Alien Abductions and the Monarch Project

[soulsurvivor]

oh gosh, I'm almost peeing my pants I'm laughing so hard - I'm thinking to my last hospital experience when my inner self raised up out of me and scared all the medical staff - reckon I had the face of a praying mantis? I could only see "me" from the back, and I was a dark shadow at that, but it was me pointing and cussing em for sure. No wonder some of them were making the sign of the cross.

I know I'm more than me, yet it is me. Lots of facets, but I have and am built upon goodness, kindness, and love with a big dash of sarcastic humor. Every human has an inner eternal self. It's really going to be a picnic when we work out all the details.

And there is a war going on and we are the prize.

Donovan, thank you for posting this message. I get so hung up in what I know is coming up that I sometimes lose sight of the big picture.

[Joe Hillshoist]

There also now seems to be a difference, a difference that is becoming more distinct as time goes on. The ‘aliens’ seem to be in complete control of what they are doing. The human abductors and mind controllers seem to be more in the vein of ‘catching-up’ or trying to take back some sort of control they are loosing.

I am no researcher into alien abduction and have never been involved in any govt sponsored abduction to myknowledge, but my impression is the exact opposite. The one time I had an abduction experience that seems to fit the classic pattern and wasn't psliocibin inspired, I wrested control and ended the experience. And yes there was a mantid there, wherever there was.

I wouldn't mind a link to that Gallipoli abduction too. When I was young I was told a similar story, back in the 70s, but it was by a kid my age with a reputation for spinning yarns that were crap. I'd really like a good account of that story.

[LilyPatToo]

soulsurvivor--{{{{{{{{{HUG}}}}}}}}}--I am SO glad that you decided to share your story one more time--believe me, I know how much easier it would have been to just not put yourself out there, exposed, and wait for the horribly familiar tide of incomprehension to wash over you like a toxic tsunami Some people will always jeer and some will be reflexively defensive and some well-meaning ones will try to soothe you back into bliss. And after going through that a couple of times, you begin to wonder if anyone is actually *hearing* you at all, since you're talking about human beings exploiting you without your consent, which is still (barely, but *still* at this time) illegal.

Well, I hear you. And we both know that there were a lot of other people being used as test subjects in the places where we were taken, so there ARE others like us. The question is Where the hell are they? A few told their stories to abduction researchers and a very few self-published and most of the rest are still buying into their programming and believe their experiences were 'just dreams' or some ephemeral delusional disorder or perhaps just confabulation.

This is my current theory on why the Bad Guys are getting away with this--they've been doing it for over 50 years in the US and they've gotten damn good at it. The subject selection protocols keep improving and the drugs and the hypnosis techniques and the tech all keep improving--and at rates much faster than in their unclassified sister fields of study, where humanitarian laws apply. So the number of us guinea pigs who fail to form impervious memory barriers diminishes with each year that passes.

Some day soon (if it's not already here) what these jerks are doing will be virtually flawless and completely covert. So if those of us who proved to be less-than-reliable test subjects don't speak up, then no one will know what was and is being done. The techniques of social manipulation will have become a true science that will verge upon art. And the cause of human freedom will have been almost imperceptibly suborned for who knows how long--decades, centuries?

The people doing this don't intend to ever relinquish their control, believe me. "Power concedes nothing without a struggle"--can't recall who said that and I may not have the quote exactly correct, but that's the gist of it. And it's true. And, soon, no one will struggle or even know to struggle.

I agree with Dream's End that the fields of UFOs/alien abduction/New Age spirituality have become societal petrie dishes being meticulously tended and exploited in order to study social manipulation on a mass scale. Memes are floated daily in articles in the press, on TV, in books and on the net that tend to instill a subtle sense of powerlessness and passivity that ends up distracting and diverting collective action by those of us who've begun to wake up.

Later on today I want to post about the 'hybrid' that I encountered during a MILAB, but I'm going to look for previous posts I've made about him, since to dredge it up from my memory causes me to relive the experience and I'm not up to that at all. But thank you for making that post. I hope you'll make others like it and that anyone else here with similar memories will post them, too--even if you've convinced yourself that it was cool aliens or 'just a dream'.

