Let's buy a bridge = A theory of RA in the United States.

[lightningBugout]

Great great great info thank you.

I'm sorry if my original post seemed a bit quixotic, but I do see the possibility for being activist about trying to identify and publicize these things that have hidden within the shadows so long. I think the torture memos have primed the American public for, perhaps, greater sympathy and credulity at RA survivors. Hence my eagerness to create something (out of so many unknowns) that is firm and solid so it can be circulated.

Now off to continue getting up to speed on Dutroux.

ps. If you have netflix and are interested, both Capturing the Friedmans [bleech] and Deliver Us From Evil are currently available as "watch instantly" films. I assume everyone knows the former. The latter is about one of the most frequently offending pedophile priests. It is incredibly disturbing on many levels.

[LilyPatToo]

Just a brief but heartfelt thank you for the Dutch material and also for the Belgian info. When I was manipulated into moving to the Netherlands in 1982 (by a man I later learned was an international smuggler), I would lose chunks of time in Haarlem and come to in Belgium again and again, with no idea why I'd gone there. So information on the European programs is very valuable to me.

LilyPat

[genericsyncretic]

This whole "is RI dying" question has me returning to something that, I believe it was, Chiggerbit pointed out - it seems likely that RI attracted the attention of *someone* important who didn't like what was happening here. Why? Because of the daily focus on RA/MC. Let's go with that.

I say, lets raise the stakes and start burrowing down that rabbit hole ever more seriously until we spring out of the ground smack dab in the middle of the dominant reality with something to pass around and a way to spread the word.

So far we have multitudinous bits and pieces, survivor's stories, provocative lines in CIA memos, a questionable cottage industry, and more.

How would you put it all together? How would you theorize RA/MC?

It might seem quixotic at first, but I don't think it's not entirely do-able either. In the right fashion. A lot of information is here, in the archives, in Jeff's posts, in data dumps. What about the beginning of a time line? If people could assess the veracity of claims, at least to a certain degree, they could perhaps be color coded based on how verifiable the information might be. Add in some other kind of disambiguation between seemingly government and private abuse. This could go back to the idea of a wiki too, which would be a good way to link together generational aspects. It would be nice if it could be hosted privately though, I don't know if anyone wants whatever kind of heat it could attract.

Then there's whatever details anyone with first hand experience here feels comfortable adding. There's a danger of misinformation in all of this of course but if it was a group effort done with due diligence and civility it might work.

Another thing that could be useful in any kind of comprehensive evaluation of ritual abuse and mind control might be a study of what works. There's all sorts of information about hypnotic techniques, drugs, and trauma. Could an idea of their methods be fleshed out believably from what we know people can do. Just look at some entertainers. I'm always stunned when I see a Derren Brown special. I just imagine what someone (or worse a whole unit) with his training and skills coupled with an enormous black budget could do to people's psyches. Well worth a youtube search if there's anyone here that isn't familiar with that particular "mentalist."

Last thought on RA. The fact that it seems to have gone on almost as long as western civilization itself sometimes terrifies me. With the amount of pedophilia and child sacrifice in so many occult belief systems it makes me wonder if there's something to it. Which sounds horrible. I don't mean that as a backhand endorsement of horrific, truly sick-fuck, behavior. I just keep getting hit with the question, "why has this gone on so long?"

[RocketMan]

With the amount of pedophilia and child sacrifice in so many occult belief systems it makes me wonder if there's something to it.

I don't think you need to comb through RI's data dumps to conclude that yes, there indeed is some powerful, transgressive mojo there. I guess that's the one thing that's shaken my paradigm the most after my Rigorous Intuition initiation, pun intended.

[8bitagent]

There is a somewhat controversial deprogrammer who claims that they have learned from survivors that there was a small circle of scientists and doctors from various parts of Europe and North America who back in the 30's began a no-holds barred quest for total control of the human mind. Their efforts preceded BLUEBIRD/ARTICHOKE, but led up to it in some way.

Oh this is more than documented, Im pretty sure its admitted fact. Hell Ford had to send a letter of apology to the Frank Olsen family for the CIA taking him out. The post Nazi mind sciences within human guinea pig subjects(including children in Canada) is pretty well documented(tho Im sure a lot is still classified)

The same person who told me about this also told me about a "witch" from Germany who came to California after the war- a highly committed occultist who has allegedly abused thousands of children in her life.

