Two explosions at Boston marathon finish line

[ShinShinKid]

Let me preface by offering condolences and warmth to all those affected by the tragedy of yesterday.
As far as Boston being a target, it has a larger population density to land area ratio than NYC. In the US, it is only second to San Fran in that regard (major cities). You get a higher casualty yield with a higher ratio. Couple that with the fact that all those extra people were in the city for all sorts of reasons; I imagine that only increased the numbers. I heard more than one newscaster say just how small Boston is.
I also thought that the white powdery stuff was explosive material floating in the air. It could have been glass, but the authorities seemed to have a concern for chemical hazards right after the explosions. That led me to believe they didn't think the white stuff was glass(they weren't sure what it was). Of course, I've never been to Boston, I have no idea what kind of construction was around the blast sites. It could have been drywall material, or something entirely different.
Who dunnit? I'm in the let's wait a bit for some more information.

Edited for update on high-explosive detonation...vs. low explosive burning. I am starting to think that the white stuff was unexploded...more research on TATB explosives is needed...

[FourthBase]

Let me preface by offering condolences and warmth to all those affected by the tragedy of yesterday.
As far as Boston being a target, it has a larger population density to land area ratio than NYC. In the US, it is only second to San Fran in that regard (major cities). You get a higher casualty yield with a higher ratio. Couple that with the fact that all those extra people were in the city for all sorts of reasons; I imagine that only increased the numbers. I heard more than one newscaster say just how small Boston is.
I also thought that the white powdery stuff was explosive material floating in the air. It could have been glass, but the authorities seemed to have a concern for chemical hazards right after the explosions. That led me to believe they didn't think the white stuff was glass(they weren't sure what it was). Of course, I've never been to Boston, I have no idea what kind of construction was around the blast sites. It could have been drywall material, or something entirely different.
Who dunnit? I'm in the let's wait a bit for some more information.

Edited for update on high-explosive detonation...vs. low explosive burning. I am starting to think that the white stuff was unexploded...more research on TATB explosives is needed...

I don't know about the stuff floating in the air. All I'm saying is that there was an explosives expert interviewed by World News Now on ABC, some old guy, and he was pointing to stuff at the base of an exploded window, calling it unexploded fertilizer, and even on my old non-HD television I could see that it was clearly a piled row of shattered windowpane. Shit, I could almost make out the individual bits. He was either legally-blind or totally-lying.

[Julian the Apostate]

Unfortunately, I'm pretty doubtful that any evidence will surface that even adds to a strong circumstantial case that any authorities were in on this, though it seems very likely to my intuition, and Reddit will continue to downvote into oblivion anyone who suggests it might have been a false flag.

See, the difference here might be us Bostonians. Not to say that New Yorkers and Londoners aren't feisty or distrustful as a whole. Hell, half or more of New Yorkers don't buy the official 9/11 narrative in one way or another, right? But we are a whole 'nutha breed. "Oh, it was just a lone wolf? Nothing to see here, move along? Nah, chief, I think I'll stay right the fuck where I am, fuck you very much. Now. Tell us more, your majesty. For example, where were you on April 15th at 2:50pm? Hmmm? Oh yeah? Not buyin' it, asshole. Prove it. I don't give a fuck what your job or security clearance is, buddy. Prove it." Etc. Multiplied by about 700,000.

It's already a meme. "You fucked with the wrong city." Stay tuned.

Indeed it is a meme and it is dangerous on a number of levels. One is that it catalyses deeply engrained sentiments, which have really only surfaced in the "coolness factor" in the last two or three decades given the likes of Ben Affleck and Matt Damon. I've known some Boston motherfuckers and all I can say is you are a "breed" that makes others "lash out" -- esp about sports and shit. Remember the story about the Boston dude who was on the construction crew who buried some jersey in the concrete of Yankees' Stadium in order to curse the stadium itself? I do dig that kind of superstition and am down, But it is very exclusive and off putting and that this meme is growing seems to be *part of it* because it will in fact grow from here and there will be no level heads. It's techno-tribalism and it is growing. The truth will be lost in the growing meme. Keep us posted about what you see and hear 4th.

