystery Missile:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QW5RKLucG1Q

[justdrew]

Long before Avatar was even being written, I wondered very seriously if some forms of consciousness might be capable of placing themselves within the "avatar bodies" of certain chosen humans.

And, on the outside chance this might be possible, how widespread might this be?

Yeah its an interesting thought. I definitely believe dark forces "work through" people with a religious fervor(politicians, leaders, Islamic jihadists, African genocide, dictators, imperialist capitalists, etc)
Aboriginals would call this "catching the Wendigo". Others would call it possession. Still, the use of humans as a kind of vessel to push through an agenda we don't fully understand is an intriguing prospect.

It makes you wonder

1) Who or what is behind the "PTB"
2) To what extent is the PTB aware of the evil and misery they are perpetuating, and to what aim?

8bitagent wrote:
After looking at the story of "The Nine", it seems like some of the "aliens" are rather racist. Though perhaps these are the same "aliens" the Nazis seemed drawn too.

I find "The Nine" and their surprisingly racist alien "teachings" interesting too. For some background pertaining to them (and particularly to Andrija Puharich's ringmaster role), here's The Stargate Conundrum and also the postscript on Reactions to its revelations.

LilyPat

I definitely remember a really stellar thread on the "Nine". My take was that this kind of exposes that these arent exactly terrestrial "aliens" from some planet. I recall reading about the Nazis interest in channeling "aliens"...perhaps they were the same racist beings.

there's several folklore's about that, one recent vein is, IIRC, the concept of "walk-ins"

but it's a psychologically dangerous area, because it engages with precisely the kind of thoughts that would get one labeled at least schizo. so wear an "astral condom" while considering.

but for a quick reference:
http://www.google.com/search?q=walk-ins+soul+exchange

===

anyway, I would have liked to have voted "all of the above"

===
"What is the nature of the Saucer menace?"

a long answer to the question that sort of brings everything into the mix can be found here:
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/vida_alien/warinheaven/warheaven-III.htm
it's a heck of a read, and I would like to hear someone else's review of the contents, I find it rather persuasive, but don't think it's 100% accurate either.

[8bitagent]

===
"What is the nature of the Saucer menace?"

a long answer to the question that sort of brings everything into the mix can be found here:
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/vida_alien/warinheaven/warheaven-III.htm
it's a heck of a read, and I would like to hear someone else's review of the contents, I find it rather persuasive, but don't think it's 100% accurate either.

Investigators like Vallee kept talking to people who had experienced “close encounters” with UFOs and undergone profound psychological changes as a result. When I and other occultists read these accounts, we saw their similarity to descriptions in our own literature of encounters with spiritual beings, psychic attacks, illumination experiences, etc. Eventually, Vallee and other well-known UFO writers grudgingly began to admit that the UFOs were “real but nonphysical.”

This concept will be discussed further in a later chapter.

They also found that their investigations of the effects of UFO encounters on people forced them to consider seriously the idea that unseen forces manipulate the course of human history. In the Fifties, the mainstream of the UFO investigation movement had ostracized Palmer and Shaver for talking about mind control and secret conspiracies. Twenty years later, many of these same investigators found that they were being drawn down the same path, the one marked “This way lies paranoia.”

I definitely would agree...though I do believe some of the UFO phenomenon is physical in nature, as in becoming physical/material in nature(such as when people see these craft land, and they leave imprints or other anomalies)

But I think people want to believe this alien stuff is a "transcendent positive new age message of tranquility and peace", and not a hell of tricksterism and a hidden manipulative agenda.

Also...he opines:

One thing is certain about World War II: whether or not high-level occult conspiracies were involved in such strategic events as the rise of the Nazis to power, occultism and psychic activities had a major impact on the course of the war. History records quite clearly that Hitler and other Nazi leaders believed in occultism enough to listen to advice from psychics, and that much of it was harmful to the Axis cause. For example, Hitler’s psychic advisors told him to stop trying to develop an atomic bomb. They also encouraged him to invade the Soviet Union.

and

However, I had some psychic experiences in 1962 and 1963 that strongly indicated that spiritual conspiracies were involved in the assassination.

Spot on, I would surmise

[justdrew]

and

However, I had some psychic experiences in 1962 and 1963 that strongly indicated that spiritual conspiracies were involved in the assassination.

Spot on, I would surmise

yes, that much seem very plausible, but that's one of the places where I question the narrative, 'cause look where they go with it. to paraphrase: "he had to die because he was a too dangerous loose cannon, would have gotten us all nuked."

[8bitagent]

and

However, I had some psychic experiences in 1962 and 1963 that strongly indicated that spiritual conspiracies were involved in the assassination.

Spot on, I would surmise

yes, that much seem very plausible, but that's one of the places where I question the narrative, 'cause look where they go with it. to paraphrase: "he had to die because he was a too dangerous loose cannon, would have gotten us all nuked."

