Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

[slimmouse]

Conniption: That blog post reads like fiction to me.

That may indeed be true. In that case.

The trouble is that it is becoming increasingly clear that there are many who, given the opportunity to speak wouldn't be making it up. Im all for skeptics and that. But you do have to wonder.

Nor that where it all leads is being continuously smothered by a very small few.

http://hat4uk.wordpress.com/2013/02/03/ ... d-cameron/

It seems, from the comments that increasing numbers are understanding this.

[semper occultus]

VIP paedophile ring
The net closes: Ex-Tory chief faces child sex arrest over claims girl was raped and boys were abused

16 Feb 2013 22:30
www.mirror.co.uk


The probe into a former Cabinet minister, the notorious paedophile Sidney Cooke, Jimmy Savile and MP Cyril Smith


Police are ­preparing to arrest a former Tory Cabinet minister after a woman came forward to claim she had been raped by him as a girl.

Detectives are also investigating claims that he abused boys.

We can reveal that the former minister is suspected of being part of a VIP ­paedophile ring that was regularly handed boys by child rapist and killer Sidney Cooke for vile sex orgies.

The former high-ranking MP, who we cannot name, is under investigation by Scotland Yard’s paedophile unit.

Sources close to the probe gave details of the new allegations to the Sunday ­Mirror and investigative news website ­Exaro.

A former detective who worked on the original investigation into Cooke told the Sunday Mirror that the minister was among those alleged to have been ­photographed in a 1986 police surveillance on premises where boys had been dropped off.

Others allegedly included Jimmy Savile, MP Cyril Smith and top judges – though none of them were ever arrested.

Cooke, 85 – dubbed Britain’s most notorious paedophile after he tortured and killed 14-year-old Jason Swift in 1985 – would pick the unsuspecting teenage boys up off the streets around Kings Cross.

He would drive them to locations across North London where paedophiles lay in wait to repeatedly rape them.

Last week the former officer, who worked on Operation Orchid which convicted Cooke and his gang, said they had taken pictures of the minister.

The former officer said up to 16 high profile figures were due to be arrested. But the day before they were to be carried out detectives were told the operation had been disbanded.

The revelation means Scotland Yard knew about allegations concerning the Cabinet Minister and Savile in 1986 but did nothing about it, instead choosing to cover up the claims.

A source told Exaro last week that senior officers, including Commander Peter Spindler, the head of the Paedophile Unit, have had a secret briefing on preparations to arrest the ex-minister.

It is understood that the investigation is at an early stage but there is a plan to arrest him in the next few weeks.

After the 1986 operation into Cooke was disbanded the former officer went to check the file – only to find the pictures had disappeared and any mention of the men involved had also vanished.

The former officer said: “It was clear a cover-up had taken place.

“The investigation showed that Cooke would pick up rent boys and take them back to flats or garages where large groups of men were waiting to abuse them.

“These paedophiles, which included a lot of high-profile figures that were said to include the former Cabinet Minister, Savile and MP Cyril Smith, all knew each other and all operated together. They would lie in wait and Cooke would turn up with the boy who wouldn’t know what was going to happen.

“We had photographic evidence of these high-profile figures entering or leaving buildings where the abuse was taking place. Everyone knew Savile was a paedo but nothing was ever done.

“Cyril Smith was photographed going into one of the properties with a high-profile film director.

“All of the others were pictured and were going to be arrested before the plug was pulled. I was sickened and to this day I wonder how many children we could have saved if we had been allowed to arrest those men.

“I feel guilty they weren’t arrested but there was nothing I could do at the time as the evidence had gone.”



The Sunday Mirror knows the identity of the paedophiles in the gang but has chosen not to name them.

In 1993 Detective Superintendent Ed Williams tried to track down the Orchid file on Cooke to see if there were any similarities with the abduction and murder of nine-year-old Daniel Handley, but he struggled to find the folder.

He eventually found it in the basement of Arbour Square Police Station in Stepney, East London.

While there were references to a “wider paedophile ring” there were no photographs or names.

Mr Williams said: “I was very upset about the way the Met treated paedophile cases but I was a voice in the wilderness at that time and people thought I was being over-emotional.

