Alien Abductions and the Monarch Project

[LilyPatToo]

Avalon, I'm a MC survivor who firmly believed until recently that I was an alien abductee and I've STILL experienced cognitive dissonance at statements like that for years now. I watch others swallow them without a single hiccough and wonder what on Earth they're thinking. Or if they ARE thinking. At all. To me, much of the abductee community is living in a state of denial that may allow them to go on functioning now, but that is doomed as a long-term solution to PTSD. It's not a coincidence that the mere mention of the Stockholm Syndrome drives many of them into frothing-at-the-mouth fury. On some level they KNOW they're being exploited by inhuman sociopaths, but they insist that they're NON-humans to distance the abuse. Drives me nuts

Dream's End, if Cannon hadn't backed off from his theory, I strongly suspect that he'd now either be dead or working at Wal-mart, rather than writing about the intelligence community. He dug deep, with the focus and tenacity and fearlessness of youth, into a sewer of deeply covert "black" programs and came back to formulate a theory that his older/wiser/more experienced journalist friends knew enough to stay clear of...if they wanted their intel sources to continue to flow.

Of course he backed off.

LilyPat

[Dreams End]

I found that blog interesting, too. It was brought to my attention by a journalist friend who I have known for years, and who was witness to a minor incident at my cabin.

Here is the letter I wrote to her after reading it:

I read his blog. It's very provocative. There MIGHT BE a lot of stuff from my childhood, but I am so uncertain about it. I do remember being taken to some horrendous classes at Randolph AFB. Pictures of Jolly West as a young man don't ring a bell with me, but I could certainly remember the face of at least one of the "teachers" at Randolph if I saw it. I have never thought that the name I have for this person, "Antonio Krause" was accurate. However, I do recall that he spoke in an unusual accent--a mix of German and Spanish. Also, we were taken to a school in Monterrey, Mexico, where unspeakable horrors were enacted.

Here is what I believe happened, in essence: During the war, my father was involved in a program to prevent US dollars going to Mexico from the Texas German community, where this money would be used to buy gold to send to Germany. Prior to the war, during the great German inflation, he had been participating in doing this himself, but certainly never for the Nazis.

After the war, he was approached and his patriotism was appealed to, I was enrolled in this program. He did not know what it involved, except that it was important cold war work. I think that he was the victim of Paperclip scientists, who singled us out because of his war work. He did not know that I was going to be harmed, but the stress was so great that my immune system shut down and I was treated in the autumn and winter of 1952 at Brooke General Hospital with gamma globulin injections. I was isolated from other children at that time. (I have my school report card from that year, showing that I was absent for the second half of the first semester.)

What happened was, essentially, a Bluebird-style effort to fracture me and the other kdis into multiple personalities. This "Krause," I believe, had done this for the Gestapo, in order to create children who could be made to be unwitting spies on their parents. The children were tormented in this way, then let go. They absorbed information that could later be 'downloaded' from the hidden personality, with the child's normal personality never knowing what had been done.

However, this fracturing also, in effect, cracked the cosmic egg, leading to contact between the children and other levels of reality. So this was also part of it.

I think that this blogger makes an error in trying to draw lines between mind-control, hoax and contact, because all three must be involved in one way or another. I have never lied or hoaxed anything, as you know, but I have had a lot of trouble both communicating what I remember, and remembering accurately, as you also know.

I think that, when children are subjected to this trauma, whether by some official source or simply by abusive parents, there is always the possibility that they will become accessible to the visitors. I have reason to believe this relating to my understanding of the way perception mediates reality, and how this can be modified, and what happens when that is done.

My impression of the visitors is that they have a very limited ability to contact us, and cannot interact with people who are well-founded in this reality. Shatter that foundation, though, and suddenly the individual is available to them.

I do not think that they are good or evil. I think that they are, if anything, more complex than we are.

It must not be forgotten that I was in quite a battle with the Reagan Administration just before I had my close encounter sequence between October and December of 1985. Specifically, I had published Warday, which had given the lie to the idea that Reagan was pushing that "limited nuclear war is both winnable and survivable." In fact, I had ruined that whole initiative. I was told at the time that Brent Scowcroft was furious about it.

Could it be that they found records of what had been done to me as a child, and decided to try to sideline me as a threat by, essentially, assaulting me in the night in an effort to drive me insane, which nearly happened?