It could be dangerous, maybe. Again, let's wait a little while before reaching a verdict.

Dude, the opinions I had on "you people" existed for a long time before today (all because of sports teams). I just find it funny/telling that it's all "you fucked with the wrong city". No, nobody did. They fucked with human lives and destroyed perhaps (at least hundreds) -- you live in a qualified educated yet insane city that is now dealing with the past it seems to think still exists and is now scaling to the meta by probably false flag events. I'm not gonna make this AT ALL a Boston argument, because that is not my point. Say something like this happened in fucking Denver or Seattle or Vancouver or where the fuck ever. There wouldn't be no tweeting about "you fucked with the wrong city". It's the beginning of 2001 "writ small". I would put my money is that you are being preyed upon, because of such attitudes known to exist. In Seattle there would just be a bunch of people running around, but no, "you fucked with the wrong cities" as some meme. They could be preying on "massholes" as a conduit to something else nation/continent/world wide.

I think part of it comes from a sense that this was a very personal attack on everything good that Boston stands for, particularly as it was a strike on the marathon and on patriots day (a distinctly Massachusetts holiday). This was like bombing an athletic event, a school, an old age home, and a hospital all at once. And this particular marathon, also a memorial to the Newtown victims. Quite a cowardly slap in the face to Boston. Hence the meme, which I like.

[Julian the Apostate]

Would a roll call of Boston-based RigInt-ers be appropriate?

I'm here, and unharmed. Obviously.
Looks like wordspeak2, too.
IanEye, you alright?

(Not even sure if either is still living in the Boston area. Anyone else?)

redsock?

There's an RI crew for NY and Philly. Who comprises the Boston crew?

I was in the lobby of the Hancock building when the bombs went off. I don't work there regularly, just happened to be there for a meeting. My first reaction was wow, that definitely felt like bombs, but no way, not here, not today... Seems very naive in retrospect.

Took a photo from the 16th floor about ten minutes later of the space on Boylston street just past the finish line where thousands of water bottles are set up on tables, with nobody there...

[FourthBase]

Would a roll call of Boston-based RigInt-ers be appropriate?

I'm here, and unharmed. Obviously.
Looks like wordspeak2, too.
IanEye, you alright?

(Not even sure if either is still living in the Boston area. Anyone else?)

redsock?

There's an RI crew for NY and Philly. Who comprises the Boston crew?

I was in the lobby of the Hancock building when the bombs went off. I don't work there regularly, just happened to be there for a meeting. My first reaction was wow, that definitely felt like bombs, but no way, not here, not today... Seems very naive in retrospect.

Took a photo from the 16th floor about ten minutes later of the space on Boylston street just past the finish line where thousands of water bottles are set up on tables, with nobody there...

Glad you're okay. Must have been kind of terrifying, jesus!

(The Massachusetts Lodge's Grandmaster must have had quite a view, from the top floor of the Pru, if he was working there yesterday, at Ropes & Gray. I cannot express enough relief that I spared myself from that same view.)

[barracuda]

The explosive devices that killed three people and injured scores at the Boston Marathon finish line were pressure cookers filled with metal and ball bearings, the Associated Press reported Tuesday, quoting an unidentified person briefed on the investigation into the attack.

A person who spoke on the condition of anonymity because the investigation was still going on, tells the AP that the explosives were put in 6-liter pressure cookers, placed in black duffel bags and left on the ground. They were packed with shrapnel, the person said.

The person said law enforcement officials have some of the bomb components but do not yet know what was used to set off the explosives.

The description of the devices coincides with observations earlier by Dr. George Velmahos, chief of trauma surgery at Massachusetts General Hospital, who said most of the injuries were "traumatic amputations," in which the blasts nearly blew off one victims' legs.

The explosions 12 seconds and 100 yards apart ripped into the crowds gathered Monday afternoon for the finale of the traditional marathon that wound through the streets of Boston.