Oh for me, JFK as much as he was an Obama like go along with the agenda type...I think he did come into his own. He "had to die" because he was a threat to the right wing Democrat/Republican power brokers. But on an esoteric level, theres part of me that agrees with the infamous "King Kill 33" rambling article.

But when he says he believes dark forces were manipulating all sides of world war 2, and were puppeteering the Nazis...I couldnt agree more. The Nazis were made to create a wide swath of unspeakable evil and then to self destruct. And then the atom bomb project, which is steeped in the occult(Bohemian Grove origins, the 33 parallel ritual Trinity Test, etc), the Jack Parsons era, so much stuff going on at the time.

The Rape of Nanking, The Holocaust, the Tokyo Firebombing/Hiroshima/Nagasaki, Dresden, and just WW2 as a whole seemed like one giant occult working to shock the world and reverberate into the spiritual realm.

[Nordic]

Long before Avatar was even being written, I wondered very seriously if some forms of consciousness might be capable of placing themselves within the "avatar bodies" of certain chosen humans.

And, on the outside chance this might be possible, how widespread might this be?

You don't think that most humans are this? I sorta do.

And some are good and some aren't. I've had some of the evil ones pick up on me. I know it sounds a bit delusional and paranoid, but I've definitely experienced that.

Maybe the good ones are "pure human" and the evil ones aren't. I don't know.

But you can usually tell just by looking at them. You can usually see it in their eyes. And often, you can tell that they know that YOU know. Which is, honestly, creepy.

[82_28]

and

However, I had some psychic experiences in 1962 and 1963 that strongly indicated that spiritual conspiracies were involved in the assassination.

Spot on, I would surmise

yes, that much seem very plausible, but that's one of the places where I question the narrative, 'cause look where they go with it. to paraphrase: "he had to die because he was a too dangerous loose cannon, would have gotten us all nuked."

Oh for me, JFK as much as he was an Obama like go along with the agenda type...I think he did come into his own. He "had to die" because he was a threat to the right wing Democrat/Republican power brokers. But on an esoteric level, theres part of me that agrees with the infamous "King Kill 33" rambling article.

But when he says he believes dark forces were manipulating all sides of world war 2, and were puppeteering the Nazis...I couldnt agree more. The Nazis were made to create a wide swath of unspeakable evil and then to self destruct. And then the atom bomb project, which is steeped in the occult(Bohemian Grove origins, the 33 parallel ritual Trinity Test, etc), the Jack Parsons era, so much stuff going on at the time.

The Rape of Nanking, The Holocaust, the Tokyo Firebombing/Hiroshima/Nagasaki, Dresden, and just WW2 as a whole seemed like one giant occult working to shock the world and reverberate into the spiritual realm.

Couldn't have been said better 8bit. They were made to self destruct. We only give a shit about America these days because our parents and grandparents did. All meant, all of it meant, to separate us from our roots. Because one way or the other that is exactly what all these escapades of mass murder have proven to have done. I'm going to go out here on a limb and say that the Nazi regime was an occultic joke. I believe the holocaust happened! Don't get me wrong there. The Holocaust likewise, happened to sever Jewish people from their roots, just by a different mechanism. And when you have a mechanism you have a profitable machine that all want in on eventually -- until they snatch it away and turn it against you. It will always be turned against you at some point. This is the lesson of the holocaust. Pure empire. Pure corporatism and pure totalitarianism.

I remember way back when, say 1999 or so where it was CRAZY to suggest that the Bush fuckers were and always will be profiteers off of "both sides" of just even WWII. Now it is common knowledge. But it was crazy talk back then. Is this disclosure and acceptance of nowadays helpful? I think not.

The Internet makes everything deniable. This is where rigor and intuition have a place.

[8bitagent]

and

However, I had some psychic experiences in 1962 and 1963 that strongly indicated that spiritual conspiracies were involved in the assassination.

Spot on, I would surmise

yes, that much seem very plausible, but that's one of the places where I question the narrative, 'cause look where they go with it. to paraphrase: "he had to die because he was a too dangerous loose cannon, would have gotten us all nuked."

Oh for me, JFK as much as he was an Obama like go along with the agenda type...I think he did come into his own. He "had to die" because he was a threat to the right wing Democrat/Republican power brokers. But on an esoteric level, theres part of me that agrees with the infamous "King Kill 33" rambling article.

But when he says he believes dark forces were manipulating all sides of world war 2, and were puppeteering the Nazis...I couldnt agree more. The Nazis were made to create a wide swath of unspeakable evil and then to self destruct. And then the atom bomb project, which is steeped in the occult(Bohemian Grove origins, the 33 parallel ritual Trinity Test, etc), the Jack Parsons era, so much stuff going on at the time.