I think that this is a real possibility. However, I also think that the same thing happened that used to happen when I was a child. I ended up in the hands of the visitors, and instead of being driven mad, received the extraordinary personal illumination that has come to define my life ever since.

But the dark side won, too, because my advocacy of my experiences has completed discredited me in intellectual and political circles. I have been effectively marginalized.

I still don't know who this blogger is or what he is doing, though. I am very wary, I have to tell you, because, while this appears to be a sincere effort he is making, one must ask, why has he gone down this particularly obscure rabbit hole? Is it out of personal curiosity, a desire to right a terrible wrong that the United States has done to thousands of helpless children, or does he have a hidden official agenda himself?

and later on:

A little more to say. My concern that the blogger might have some sort of an official agenda stems from the fact that he seems to be concentrating on two possibilities: that I was the victim of a mind control experiment or that I am a hoaxer, with the greatest likelihood that I was the victim of some sort of experiment.

The reason this suggests an official agenda to me is that such an explanation is skillfully dismissive. It is an excellent way of diminishing the importance of the government operation, and also of mooting the notion that contact was involved.

In fact, the government operation was and, I think, is, large and ongoing. The last time it surfaced in the public eye was during the Finders controversy in 1985. Investigation was squelched by the CIA, and I think, for that reason, we can assume that it still goes on.

So, it is no 'experiment.' It is something much larger. And it DOES lead to contact, and whoever is behind this assault on children knows this, and is, I believe, intentionally putting people in harms way by methodically shattering their grip on reality when they are children, then monitoring them and learning from the contact experiences they then have.

http://www.unknowncountry.com/board/mes ... 1171148896

By the way, Cosmic/Jonah...how do you square your contention that mind control has nothing to do with alien abductions with Strieber's own statements above. He says they were running a BLUEBIRD type program on him when he was a kid. I also tracked radiation experiments to the very hospital he was taken to when his immune system collapsed.

Cannon aside...and I never rely on anyone else to make my case for me...I'd say my case looks pretty plausible.

Oh, but man....I'm just getting started...wait till you see what's coming.

[Dreams End]

maybe I was right about Cannon after all. Last statement I can find from him on the matter. Yeah...it was the O'Brian phenomenon as well as, I'm sorry to say Cowbell, the fact that UFOlogists continually called him a "spook". From the horse's...er..the Cannon's mouth:

+Addendum, February 4th, 2002+
From: "Martin Cannon" mjcannon137@yahoo.com
To: Mark Pilkington

Mr. Pilkington, Greetings. My name is Martin Cannon, mentioned by you in an article which (unless I've misread the attribution) you wrote for the e-journal "Blather" back in 1999. I caught up with it only just now.

In the piece, you mention the Mark Phillips/Cathy O'Brien imbroglio, and you note in passing that they were the reason I got out of researching mind control.

Well...not exactly. It might be better to say that Mark and Cathy helped create a mythology, and that a number of unbalanced people attached themselves to this myth.

When I started expressing doubts about this myth, I got more than the usual amount of negative feedback along the lines of "Cannon's an agent." After putting up with tons of that sort of crap over the years, I reached a point where I had to ask myself: Who needs this?

That was only one reason why I marched out in disgust. There were a number of other reasons -- including the fact that my work got reprinted by a bunch of right-wing organizations. Conspiracy buffs who disagreed with my more cautious and skeptical attitude started to say the most obscene things about me. (You can find a lot of that crap on usenet.) From the beginning, the ufologists all thought I was some sort of spook. Of course, they say that about EVERYONE -- I think that accusation is a control mechanism, much as the "witch" accusation was back in the days of the Salem witch trials.

But perhaps the main reason I "had to let it go" was the dawning realization that a lot of the folks I was talking to were simply nuts.

Cathy O'Brien may well be in that category, although Mark is, in my opinion, a money-motivated con-man. I've talked with a few "Mark and Cathy" watchers over the years. And I spoke to Cathy's former husband, Alex Houston, who plays a huge role in her demonology. Hell, I may be the only outsider to speak to both Houston and Phillips. I must admit, Houston makes a much better impression. But he ain't selling conspiracy, so the buffs prefer not to seek him out.

