Alien Abductions and the Monarch Project

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Postby Joe Hillshoist » Sun Mar 18, 2007 6:15 am

had a quick glance at that last site.

I dunno how much the author really understands about primative religions, but here are a few criticisms. Based mostly on Australian indigenous culture and a little on indigenous phillipino culture.

Do not kill your totem animal.

In cultures where totem animals are shared through some members the society, the taboo on killing the totem animal has a food proitection function.

IE If one fifth of the population has a totem of a certain kangaroo, that means one fifth of the population don't consume that animal. It reduces the pressure on the animal from hunting, and lowers the chances of over hunting and destroying the animal as a viable food source for the rest of the population. If the people who belong to that totem have some control over the rituals associated with it they bear some responsibility for the species' well being. That means they can call a taboo on any hunting of the animal if its numbers drop too low. Thus food sources are protected.

Totems can change over a lifetime, as can the taboo on eating totemic animals.

Ceremony and ritual

Any western academic interpretation of ceremony is inherently flawed IMO, because it discounts the reality of magic and ritual. By ignoring the fact that these processes may work they become something to be criticised and patronised.

Dreamtime

Does he the author understand the relationship to the dreamtime. The word Dreamtime is actually a mistranslation of Altjeringa, a Arrente word with a root meaning closer to "Eternity" than to dream as we in the west understand it.

Beyond that its pretty hard to make specific comparisons cos of the differences of cultures.

What do they think about Creation? The world is considered to have been created. There is supposedly a sky god but he has no part in the lives of men. The totemic ancestors walked the earth in a period known as the dream time


this is crap frankly.

Creation occurs continuosly by following songs and ceremonies dictated by tribal law. the ceremonies occur in sacred places and the people performing them enter a world where the dreamtime and this world meet.

There they invoke the creation spirits or sky beings, who have an ancestral and totemic relationship as well. And enact (or renact tho in the dreamtime there is only one monent that runs paralell to linear time) creation.

the idea behind this is that all members of the culture are involved.

Each have a role in their specific ceremonies.

IE Everyone is a priest and priestess for specific situations.

Thats why the these religions could not be written down codified and controlled. they relied on a direct relationship between place and the people who had an ancestral connection to that place.

I guess that is the major difference between tribal religions that I have come across, and modern religions.

They were more democratic in some ways. Although there was a tradition of initiation and some people held power in some areas, no one person or group held all the power or the monopoly on interpretation of and connection with "the divine".

Probably didn't solve all the typical problems of human culture tho.
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Postby Avalon » Sun Mar 18, 2007 7:43 am

Dreams End wrote:I happen to think Whitley Strieber is a victim...in fact, I know a lot more about him than about OSR. But that doesn't mean I won't protest his "love your abuser" message, or his former practice of bringing truth seekers to his cabin so they could be raped by "aliens" while he provides "reassurance." (Did people know he did this...creepiest thing ever.)
this time.


Dreams End, how do you assess Anne Strieber's part in all this?
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Postby Avalon » Sun Mar 18, 2007 7:45 am

Dreams End wrote:I happen to think Whitley Strieber is a victim...in fact, I know a lot more about him than about OSR. But that doesn't mean I won't protest his "love your abuser" message, or his former practice of bringing truth seekers to his cabin so they could be raped by "aliens" while he provides "reassurance." (Did people know he did this...creepiest thing ever.)
this time.


Dreams End, how do you assess Anne Strieber's part in all this?
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Postby Dreams End » Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:27 am

Anne Strieber? Well, if Whitley Strieber is hoaxing all of it, then she's in on it. No other option.

But under all this bizarreness there's this weird internal consistency. For example, if it were a hoax then I think in Communion she would have either been given a more direct witness role or would have been left out. Instead, she has memories of knowing that Strieber "gets up" in the night but she knows instinctively or via suggestion that she is not to follow. That makes the "evidence" weaker and so, in my view, makes the story seem more authentic. Why not, if he's making this stuff up, just write that she saw a bright light and then lost consciousness? Or have her be a full witness or participant in these events?

I actually managed to track down a witness to a small part of Communion. She and her husband were at the cabin but her account differs from Strieber's in one way. The night after the events she and her husband recalled nothing unusual but when he called them up three months later after his own hypnotic regressions and asked (without prompting with any leading questions) they both remembered odd details they hadn't remembered that night. She found that odd. Why would she not have remembered the events the next day?

That's the sort of thing that makes me believe there's an underlying reality here.

Now, as for Freemasons. Jeez. One thing to remember is that like the Jews and communists, Freemasons have often been blamed anytime opposition to the ruling elites came along. Everyone, so it goes, is actually perfectly happy till these outside agitators come in and stir things up.

That said, I can't seem to extricate myself from explanations that don't at least in part involve Freemasonry. Here's an example. The original "Round Table" started by Puharich had Henry Wallace, former vice president, as a supporter. Wallace was a Christian but also into mystical Freemasonry and got in some hot water for writing letters to Nicholas Roerich and calling him "guru."