“I found the Orchid files where they had been put for storage purposes and somebody had completely forget to send it back to the Yard. I was trying to look for paedophiles and connections with other cases as I was trying to build up a profile of the offender.

“The report spoke about boys being passed around from paedophile to paedophile.

“There were no pictures on the file. It did mention that there was a wider ring of individuals but did not mention Jimmy Savile or a cabinet minister.”

Sidney Cooke, along with three accomplices – Leslie Bailey, Robert Oliver and Steven Barrell – was found guilty of the manslaughter of Jason Swift in May 1989. They have been linked to up to 20 murders.

Cooke was believed to have murdered seven-year-old Mark Tildesley but the Crown Prosecution Service decided not to bring charges as he was already serving 19 years for Jason’s death.

He was released in 1998, to a public outcry, but was rearrested the following year for systematically abusing two boys in the 1970s and jailed for life.

Savile was exposed last year as one of the UK’s most prolific paedophiles, with 450 victims. Police said he “groomed a ­nation” by avoiding justice while ­abusing hundreds of children over 54 years.

Officers on Operation Yewtree, which investigated the claims, have also ­arrested celebrities including Gary Glitter, comedian Freddie Starr, DJ Dave Lee Travis, publicist Max Clifford and comedian Jim Davidson. All have denied any wrongdoing and not all the allegations involve under-16s.

Scotland Yard said they would not comment on an on-going investigation.

Visit the Exaro website for more on this story.

[hava007]

dear semper, can you plz explain to those not familiar with the UK, who/what this is about ? (the politician, how is he connected to savile, what's the implications).
obliged

[Col. Quisp]

Conniption: That blog post reads like fiction to me.

That may indeed be true. In that case.

The trouble is that it is becoming increasingly clear that there are many who, given the opportunity to speak wouldn't be making it up. Im all for skeptics and that. But you do have to wonder.

Nor that where it all leads is being continuously smothered by a very small few.

http://hat4uk.wordpress.com/2013/02/03/ ... d-cameron/

It seems, from the comments that increasing numbers are understanding this.

Oh, I believe the stories for the most part. But that one in particular seemed written as either disinfo, or an attempt to exploit the whole situation and perhaps feed off the energy of people who read that story/blogpost. It was very "over the top" but of course, so is the abuse. It is possible the blogger is being honest. I just don't know. There are always those who crave the limelight and will make up stuff to be in it, no matter how sordid.

[slimmouse]

Conniption: That blog post reads like fiction to me.

That may indeed be true. In that case.

The trouble is that it is becoming increasingly clear that there are many who, given the opportunity to speak wouldn't be making it up. Im all for skeptics and that. But you do have to wonder.

Nor that where it all leads is being continuously smothered by a very small few.

http://hat4uk.wordpress.com/2013/02/03/ ... d-cameron/

It seems, from the comments that increasing numbers are understanding this.

Oh, I believe the stories for the most part. But that one in particular seemed written as either disinfo, or an attempt to exploit the whole situation and perhaps feed off the energy of people who read that story/blogpost. It was very "over the top" but of course, so is the abuse. It is possible the blogger is being honest. I just don't know. There are always those who crave the limelight and will make up stuff to be in it, no matter how sordid.

I know what youre saying in some respects. But for every BS merchant, how many countless tens of thousands are shamed or have been intimidated into silence. How would what they experienced be any different? In many cases, I have little doubt this kind of story might be less harrowing.

The anecdotal evidence that those elites in power will abuse individuals for any number of reasons, is further borne out, not least, by their mindset.

Sociopathic sicko's who's mentality essentially precludes empathy, as evidenced by a glance at the world we live in today. This is where, courtesy of their decisions, the kind of children they are doing what they will with are being blown up, dispossessed, orphaned and stripped of all possessions, along with many of their normal emotions.

It's pretty clear to me that beyond the likes of Jimmy Saville is a doorway to the real cesspit.

[AhabsOtherLeg]

We can reveal that the former minister is suspected of being part of a VIP ­paedophile ring that was regularly handed boys by child rapist and killer Sidney Cooke for vile sex orgies.
....
A former detective who worked on the original investigation into Cooke told the Sunday Mirror that the minister was among those alleged to have been ­photographed in a 1986 police surveillance on premises where boys had been dropped off.