Naturally, nobody connected to David Icke has ever sought out the other side of the story. No conspiracy buff has ever tried to talk to Houston, although he is not hard to find. I'm sure if I ever made my skepticism about the Mark and Cathy case better known, Icke would simply denounce me as a witting member of the BLC (Big Lizard Conspiracy).

Anyways, sorry for inundating you with the ramblings of a burnt-out "fringe" researcher. But I just thought you should know that there was more to the story of why I got out. There's more to the story of Mark and Cathy, too...and one of these days, someone should tell it.

-- MJC

http://www.blather.net/blather/1999/03/ ... agons.html

Well...I do happen to live in the same city as O'Brien and Phillips...but I think I'll have to put that on the back burner.

[Project Willow]

I hate to post what is essentially a finger-waving comment here, but I can't resist any longer.

I don't believe anyone can be diagnosed via internet chat board. It's legitimate to speak to one's own experiences, to share them in respectful ways with part of the intention being to enlighten others who might eventually follow a similar path. But adapting a position of superior and absolute knowledge will not win any converts, and casts a bad light on others who might share your beliefs.

[Attack Ships on Fire]

This continues to be a fascinating thread and the four part Strieber investigation by Dream's End was very intriguing as well. As well, the comments by Avalon in the page before this one resonated with me because I felt the same after reading the material I found on Streiber's site.

I read the thread on Streiber's site where the lady that visited his cabin told of her abduction experiences, and one particular event was particularly chilling. She remembers being awakened to the sound of feet marching in the hallway and screaming coming from elsewhere in the cabin, then a non corporeal voice commanding her to go back to her bed so that things will be easier. A few moments later she describes Greys coming into the room and performing a sexual examination. As this is happening Streiber is consoling her by her head, apparently crouching down beside the woman as she lays upon the bed.

Later on, the same woman is left alone in the cabin by Streiber as he drops friends off in the city. That same night she has another frightening experience.

I should add that this poster has been forthright in her belief that, while she doesn't appreciate what was done to her, she does not blame Streiber at all for the violations to her. My thought, sitting on the other side of the monitor and reading this, as well as the other comments by Streiber of what was happening at his cabin, make me suspect that his way of dealing with these traumatic events isn't the same way that other would like to deal with them. To me these encounters with the visitors sound intensely frightening and disturbing, and worse, the thought of placing children in this kind of situation (if one believes that it is happening) is even worse.

I've read Streiber's books and there are many instances where things do not add up and it is plainly obvious that he is not sharing all that he knows about what happened to him, or that he is a charlitan on some level and has made holes in his story. I tend to side with the former train of thought but my mind remains open to all possibilities. I say this as a fan of the man's work pre-Communion (it's a shame that "Warday" and "Nature's End" are out of print).

Dream's End, you keep on doing what it is that you're doing. You're tackling this mystery with sensitivity to the individuals that you're asking tough questions about as well as remaining steadfast in keeping your eyes focused on what matters: the truth, whatever it may be. If your investigation convinces Streiber to be more forthright with his readers, why wouldn't that be a good thing? If these events are happening just as Streiber chronicled in his books, I cannot imagine walking in his shoes, either emotionally, spiritually, as a father or as a huband, and economically either. That said, when he presents the image of a tortured spirit striving to understand the motivations (or even the very reality) of these visitors and then abruptly turns face and tells his readers that he met with these beings in a frame of full consciousness and knows more than he is allowed to share, that smacks of dishonesty. There are people in states of emotional agony over these visitations and the things I read, if taken at face value, are heartbreaking. If it is within Streiber's power to dispel some more mystery associated with the alien abduction phenomena, whether it's drawing or disputing connections to human mind control programs or offering more evidence that this is some forth of otherworldly contact, he should do so. Otherwise, what is the point? Streiber says that he wants to help others like him, but if he is withholding information, or worse, adding more injury to already traumatized souls, then at what cost is his own spiritual journey?

[Joe Hillshoist]

Well pal, it was YOU who pm'd me and asked me what I thought about your story which YOU linked me to ....I told ya and predicatably you respond like most others who have been this horror would , and I , in an effort to see if there might be a hole in your MC soaked brain, attempt to get through to some small part of you that obviously knows more and is looking for help. Now it's "oh, you're trying to control me and tell me what I think time." Sorry, not playing that one anymore. I need to save my time and efforts for those whose intense desire for freedom has some moderate control over those defensive alters.

