Horrorcore rapper faces murder charges.

[Percival]

I have been in private discussions with this Sicktanick fellow and others in their community now for a few days and I will share that when I am done speaking with them but the one thing they continue to say to me is that what they are doing, ie making rap music about killing, slashing, stalking and raping is no different than what Stephen King does with his films. Yes I think its funny that these hacks compares themselves to King but I am interested in what you folks think about that comment and how you might argue that in fact he is NOT like King because rapping about these things is different than making films about them.

Anyone care to make that argument?

[IanEye]

[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maximum_Overdrive]
satellite send me picture
get it in the eye
take it to the wire
spinnin' like a dynamo
feel it goin' round and round
runnin' outta chips
you got no line in an 8bit town
so don't look down...[/url]

[Maddy]

Percival, right off of the top of my head, not awake and without thinking I'd argue that first King has talent (no seriously, he's not just doing gore for gore's sake though he admits he'd go down that aisle if he has to) and that King and other horror writers don't GLORIFY slaughter, they have morals in their work, and the bad guy is the bad guy - they make sure you realize that what is happening is wrong, even with loveable bad guys (Tarantino's Natural Born Killers are sympathetically accessable and obviously psychotic, and its made absolutely plain in no uncertain terms that what they are doing is wrong) - they ensure you realize that they're psychopaths. Also the bad guy always loses (okay, maybe not with Tarantino).

I'll actually think about this while I go out for my morning walk. That's a very good question.

[barracuda]

Anyone care to make that argument?

I doubt that any argument along those lines is likely to hold water. SickTanicK is pretty much right - at some fundamental level, his production has a congruence to Steven King's or Caravaggio.

[IanEye]

I am the literary equivalent of a Big Mac and Fries. - Stephen King

[Percival]

Anyone care to make that argument?

I doubt that any argument along those lines is likely to hold water. SickTanicK is pretty much right - at some fundamental level, his production has a congruence to Steven King's or Caravaggio.

Sure, but I think Maddy above makes some very good points.

[barracuda]

I think there is no question that in the painting above, Caravaggio has chosen to glorify the sheer horrific slaughter of the incident. He could have painted any number of other views or points in the timeline of David's defeat of Goliath, but he decided to shove the dismembered gore of the decapitated head virtually out of the picture plane and into your face.

Keeping in mind as well, that Caravaggio was a murderer, too.

[Pierre d'Achoppement]

I mentioned this earlier, he namechecks Euronymous in that clip someone posted. Euronymous was the leadsinger of Mayhem, also had his own store and recordcompany, and was the leader of the norwegian black metal cult in the 90s that ended up with a couple of churches burned and multiple murders and suicides. So if Sicktanic is rapping about "being a real killer like Euronymous" I'd argue that's blurring the line between fiction and reality a little more than Stephen King writing about some random killer.

[Percival]

Some comments here of our conversations so far:


ME:

What I AM here for is to try and understand the purpose of horrorcore culture and music and to try to come to some agreement with you as to whether we as artists have some responsibility to those who are influenced by what we produce.

HIM:
The only responsibility the artist have is to put out a solid album. This is the type of music we like to hear. I'm not here to speak on others behalf because i cannot do that. I actually think these artist are doing something positive believe it or not.This music it actually is kinda relaxing,when you having one of those days. I know with you being Buddhist and all you don't believe in harming anything, so this may be hard for you to understand. I say that meaning no disrespect to your beliefs.


ME:

What is the purpose/message that you intend to convey with your lyrics about killing, raping, slashing etc?

HIM:

For most horrorcore artists, it depends on the specifics. If an artist raps about killing a cop - they generally have a problem with authority. If an artists raps about killing some high class woman - it generally means they're taking issue with upper class people. There are underlying meanings within horrorcore, be it political, social or otherwise, however the general population chooses to be blind to the fact and only focus on the fact that we "only" rap about killing people. The message generally brings awareness to the meaning - eg. authority = corruption, upper class = vanity, pretentiousness. Therefore in MY opinion, horrorcore DOES have certain meanings depending on the song, depending on the artist, consciously or subconsciously. The question is whether you've taken the time to listen to any horrorcore and attempt to find the true messages.

[Percival]

More:
ME:

I agree that most people who rap about murdering people are not going to actually go out and do it but as an artist dont you feel that whatever creation it is you produce, whether it be a painting, a poem, a novel or a song, has the ability to influence others? Does that mean all art and music has to be sunshine and roses? NO! You can inspire others with darkness and morbidity but you have to be aware that when you take that route you are walking a very fine line and you need to be aware of the fact that you have an influence on people who may not be as mentally stable or strong as the rest of us and your presentation, creation or product can be what pushes their buttons just enough to get them to do something that they wouldnt have done without your help. So as an artist nobody should be able to stop you from expressing yourself however you wish, but you should respect the gift enough to know there are lines one should not cross.


HIM:

No, not really. I appreciate art as entertainment. When I looking at Goya or Fuseli I appreciate the technique and the artistry, but the motives in themself don't influence me. Even with happier motives like when I listen to Debussy or Stravinsky I don't feel the need to drink absinthe or dance the ballet. I just really like the harmony and the orchestration.