LilyPat

[Hugh Manatee Wins]

This is my current theory on why the Bad Guys are getting away with this--they've been doing it for over 50 years in the US and they've gotten damn good at it. The subject selection protocols keep improving and the drugs and the hypnosis techniques and the tech all keep improving--and at rates much faster than in their unclassified sister fields of study, where humanitarian laws apply. So the number of us guinea pigs who fail to form impervious memory barriers diminishes with each year that passes.

Some day soon (if it's not already here) what these jerks are doing will be virtually flawless and completely covert. So if those of us who proved to be less-than-reliable test subjects don't speak up, then no one will know what was and is being done. The techniques of social manipulation will have become a true science that will verge upon art. And the cause of human freedom will have been almost imperceptibly suborned for who knows how long--decades, centuries?

The people doing this don't intend to ever relinquish their control, believe me. "Power concedes nothing without a struggle"--can't recall who said that and I may not have the quote exactly correct, but that's the gist of it. And it's true. And, soon, no one will struggle or even know to struggle.

I agree with Dream's End that the fields of UFOs/alien abduction/New Age spirituality have become societal petrie dishes being meticulously tended and exploited in order to study social manipulation on a mass scale. Memes are floated daily in articles in the press, on TV, in books and on the net that tend to instill a subtle sense of powerlessness and passivity that ends up distracting and diverting collective action by those of us who've begun to wake up.

LilyPat

Saving this, LilyPatToo, because your views perfectly match my views on how media are used to deploy on a massive scale what is learned from the individuals ensnared and manipulated.

I so enjoy reading your posts due to our matching synthesis of technology, history, and proportionality of motive to action.

[Avalon]

There are many abductee reports that one type of ET called ‘Grays’ seem to be almost robots, controlled by large Mantises.

When is the earliest mention of Mantis aliens? Anyone have a source for that?

[Donovan]

(Wish to answer to LilyPat and Soulsurvivor later but will put this first to Joe and Hugh.)
Joe,
Lol, as I was writing that I was thinking of you and feeling you might object !!! Your ‘push’ had not come to their ‘shove’. I really love your overviews, the concept of creating future ‘religion’ is always on my mind.
That information on Galipoli came from an old UFO book, most likely there is not a link. The authors were a couple, Blum or Blume. (Not the NYTimes apologist, Howard Blum who wrote ‘Out There’ – ufo – who also wrote the Walker cover-up ‘I Pledge Alligence’ that was made into a propaganda TV movie.)

Stranger- that situation (sans UFO / abduction) came up in a fictional TV drama. Some such thing as ‘Indiana Jones Continues’ or such. In that Indiana Jones is the broker for the deal with Kamel. But he was a Belgium journalist. Christ, I said to myself, this ‘fiction’ might be close to the truth, would be obvious ‘Dutch’ brokering !!

Holding that thought it is now Peter Pace who has shown high insubordination and was in Jakarta, (or someplace in Indonesia) at the time. Seventh Fleet is the largest command. Wonder who else was there. Unlike General MacArthur he is holding his own. But about a year ago Pace went over and met with General Ozkok in Turkey. (Prior to Ozkok’s replacement). So Pace has a strong international (group naval) support to
undermine the top neocons and get away with it so publicly. Admiral Dennis C. Blair should have been Chief of Staff, Rummy picked (mind fart- the Air Force General – Meyers ? spelling). Blair was very advanced, many good speeches, some posted to Internet, on given in Monterey the best. He was also advocate of open information and promoted a private, anyone can contribute, ‘security’ site which was taken over, went to hell. Stratigically it is all about Malacca. 600 miles, 1200 miles shoreline both sides that they were talking about patrolling with some rubber boats and 50 caliber !!! So think inner meeting would be in Jakarta.
(forgive the admixture)
Back to your experience. The grays, (or possibly gray operating Mantis), might easily be misunderstood. I have a strong feeling to let the Mantis speak to this. Perhaps I will. Often the sexual encounters are put forth as ‘proof’ that they do not have our interest at heart. But on this thread……..!!! We have already discussed Wm Reich. (Feeling Mantis now). There is nothing wrong with mind control per se. If you whack your kid because he chased a ball across the street without looking well, that is mind control. If you take the kid to the doctor against his will, (knowing he will get a shot) that is control also. Just a tad of cabalistic study and the of reported sexual encounters become obvious as no more than a quick energy adjustment. Quick chiropractic of prime energies.
(In no manner an I saying that there is anything good about what the government is doing)