You are on your own. I have no time for people who chose the blue pill whislt pretending to chose the red one.


Best of luck.

-OSR[/i]

Wow chill out.

Ok

point 1

What was going on that night. How did the experience I had have something to do with MC and techniques? thats what I would like to know, and what are the forces hiding behind the mantid critter.

You haven't told me what you think that is, and thats what i would really like to know.

What processes were at play, if there were non human actors what role were they playing and how do they play. What techniques or technologies are they using?

Thats what I want feedback on. I guess saying that it was some hypnosis this, kidnapping that thing doesn't fit the picture. Thats why i have trouble taking it on. I accept my nighttime dream experiences are bizarre and scary and resonate with MC, but mine have always followed a process that seems to give me power in the world, not take it away.

I am not actually looking for help re that link I sent, but for your interpretation of what that experience was about, how it could have occurred etc etc, and if there are no mantid space aliens (or mindspace aliens as i would describe them) then what were they.

I remeber terrence Mckenna's quote, about the DMT?Shroom experience. The one that goes something like: "Every now and then I ask the experience to show me what it is for itself, without the cute elves and other glosses, and after about 45 seconds of rising organ music, and tentacles pulling back the drapes and creeping through i go "Thats enough lets go back to the elves."

Once upon a time I did the same thing, and steeled myself to hold on, and not back out the way T Mac does, at the point he did or any point further.

In the link, and my story I refer to the classic alien abduction exp, and thinking to myself "If I hadn't taken shrooms..." the laughter that inspired caused that image to shatter like glass. What followed was ... Its still hard to describe. I can guess where hr giger got aome of his inspiration, but even that is nothing like it.

I wasn't asking for help, cos quite honestly all my serious problems are of my own making, no offense but I don't see how you can help with them. And the other things in my life are challenges that I may or may not be able to deal with.

Point 2

You are making massive assumptions. i don't have a number of experiences that seem to go with the MC MO. i don't get triggered for a start, well, i do, but every human has "triggers" of a mundane sort. For instance, I don't like cops or authority figures. I look at attractive women on the street, whether I am aware of it or not. Politicians on tv inspire anger in me. etc etc. there is nothing beyond that. )Of course if I was MC I wouldn't be aware of that so you will probably decide thats the case).

but my response was nothing like Lilypat's after reading the thread about Beth Goobie:

http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board/viewtopic.php?t=11018

The movie fight club, supposedly a wall to wall collage of MC inages and triggers, well its agreat movie but thats about it. Wizard of Oz - nothing.

Point 3

I have an understanding/construction of the other world that probably has a lot to do with my genetic and cultural heritage, and with my relationship with the dirt i walk on(our universal heritage) and recognise the theft of much of the elements of that heritage in the way MC programs are designed. But that doesn't necessarily mean I have any experience with them. They don't have a monopoly on this stuff, i would suggest that the idea that they do is one of their attempts at control, a meme that disempowers, and if you are holding on to it its probably worth dropping.

point 4

Perhaps you missread this.

I appreciate the time you are taking to read and interpret my story, but I still don't agree, and some of what you are saying seems almost like an attempt to tell me how to think, which never sits well.

To interpret it as this, tho I could have been clearer.

Now it's "oh, you're trying to control me and tell me what I think time." Sorry, not playing that one anymore.

Its not the same as saying "you are trying to control me". Control me - ha good luck. What I meant was that you are trying to interpret my story as something else, and you are. Instead of taking it on its own merits.

The fact that you said that is another example of it - you are playing that game, but with yourself in this case.

Or perhaps you just misread it.

If I was gonna be a little harsh (OK I am gonna be) I would say you have some messiah/save the world complex going on that causes you to read everything weird as MC related and everyone who has a weird experience as a victim who needs you to save them. Perhaps you should listen to a particular Stabbing Westward song.

I don't need saving.

I am interested in other people's opinions of the mechanics of that experience and how those particular weirdo freakazoid things operate, but if you have that knowledge you are certainly not all that keen to share it.

[Joe Hillshoist]

Anyone else reading this might be inclined to think that I would disagree with DE's interpretation of streiber, and the way alien abduction has been presented for the last 20 years.

but I actually think thats spot on.

I recently reread Dark White by Jim Schnabel, and skimmed thru communion.

