mentalgongfu2 wrote:American Dream, do you have something against the Constitution and the upholding of oaths?
Which ones do you object to?
1. We will NOT obey any order to disarm the American people.
2. We will NOT obey any order to conduct warrantless searches of the American people, their homes, vehicles, papers, or effects -- such as warrantless house-to house searches for weapons or persons.
3. We will NOT obey any order to detain American citizens as “unlawful enemy combatants” or to subject them to trial by military tribunal.
4. We will NOT obey orders to impose martial law or a “state of emergency” on a state, or to enter with force into a state, without the express consent and invitation of that state’s legislature and governor.
5. We will NOT obey orders to invade and subjugate any state that asserts its sovereignty and declares the national government to be in violation of the compact by which that state entered the Union.
6. We will NOT obey any order to blockade American cities, thus turning them into giant concentration camps.
7. We will NOT obey any order to force American citizens into any form of detention camps under any pretext.
8. We will NOT obey orders to assist or support the use of any foreign troops on U.S. soil against the American people to “keep the peace” or to “maintain control” during any emergency, or under any other pretext. We will consider such use of foreign troops against our people to be an invasion and an act of war.
9. We will NOT obey any orders to confiscate the property of the American people, including food and other essential supplies, under any emergency pretext whatsoever.
10. We will NOT obey any orders which infringe on the right of the people to free speech, to peaceably assemble, and to petition their government for a redress of grievances.
How do they look through your personal lens?
Well, all right. I'm going to do this in several posts, starting with the two questions posed by mentalgongfu about the Ten Oaths: "Which ones do you object to?"; And "How do they look through your personal lens?"
Starting from the top:
1. We will NOT obey any order to disarm the American people.
I have no objections to that, per se.
However, it looks like an unnecessarily emphatic statement to me, if not a wholly unnecessary one. Because no such orders have been expressed and no such orders have been implied. Furthermore, the rights of Americans to bear arms under the second amendment aren't in any general peril from any quarter at the moment. On the contrary, they've recently been substantially strengthened by the federal judiciary in a way that makes it impossible for the federal legistlature to override pretty much any and all statutory expansions of that right at the state legislative level. And such statutory expansions are in fact currently under way at the state level in a number of places. Notably Michigan.
The Oath Keepers are comprised primarily of current and former members of the military and law enforcement. And I'm going to elaborate on that briefly in a separate post. But for the moment, I'll just confine myself to saying that I don't see anything suggestive of a very real interest in the rights and liberty of the people in the military and police getting all aggro about their passionate commitment to resisting a threat that doesn't exist to a right that they've already sworn to protect. It looks to me more like a statement that's designed to make the prospect of the military and police acting independently of the systems through which the people derive those rights and that liberty appear unobjectionable. As opposed to "like a military coup d'etat." Because that's how it would look otherwise.
2. We will NOT obey any order to conduct warrantless searches of the American people, their homes, vehicles, papers, or effects -- such as warrantless house-to house searches for weapons or persons.
Again, no objections, per se. And again, they're not being ordered to do this. And by the way, that would even apply to whatever ex- and current members of the FBI might be taking that oath. In fact, the phrasing strongly suggests that there are some ex- and current feds, members of military intelligence and so forth taking these oaths. Because it seems to me like it can't be accidental that none of the massive, widely publicized and presently ongoing fourth amendment violations presently being commited by various precincts of the state, military and law enforcement in the form of electronic surveillance of various kinds even rate so much as a passing mention by the OK. From which I infer that they evidently don't have any problems continuing to comply with orders to commit it.
3. We will NOT obey any order to detain American citizens as “unlawful enemy combatants” or to subject them to trial by military tribunal.
No objections. But once again, no threat. Plus I'd really like them to start NOT obeying any order to detain Islamic citizens of all countries as "unlawful enemy combatants" or to subject them to trial by military tribunal. Because that's what they're actually doing, and it's not only illegal but part of a much larger and more grotesque systematic abuse of human rights by the U.S. military. So, you know. When they come out against torturing and killing people and then
claiming the people they murdered were committing a unilateral act of terrorism by committing suicide, I might start feeling a little more confidence in their bona fides.
4. We will NOT obey orders to impose martial law or a “state of emergency” on a state, or to enter with force into a state, without the express consent and invitation of that state’s legislature and governor.
No objections, per se. Not presently an immanent threat. Please see earlier remarks about making an armed coup d'etat look less objectionable.
5. We will NOT obey orders to invade and subjugate any state that asserts its sovereignty and declares the national government to be in violation of the compact by which that state entered the Union.
Ibid.
6. We will NOT obey any order to blockade American cities, thus turning them into giant concentration camps.
Ibid.
7. We will NOT obey any order to force American citizens into any form of detention camps under any pretext.
Ibid.
8. We will NOT obey orders to assist or support the use of any foreign troops on U.S. soil against the American people to “keep the peace” or to “maintain control” during any emergency, or under any other pretext. We will consider such use of foreign troops against our people to be an invasion and an act of war.
Ibid. In addition to which the absence of their refusal to obey orders to assist or support the use of private contractors who employ ex-foreign troops on U.S. soil and on foreign soil to "keep the peace" or to "maintain control" during an emergency, or under any other pretext is kind of conspicuous. Since the military's actually doing that.
9. We will NOT obey any orders to confiscate the property of the American people, including food and other essential supplies, under any emergency pretext whatsoever.
I have no objections to this, per se. There are no such orders. There haven't been any such orders. And I don't see any signs that there are going to be any such orders. I sometimes did under the previous administration. But so far, not under this one. To damn it with faint damns.
10. We will NOT obey any orders which infringe on the right of the people to free speech, to peaceably assemble, and to petition their government for a redress of grievances.
I have no objections to this, per se. However, I very much question its sincerity, given how much solidarity with the Gathering of Eagles and also with the Tea Party groups on their website. Because they've done practically nothing but infringe on the right of the people to free speech and peacable assembly. As, for example, at all those health care town hall meetings in August at which they made speech and sometimes also assembly impossible or, in a few instances, dangerous.
________________________
In summary, I don't object to the letter of any of it.
But its spirit looks flagrantly propagandistic to me. More specifically, it looks like a flag-waving, disingenuous piece of propaganda that's almost exclusively oriented around appeals to fear and unstated assumptions. All of which I strongly object to. Very strongly.