Hugh,
Yes, there is a petri dish. And this a petri dish for a number of sides. I don’t think secret government likes what they are seeing but they don’t dare break the dish. The number of possible moves the media/cabal/’secret government’ can make are declining.
Yes, they are studying ‘mass manipulation’, but they are loosing the battle.

[LilyPatToo]

I’ve been really struggling to create a post about my MILABs for about 24 hours now and find that the subject still has the power to really upset my emotional applecart. The alter who experienced them is also the one of us who paints and is currently working intensively on artwork, so she’s “out” a lot and hovering very close to co-consciousness much of the time. And she still believes, at least to an extent, that she was interacting with real aliens. So when I reread the posts we made to the UC board in 2003 and relate them to what I've learned of mind control ops, it upsets her terribly.

(Sorry to interject my personal alter system problems here, but they’re directly impacting my ability to post cogently about this part of the MC puzzle)

What I’ll do is to present the few early posts I saved on MILABs exactly as she/I wrote them then--with the belief in actual aliens intact. I don’t want to be confusing, but I think it’s perhaps important to other abductees to show how much my thinking on this has changed over the past 4 years:

Posted on Unknown Country board on Sunday, October 26, 2003 - 1:39 am:
  
When my nasty 'ovulation day' experiences were going on, they used either a drug--a so-called 'hypnotic'--or some mind-control technique to induce a terrible fatigue that made it hard for me to raise my eyes from the floor. When they would get me up and walk me to my examination room, I could kind of see other victims but I couldn't get a clear look at my captors. But I was then and am now sure that they were human.

In fact, the only really alien-looking being that I saw, I only saw once, through a slightly open door, conferring with a military officer. There was a hybrid sort that I saw one other time, heavily disguised as a human, but he definitely was not in charge--I felt very sorry for him.

Only one face ever was very clear to me and that was a youngish guy with dark curly hair who seemed to have a lot of authority. I think I might have seen him on the street once, when I was unimpaired and in full waking consciousness. Or maybe I only saw someone who resembled him...not sure anymore. Can't tell you how grateful I am that these experiences seem to have ended.......

And:

Posted on Unknown Country board on Saturday, November 15, 2003 - 4:19 pm

I was so 'drugged' that my memories are kind of fragmented, but I can recall one time that they brought into my tiny examination room a tall, slender young man who was obviously a hybrid--his skin color was the exact same off-white color that some of the little spiders in my garden are....and I'm a raging arachnophobe, so that did NOT help my state of mind at the time!

They had applied a lot of make-up to his face and put a (bad) wig on his slightly over-large head, but had forgotten to do his hands and wrists and I totally freaked out when I saw them--all I could think was, "SPIDERS, SPIDERS!" due to their color and their extreme thinness. At that point, I remember the uniformed officer coming into the room and ordering me to settle down and cooperate, which made me angry as well as frantic.

I think they may have over-medicated me and I lost consciousness for awhile--which may have been a great blessing, since I my skin still crawls when I think about his body touching mine--*eeew!* The next thing I remember is crouching behind the over-turned examination table and pleading with the officer guy to just please, please let me go--that I'm so old and close to menopause that it makes no sense for them to keep trying to do this with me--why ME?!

At that point, I remember nothing more until I regained consciousness lying on the bed where I'd thrown myself when I first got the familiar "lie down NOW!" message that always preceded this kind of abduction. I spent a lot of time going over my memories of this hybrid, since all I'd ever seen prior to then was a glimps of the arm of an off-white non-human outside the examination room in the corridor, talking to the officer guy.

