Madeleine Incorporated

[hiddenite]

What I am trying to explain (but failing I think) is revealed in the currency now given to that First Post article , which has been hanging there for a week or more...yesterday's tabloid headlines were Madeleine alive in spain versus Madeleine died in the apartment.

This has touched something basic and visceral in brits.
On the Mirror Forum people are now saying well I never believed David Kelly committed suicide or that there were really weapons of mass destruction in Iraq for that matter. It has opened the flood-gates for people who have all assumed they have been lied to and now here is a case in which they can meet and agree that "summat's up" .

It's not envy Blanc , it's people fed up with the boozy, flagrantly careless image of themselves they have seen promulgated. People who have learnt to recognize spin when it's shoved at them and are angry about something they can get their teeth into, that they feel entitled to have opinions about . (like the page scandal?)
There is real outrage out there ...the idea that you can leave kids alone for hours in a strange place while you get stoned ...it's not how Brits see themselves.
And the fact that Clarnece Mitchell was a journalist /advisor who "helped" Paula Yates after Hutchence's suicide and was the BBC correspondent at Soham , murkies the waters the parent's are swimming in .
Gerry Mccann was due to speak at the Edinburgh festival on the the role of the media and internet forums in aiding his search for his daughter. That speech (if delivered) is now billed as a discussion of the "double-edged sword" that is media assistance .

[blanc]

very happy if people question questionable official versions hiddenite, but think that when there is a victim of organised crime, or victims, perspective must be applied. not everyone is fair game all of the time.
what happens, repeatedly, and following a predictable pattern, when crimes against children are signalled, is whitewash, fudge, and blame the victim. must I remind you that when the fbi gave the brit authorities details of thousands of ukpaedophiles the response of the government, as soon as the investigation got close to downing street, was to kill investigation by denying adequate funding? every case involving organised paedophile crime which is not investigated adequately, or is shut down prematurely, leaves a structure of criminal organisation in place and unmolested. my particular concern here is that I do know of such cases, which have close links to the algarve, aside from the homegrown portuguese ones mentioned above.this info has been placed before the investigating authorities anew, and appears to have been ignored. perhaps there is a good reason why it is not prioritised, but Madeleine is still missing. I think prattling about the wisdom of the arrangements her parents made that night is irrelevant, at best, or a strategy for distracting the public from the reality of things at worst. Organised crime is so profitable and risk free that no parent skills can protect with infallibility that is the story, that is what must be understood. aside from that, why attack people who are suffering the consequences of their decisions - what is the purpose?

[sunny]

From a Law Enforcement perspective, when a child goes missing or is found dead, espesially from or within their own residence (primary or vacation) it is SOP to look at the parents first, if only to eliminate them from the suspect list so they can quickly go about looking at others. Apparently from all I've read, this was not done. Just as in the JonBenet Ramsey case, the parents, well to do prominent citizens like the McCann's, told LE a story, LE believed them and precious time was wasted waiting for a ransom call. In the McCann case, they did not do a forensic examination of the room the child had been in until several weeks later.

It is obvious the authorities in Portugal were reluctant to suspect the parents first and fact check their every statement, thus wasting precious time. This is why many people like myself are suspicious and it is perfectly understandable and reasonable. If this had been you or me, do you think they would give us such incredible benefit of doubt, or do you think they would haul us down to the station and question us for hours on end, be damned with what the media might say about us? No. This happens only when the suspects, and the McCann's are suspect until the matter is clarified, are wealthy.

In another case of a missing baby of wealthy parents, even when LE does it's job, they get punished. (In this case, instigated by Jeb Bush)

http://www.karisable.com/sabrina.htm

[Telexx]

My best guess:

A group of middle class friends (mainly doctors) go on holiday. They spend their evenings drinking at various establishments up to 1 km away while leaving their children unattended in their apartments (on the night in question 'only' 150 metres away - where nine of them got through 14 bottles of wine in an hour). On earlier nights the children are heard crying and complaints are made, but they refuse baby sitting.

