How Bad Is Global Warming?

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Re: How Bad Is Global Warming?

Postby Ben D » Sat May 17, 2014 11:56 pm

Iamwhomiam » Sun May 18, 2014 1:19 pm wrote:
Well the paper in question is saying that less than 1% endorsed the claim that most of the global warming since 1950 was anthropogenic caused.

Ben, that's not at all what was quoted and while being informative, your inaccurate summation as it is, is misleading, as is the article.
In fact it's untruthful.

Ok...I will quote from the 'Climate Consensus and ‘Misinformation’: A Rejoinder to Agnotology, Scientific Consensus, and the Teaching and Learning of Climate Change' abstract...."However, inspection of a claim by Cook et al. (Environ Res Lett 8:024024, 2013) of 97.1 % consensus, heavily relied upon by Bedford and Cook, shows just 0.3 % endorsement of the standard definition of consensus: that most warming since 1950 is anthropogenic."

I don't see why you think my statement is misleading wrt the abstract?

Read this and you will see why the conclusions of the Cook et al SkS team were biased...scientists whose papers fell in the 1,2, and 3 category because they agreed that CO2 contributed to global temperatures were automatically put in the AGW consensus without further ado....they were not required to have expressed an opinion that human derived CO2 was involved. This is why the Legate et al paper above was approved by peer review for publication, because the Cook et al SkS paper was skewed and obviously so when properly analysed, and needed to be exposed as such.
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Re: How Bad Is Global Warming?

Postby DrEvil » Sun May 18, 2014 6:32 am

Ben, you really know how to pick them. That opinion piece in the Financial Post was written by Roy Spencer. From the all-knowing wikipedia:

Spencer is a signatory to An Evangelical Declaration on Global Warming, which states that "Earth and its ecosystems – created by God's intelligent design and infinite power and sustained by His faithful providence – are robust, resilient, self-regulating, and self-correcting".

It's worth quoting the whole thing (from here: http://www.cornwallalliance.org/article ... l-warming/) :

An Evangelical Declaration on Global Warming

PREAMBLE

As governments consider policies to fight alleged man-made global warming, evangelical leaders have a responsibility to be well informed, and then to speak out. A Renewed Call to Truth, Prudence, and Protection of the Poor: An Evangelical Examination of the Theology, Science, and Economics of Global Warming demonstrates that many of these proposed policies would destroy jobs and impose trillions of dollars in costs to achieve no net benefits. They could be implemented only by enormous and dangerous expansion of government control over private life. Worst of all, by raising energy prices and hindering economic development, they would slow or stop the rise of the world’s poor out of poverty and so condemn millions to premature death.

WHAT WE BELIEVE

We believe Earth and its ecosystems—created by God’s intelligent design and infinite power and sustained by His faithful providence —are robust, resilient, self-regulating, and self-correcting, admirably suited for human flourishing, and displaying His glory. Earth’s climate system is no exception. Recent global warming is one of many natural cycles of warming and cooling in geologic history.
We believe abundant, affordable energy is indispensable to human flourishing, particularly to societies which are rising out of abject poverty and the high rates of disease and premature death that accompany it. With present technologies, fossil and nuclear fuels are indispensable if energy is to be abundant and affordable.
We believe mandatory reductions in carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gas emissions, achievable mainly by greatly reduced use of fossil fuels, will greatly increase the price of energy and harm economies.
We believe such policies will harm the poor more than others because the poor spend a higher percentage of their income on energy and desperately need economic growth to rise out of poverty and overcome its miseries.

WHAT WE DENY

We deny that Earth and its ecosystems are the fragile and unstable products of chance, and particularly that Earth’s climate system is vulnerable to dangerous alteration because of minuscule changes in atmospheric chemistry. Recent warming was neither abnormally large nor abnormally rapid. There is no convincing scientific evidence that human contribution to greenhouse gases is causing dangerous global warming.
We deny that alternative, renewable fuels can, with present or near-term technology, replace fossil and nuclear fuels, either wholly or in significant part, to provide the abundant, affordable energy necessary to sustain prosperous economies or overcome poverty.
We deny that carbon dioxide—essential to all plant growth—is a pollutant. Reducing greenhouse gases cannot achieve significant reductions in future global temperatures, and the costs of the policies would far exceed the benefits.
We deny that such policies, which amount to a regressive tax, comply with the Biblical requirement of protecting the poor from harm and oppression.