Even when I was face to face with the hybrid, even through my spider phobia, I felt heart-wrenchingly sorry for him. I'm still absolutely certain that he was as much a victim as I was. I still wonder sometimes if he's still alive somewhere and still being abused. If I ever have an opportunity to help him, I would do it in a heartbeat--as long as it didn't involve touching him.

And about the mysterious “dark-curly-haired guy”:

I've been posting about him since 2003 in hopes of finding another MILAB woman who's seen him too...but no luck so far. He has a light-medium skin tone and dark curly hair. I was always lying down when he was in the room with me, so I'm unsure of his height, but he definitely wasn't unusually tall.

The most noticeable things about him were his amazing *youth*--he looked to be 20 or so--and the fact that he was a civilian in a military environment. And much older doctors and military officers deferred to him! He had pleasant, open features, but wasn't outstandingly handsome, either--just really cute. By now, he'd be in his early 30's.

I'd seen him a number of times when the following incident occurred:
"I think I began to become resistant to whatever they used to keep us docile and started trying hard to flail around and cause any disturbance that I could, once I was in that little examination room. When I did that, the 'doctor' was quickly joined by a young guy who was wearing regular street clothes under a white lab coat--he had dark curly hair and a very charming manner about him. Once he offered to go out and get me some chocolate if I would calm down and cooperate with them. And darned if he didn't come back with a small brown paper bag with malted milk balls in it! I recall wondering who the heck he was."

Generally, too, I was touched very roughly by the techs who hauled us to our feet and into the exam rooms, and very impersonally by the doctors, but the young man would touch me very gently, often laying his hand on my bare shoulder to calm me.

I thought that was sweet until Onesmartrat mentioned that that touch is commonly used by handlers and programmers on Monarch mind control slaves. In a number of my "Lily dreams" (that seem to be from the point-of-view of an alternate personality of mine) she is touched that way by the men who use her, when they want to calm her instantly. Yuck.

So I dunno who he was, but he did treat me kindly when I was under terrible stress, so I still find myself looking for him when I walk down local streets. In actuality, he probably left the Bay Area when the big military bases closed down and my MILABs abruptly stopped.

And just over a year ago, I was confronted by him on the main street just below my house, in a very bizarre, “street theater-ish” manner:

Posted in the When there are witness [sic] thread on UC - Friday, December 16, 2005 - 3:40 pm:   

Yesterday afternoon, a weird thing happened to me as I was running errands on our little main street, about a block and a half from my house....The sidewalk was quite crowded, but I noticed a very good-looking young man coming toward me, looking directly at me, about half a block away. He kept almost continuous eye contact with me, which was unusual and I was searching my wonky memory to see if he was an acquaintance that I'd spaced on, some friend of The Skeptic's, but to no avail.

When he got about 8 feet away from me, he stopped and, still looking directly into my eyes, he suddenly sang part of a Christmas carol at me! His voice sounded professionally trained--perfectly in tune--and I just stared at him, startled out of what wits I have left.

Then his expression changed into a vicious, feral smile and he said, "Smile! Smile, you mean blonde B*TCH!!!"

At that, I stepped away to one side and quickly walked away from him and into the card shop I'd been about to enter. I was so shocked that I didn't think to look around and see if anyone else had paid any attention to him. My heart was pounding at the "Monarch smile" and I was having difficulty concealing my agitation. I felt on the verge of tears, in fact.

When I managed to calm down, I realized that I couldn't recall the lines from the carol he'd sung--which also scared me, since I've been deliberately accessed and triggered by song lyrics before and the words had been very difficult to remember afterwards. I'd forgotten to put my watch on, but when I asked the time of the shop owner, it was only about 5 minutes since I'd left my house...a little long, perhaps, but only by about 2-3 minutes. And her watch could have been a bit off, too.

So I don't *think* I had any missing time, but why did this stranger do what he did?? He didn't do it to anyone else and he was definitely no street person--he was very well-dressed. His jacket was soft, expensive leather, for example, and he was immaculately groomed. Dark, wavy hair and clean-shaven.