The whole thing reeks of mind control IMO. What I have seen of DE's blog, he is definitely onto something.

( BTW DE If you have the time you might want to check out Stribers "Unholy Fire", if you haven't already, it kind of resonates with what you are saying.)

If my reactions to OSR's interpretation of my life seem a little out of joint with that comment and opinion of Striber and the alien abduction by grey's scam ... well you can't deal with reality if you can't deal with paradoxes.

[Trifecta]

I wonder where I may sit on this whole thread now???

As an explorer of the strange, parralles of manifesting my own realities, vs karmic shit that always hits the fan of my current life situation. Seems to me as if I would need to read a great deal more to comprhend what you guys are submitting other than an intellectual pissing competion, an agenda or more rabbit holes to climb into, up and down. My brain already hurts, perhaps that is the point?

I have been told by others whom deem themselves in the know that I am a prime candidate for being an mkkid, and its is true, based on the variables I have taken in, that I see corelations between my life story and those being part of a massive global control operation. The big questions like to what ends, purpose, calling and free will, or indeed freedom of will.

Fear fascism has gone on for milenia.

Each here are acting out, an indeed the internet forum/discussion/non peer reviewed thesis all have one common thread, none know the whole picture, and as such each word we text, or vibe we create is but a form of acting out, acting our part/s, depnedant solely on our moods, knowledge and comprehension of the massiveness we face every day, we open up to new information.

it easier to be knider on my soul, to admit I am part of some great conspiracy and my calling as an operative will come. Its softer on my current living in the now to recognise that a tommorow looms and we live in a stinking whole filled with rotting corpses of our fellow humans, our beloved life forms endangered at an unprecented pace. We are debating aliens taken our very beings and manipulating them to their own nefarious ends. Yet we are far more viscious on oursleves to worry about bicameral evolution to fully being digitised drones.

The actors assume their roles based on the knowledge and experiences to hand. Whatever you believe in a digitaised planet will manifest in your reality, you choose it, you see it, you expereince it.

Movies, Tv, infotainment, become a consiousness all of there own, those choosing to act in that mode will resonant with the underlying incentives embedded into the control mechanism. We can of course choose to withdraw our act, and follow a different script.

So the controllers man has changed his script, he has more info. Much braver to do this than to carry to the death a theory, which can never be broken.

OSR, a link to part two would be grand.

[Onesmartrat]

I wonder where I may sit on this whole thread now???

As an explorer of the strange, parralles of manifesting my own realities, vs karmic shit that always hits the fan of my current life situation. Seems to me as if I would need to read a great deal more to comprhend what you guys are submitting other than an intellectual pissing competion, an agenda or more rabbit holes to climb into, up and down. My brain already hurts, perhaps that is the point?

I have been told by others whom deem themselves in the know that I am a prime candidate for being an mkkid, and its is true, based on the variables I have taken in, that I see corelations between my life story and those being part of a massive global control operation. The big questions like to what ends, purpose, calling and free will, or indeed freedom of will.

Fear fascism has gone on for milenia.

Each here are acting out, an indeed the internet forum/discussion/non peer reviewed thesis all have one common thread, none know the whole picture, and as such each word we text, or vibe we create is but a form of acting out, acting our part/s, depnedant solely on our moods, knowledge and comprehension of the massiveness we face every day, we open up to new information.

it easier to be knider on my soul, to admit I am part of some great conspiracy and my calling as an operative will come. Its softer on my current living in the now to recognise that a tommorow looms and we live in a stinking whole filled with rotting corpses of our fellow humans, our beloved life forms endangered at an unprecented pace. We are debating aliens taken our very beings and manipulating them to their own nefarious ends. Yet we are far more viscious on oursleves to worry about bicameral evolution to fully being digitised drones.

The actors assume their roles based on the knowledge and experiences to hand. Whatever you believe in a digitaised planet will manifest in your reality, you choose it, you see it, you expereince it.

Movies, Tv, infotainment, become a consiousness all of there own, those choosing to act in that mode will resonant with the underlying incentives embedded into the control mechanism. We can of course choose to withdraw our act, and follow a different script.

So the controllers man has changed his script, he has more info. Much braver to do this than to carry to the death a theory, which can never be broken.

OSR, a link to part two would be grand.