The Rape of Nanking, The Holocaust, the Tokyo Firebombing/Hiroshima/Nagasaki, Dresden, and just WW2 as a whole seemed like one giant occult working to shock the world and reverberate into the spiritual realm.

Couldn't have been said better 8bit. They were made to self destruct. We only give a shit about America these days because our parents and grandparents did. All meant, all of it meant, to separate us from our roots. Because one way or the other that is exactly what all these escapades of mass murder have proven to have done. I'm going to go out here on a limb and say that the Nazi regime was an occultic joke. I believe the holocaust happened! Don't get me wrong there. The Holocaust likewise, happened to sever Jewish people from their roots, just by a different mechanism. And when you have a mechanism you have a profitable machine that all want in on eventually -- until they snatch it away and turn it against you. It will always be turned against you at some point. This is the lesson of the holocaust. Pure empire. Pure corporatism and pure totalitarianism.

I remember way back when, say 1999 or so where it was CRAZY to suggest that the Bush fuckers were and always will be profiteers off of "both sides" of just even WWII. Now it is common knowledge. But it was crazy talk back then. Is this disclosure and acceptance of nowadays helpful? I think not.

The Internet makes everything deniable. This is where rigor and intuition have a place.

I remember getting so much shit from people within para-political/conspiracy circles online when I suggested the Nazis and Hitler themselves were merely puppets. As if, somehow I was lifting responsibility for their unimaginable evil. But the US was also manipulated into committing evil, as were the Japanese(Unit 731, March of Baton, Nanking, etc) And the Russians.
The Nazis were tried to wipe out Freemasonry, tried to shut down psychic shops, and went on an "occult house cleaning"...people cite this as "evidence" that "the Nazis were Christian". In reality this was more like Walmart eliminating mom and pop competition. People also seem shocked when its said the Nazis were obsessed with Tibet and Tibetan Buddhism, making numerous pilgrimedges to Tibet. Or that the Nazis worked hand and glove at times with non white Muslim militants.

Now on a more exoteric level, we have the great "IBM and the Holocaust" book, and numerous books on Siemens, Bayer, IBM, Ford, hell even Coca Cola working hand and glove with the Nazis. The tattoos being IBM Holerith numbers. And Wallstreet and European "old money" going right into the Nazi coffers. Oddly enough, such is still not common knowledge...as say, Gulf of Tonkin, Tuskegee, or CIA-crack cocaine may be.

We must be very careful as para political researchers or outside thinkers to never intentionally stretch truths, or try and fit puzzle pieces into a confirmation bias. This is the main reason I do not like a lot of conspiracy writings from the left nor the right. It just smacks of lazy, truth stretching(especially in 9/11 "truth" circles, and the right wing "anti Illuminati/NWO" writings)

However, you're right...more people are a bit more open to this stuff. Though it seems like even my leftist friends don't want to hear about war crimes going on under Obama, or any of this stuff anymore. Call it fatigue, or cognitive dissonance.

The Nazis were a joke in one sense, much like 9/11 could be seen as abstract art. Because in the black brotherhood, comedy seems to be a reoccuring theme. Oh, some real kneeslappers have been made. 9/11, 11 years after Bush Sr's "NWO" speech...haha, good one guys! Yankees Star pitcher Cory Lidle plowing into a high rise apartment on 9/11/01 flipped upside down.
Clinton's "IsIs", Osama/Obama, Flight 77 into the 77 foot Pentagon. Ba Dum Tish! Revelation of the method.

Doesnt it seem, that like the neocons, the Nazis were intentionally designed to fail? Like they were meant to create endless fear, death and change the course of history forever...but then pave way for the "good guys"? I almost wonder if one reason for WW2 was for the creation of Israel, to fit into some end time scenario.

[82_28]

Well it is 2010. Most probably know this already but take your HAL and turn that into an IBM.

ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ

HAL/IBM

I=H
B=A
M=L

[KeenInsight]

and

However, I had some psychic experiences in 1962 and 1963 that strongly indicated that spiritual conspiracies were involved in the assassination.

Spot on, I would surmise

yes, that much seem very plausible, but that's one of the places where I question the narrative, 'cause look where they go with it. to paraphrase: "he had to die because he was a too dangerous loose cannon, would have gotten us all nuked."

Oh for me, JFK as much as he was an Obama like go along with the agenda type...I think he did come into his own. He "had to die" because he was a threat to the right wing Democrat/Republican power brokers. But on an esoteric level, theres part of me that agrees with the infamous "King Kill 33" rambling article.

But when he says he believes dark forces were manipulating all sides of world war 2, and were puppeteering the Nazis...I couldnt agree more. The Nazis were made to create a wide swath of unspeakable evil and then to self destruct. And then the atom bomb project, which is steeped in the occult(Bohemian Grove origins, the 33 parallel ritual Trinity Test, etc), the Jack Parsons era, so much stuff going on at the time.