Now that I type that, I realize that he actually resembled my mysterious "dark curly-haired young man" from all those MILABs--the one who looked almost identical to pictures of a young Josef Mengele. But I'm not sure if that's a coincidence and he was just a hostile eccentric who picked on me at random, or if this was classic "street theater", to which I've been subjected twice before and which happens to many people who are mind control survivors. It still bothers me today to think of that feral smile.

And yes, I did indeed win the Stockholm Syndrome Poster Child of the Year Awards for 2003-2005, but the competition is now open again--just in case you were wondering

This is a very long post, so I'll present my own take on what was going on in those incidents later--perhaps tomorrow. But at least you now have the background. This is very difficult for me to post about. Part of it is my aversion to remembering the forced sexual component of my introduction to the "hybrid"--notice that I didn't directly state that bit in my early posts at all. The rest of my aversion to it is, I suspect, due to the stress of directly disobeying a post-hypnotic suggestion.

LilyPat

[Donovan]

LilyPat,
Keep posting all of that. Great.

Perhaps I have a pet problem: The Mantis is back. Here are some odd quotes from the Internet. Site is http://www.desertusa.com/mag06/feb/mantis.html
Quote: “…Quick as an electronic flash, it uses its “prayerful” front legs to snatch up the unsuspecting victim, locking it tightly in a barbed nutcracker-like clinch. It devours its prey alive, oblivious to the futile attempts to escape. Let another praying mantis wander too near, and the two may join in a savage fight to the death, with the winner eating the loser, utterly undeterred by an act of cannibalism. Let the mate of a female praying mantis wander too near, and she, always the larger and stronger of the two, may attack and eat the father of her own children….”
Mantis is the only insect that can turn its head like a human.

Another quote:
“…With its worshipful appearance on one hand and bloodthirsty behavior on the other, the praying mantis, widely distributed across the world, has given rise to many myths, as suggested by its very name, “mantis,” which means “prophet” or “seer,” a being with spiritual or mystical powers. The praying mantis supposedly directed pilgrims to Mecca, the holiest site in the Islamic world. It became a god, restored life, bestowed good luck, and helped find lost sheep and goats in Africa. It helped wandering lovers and lost children find their way home in France. Its eggs cured bedwetting in China. Its brown defensive liquid blinded men and killed horses and mules in the United States….”

Another:
“…Strangely, the triangular-shaped head and face of the praying mantis bears an eerie resemblance to the heads and faces of some purported extraterrestrials, in particular, those portrayed in various photographs and illustrations of the “crews” who occupied the Unidentified Flying Object (UFO) that supposedly crashed near Roswell, New Mexico, in 1947. It even looks somewhat similar to some strange figures in prehistoric rock art….”

Don’t know how well researched above is but do know many see the Grays as controlled my Mantises. It is a type of roach, roach the oldest insect known. Should note that UFOs (jine ?spelling) part of Islamic culture. Also, strange thought. - Have always groked very with the channeled ‘Seth Material’ by Jane Roberts. Not too well known but prior to her death she started walking around like an insect, could not control it. She saw many doctors on this.

As said the Mantis came to a group of us in a group meditation, quite unexpected to say the least. Not at all scary. What is this? Well, if you wanted an archetype of the oldest ‘creature-hood’, and the ‘Lion King’ of this creature-hood, then the Mantis would be it. Roaches are almost indestructible. It areas of atomic blast they are the first living thing to come back. Can eat almost anything including plane dirt.
Of course in this ‘high strangeness’ an archetype becomes more than an idea, but a consciousness in-and-of itself. I have been playing with this over the last few days, more and more can make contact. And with this – very directly – solved a math problem that has been haunting me for the past five years. (Last night and night before).

Remember that Mecca was a holy site way prior to Islam, perhaps the oldest in the west. People would go there and make seven circumbobulations. Always the same ‘seven’. Oldest known mass human ritual.

This has much meaning to me in the new geometry
http://www.midcoast.com/~michael1/book.htm

[LilyPatToo]

“Alien Abductions and the Monarch Project”-- It’s taken me a while, but I now see my own MILABs as pure mind control project activity and not in any way as alien contact. Like many test subjects, I believe that drugs and hypnosis (and possibly VR technology) were used to fake the alien I thought I saw in the hallway. The “hybrid” was most likely another programmed victim like myself, but with an ectomorphic body type--very slender and elongated. I suspect that my instinctive empathy with him as a victim was precisely correct.