Velmahos had said that all of the victims had "10, 20, 30, 40 pieces of shrapnel embedded in their bodies, mostly in their legs, but as high up as their necks." He had described the shrapnel as pea-sized pellets and nails stripped of their heads.

A law enforcement official said earlier that the devices were believed to be assembled with gunpowder and ball-bearing-type material to serve as shrapnel. The official, who has been briefed on the matter but is not authorized to comment publicly, described the devices as "rudimentary'' but powerful.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nati ... s/2086853/

[Julian the Apostate]

they were either very small bombs made by someone genuinely amateur,

or they were designed for minimal casualties

an Iraq style explosive in a similar setting would have killed 40-100 people and ripped the front off the building standing over the detonation site

i think it looks like maximum publicity for minimum casualty

(pure speculation, dismiss as you feel free)

More likely scenario: it was the Boston marathon and not someplace in Iraq. How big are those bombs that "have killed 40-100 people and ripped the front off the building standing over the detonation site". Could they fit in a backpack, without arousing suspicion? Doubt it. The bomber would have had to make a tradeoff between mass casualties, and not getting caught before carrying out the attack. Plus maybe the perp wasn't an expert bombmaker. Lots of things could go wrong with the actual explosion itself. And wehat about all the other devices they found? Why didn't they blow up too? Seems to me it was an amateur bombmaker who built a bunch of shoddy bombs and got lucky with two of them.

[FourthBase]

It occurs to me...How could whoever is responsible possibly think they could get away with it? Here? This city? These people? At the fucking finish line? All those cameras? Perhaps something in whoever is responsible for it, wants to be caught, wants whatever agenda is underlying the attack to end, wants to be removed from society and placed forever in prisons. And if so, may I say: Happy to oblige.

[elfismiles]

FAA: Security incident on board US Airways flight 1716. The plane is on the ground in Boston - @cbsboston
Story metadata:
Submitted 2 hours ago by editor
http://www.breakingnews.com/item/ahZzfm ... plane-is-o

[Canadian_watcher]

as to the gold thing... "prices are down" tells us little. I'd guess there are more sellers than buyers atm. Possibly some big gold owner is getting some cash together to make margin calls? but couldn't they just make the call by transferring the certificates of ownership directly? No idea why gold is doing what it's doing, I guess someone needs muny.

It's been dropping for months now. Cyprus was forced to hand off their reserves as part of the EU bailout deal, and then leveraged bets were unloaded to deal with margins. I think. It seemed extremely odd yesterday afternoon when news accounts were attempting to tie the bombings and the gold price fall in some correlation, but if you'd been watching the price daily, it was (retrospectively) a drop bound to happen. The tie-in was a convenient excuse, or at least felt like one.

A. yes, it's been dropping for months but this was a cliff - and not after the bombings, either.
B. do you have links to those news accounts? I didn't see anyone making the connection.
c. Those drops are never 'bound to happen' just because there's been a steady decline.
D. Excuse? for what - ??

[Project Willow]

I heard the sound of a hovering helicopter and sure enough, right at the corner of my building:

http://blogs.seattletimes.com/today/2013/04/police-investigate-suspicious-package-in-downtown-seattle/

Police investigate suspicious package in downtown Seattle

Posted by Christine Clarridge
Report a map error

Seattle police are investigating an unattended backpack that was found at Third Avenue and Yesler Way. The area has been closed to vehicular traffic and pedestrians during the investigation, police say.

A police officer and his K-9 were on patrol this morning when they spotted the backpack, which was determined to be suspicious. Police spokeswoman Renee Witt said the officer and the bomb-sniffing dog were on a patrol that was ordered in the wake of Monday’s explosions at the end of the Boston Marathon.

The Police Department’s arson/bomb squad as well as additional police units are assessing the backpack, police said.

“After yesterday, we have to act with an abundance of caution,” said Witt.

We’ll update this post as soon as we have additional information.

[Simulist]

That would fucking freak me out, PW. I sincerely hope it turns out to be just a backpack.