The Rape of Nanking, The Holocaust, the Tokyo Firebombing/Hiroshima/Nagasaki, Dresden, and just WW2 as a whole seemed like one giant occult working to shock the world and reverberate into the spiritual realm.

I'm thinking the crime committed against the Japanese people at Hiroshima and Nagasaki never would have happened if someone else replaced Truman.

"I think one man is just as good as another so long as he's not a n*gger or a Chinaman. Uncle Will says that the Lord made a White man from dust, a nigger from mud, then He threw up what was left and it came down a Chinaman. He does hate Chinese and Japs. So do I. It is race prejudice, I guess. But I am strongly of the opinion Negroes ought to be in Africa, Yellow men in Asia and White men in Europe and America." -Harry Truman (1911)

The decision for him was very easy. Plus, he had his hands dipped deep in the C.I.A. beginnings and Roswell.

"The only thing new in the world is the history you don't know."

"You have got to understand that [the atomic bomb] isn't a military weapon. It is used to wipe out women and children and unarmed people, and not for military uses." - Harry S Truman, discussing atomic bomb on during July 21, 1948

Straight from the horses mouth. And people still argue that there is a "controversy" of right and wrong with the use of the atomic bombs.

[vanlose kid]

Thanks for those blimp/missile/manta vids VK. Gotta add them to the Utah Mystery Missile thread:

Crop Circles Caused by Microwave Weapons?
viewtopic.php?p=326772#p326772

And the "hyperblimp" search term yields the Utah Mystery Missile:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QW5RKLucG1Q

elfis: no sweat.

just my attempt at answering a poll that didn't feature the one option i would have chosen, which is mil-made, lo-tek/high efficiency of design crafts.

every craft in the vids i posted display, to my eyes at least, the flight characteristics of reported craft in "ufology" (if that's a word).

also, the common dismissal: "they're only weather balloons" is as close to the truth as an efficient lie can be. which adds plausibility.

and the profile of that hyperblimp in your vid above reminds me of any number of still images of classic ufo's seen over the years.

moving air through air is a lot easier than moving mass. -- a light weight frame and well designed propulsion plus the lack of or very little gravitational on the objects explain the "odd" patterns of movement observed.

my 2sense.

*

on edit: i seem to recall having read about mil-designed black delta wing blimps somewhere but haven't been able to dig anything up.

*

[Stephen Morgan]

Life out there started here. That's my view.

How so? Curious, please do explain. Unless I've missed something in the thread, apologies if I have, I tend to do that sometimes.

Read again what Shaver said about our being denied out ancient science. But if you're expecting a cogent and rational theory I'll disappoint you. Just a general philosophical position. I don't buy all this stuff about life being common in the Universe, I think the Earth is it. I'm convinced, however, of the ancientness of human life. The evidence, the forbidden archaeology and so on, shows one of two things is true: humanity is old or the earth is young. I'll go with the first. I believe humanity may have been the first living thing in the universe. Almost certainly, between ancient cataclysms, mankind travelled between the stars. I believe in the power of mankind, collectively. I believe evil is anthropogenic. Keel, in Our Haunted Planet, puts forward the idea that the ghosts of ancient civilisations still roam the earth. Could be. Perhaps the you-foes are tulpoid entities. Knowledge lost by mankind after some catastrophe, cut loose from human consciousness, may now float loose in the ether, occasionally appearing in our realm to put ideas into peoples heads. Perhaps humanity is psychic, ebbs and flows. Perhaps if we were to find our way to the stars we would find people on other worlds, trapped by the ebb tide of mankind. Perhaps they would be funny colours, adapted to their environmental conditions. Like a Viking longship sailing to the south and meeting a black chap. Perhaps if we met them they'd ask us about the lights in their skies. Perhaps they have tentacles, after men of a previous aeon tried to genetically modify themselves. Like Elvis says, balls of light as vehicles of disembodied consciosness, but human.

Perhaps not.

[Nordic]

Hey, I'm cross posting this from the Philip K. Dick thread. This seems to belong over here instead of there:

Here's the video that really made me go



NASA seems to be saying these are "space junk". And the first few do indeed look like blackened scrap metal floating around in space.

But the last two, and especially # 70, most definitely do not look like this. #70 really looks like some kind of a craft, with a propulsion rocket of some kind and little lights on it.

Granted, these could be reflections from the sun, seeing as how the angle of the light is in this particular shot, but the "propulsion engine" flare is difficult to see as a reflection. Although I suppose it could be.

Somehow they found higher-res images than I could find on the NASA site.

Crazy stuff. Probably deserves its own thread.