The sexual stuff involved here is abhorrent to me. With what I’ve learned about the disgusting ways that eugenics ties into the early programs, I suppose that some of the (apparent) breeding experiments that involved forced sex (rape) were justified in the minds of the experimenters, but to have been exploited that way was terribly, indefensibly degrading. I have the impression, looking back from where I am now, that the doctors and scientists had depersonalized me completely. I was treated the way that I’ve seen lab animals treated--as if I had no feelings or ability to feel pain, either physical or emotional.

It makes me angry still when I find myself making excuses for their treatment of me--”well, it was a long time ago after all” or “they were focused so tightly on test protocols that I was just a means to an end”--that’s total crap. They were human beings preying upon one of their own kind. At least during the MILAB-type ones, it was the mid-1980’s-early 1990’s and women’s rights/human rights were major issues--these jerks HAD to have known that what they were doing was wrong.

Were these San Francisco Bay Area projects part of what we call “Monarch” (actually--trauma-based mind control)? I think they were, since I was used in trauma-based programs all my life and the other women I met while living in that condo were too, from what I can now figure out. The victim/handler who’d maneuvered us into living there (in her condo unit) was a classic “Monarch” type--we looked enough alike to be sisters: blonde, blue-eyed and petite. She too had been very psychic when she was younger (and had a mother who’d been a professional psychic). The beautiful dark-haired young woman who was living with the scientist (who worked at the local high security national lab) was DID/MPD, with decaying programming--she would scream for hours, locked inside his condo unit, as she abreacted violent sexual assaults she’d barely survived.

I’ve tried to reach the woman whose name I can remember, but, following several years in prison, she’s vanished. And I can’t remember the pretty dark-haired woman’s name at all. The last time I saw her was the morning of the Oakland Hills firestorm--we were both so terrified and dissociated that we just stood by a window in the scientist’s bedroom and stared at each other and watched as the fire devoured the houses up on the hills. She was clutching her pet bird’s cage and shaking so hard that the cage rattled. Now that I have some idea of what was going on then, I’d give *anything* to be able to ask both of them some questions about things like “alien” screen memories and missing time and the psychological markers I’ve learned are associated with most survivors of the trauma-based programs--severe depression, complete lack of boundaries, no or low self-esteem, sexual dysfunctions.

I’d love to know if either of them happened to be in the military-connected program that I was then in. Since I was taken precisely on my mid-cycle ovulation day, I’m assuming that there was some genetic component to what was done to me. A doctor I saw for reproductive system surgery asked me what had made me decide to “donate so many ovum”, since my right ovary in particular was covered with scar tissue. When I replied that I’d never donated a single one, he obviously disbelieved me.

The time I saw the “alien” in the hallway, I’d resisted the drug enough to knock over a lot of equipment, including a very heavy examination table. The doctor had angrily left the room and I was sitting on the cold floor, wearing a hospital gown and blubbering. And wondering if I was about to be sick, since the drugs they were using on me made me very nauseous. The door to the hallway, which was always kept closed, was open a crack and I could see some men standing talking. Then I saw what I believed was an alien--tall and thin, with odd off-white skin. I could only see the side of his head and his shoulder. Now, I suspect that the whole thing was staged for me to see and remember.

LilyPat

[Donovan]

LilyPatToo,
I do have a friend who was very psychic as a child. Gov ops took her over, she has vast areas of missing time but at one point in youth ended up a streetwalker in Bay area. She also fights this stuff, but happily married. But she sees a greater scope.

Now, something inherently wrong with your view from my point of view, depending on exactly what you are calling ‘alien’. If you start to enter, mess with, other realities you come across a broad range of entity. Runs the scope. In the standard Western traditions those trained in these areas had ‘wars’, politics as usual but with other planes included (almost part of training from higher perspective). If you accept your logic in this situation as you described above you are almost saying ‘government ops’ are the only things you are accessing when you enter other planes. That is doubtful.
There is a classic book on this subject out of the 1920s called ‘Psychic Self Defense’ by Dion Fortune. (She has a good number of classics in this area.) As it never goes out of print (very unusual for a book), most likely you can pick one up on half.com for half a buck or so.