Given the black brotherhood of occultism lies at the very core heart
of elite linked abuse, it wouldnt surprise me. Look at all the Satanic ritual killings linked to the elite across Europe in various castles and mansions. Kubrick only got it part right in Eyes Wide Shut I imagine.
While some of the elite's spiritual advisors like Nicholas Roerich didnt seem depraved in the least, others Im sure(especially with the Third Reich and British Monarchy) were into some very bad stuff.

Now assuming both these stories are "true", which granted is somewhat of a leap of faith, the fusion of these two kinds of archetypes must have, for the MKULTRA insiders represented a very, very heady fusion of two powerful currents- which especially given the political protections they probably enjoyed must have brought with it a megalomaniacal, "we're going to take over the world" sense of power.

The scientists/bluebird/artichoke thing is 100% vetted and verified. I mean look at the mind control the US does in Iraq prisons or elsewhere to this day.

This is what we're up against, and these are some of the kinds of people who wouldn't want Rigorous Intuition to be a place where people are actively and productively getting at the deeper truths. Therefore we should do it as best we can.

Ive been on several "9/11 truth" forums where people literally thought there was CIA spook operatives crawling all over the place. Im sure they have better things on their time to do; like blowing up innocent Afghan and Pakistani villagers or orchestrating oil based genocide in Africa

[8bitagent]

1. I don't believe in all powerful and singular explanations for historical events and phenomena.

Aw, I miss the days when I was like you:)

I do indeed think JonBenet was killed in an RA event. I'd had an intuition for many years the poor child's death was the result of a deeply disturbing "organized" event, but I did not know from RA until I came here to RI. Project Willow made a comment very early on in the life of the forum in regards to JonBenet that put me on the road to discovering Krebs and her allegations. Here it is:

Ive no doubt of this either. I would also add Laci Petersen, as her death seems very consistant with a ritualistic type sacrifice.

I know why people laugh at Ted Gundersen's claims, SRA "as the product of 80's hysteria", claim Dutroux was merely done by two people, etc. It's because to even begin to entertain that some of the stuff in David Icke's Worlds Biggest Secret is remotely plausible...is to completely shatter one's psyche and paradigm. Beyond waking up to 9/11 or other events

[8bitagent]

Franklin and Finders are quite conclusively proven, but I'm surprised no-one's mentioned the Dutroux/affaire Pinon/X-Dossiers/ballet roses/Brabant massacres affair.

Same reason the usual level entry "conspiracy theorist" talked endlessly about "skull and bones", "bohemian grove", and some cartoonish vague "Illuminati" meme...instead of proven cases of a Satanic black brotherhood agenda dovetailing throughout most world governments and agencies...from the Serbian Black Hand and Thule Society, to P2 in Italy to the modern day decadent child slavery of Dubai and Saudi Arabia; as well as the mass occult slayings in Swaziland, Kenya and the Congo.

Be it the drug routes of Kosovo and Albania, the corporate based genocide snaking throughout Africa, or the nightmarish world of child sex and labor slavery in Southeast Asia and worldwide...the global elite agenda is so cloaked in pure darkness that most would rather shine a light onto "safe" conspiracies or coverups. God knows what kind of dark spiritual ley lines these guys operate through.

People here about SRA, organized elite pedo rings, the elites raping and sacrificing children and they think "Oh, thats just Fritz Springmeier, Ted Gundersen and David Icke fantasy"...

Well, its just, the "kooks" are some of the only ones willing to talk about this stuff. And when you have pure disinfo like "Ganon=Gosch" and fictional narratives swirling around some of the O'brien/Philips/survivor stuff(be it intentional disinfo or planted memories) its quite a mess to navigate.

But lets be honest...unless famed professor John Mack faked all those countless accounts of alien encounters, you know theres some crazy shit out there and that all possibilities must be considered.

[8bitagent]

blanc wrote:

Oh yes Belgium, a watering place for arms deals, a connection with Africa too.Don't get Amerocentric because ra isn't.

I very much agree. I tend to focus on MK ties to intelligence agencies because that seems like the most strategically important place to focus. In the United States that sort of research is heavily, heavily focused on the CIA, with perhaps an added emphasis on the Nazi antecedents.

With Belgium though, we really arrive in Rigorous Intuition territory because the multi-generational RA cults and occult secret societies with which we should be concerned definitely have major roots into Europe. In that, there must be a deep power structure of which I know little, but without a doubt Belgium has a place on the map of occult Europe and deep power Europe.

The connection of Belgium to Africa, especially with regards to diamonds and weapons is intriguing in light of some of the child soldier armies that have been organized in Africa. Some of these organizations are functionally very, very similar to the worst of the RA cults. So maybe these kinds of groups have some kind of place in the network, though proving this incontrovertibly would be very, very difficult.