A CALL TO ACTION

In light of these facts,

We call on our fellow Christians to practice creation stewardship out of Biblical conviction, adoration for our Creator, and love for our fellow man—especially the poor.
We call on Christian leaders to understand the truth about climate change and embrace Biblical thinking, sound science, and careful economic analysis in creation stewardship.
We call on political leaders to adopt policies that protect human liberty, make energy more affordable, and free the poor to rise out of poverty, while abandoning fruitless, indeed harmful policies to control global temperature.
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Re: How Bad Is Global Warming?

Postby Iamwhomiam » Sun May 18, 2014 3:51 pm

Oy veh!
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Re: How Bad Is Global Warming?

Postby Ben D » Sun May 18, 2014 5:11 pm

DrEvil » Sun May 18, 2014 8:32 pm wrote:Ben, you really know how to pick them. That opinion piece in the Financial Post was written by Roy Spencer. From the all-knowing wikipedia:

Spencer is a signatory to An Evangelical Declaration on Global Warming, which states that "Earth and its ecosystems – created by God's intelligent design and infinite power and sustained by His faithful providence – are robust, resilient, self-regulating, and self-correcting".

Yes, I do....I am not small minded and discriminate against climate scientists because of their religion, race, gender, or colour, I assess their actual experience in the field of climate science....here is his Dr Roy Spencer's bio..http://www.drroyspencer.com/about/

Roy W. Spencer received his Ph.D. in meteorology at the University of Wisconsin-Madison in 1981.

Before becoming a Principal Research Scientist at the University of Alabama in Huntsville in 2001, he was a Senior Scientist for Climate Studies at NASA’s Marshall Space Flight Center, where he and Dr. John Christy received NASA’s Exceptional Scientific Achievement Medal for their global temperature monitoring work with satellites.

Dr. Spencer’s work with NASA continues as the U.S. Science Team leader for the Advanced Microwave Scanning Radiometer flying on NASA’s Aqua satellite.

He has provided congressional testimony several times on the subject of global warming.

Dr. Spencer’s research has been entirely supported by U.S. government agencies: NASA, NOAA, and DOE.

He has never been asked by any oil company to perform any kind of service.
.
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Re: How Bad Is Global Warming?

Postby Rory » Sun May 18, 2014 6:05 pm

Roy Spencer is a fucking spastic who thinks god (the Christian one) is responsible for everything scientific.

His views as a scientist are moot, because he is a fucking spastic.
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Re: How Bad Is Global Warming?

Postby DrEvil » Sun May 18, 2014 6:17 pm

Ben, he signed a statement that says the climate is stable because of god. You don't think that might constitute bias? Plenty of scientists believe in god, but they have the brains to check their personal beliefs at the door when they go to work. This guy clearly doesn't, or he wouldn't have signed the damn thing in the first place. Mixing invisible sky fairies and facts usually ends badly.
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Re: How Bad Is Global Warming?

Postby Ben D » Sun May 18, 2014 7:50 pm

DrEvil » Mon May 19, 2014 8:17 am wrote:Ben, he signed a statement that says the climate is stable because of god. You don't think that might constitute bias? Plenty of scientists believe in god, but they have the brains to check their personal beliefs at the door when they go to work. This guy clearly doesn't, or he wouldn't have signed the damn thing in the first place. Mixing invisible sky fairies and facts usually ends badly.

What a person believes wrt religion is a personal matter....you believe in atheism and don't know squat about global climate science, but that doesn't mean all atheists are ignorant of the science....Dr Roy Spencer apparently is a sincere fundamentalist Christian, but no one except an extremely prejudiced AGW wacko would try to use that to obscure the fact of his obvious world class expertise and understanding of the global climate field, particularly as it relates to the satellite UAH data set, of which he was a principal in its first publishing. His work with NASA makes him one of the world's foremost experts in this field, which is why your government invites him to give congressional testimony at hearings to do with climate, and he is respected by all professionals in the field of climate science.

As for Rory's besmirching of spastics....shame on you...
There is That which was not born, nor created, nor evolved. If it were not so, there would never be any refuge from being born, or created, or evolving. That is the end of suffering. That is God**.

** or Nirvana, Allah, Brahman, Tao, etc...
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Re: How Bad Is Global Warming?