So on the night in question they sedate them (Dr. Kate was an anaesthesist), but it goes horribly wrong and they cook up up a cover story.

Guesses like that help nobody.

At the initial tv press conference the McCanns held, I felt certain that the mother (at least) was distraught at the loss (and judging by her use of tense, not death) of her daughter.

Just my opinion, but hopefully less rank, magotty and appalling than some of the other opinions on this thread.

Thanks,

Telexx

[archie]

My best guess:

A group of middle class friends (mainly doctors) go on holiday. They spend their evenings drinking at various establishments up to 1 km away while leaving their children unattended in their apartments (on the night in question 'only' 150 metres away - where nine of them got through 14 bottles of wine in an hour). On earlier nights the children are heard crying and complaints are made, but they refuse baby sitting.

So on the night in question they sedate them (Dr. Kate was an anaesthesist), but it goes horribly wrong and they cook up up a cover story.

Guesses like that help nobody.

At the initial tv press conference the McCanns held, I felt certain that the mother (at least) was distraught at the loss (and judging by her use of tense, not death) of her daughter.

Just my opinion, but hopefully less rank, magotty and appalling than some of the other opinions on this thread.

Thanks,

Telexx

Apologies if I've offended anyone - I was asked what I thought. The first paragraph you quoted is not my opinion - just a statement of some of the known facts in the case.

The final sentence may be "rank, magotty and appalling", but since I made the post it has emerged as a theory of the Portugese police (who are not, contrary to the oft stated views of the British gutter press, a bunch of incompetent buffoons). See e.g.:

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,22308860-2,00.html


Since I posted the link, the aricle has been modified to baldly state:

"The story was dismissed by Portuguese police"

The original story says they said it had "no authority".

[Avalon]

Archie, thanks for the link to the Mirror forums. While poorly sourced (seems like many of the participants are new to online forums and don't realize you have to be able to inform those just tuning in, as well as the names participating) and confusingly quoted, it looks like an interesting source of information that we here haven't heard.

For instance, it now seems that Gerry McCann at some point said that he did the 9:05 checking of the kiddies, and Madeleine was not in her bed, so he assumed she had wandered into the parents' bedroom but didn't check to confirm. He didn't discuss this with Kate when he got back to the tapas bar, it seems.

What.... the...holy.... fuck....?!?!?!?!?!?

The mind boggles. Wake up and smell the fish. And take the twins away from these horrendously negligent parents.

http://forums.mirror.co.uk/viewtopic.ph ... sc&start=0

[sunny]

So what happened with the announcement that was supposed to come out last week?

[hiddenite]

Still awaiting the FSS results Sunny

meanwhile

http://ben-fairhall.blogspot.com/2007/08/darkness-falls-on-beach-of-light.html

[11:11]

Just noticed that Larry King is doing a show on this. The show will be re-run in a couple of hours. Said M's mother is being seriously questioned.

What's that about crimes not solved in the first 48 hours?

[blanc]

both of the theories being tossed around , that the parents did it, that Maddie died in the appart. encourage us to take eyes off the ball.

[archie]

Kate spent 12 hours being questioned from 15:00- 01.00 Portugese time yesterday. Questioning due to esume imminently (11:00 am Portugese time).

Focus is on Madeleines dna found in a car they rented 5 weeks after her disappearence.

Clarence Mitchell, government media spinner, still around, but described as " close family friend"

[8bitagent]

I think there is a much more *likely* and probable, yet all the more unthinkably dark probability with this case

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3355621.stm

The former employment minister in the last Socialist government, Paulo Pedroso, and former ambassador to South Africa Jorge Ritto are among them.

Police have spent more than a year investigating allegations that children from the Casa Pia homes in the capital were abused by a paedophile ring.