Others allegedly included Jimmy Savile, MP Cyril Smith and top judges – though none of them were ever arrested.

Cooke, 85 – dubbed Britain’s most notorious paedophile after he tortured and killed 14-year-old Jason Swift in 1985 – would pick the unsuspecting teenage boys up off the streets around Kings Cross.

He would drive them to locations across North London where paedophiles lay in wait to repeatedly rape them.

Interestingly, Cooke and his gang used what could be called "intelligence" techniques to communicate with each other and coordinate their activities across the country. Dead letter drops, messages hidden inside hollow bricks in the walls of alleyways, etc. He was very much the mastermind and the man in control, his accomplices were unstable - one of them was close to being an idiot - but Cooke himself was described by one policeman as: "mentally, the toughest individual I have ever known."

Btw Semper, your work on this thread has been fantastic. Hope you're still around from time to time.

EDIT: I'd still like to find out if the paedophile Gary Cooke, who gave evidence to the Waterhouse inquiry (he admitted organising child abuse parties attended by wealthy and powerful people, who's names were not allowed to be mentioned or released due to the inquiry's restrictive remit) was or is directly related to Sidney Cooke. It would be another strong link between the abuse in London and that in North Wales.

[AhabsOtherLeg]

Just want to add a few (not particularly interesting) things to this excellent post by Semper Occultus.

The show-business/pop links are everything …..

“As well as boys there were East End orgies and sex shows involving criminals. One account described Boothby lying under a glass-topped table while boys were made to defecate above him."

I saw a documentary once, I don't think it was specifically about the group Slade, but Noddy Holder was in it, and he told a story about the band's time in Germany when they were just starting out. Apparently a rich German man used to pay Noddy to perform exactly the same service as that described above, and he was prepared to do it for the money. "50 deutchmarks
a turd," he laughed (the price might be off, I can't remember what the exchange rate was at that time).

Lord Boothby – Conservative politician - linked to paedophile London gangsters the Kray Twins

This is a useful documentary on all the goings on at Cedra Court, which appears to have been the Elm Guesthouse of it's day. Explains the relationship between Ronnie Kray and Lord Boothby (and Tom Driberg, who was also likely an Mi5/KGB double agent) - how the gangster supplied the Lord with "young men" and so forth.

It also details how Cecil King (owner of the Mirror newspaper and Mi5 asset), the press, the Tories, and Labour, all conspired together to cover up the scandal after the Sunday Mirror got hold of the story. It doesn't mention children as such, just teenaged boys, but the implications are clear, and of course the whole thing was illegal at the time. There's no question that the boys were being exploited anyway, and there is good reason to believe younger boys were abused by this crowd.

Skip to 4mins 20 for the meat of it:



Like you say, it's all being going on a long time, both the crimes and the coordinated cover-ups.

The Wheel of Fortune

By T Stokes on September 6, 2011
....
Under threat of exposure Heath was forced to enter Britain into the Common Market, now the European Union, under very unfavourable conditions. It is still a bone of contention among scholars how he became PM in front of the immensely popular and scholarly Enoch Powell who to all intents and purposes should have been Prime Minister.

Hahaha, who is this T Stokes fella? At least I don't have to wonder which end of the political spectrum he's on.

[AhabsOtherLeg]

UK RI folk, what's the skinny on this group? They mention NLP as mind control used on victims so they don't remember being abused.

I agree with Semper on this, they are a bit of a populist "UKIPpy" bunch, and have some kind of vague agenda that goes beyond child protection or truthseeking, though it's hard to say exactly what it might be. If forced, I'd have to say UK Column, Gerrish, and his mate Bill Maloney are "not wholly reliable", in my honest opinion. I feel bad saying that, because as he says he was a care home resident and suffered abuse himself.

Maloney made a documentary about the Haut de la Garenne scandal (it's on Youtube) called Sun, Sea, and Satan, and unfortunately, in my view, it is... not good. Worth watching though, I suppose. Trigger warning, obviously. Language warning too, as he's not exactly a diplomat.

