I like you a lot AD, your anti cult materials provide me with an interesting perspective. Don't be so mean to him VK.
In fact, because I always like to state where our opinions (for whatever they are worth) coincide, here is something else I can happily agree with;
AD wrote:So my point was not to say "faith bad" or "faith good" but to use this example of further evidence of my ongoing point, which is: spiritual "faith" in and of itself is no guarantor of ethical behavior individually, nor of decent social politics, nor that critical thinking is being used in general.
Having said that, this "faith" label is problematic. Rajneesh would never have encouraged anyone to have faith in anything except themselves, and that's a fact.
Also, go check out more details about Sheela Silverman, if you want to find out the likelihood of whether a lot of bad things might have come from the commune without the Bhagwan's knowledge.
Firstly, it was the Bhagwan himself, who told the authorities of the crimes that had been committed, and provided them with the evidence. He claimed that as soon as he found out what was happening, he went to the authorities. He was never charged with any of these crimes, but deported on the basis of a violation of immigration law, to which he admitted. What did they have on him? Clearly nothing. He gave them the evidence on Sheela though, so they had to at least be seen to be doing something there;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ma_Anand_Sheela wrote:Sheela and her co-conspirators admitted to the attempted murder, poisoning two county officials, setting fire to a county office, and setting up an elaborate wire-tapping network at the commune's telephone system, among other charges. Sheela and Puja were sentenced to 24-year jail terms in federal prison,[36] and fined $470,000.[31] She was fined $400,000, plus a charge of $69,353.31 in damages of restitution to be paid to Wasco County, Oregon.[46][47] All told, Sheela received sentences of three concurrent 20-year terms in prison.[46] The State of Oregon recommended that Sheela's jail time be spent in federal prison.[46] Sheela and Puja served their jail time in Pleasanton, California, in a prison for nonviolent white-collar criminals.[47] She was released after two and a half years and immediately left for Switzerland on 13 December 1988.[2] The State of Oregon had intended to charge Sheela and Puja with additional crimes after their federal sentences had been served, but the two left for Europe before the United States Department of Justice had given notice to Oregon.[47]
Release and later life
In December 1988, Sheela was released for good behaviour after serving twenty-nine months of the 20-year sentence for attempted murder of Meredith, first and second degree assault (poisoning) of public officials, immigration fraud, wiretapping within Rajneeshpuram, and the bioterror attack.[1][48][49] She also lost her green card.[48]
Following her release, Sheela returned to Europe and married Urs Birnstiel. She gained immunity from extradition from future charges, including those related to the 1985 plot to assassinate US prosecutor Charles Turner; however, she was convicted by a Swiss court in 1999 for "criminal acts preparatory to the commission of murder", but did not serve additional time.[14] After her release, Sheela moved to Switzerland where she started a new profession managing two nursing homes.[49] In 2000, she lived in Switzerland, being the widow of a Swiss citizen.
What happened at the commune couldn't have been that bad, could it? She got less than two and a half years in a cushy prison for nonviolent white-collar criminals. And that's for poisoning and a bioterror attack. You know, some folk might suspect she was some sort of agency agent provocateur within the movement. They always slide at least one in. They have to get the handler inside to look after the one perceived as dangerous. Like my YoYo that glows in the night; what made him special, made him dangerous. She was big on poisoning too, might she have been slipping the Bhagwan something? She was later convicted of plotting murder, but did not serve time apparently. That's good going. But it's all fine now, she's managing two nursing homes and the bhagwan is cold and dead and tarred with her crimes. Job done eh? She seems to be able to plot murders and never get charged with anything.
I'm just concerned about the residents of those nursing homes. Perhaps someone should find out if she still manages them, and let everyone involved know exactly who their manager is.