Seems just like Belgium, Chile, Mexico, America, Sudan, East Timor, Bosnia, etc Portugal has organized child kidnapping rings with ties to government officials.

[8bitagent]

Also wanted to mention the two other highly publicized cases, I believe were part of something very sinisters.

I think Jon Benet Ramsey was killed by her mom, now dead of cancer,
to "save" her from a well organized pedophile/child porno ring that was abusing her and other kids. The mother's obsession with an evangelical sect
was evidenced in the "random note" in the signature and things she was saying.

I also find it very likely Laci Peterson was killed by a cult, given the circumstances of Peterson and her forced born child turning up dead matched exactly with the same situation that happened to a woman who turned up washed up in the same area, along with other abducted pregnant women in the area. The details of the Peterson case point to a ritualistic sacrifice, not some mad cheating husband.

[sunny]

8bitagent, here is a fascinating thread on JBR, which contains a great deal of info on the murder:

http://rigorousintuition.ca/board/viewtopic.php?t=4775

[sunny]

Kate McCann accused of killing Madeleine
By Caroline Gammell in Portimao and Gordon Rayner
Last Updated: 12:16am BST 08/09/2007

Kate McCann has been warned she could be charged with the "accidental" killing of her daughter Madeleine after Portuguese police directly asked her whether she was behind the toddler's disappearance.

The claims and the case for the defence
Shocked response from friends and family
Full coverage: The search for Madeleine McCann
In an extraordinary twist, Mrs McCann's family said detectives now believed she caused the four-year-old's death in their holiday apartment, then hid the body before returning a month later to dispose of it.


Video: Crowds gathered to support - and jeer - Kate McCann as she returned to the police station in Portimao today
It was claimed that police had offered Mrs McCann a "deal" of a two-year jail sentence if she confessed and told them where the body was.

The astonishing developments followed the discovery of blood in a car the McCanns hired four weeks after Madeleine's disappearance 128 days ago, which police believe proves Mrs McCann killed Madeleine.

The allegation was dismissed as "ludicrous" by Mrs McCann's husband Gerry, while her parents said the police investigation had become "a joke".

Mrs McCann was declared a formal suspect, or "arguida" by police, who spent a second day questioning her in the Algarve town of Portimao before releasing her without charge five hours later.


Mr McCann was also questioned, but remains a witness rather than a suspect.

Mrs McCann has been warned by her lawyer Carlos Pinto de Abreu to be prepared for the fact she might now be arrested and charged.

A family spokeswoman, Justine McGuinness, revealed that Mrs McCann had been asked outright if she had killed her daughter, and was "shocked and angry" at the allegation, which she emphatically denied.

Miss McGuinness said: "They believe they have evidence to show that in some way she's involved in the death of her daughter, which of course is completely ludicrous.

"They have suggested that blood has been found in a hire car that they hired 25 days after Madeleine was taken. How on earth could you hide a body for that long? We are in a hot climate.

"When this was put to Kate she was very taken aback. It was the first time she had heard the allegation and she actually swore at police."

Mr McCann's sister, Philomena, later revealed the plea bargain offered by detectives.


She said: "They tried to get Kate to confess to having accidentally killed Madeleine by offering her a deal through her lawyer, which was 'if you say you killed Madeleine by accident and then hid her and then disposed of the body, then we can grant you a two-year jail sentence or even less. You may get off because people feel sorry for you'."

According to one report, the police asked Mrs McCann, a doctor, whether she had sedated her daughter, leading to speculation that detectives think she may have accidentally given Madeleine an overdose.

Mr McCann, 39, expressed his own frustrationin his blog on the Madeleine campaign website, saying: "We will fight this all the way."

Police had told Mrs McCann before she went for questioning that they had 22 "difficult" questions to put to her further to the information she had given them during 11 hours of questioning on Thursday.

Whistles and jeers mingled with shouts of support as she arrived at the police station today carrying Madeleine's favourite toy, cuddle cat.




http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jh ... ddy907.xml