What happened in Jersey needs to be exposed, needs to be put in front of the public, and a powerful and well-made documentary would be a perfect vehicle to do that, so fair play to him for trying, but I don't see Maloney as being the man for the job. He spends an inordinate amount of the film obsessing about a bit of garden furniture. Maybe he does good work in other ways. I don't know.

[semper occultus]

...thanks Ahab & good to see you back contributing , surely as the poet said...

Whyles, on the strong-wing'd tempest flyin,
Tirlin' the kirks;
Whyles, in the human bosom pryin,
Unseen thou lurks.

...er yes, sorry about the "T Stokes" quote - seems to be a palm-reader actually & posts an absolute shit-load of interesting gossip amongst some swivel-eyed nastiness - prob. well dosed with informational horse-meat & best left to red ice creations & the aangirfan blog ..... for that I''ll let you off the mental-image you've now left me with of Noddy Holder - ( talking of shit-loads ) seems worse when you can put a face to the act...wonder if the beatles got involved in anything to pay the rent when in Hamburg..certainly the right place for it..

...was reading a Sunday tabloid interview with one of the kids from Richmond Council care home who ended up in Elm Guest House as chicken on the menu along with his younger brother ...realised I actually went to school with him - not just same school but same class...his younger brother committed suicide apparently & he was close to 2 other kids there who I knew going back to primary school who I saw years later on Friends Reunited ( yes it was that long ago ) had subsequently both committed suicide...

[hava007]

side note on the suicides of victims of pedo crimes...really upsetting, but quite understandable . At least I would want those people who chose this avenue to make their death count, not just make it easy for the perp.

...thanks Ahab & good to see you back contributing , surely as the poet said...

Whyles, on the strong-wing'd tempest flyin,
Tirlin' the kirks;
Whyles, in the human bosom pryin,
Unseen thou lurks.

...er yes, sorry about the "T Stokes" quote - seems to be a palm-reader actually & posts an absolute shit-load of interesting gossip amongst some swivel-eyed nastiness - prob. well dosed with informational horse-meat & best left to red ice creations & the aangirfan blog ..... for that I''ll let you off the mental-image you've now left me with of Noddy Holder - ( talking of shit-loads ) seems worse when you can put a face to the act...wonder if the beatles got involved in anything to pay the rent when in Hamburg..certainly the right place for it..

...was reading a Sunday tabloid interview with one of the kids from Richmond Council care home who ended up in Elm Guest House as chicken on the menu along with his younger brother ...realised I actually went to school with him - not just same school but same class...his younger brother committed suicide apparently & he was close to 2 other kids there who I knew going back to primary school who I saw years later on Friends Reunited ( yes it was that long ago ) had subsequently both committed suicide...

[AhabsOtherLeg]

...was reading a Sunday tabloid interview with one of the kids from Richmond Council care home who ended up in Elm Guest House as chicken on the menu along with his younger brother ...realised I actually went to school with him - not just same school but same class...his younger brother committed suicide apparently & he was close to 2 other kids there who I knew going back to primary school who I saw years later on Friends Reunited ( yes it was that long ago ) had subsequently both committed suicide...

I'm sorry to hear that Semper, it really brings it home if you know someone who has been personally involved in these events, or if you have been personally victimized like some of the other posters here. If my posts sometimes come across as heartless, or at least tactless, I apologize - it is because I have no personal experience of these kind of crimes, and in a way I have no real stake in any of it (except that I abhor child abuse obviously, and have a wider concern about the corruption of the justice system and the potential for subversion of the democratic process).

Aye, the democratic process. I still half-believe in it. I'm old-fashioned like that.

My interest (and I suppose we all have to explain why we have an interest in these cases at some point) stems from the fact that my uncle was sent to a List D school as a youngster, which was run by a Catholic brotherhood (I won't name them, though I will say that it wasn't the Christian Brothers). He was a minor thief and tearaway when he went in, but he came out a full-blown psychopath, perhaps the only real psychopath I have known in my life.