I did some Internet research on Mantis. Seems that this has not appeared in the UFO literature until about 1990 which is curious. Perhaps always there but always screened. But curious as many in group meditation saw this. Also now appears with psychoactive drugs. Neither I nor anyone else involved takes any drugs. Strange. Strange also that, well over the past year or so get that ‘someone-stepped-on-my-grave’ shiver quite a few times a day. But in the last few days there have been real slow – long, long- long ‘golden’ ones ?????
Michael

[LilyPatToo]

Donovan, as I've said many times before, there may be genuinely occult stuff going on in the mind control programs, but it's been used to disinform and distract discussions of the human rights abuses so many times that I refuse to discuss it except when it directly contributes to a human test subject's abuses.

I've now seen numerous threads on human instigated mind control abuses go FAR OFF-TOPIC when the psy/occult stuff is introduced, so I consciously choose to avoid getting sucked into that particular disinformation-tinged black hole entirely. Discuss it to your heart's content, but don't expect me to join in the discussion. I don't mean that to sound as rude as it does in print, but it's a thoroughly thought-out position and as such is not going to change substantially. I am completely committed to keeping the focus of mind control discussions on the Real World human rights abuses that are ongoing.

If you know program survivors personally, for heaven's sake, *please* share whatever you're sure they wouldn't mind you talking about with us here! It's very rare for one of us to wake up and begin talking about this and those of us who do, need to share information if we're to free ourselves and others who are still caught up in the program lies and deliberate diversions.

All talk of planes and aliens and psy/soul stuff pales beside personally-known FACTS about actual program survivors. Perhaps not to you or to the folks who are occult enthusiasts, but to people like me--who are still being accessed--it's literally a matter of life (and quality of life) and death. Please talk about the survivors you know. And, if possible, get them to post here too.

LilyPat

[soulsurvivor]

My abduction couldn't have had anything to do with sexual activity. I was 54 at the time of the abduction, but had a complete hysterectomy at age 28. That's not to say that I don't suspect the sexual abuse in my younger years, but there's only one incident I can recall, and it was myself as a toddler being instructed by my doctor on how to masturbate. From a very young age, I had major health problems because of my reproductive system. Mom told me that the doctors were ready to do a complete on me at age 8, but I began to show improvement to the drugs they were giving me. It was a major health battle from then on.

I don't think I have any big areas of missing time, except for extended hospital stays/surgeries where I was heavily sedated. I've always been surrounded by family and friends, rarely alone. I've been insulated inside such a normal lifestyle, it's difficult to even allow the not-so-normal to intrude.

I'll say this - when I had that fairytale reality going, it was in this physical everyday reality, just better, until the creeps in the triangle showed up.

Due to congestive heart failure complications, I tend to do a lot of sitting. I feel almost normal if I limit my physical activity. Time should seem to move slower. Wouldn't you think? hmm, not. From my perspective time is flying by. I'm about ready to put all my clocks in a drawer because none of them keep time accurately. I have a combination of electric/battery-operated clocks in my world and none of them are working properly. They're gaining time or I'm losing time. I won't even go there. I'm looking at the computer clock - 4:16 pm. Bedroom wall clock (battery, was reset yesterday) 4:30 pm. Bathroom clock (battery, reset yesterday) 4:27 pm. Other bedroom clock (battery, reset yesterday) 4:40 pm. Kitchen clock (electric, reset yesterday) 4:40 pm. Other kitchen clock (battery, reset yesterday) 4:25 pm. Living room clock (battery, reset yesterday) 4:43 pm.

This is eastern time zone. No two clocks in my life ever match anymore. Variations have been observed with differentials of +/- 35 minutes.