Well we have hordes of roaming occult based militias raping and sacrificing people and children as government and corporate proxies in Swaziland, Kenya and the Congo.

We have the United Nations carrying out massive child sex slavery for over a decade, going so far as to use UN ships to transport East Timorese children in crates.

We even have the government heads of Chile and Portugal involved in child sex rings.

So this thing is absolutely global, and far outside the "CIA done it" route.

I mean when the leaders of Dubai are alleged to have organized the slave trade of 30,000 young boys you know its bad

Last thought on RA. The fact that it seems to have gone on almost as long as western civilization itself sometimes terrifies me. With the amount of pedophilia and child sacrifice in so many occult belief systems it makes me wonder if there's something to it. Which sounds horrible. I don't mean that as a backhand endorsement of horrific, truly sick-fuck, behavior. I just keep getting hit with the question, "why has this gone on so long?"

Absolute power corrupts absolutely? Part of me thinks its a sick jollies, or power play. (I know some think it merely to be blackmail)

Another part of me thinks its the elite doing these things to gain power and guidance from interdimentional nastys', with the occasional mass ritual event like 9/11 to change the aeon.

Of course, I also feel most religions including Christianity are all just there to trick people.

[genericsyncretic]

Absolute power corrupts absolutely? Part of me thinks its a sick jollies, or power play. (I know some think it merely to be blackmail)

Another part of me thinks its the elite doing these things to gain power and guidance from interdimentional nastys', with the occasional mass ritual event like 9/11 to change the aeon.

Of course, I also feel most religions including Christianity are all just there to trick people.

I go back and forth between the two, depending on how much I'm trying to ground myself at any particular time. Just 'cause what I do believe is kinda too ominous to carry around all the time I think. Optimism? I suppose it's a good fallback now and then to avoid paranoia.

That said there seems to be reason to believe that there's more to it then vice and leverage. Just the numbers really. 'Cause it seems overwhelming that so many people are just naturally inclined to such horrific behavior when in a position of power. Maybe that's naive, I don't know. It just seems to me that if it were really a combination of blackmail and the worst frat boy/deliverance style hillbilly networks it wouldn't be so common. Could be wrong though, maybe people are inherently worse than I want to believe.

[8bitagent]

I go back and forth between the two, depending on how much I'm trying to ground myself at any particular time. Just 'cause what I do believe is kinda too ominous to carry around all the time I think. Optimism? I suppose it's a good fallback now and then to avoid paranoia.

That said there seems to be reason to believe that there's more to it then vice and leverage. Just the numbers really. 'Cause it seems overwhelming that so many people are just naturally inclined to such horrific behavior when in a position of power. Maybe that's naive, I don't know. It just seems to me that if it were really a combination of blackmail and the worst frat boy/deliverance style hillbilly networks it wouldn't be so common. Could be wrong though, maybe people are inherently worse than I want to believe.

In the underground occult world and networks, sex magic is considered the highest form. So be it phallic shaped planes flying into buildings or unspeakable acts committed against the innocent; the true black brotherhood(not the Dan Brown cartoony stuff or "skull and bones/bohemain grove" stuff) has a thirst and a duty toward something more baffling than the usually ascribed greed and corruption.

Youve seen this right? While we all know about UN and Dyncorp child kidnapping, Jeff wrote this absolutely soul crushing post about just how deep the SRA/child abuse/slavery networks go worldwide, and their connections to governments

http://rigorousintuition.blogspot.com/2 ... satan.html

Jeff perfectly dovetails the article with some pretty esoteric musings, but it all seems pretty logical to me

[genericsyncretic]

Youve seen this right? While we all know about UN and Dyncorp child kidnapping, Jeff wrote this absolutely soul crushing post about just how deep the SRA/child abuse/slavery networks go worldwide, and their connections to governments

http://rigorousintuition.blogspot.com/2 ... satan.html

Jeff perfectly dovetails the article with some pretty esoteric musings, but it all seems pretty logical to me

I did. It was reading all of Jeff's work (except the book unfortunately) that led me to where I am. I've been interested in parapolitics for more than half my life, but Jeff tuned me into RA/MC. Before finding his work the only credible information I'd ever found on that was in the declassified MK documents. As we all know nearly everyone else who touches this stuff comes at it from either a cartoonish or overtly religious perspective. So I have Jeff to thank for scaring the hell out of me.

It's incredibly frustrating too, 'cause my wife is the only person I can discuss any of this with outside of this forum. It's hard to start talking about elite pedophile networks if you don't have a few hours and a power point presentation ready to explain why you're not nuts.