The family were astounded by the changes in him when he came home, but everybody put his subsequent acts down to him being just "a bad bastard", and he was known as nothing more than that for decades. Eventually the "reformatory" he had been sent to was revealed as having been a hotbed of physical, sexual, and psychological abuse at the time of his incarceration there. The abuse had been carried out, routinely, by the well-respected monks who ran the place - and (then as now) there had been plenty of evidence available to anyone who dared look for it, and many complaints were made by inmates, but nothing was done and no one wanted to know.

The number of (barely investigated) suicides which occur in the aftermath of all these "historic" abuse cases is to me the real heart of the crime - even though I believe that most of them were and are suicides.

...er yes, sorry about the "T Stokes" quote - seems to be a palm-reader actually & posts an absolute shit-load of interesting gossip amongst some swivel-eyed nastiness

No need to apologise, I'm sure we've both been wading through all the same stuff. It's unavoidable really. You kind of put a disclaimer into the post anyway. Hopefully anyone researching these cases will know that it's a minefield already, and many of the mines were laid by previous researchers, whether they were well-intentioned (like Simon Regan and Angus Young) or otherwise.

[AhabsOtherLeg]

...thanks Ahab & good to see you back contributing , surely as the poet said...

Whyles, on the strong-wing'd tempest flyin,
Tirlin' the kirks;
Whyles, in the human bosom pryin,
Unseen thou lurks.

You left out the best bit.

When masons' mystic word an' grip
In storms an' tempests raise you up,
Some cock or cat your rage maun stop,
Or, strange to tell!
The youngest brither ye wad whip
Aff straught to hell.

Speaking of which, for what I see as a more reliable version of UK Column (and by more reliable, I probably just mean better produced) Rebecca Television have put up some highly disturbing documentaries on these subjects, though they have an agenda too, mainly concentrating on the Masonic angle.

I can't vouch for them or anything, but they are certainly more professional than UK Column, and have actually done some original research, and succeeded in tracking down interview footage that was cut (on Waterhouse's orders) from the HTV documentary about Bryn Alyn that I posted earlier in the thread. Viewer discretion is (as always) advised though. This one, in three parts, is about the Waterhouse Inquiry and it's various failings:



This one is about another possible cover-up of child abuse in North Wales, connected to (or facilitated by) a Freemasonic network within the police force there:



I realise, again, that anyone who has been looking into these events in the UK will already have seen these documentaries, or might have done, but I'm mainly posting them here for the convenience of those who bide in foreign fields.

Another decent source of information is the Exaro News website: http://www.exaronews.com/

Exaro are a bunch of professional journalist mainly made up of old Murdoch hacks, but now that they are free from the old man's influence they are publishing stories that no doubt would have been buried by the editors in their old Sun and NOTW days. They mostly concentrate on the Elm Guest House angle. There is some decent investigative journalism, hopefully utilising more legal means than they did in their previous employment.

It's a subscription service though, and the mainstream press usually pick up and publish their stories word-for-word a few days later, so it might not be worth signing up. I haven't. But it's worth keeping an eye on.

[AhabsOtherLeg]

....interesting coincidence of the day...someone's decides this loose cannon needs tieing down & brought infor a "little chat" :

www.mirror.co.uk

Plymouth paedophile William Goad dies in prison

Goad's abuse of victims went back to 1965

A Devon paedophile who is believed to have abused up to 3,500 boys has died in prison, the Ministry of Justice (MoJ) has confirmed.

William Goad, 68, from Plymouth died of "natural causes" overnight at HMP Albany, on the Isle of Wight.

The MoJ said: "As with all deaths in custody, the independent Prisons and Probation Ombudsman will conduct an investigation."...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-20014945
20 October 2012 Last updated at 18:41

Check this, from 2000, the "execution" of an assosciate of the Sidney Cooke gang. The contract was suspected to have been taken out by East End gangsters (like the Krays? Maybe not) who had also put contracts on every other member of Cooke's crew.

Paedophile gang terrified as fellow abuser is killed

Tony Thompson, Crime Correspondent
The Observer, Sunday 20 February 2000

Four men belonging to the most reviled gang of child molesters in Britain were last night in fear of their lives after a second of their number was slain in an apparent revenge killing.