[Donovan]

LillyPatToo,
You seemed to have boxed yourself into a corner. On one hand you can see that some of the activity against you is occurring on ‘other planes’, ‘astral planes’ whatever you wish to call it. The best information is in older standard ‘occult’ literature as the New Age, (for damned good reason) threw this material out so that the garbage could come off of it before proceeding.

In ‘standard’ form it is recognized that to control one plane you must act on the plane above it. (To a great degree you have demonstrated your ability to do this) (So in that respect you were acting as –God forbid lol – an ‘occultist’) In these ‘astral realms there is just about everything. It is ‘the big city’. In that respect you don’t send a child out into the ‘big city’ without guidance and protection. And even an adult fares better with the right ‘map’ and the right introductions.

Somehow you have gotten it into your head that because there are 3-D mind control abuses you need to stick to the 3-D. But you report, document, that it is happening on many levels. The guy on the street, this is 3-D, he is reinforcing his ‘power over you’ on another plane. You stick to the lower plane.Again the military example: All military action reduces to two principles, that you can only either assault or maneuver and that you send strong to weak never weak to strong. Well, you have limited your ability to maneuver to only one plane. You can stay in that position getting more and more pissed off but at some point you will begin to see this.
The mass acceptance of ‘other reality systems’ is part of the overall ‘battlefield’. You feel that if you go there it will detract from the reporting of the abuses. I don’t think so. But I can see how you might.

[LilyPatToo]

soulsurvivor, I suspect that whatever you got involved in was another of the many types of programs--there were over a hundred of them just in the MKULTRA projects that we know about. And as far as the Special Access Projects that we have only hints about, there were probably many, many more than that. The Church Committee hearings on MKULTRA drove the trauma-based programs deeper into covert territory, unfortunately.

Many people who self-identify as alien abductees have reported electrical anomalies occuring around them. I've had some that came and went myself, so I know how annoying they can be. Some seem deliberately inflicted on us to discredit us--though I know that sounds paranoid. Often the person who was our chief abuser (or enabler for others to abuse us) told us that "we broke clocks/watches" and removed them from our environment.

It was decades before someone explained this to me--it was done to keep me "separated from time" so that I'd not be likely to notice the many missing time episodes. I kind of lived "apart from time" for most of my life. It wasn't until Onesmartrat explained what she suspected was going on that I bought myself my first watch (since I was a child) in 2005. And the trip to the store to buy it was a Keystone Kops-type of tragi-comic misadventure in which I dissociated and "lost" the slip of paper reminding me to buy it so many times that finally I wrote it on my hand in ballpoint ink--!

Whatever happened to you was something that was different in many ways from what happened to me, but many of the programs seem to have had basic similarities. That memory of a doctor teaching you to masturbate is fascinating. Many of us were addicted to sex as children--Kathleen Sullivan has written about this the most openly of any survivor, as near as I know. When I read "Unshackled" I cried at that part.

And a properly-handled test subject would not have noticed missing time at all--the programs were very focused on this, since it had the capacity to wake up a slave via cognitive dissonance. I've read bios of high-profile survivors used at international levels who had almost no consciousness of missing blocks of time at all. There was always a screen memory in place to explain it.

I don't think I've posted here about one of the few times that that programming failed to work on me, back in the 1970's. I'll write up a post on that to demonstrate how well screen memories work...when they don't malfunction due to a slip-up, that is.

Could you explain about that triangle, soul survivor? I've not done nearly as much reading at this board as I'd like to--I'm particularly short of time right now--but if you can direct me to a post of yours about it, I promise to go find it.

LilyPat

[soulsurvivor]

LilyPatToo - "triangle" has 2 significant memories for me - the first in 1997 when the 2 black triangle craft showed up and the second that was the mark they burned and punched in my hand. I've explained both of those here in this same thread. If you want, you can pm me.

And I'd like to add that even though I've never seen an alien, I'm open to discussion. I'm attempting to tear down walls rather than erect more.

As for the time factor, wrist watches refuse to work on me. I have to carry it in my purse. It's how it's always been.

The house clocks have only been a problem in the past couple of years though, especially noticeable since last fall. My question - is anyone else noticing significant time differentials?

I try to observe everything around me. I have an inner sense that it's a wise thing to do.