Just look at all the products we have in society like guns, alcohol, trans fat, casinos and prostitution. You don't have to like any of these but on a free market I think the artist has no responsibility towards a society that allows such things.

And also we don't always need things that inspires to greatness, sometimes we just need a little bit of fun or relaxation, in horrorcore's case we sometime want to be scared.


I hate hidden moral in entertainment, If I'm watching a horrormovie I want to be scared, If I'm watching a comedy I want to laugh. I hate when people try to use horror to promote some sort of moral cookie.

Neither as an artist or as a person should I have responsibility towards other people and what they do with their life. I mean, I can be wearing a red shirt and somebody who hates red goes off on a killing spree. And I don't think I'm responsibly for that.

I run into people all day that I don't like and people that has the ability to influence me to violence, But I don't use violence in my daily life, because I have ethics, morals and some sort of self control. If I someday loose it and beat the shit out of somebody who annoys me, the blame will be on me, because I was the one who lost control.

I can't go through my daily life being afraid of how my action might influence unstable persons, in that case I would have to look myself inside and never go out.


Horror for me is entertainment, it is a way to be afraid under controlled situations. If it gets to violent or to scary I can pause the album, pause the movie or put down the book. But it doesn't matter if it is a book, an album or a movie, I still appreciate it on the same level as a roller-coaster ride, As long as I'm on the ride I'm fully devoted to the feelings I experience, but as soon as the ride stops, I usually laugh at it and think of it as a nice experience. A good horrormovie will do the same, or a good horroralbum.



I edited his spelling and grammar as much as possible because he cant spell for shit lol.

[Maddy]

You know, he has good, valid points, as much as many others here have had. Its hard when you're trying to figure out the mind of a psychopath. This is why I keep reverting to something that is inherently different between (for example) Sicktanick and Syko Sam. Is Sicktanick going out and slaughtering people? I have to say no, because I have no proof that he is. And frankly I don't believe that he is and wouldn't unless there was proof. But he and Sam listen to the same music, create the same music, reside(d) in the same culture, etc. This is why I don't think that particular culture can be blamed (even if it did have deleterious effects upon Sam, or if it has those effects upon others).

I agree that what you put into yourself eventually defines yourself. As above, so below, as within, so without. A steady diet of anything will brainwash a person. But I don't think that most people are getting enough of a steady diet of horrorcore for it to have a brainwashing effect. Even Sicktanick admits to listening to various music, or watching various movies. So my question remains what was "put into" Sam, or what is inside of him that differentiates him from Sicktanick or any of the others who aren't out there killing someone?

Ask him that. Seriously. Ask him, what does he think is the difference?


PS: yeah, Stephen King is junk food. He's one of my two favourite junk food authors.

Edited for correct spelling.

[Percival]

I mentioned this earlier, he namechecks Euronymous in that clip someone posted. Euronymous was the leadsinger of Mayhem, also had his own store and recordcompany, and was the leader of the norwegian black metal cult in the 90s that ended up with a couple of churches burned and multiple murders and suicides. So if Sicktanic is rapping about "being a real killer like Euronymous" I'd argue that's blurring the line between fiction and reality a little more than Stephen King writing about some random killer.

Good eye I just went back and saw that myself. I will touch on this in my next conversation with him.

[Percival]

Another comment he sent me:

If you need a clear statement that raping kids is wrong, their is something wrong with you. Of course everybody knows that rape, murder and slashing is wrong, that's why we do songs about it, because we are afraid of it. If we did songs about teddy-bears it wouldn't be HORRORcore.

And there is a whole bunch of movies that doesn't have a moral and that does 'glorify' violence.
Me personally, think that a lot of people mistake artists for glorifying when they are just giving it straight to the listeners. If every horrorcore song had a 'don't do this at home', 'please don't feed the cannibal' or 'this is wrong' message the flow of the song would be disrupted.

When I do a song about raping children, I assume that the listener is smart enough to realize that this is something that I'm afraid of and not something I agree on, If it was, I would do a bunch of happy beats with my friends 5 year old singing 'happy anal rape day' or something that would glorify pedophilia more, but if I make a dark evil beat to lyrics about rape, I assume that people get the idea.

Also, horrorcore is not for children, if you find a horrorcore album in your kids record collection; burn it.

[OP ED]

Aleister Crowley was Satanic.

Aleister Crowley was not a Satanist. He played with provocative "Satanic" imagery and metaphor, but that is very different from being a Satanist.

Michael Aquino isn't a "satanist" either. [he's worse]

Crowley wasn't a satanist, but he got robbed by them after his death, which is to say that they stole all their good ideas from him and watered them down to be more easily digested by suburban white kids.

they actually don't even like him. Burning an effigy of the Beast was one of the first rituals the CoS ever conducted.

...

Stephen King is a terrible writer. Almost as bad as deSade.

again, selling many copies doesn't make it good...

[Maddy]

Mea culpa, mea culpa I'll bow out to more educated minds.