Dear OS;

Here the deal. I don't waste my time anymore on endless chatter from ...the "uninitiated" ... unless, of course, they are worthy of my time and energy.

Now, having said that. Let me say this as well.

I am a high-bloodline occult-trained super-intuitve, domestic and foreign assassin, Defence Intelligence intel-analyst, in-field Intelligence/paramilitary operative** (**"Psychic Warrior style" ...see Andrew Marshall's protege' and current Bush senior advisor on Iraq; Michael Vickers, whom I "served under" in covert operations abroad), and while still a child in their highly-secretive "Pretender" program, I was a part of a high-level Pentagon-contracted gathering of the best and brightest minds in applied sciences, physics, and spatial mathematics who were using the Cult-contracted "lab rat kids" like me in a quest for what was described symbolically/metaphorically as "the Golden Fleece" (which is why the group was called The JASON Group and the kids were known as "JASON protege's albeit heavily mind-controlled "compartimentalized" ones).

I could feign some kind of fake humility here and go through any number bullshit linguistic dance routines in an attempt to soothe the fear-paranoia of the perrenial self-doubters here who have been culturally conditioned to think that maintaining an "open mind" means being in an endless mental paralysis of "never knowing anything for sure" and whoever actually is sure they know something is very un-PC and couldn't possible know anything kind of looped-paradigm mentality ... and I could drown out the professional naysayers here by endlessly pointing out their classic formula-denial bullshit/character assassination technique, and then maybe after some pseudo-validation by the rest of the "innocent" rabble, I would feel "more open" about telling some nasty shit I know that may be of interest to some of the more free-thinking intelligensia here, including you. However, most of the responses would most probably come from the loudest debunkers (some of whom are indeed no doubt professionals and others, slaves themselves in denial), wherein, by the way, most of these people posting in here would then spend endless hours in cyberspace asking me for "links" and calling me the ...well, the ...usual names.


But, it's no longer a fun sport for me making fun of ... well, ...let's leave it there.

So, yes, there was kind of a "second part" but as it did not continue in the same line of thinking as the frist part and was written from a standpoint of apparently "overestimating" the intelligence of the readers on that particular site, who could not undertand most of what I wrote, it really became more of separate piece, instead of any kind of second part" to the piece that opened this thread.

In order to give you that second part you desire, I would have to actually write a whole new piece ...and while you my friend may be well worth the effort ...these days, I need a little more motivation than that ....and a little more interest in writing for an audience worthy of my time. And yes, I got an ego, it's big and I am rather arrogant when it comes to this subject matter ...(and I have earned the right, in sweat and blood and a lifetime of pain, to be arrogant on this subject, believe me ...besides I'm Irish!) and yes, I do know what I am talking about; one not necessarily cancelling out the other (arrogance and true-knowledge and insight) ...however, the level of discernment I am observing, with a few exceptions and over tone in here is well below what I would have expected for such an articulate and literary "smart guy" as owner blogger of this site in terms of his watering-hole "draw." Which is why this particular watering-hole gathering on this thread, at this time, is fairly disappointing.

It has de-evolved into a back and forth yammering over a second rate academnicaian's personal flip-flop on the so-called "alien abduction vs. mind-control debate" ...YAWN.


Perhaps, when I check back later on, something will have happened, like a miracle, and the thread will have picked up in terms of intellectual debate and progressive insight with more original thoughts and personal experiential knowingness put into it, instead of post-paste-in jabberings in a sea of endless circular reasoning.


Until then ...



Hasta la vista, baby ...






-OSR

[OpLan]