[lightningBugout]

Youve seen this right? While we all know about UN and Dyncorp child kidnapping, Jeff wrote this absolutely soul crushing post about just how deep the SRA/child abuse/slavery networks go worldwide, and their connections to governments

http://rigorousintuition.blogspot.com/2 ... satan.html

Jeff perfectly dovetails the article with some pretty esoteric musings, but it all seems pretty logical to me

I did. It was reading all of Jeff's work (except the book unfortunately) that led me to where I am. I've been interested in parapolitics for more than half my life, but Jeff tuned me into RA/MC. Before finding his work the only credible information I'd ever found on that was in the declassified MK documents. As we all know nearly everyone else who touches this stuff comes at it from either a cartoonish or overtly religious perspective. So I have Jeff to thank for scaring the hell out of me.

It's incredibly frustrating too, 'cause my wife is the only person I can discuss any of this with outside of this forum. It's hard to start talking about elite pedophile networks if you don't have a few hours and a power point presentation ready to explain why you're not nuts.

The value of Jeff's work for communicating about this stuff to the world is immeasurable. Talking to 99% of people, at this point, very tough. I am really excited to put together this guide.

[8bitagent]

I did. It was reading all of Jeff's work (except the book unfortunately) that led me to where I am. I've been interested in parapolitics for more than half my life, but Jeff tuned me into RA/MC. Before finding his work the only credible information I'd ever found on that was in the declassified MK documents. As we all know nearly everyone else who touches this stuff comes at it from either a cartoonish or overtly religious perspective. So I have Jeff to thank for scaring the hell out of me.

It's incredibly frustrating too, 'cause my wife is the only person I can discuss any of this with outside of this forum. It's hard to start talking about elite pedophile networks if you don't have a few hours and a power point presentation ready to explain why you're not nuts.

Well I like Jeff's work, as precisely...it doesn't come from some evangelical or right wing angle like much of the stuff out there does.

You'll never hear Jeff obsess over "Jesuit Zionist Masons" or whatever hodge podge of conspiracy mad_libs is out there.

I would have to say Rigorous Intuition(yay for Barnes and Nobles) IS the most frightening book Ive ever read. And its just amazing his work hasnt gone super nova viral. Of course, I have to say RI was way too much of a soul crushing red pill...that it took me several tries to try to even confront the ideas he was discussing.

Fact is this stuff is just way too disturbing for people. I have no problem understand why people would completely close off their mind to this.
I also understand why a lot of people get angry at what were discussing.
There is so much compartmentalized serial sexual and psychological trauma people endure thats merely the product of a really sick and power hungry sole individual(like that Austrian guy who kept his daughter in the cellar for decades) or even just brief periods of sexual abuse as a pre adult...that to many the deep parapolitic aspects we are discussing might to them "muddy the waters".

I don't know if what a lot of these better known names in the RA/MC truth movement are telling the truth. If its delusions, stretches, etc.
All I know is nothing at all is surprising to me; and even the most unbelievably bizarre claim could be frighteningly real to the person.

But yeah, I try and stay on the dapper positive light hearted end of discussions with people...still, good to see others aware of this stuff.

[lightningBugout]

And its just amazing his work hasnt gone super nova viral.

I think Jeff's book is one of the first best, real counterculture books of our time. It may take quite a while to explode. I'm sure it will but I also think its one of the most difficult books within its genre (if it has one.) I read it after a couple years watching the board and still found it overwhelming at times.

[genericsyncretic]

Fact is this stuff is just way too disturbing for people. I have no problem understand why people would completely close off their mind to this.
I also understand why a lot of people get angry at what were discussing.
There is so much compartmentalized serial sexual and psychological trauma people endure thats merely the product of a really sick and power hungry sole individual(like that Austrian guy who kept his daughter in the cellar for decades) or even just brief periods of sexual abuse as a pre adult...that to many the deep parapolitic aspects we are discussing might to them "muddy the waters".

Is that an attitude you've encountered before? I'm curious, if this is offensive to some victims of the more personal types of abuse. It's something I was afraid of at one point, I know that. Introducing my lovely bride to this material wasn't something I particularly relished as I was afraid it could be triggering for her or insulting in some way. Anyway, that's not how it came off, which is good because I'd rather not keep an idea to myself. Since then I haven't thought about it a lot. Obviously, there's nothing we talk about here that should be denigrating to any kind of abuse victim. And suggesting that these things happen on an organized level shouldn't detract from the one on one abuses that go on in far too many homes.