[compared2what?]

they were either very small bombs made by someone genuinely amateur,

or they were designed for minimal casualties

an Iraq style explosive in a similar setting would have killed 40-100 people and ripped the front off the building standing over the detonation site

Over the last decade or so, there have been numerous Iraq-style explosions in Iraq that killed five or fewer people. Sometimes none, besides the bomber. And sometimes none at all. Same in Afghanistan..

i think it looks like maximum publicity for minimum casualty

Maximum publicity is almost always a higher priority aim for terrorist acts than maximum carnage, pretty much by definition. Per the UN:

Criminal acts intended or calculated to provoke a state of terror in the general public, a group of persons or particular persons for political purposes

You don't really have to kill a lot of people to do that here. Or probably anywhere. I mean, most of the Palestinian civilian casualties in the Second Intifada were single-death incidents. And some of them were the work of amateurs (ie -- settlers, not the IDF). Were any of those no big deal?

.

[barracuda]

A. yes, it's been dropping for months but this was a cliff - and not after the bombings, either.

I'd say Friday was a pretty good "sell" signal, as gold dropped to 20% off the high, bear marker for sure.

B. do you have links to those news accounts? I didn't see anyone making the connection.

Not the exact headlines I was seeing yesterday, but I was sitting in front of Yahoo Finance with some other folks discussing the weirdness of the connections made by headlines like this one:.

World markets slump after terror attack

...when the the shit had hit the fan before the bombs even exploded at 3:00.

c. Those drops are never 'bound to happen' just because there's been a steady decline.

Last week was pretty bad for Au. Bubbles are gonna burst.

D. Excuse? for what - ??

The bombings as an excuse for the markets. Any one will do in a pinch, I guess.

[divideandconquer]

As a couple of you have said ... doesn't matter who "did it" ... the DHS / TSA / MIC all win.

So true. And let's face it, if they were involved, we'll never know the who, what, why...only that they were ultimately responsible. We know that "they" will go to any extreme necessary to "protect" the interests of the "state"; however, as efficient at they normally are, they kill a few birds with one stone. In this case, destroying the archives, creating fear, and drumming up support for the continuing build up of Homeland Security might be the likely agenda.

Boston runners were warned on Saturday. http://www.squamishchief.com/article/20 ... uamish-man

Mike Heiliger, 59, said a woman holding several bags was telling runners who were picking up their pre-race packages in downtown Boston on Saturday (April 13) that they were going to die if they participated in the event.

“I was downtown on Saturday and you know, you see these people on the street and think it's just some nutbar,” he told The Chief from his Boston hotel on Monday. “It was a little creepy because you can identify who the runners are and I heard her say to this runner two feet away from me that, 'If you run tomorrow you're going to die.'”

JFK Library opens exhibit on Cuban Missle Crisis http://www1.whdh.com/news/articles/loca ... z2QZYC5ZNw

The JFK Library and Museum in Boston has a new exhibit that tells the story of the Cuban missile crisis through once-secret White House recordings and documents.

It opened Friday after an earlier debut at the National Archives in Washington.

It depicts President John F. Kennedy and his advisers in deliberations as the United States and Soviet Union were in a nuclear standoff during 13 days in October 1962.

Listening stations with tapes of Kennedy's National Security Council meetings are the centerpiece.

A recreated fallout shelter and one of the first aerial reconnaissance photos of Soviet missile sites under construction in Cuba are also part of the presentation.

There are also personality studies that the Central Intelligence Agency did on Soviet Premier Nikita Khrushchev and Cuban leader Fidel Castro.

One of the firms in the target zone was a Boston Legal Service Brody, Hardoon, Perkins & Kesten, LLP. They are located at 669 Boylston. A caller to a radio show I listened to said they were involved in the Libor scandal.

Who knows? But, even if one of these is true, it provides enough reason in addition to the reason behind all of these "false flag" events: the creation of fear.

Oh, and author Dennis LeHayne said that the meme, "They fucked with the wrong city" is not so much macho posturing as it is, "we're not going to change our ways."