Postby Rory » Sun May 18, 2014 8:01 pm

Ben, go fuck yourself, you spastic
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Re: How Bad Is Global Warming?

Postby Rory » Sun May 18, 2014 8:01 pm

Namaste
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Re: How Bad Is Global Warming?

Postby DrEvil » Sun May 18, 2014 8:59 pm

Here's a summary of just how competent Dr. Spencer is (hint: It's not pretty):

http://bbickmore.wordpress.com/roy-spencer/
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Re: How Bad Is Global Warming?

Postby Ben D » Sun May 18, 2014 9:56 pm

DrEvil » Mon May 19, 2014 10:59 am wrote:Here's a summary of just how competent Dr. Spencer is (hint: It's not pretty):

http://bbickmore.wordpress.com/roy-spencer/

Seriously....posting a 3 year old blog post from bbickmore (never heard of him), did you not read it first?

The blog post says....
The Great Global Warming Blunder

1. Roy Spencer’s Great Blunder, Part 1. In his latest book, The Great Global Warming Blunder, Roy Spencer lashes out at the rest of the climate science community for either ignoring or suppressing publication of his research. This research, he claims, virtually proves that the climate models used by the IPCC respond much too sensitively to external “forcing” due to changes in greenhouse gas concentrations, variations in solar radiation, and so on.


So the claim of a The Great Global Warming Blunder is busted by none other than the IPCC itself.....
Climate Models and the Hiatus in Global-Mean Surface Warming of the Past 15 Years, page 31, (bold emphasis added):

(c) Model Response Error

The discrepancy between simulated and observed GMST trends during 1998–2012 could be explained in part by a tendency for some CMIP5 models to simulate stronger warming in response to increases in greenhouse-gas concentration than is consistent with observations… This finding provides evidence that some CMIP5 models show a larger response to greenhouse gases and other anthropogenic factors (dominated by the effects of aerosols) than the real world (medium confidence).

Now this is what I've been saying all along...the 17 year old pause shows us that the models use too much forcing for the CO2/GHG and thus produce too high a temperature projection compared to actual temperature over time....so Dr Spenser isn't busted but bbickmore is....along with his climate change science ignorant patsy DrEvil....
There is That which was not born, nor created, nor evolved. If it were not so, there would never be any refuge from being born, or created, or evolving. That is the end of suffering. That is God**.

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Re: How Bad Is Global Warming?

Postby Rory » Sun May 18, 2014 10:12 pm

Ben, you really are a piece of shit. You're a bad faith actor and a malignant troll. And a liar.

Just like the good Reverend Roy Spencer, your climate science related postings are dishonest and completely untrustworthy.

But, you know, namaste.
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Re: How Bad Is Global Warming?

Postby Ben D » Sun May 18, 2014 10:44 pm

Rory » Mon May 19, 2014 12:12 pm wrote:Ben, you really are a piece of shit. You're a bad faith actor and a malignant troll. And a liar.

Just like the good Reverend Roy Spencer, your climate science related postings are dishonest and completely untrustworthy.

But, you know, namaste.

Show me the error and I will acknowledge it Rory...otherwise your words are just so much blather...
There is That which was not born, nor created, nor evolved. If it were not so, there would never be any refuge from being born, or created, or evolving. That is the end of suffering. That is God**.

** or Nirvana, Allah, Brahman, Tao, etc...
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Re: How Bad Is Global Warming?

Postby 82_28 » Sun May 18, 2014 10:52 pm

Chill, fellers. Honestly, I don't know what this is about other than the topic of the OP. But if you hate each other, I would suggest taking it to PM and not keeping this on the general board. A mod's gonna come in here soon. Shake virtual hands and be done with it and/or this thread should now be locked. Just get along. . .
There is no me. There is no you. There is all. There is no you. There is no me. And that is all. A profound acceptance of an enormous pageantry. A haunting certainty that the unifying principle of this universe is love. -- Propagandhi
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Re: How Bad Is Global Warming?

Postby smiths » Sun May 18, 2014 11:00 pm

but Rory is right, BenD posts endless shit with the same aim, disruption and time-wasting

to post a link to a dude who thinks God is regulating the biosphere is either moronic or manipulative

i'd go with manipulative
the question is why, who, why, what, why, when, why and why again?
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