I don't know what it is that makes me resist posting here.Probably thinking whatever I have to say is trivial compared to some members experiences..but I'll post whats been going through my mind just to show I haven't been ignoring you.
A couple of weeks ago,I basically stared at this thread all day and deleted a good 2 hours worth of thoughts.There was an episode of 'diagnosis murder' on the TV,and dick van dykes sidekick thought he had been abducted by aliens,but Dick found a bottle of scoplamine rigged up to his water supply..pesky chemical company was messing with his head.
That Karla Turner lecture was quite an eye opener.What do I make of the dream where I met Madonna in a nightclub,like I'd known her all my life,who spoonfed me a dose of LSD?I'm not a fan of her music,or the Spice Girls-I've dreamt a few times of embracing Baby Spice in the shallow waters of a tropical island-we hug and she says 'you have to go now' and each time right on cue,my alarm clock would go off to start the day.How about the Egg shaped man I dreamed of a few times as a small kid.He ran a small pokey toyshop.I would be in my push chair,my ma would ask him for something and he would go in the back room,but he would stare through the gap between the door and frame at me..with this creepy smile on his face..then the dream would jump to my bedroom,me laid in bed pretending to be asleep,peeping through my barely open eyelids as the eggman slowly appeared at the doorway,his creepy eye gazing at me through the doorframe.I used to dream of a white faced old hag,with deep green eyes-she would come close up and the green of her eyes became a jungle,like I was looking through windows on to the canopy of the amazon forest.
Someone else wrote about not wanting to talk to those who hadn't seen themselves..I took that literally,because I used to have another recurring nightmare,where I would be laid in bed,staring at the wall,then the next second,at my bedroom door,trying to turn the doorknob with powerless fingers,a deep dread of turning round..then I would be back in bed staring at the wall,with the same dread of turning around..then at the door/wall/door.I still prefer to have my bed next to a wall and sleep with my face to it.

Communion is the only book I've ever bought on the strength of its cover.I remember seeing it across a crowded shopping centre.I spent the last of my dole money on it and lived on toast for a week.Taken at face value,its a terrifying read.I remember a few times I had to stop reading,get out of bed and go sit with my folks for a while.
I've seen lots of UFOs but only ever dreamt of a grey.the little creep grabbed my arm and its the most terrifying feeling I've ever had..thats comparing it to abseiling,parachute jumping,almost drowning as a kid,and several awful overtaking decisions as a motorbike courier.I woke up screaming loud enough to wake my girlfriend,flatmate,and next door neigbour.
That particular dream had a sky crowded with ufos.A line of them did a loop de loop in front of a full moon-they approached the moon so that they presented a saucer shape,but did the loop as discs..if u see what i mean..very artistic..I tried to get my girlfriend to look but she was terrified..a group of children caught my eye doing acrobatics in the shadows of a doorway..one of them ran to me and I realised as it reached out for my arm that it wasn't a kid.Even thinking of it now has got my heart rate pumping..12 years later.That dream also had a fake police car in it.
Talk of the Garland film made me stop and realise I've never watched it all the way through.I've only ever seen bits of it.It just creeps me out completely.I don't think I'm an MK victim.Maybe Streiber and MILAB people are hitting on some kind of natural human dream elements or fears?

Which is why this particular watering-hole gathering on this thread, at this time, is fairly disappointing

This thread has had over 9000 views..I think there are more people reading than talking.
Personally I tend not to actively participate in MK/RA threads,because I don't really know enough to pass comment,and I don't want to accidentally tread on toes.Most of the time I've only got drivel like the above to contribute.Don't make the mistake of thinking nobody cares.

[slimmouse]

Perhaps its just me,

But does anyone else on this thread get the impression that there might be an attempt to make BOTH schools of thought on this thread out to be irrational by the age old method of divide and rule.

And that in doing so, they kill 2 very REAL birds with one stone ?

Or am I the only dumb one here ?

[philipacentaur]

But does anyone else on this thread get the impression that there might be an attempt to make BOTH schools of thought on this thread out to be irrational by the age old method of divide and rule.

In your opinion, who's the perpetrator and what are the two schools of thought you identify?

[slimmouse]

In your opinion, who's the perpetrator and what are the two schools of thought you identify

Hmm.

C'mon Phil, your a clever guy.

Im sure you know exactly what I mean.

Hows about the main contributors to this thread ?

[philipacentaur]

I guess I'm just not clever enough. I wouldn't have asked if I already knew the answers. Who are the "main contributors" here?

[sunny]

OpLan-

This thread has had over 9000 views..I think there are more people reading than talking.
Personally I tend not to actively participate in MK/RA threads,because I don't really know enough to pass comment,and I don't want to accidentally tread on toes.Most of the time I've only got drivel like the above to contribute.Don't make the mistake of thinking nobody cares.

OpLan, your comments were not drivel at all. I found them incredibly affecting. Your memories of childhood dreams stirred one of my own, one I'm most reluctant to face, but maybe I should, I don't know.

I've never watched the Wizard of Oz all the way through, either.