Sidney Cooke, Robert Oliver and Stephen Barrell, believed to have murdered up to 20 young boys, and their friend, Brian 'Chickenmaster' Turner, a former scoutmaster convicted of abusing dozens of boys, fear their names are on a hit list drawn up by East End gangsters sympathetic to the victims' families.

All four are known to have associated with Bill Malcolm, who was shot through the head with a single bullet when he answered the door at his home in Forest Gate, east London, last Thursday night. The killing bore the hallmarks of a professional hit and two white males were seen running away. Malcolm, 46, died on the way to hospital.

The four men, along with Malcolm, were also closely associated with Leslie 'Catweazle' Bailey, the man convicted alongside Cooke, Oliver and Barrell of the murder of 14-year-old Jason Swift. Each of the men had paid £5 to have sex with Jason in a filthy flat in Hackney in 1984, but he died when the orgy went wrong.

Bailey was found dead in his cell in Whitemoor prison in 1993. At first he was thought to have taken his own life, but a post-mortem examination showed he had been strangled. Two prisoners, Michael Cain and John Brookes, were convicted of his murder. They are believed to have acted in a bid to avenge Bailey's victims.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2000/feb/2 ... heobserver

More at link.

I can see the possibility of gangsters taking hits out on such people as a way of currying public favour, or simply through some neanderthal sense of criminal honour - "Yeah, so maybe I break a junkie's legs from time to time because he's owing a fiver - but at least I've murdered a nonce! They can;t take that away from me!"

That kind of attitude.

It's rumoured that anyone who kills Cooke or a member of his gang in jail won't have any trouble sourcing heroin (or paying for it) from that point onwards...

But who knows? It's possible that some people, including some gangsters, might have better reasons than their own crypto-morality to get rid of these guys.

Warwick Spinks is exceptional though. It seems nothing bad ever happens to that bastard. When he's caught he's rarely charged. When he's charged he's rarely convicted. When he's convicted he never seems to stay in jail, where he belongs. Anyone who's read "The Paedophocracy" or Nick Davies' series of articles from 1997 will know about this guy and what he admits to being involved in - maybe this time he will actually be punished for it.

[conniption]

the guardian


Police question officers in Jimmy Savile's 'breakfast club'

West Yorkshire police to quiz officers who attended Friday gatherings at disgraced BBC presenter's penthouse in Leeds

The Guardian, Thursday 28 February 2013

Jimmy Savile in his Leeds penthouse, where the 'Friday Morning Breakfast Club' was held every week for about 20 years. Photograph: Gary Calton for the Observer

Serving police officers who took part in disgraced BBC presenter Jimmy Savile's "breakfast club" meetings at his home are to be quizzed by West Yorkshire police, the force has confirmed.

Police said on Thursday they had "identified some individuals who were in the so-called Friday Morning Breakfast Club", a weekly gathering of the late Top of the Pops host's friends at his Leeds penthouse.

In October, West Yorkshire police said they had no information about officers attending the gathering but that they were free to do what they wished when off duty.

However, a force spokesman said police did attend, and while there was no evidence of any wrongdoing by the officers – some of whom are still serving – they were being questioned to find out more about the meetings.

The spokesman added: "Local officers working in the community were invited by Savile to his home for a coffee. At that time the force was encouraging community officers to interact more with residents in their area. The officers usually visited on a Friday. It was usual for other friends of Savile to be present, drinking coffee and chatting.

"They have explained their attendance and we reiterate that there has been no evidence forthcoming of any wrongdoing by any West Yorkshire police employee, past or current.

"However we are now carrying out further inquiries to obtain a better understanding of the circumstances surrounding the contact between West Yorkshire police officers and Savile at the so-called Friday Morning Breakfast Club."

The meetings are believed to have run for around 20 years at Savile's penthouse, which recently sold for £75,000 below the £325,000 asking price.

[cptmarginal]

The meetings are believed to have run for around 20 years at Savile's penthouse, which recently sold for £75,000 below the £325,000 asking price.

That reminds me...

Top Of The Lots: The maddest items from today's auction of Sir Jimmy Savile's possessions

One last Fixit from the jingle-jangle king... you could be wearing his remarkable gear!