Wallace also had a dream to "Christianize" China. AT about that time, Edgar Cayce, who was far more knowledgeable about Western hermetic lore than popular accounts would let on, started having "visions" of a Christian China. Meanwhile, he too was big on Freemasonry.

So fast forward to the seventies and you have SRI's Changing Images of man which sets up Freemasonry as the best example of what this "new religion" needs to look like.

The question becomes, are those guys latching onto this already existing stream because it suits their purposes or is a big part of the agenda to continue this longrunning "project"? While I am going with the former hypothesis for now, since there's simply so much distortion and mythologizing going on that I'm trying to get underneath, I keep running into some pretty convincing evidence that, although this stuff is currently a tool of our national security state, it certainly had a history well before the onset of the national security state. It's almost trivially easy to track it back to Nazi times and really to the turn of the previous century.

But it gets murky after that because any esoteric group you could name will trace its lineage back into the mists of time, so to speak, whether or not that lineage is real.

So, the templars existed. We know that. They got shut down. We know that too. Some claim they went underground...that seems sketchier to me. And while gatherings of literal stone mason guilds certainly track back to not long after this, it wasn't until...what, the 17th century?...that people began participating in Masonry for esoteric reasons. At least as far as I can see from the historical records.

The fact that Freemasonry borrows from Egyptian lore does not mean it is therefore part of some continuous lineage. But, to be honest, there's really not that huge of a gap between the Templars and the rise of the Freemasons in recorded history. So it's certainly conceivable to me that whatever the Templars were up may have continued underground. It's just that I don't take that as a given.

To add to this, there are other twists which may come into this. There's been a Freemason/Catholic battle, I think, for hundreds of years. This is why some like Daniel Brandt have speculated that Lyndon Larouche may, in part, be supported by the Vatican. Anti-Masonic, anti-Anglican, etc.

Whether this is an extension of the battle against the Templars or arose due to the independent threat the church saw Freemasonry to be, that doesn't mean that one side is the "good guys" necessarily.

But it does mean a lot of "psychological warfare" and disinformation over centuries.

But I think there's another interesting phenomenon that I don't know that anyone is tracking, and that is the deliberate attempt to influence Catholicism (as well as other brands of Christianity) in the esoteric direction. Think Dan Brown, of course. But did you all know that Strieber, when not shilling for the Cosmic Mafia, along with his buddy Ed Conroy who wrote "Report on Communion" are into the whole Jesus married Mary Magdalene and the bloodline survived business? And bringing the alien theme into Catholicism and Christianity is also a part of that. If someone ever writes a biography of Danny Sheehan, I think that this effort will be pretty apparent.

Meanwhile, before Strieber started having his abduction experiences at the cabin, he'd been part of the "Gurdjieff foundation." He says, somewhat cryptically, that this is a private group and NOT the group that uses that name publicly. Well, Gurdjieff is in that same tradition of Freemasonry and other Western occultism mixed in with arcana from Egypt and also things like Sufism.

The basic idea is that there is a continuous line of "secret" adepts shaping history...in this case they are "good guys" not plotting Jews. This was Gurdjieff's contention. This puts Strieber's "Secret School" experiences into a different light. In fact, the woman who ran the "astronomy club" that is so linked to those experiences, seems to have been into this sort of thing...Rosicrucianism or Theosophy or something along those lines (I'd love to look at her letters which are preserved in a Texas library.) He speculates openly in Secret School that maybe she, (Arlene Carter, former poet Laureate of Texas) was actually the "alien nun" of his experiences and similarities in description support this idea.

And Strieber mentions the somewhat disturbing fact that when he'd been in this secret Gurdjieff foundation he had been "working" with young people. I.e. maybe he, too, was running a "secret school."

So, are various elites in a longrunning conspiracy to take over the world? Well, they are elites..they already run the world. But they are elites and elites like to feel...well elite. Therefore, any spirituality that suggests that the world is run (and by extension, SHOULD be run) by an elite core of spiritual adepts who, either by membership in a "spiritual brotherhood" or by access to "spiritual technology", is going to be a preferred religion to one that suggests we are all equal in God's eyes. And I think that is why you have all these longrunning occult undercurrents which seem to always be just below the surface of "mainstream history."

With that interpretation, in some ways at least, it doesn't really matter that much whether there really is one longrunning elite occult underground or whether elites at various times have developed esoteric beliefs which borrow from and claim continuity with former belief systems. Meanwhile, the Catholic/Freemasonry battles seem more about WHICH elites get to run the place than about one side championing the rights of the people against the other.
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Postby kristinerosemary » Sun Mar 18, 2007 1:05 pm

alien abductions and mind control topic too
uncomfortable? too potentially stressful and
scary to talk about? let's do go over nice
diversionary ground awhile and talk about
gurdjieff. who was influenced clean pure
and direct by russian orthodox church and the
sufi orders of islam. or maybe he was just
another of madame blavatsky's baboons.
but really, i don't think his ideas can be
diagnosed on an internet chat forum, do
you?
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Postby 11:11 » Sun Mar 18, 2007 2:55 pm

Joe Hillshoist, intersting stuff about the aboriginies. That link could be full of shit, or right on. I don't know. Just stumbled on it. One thing I've noticed when reading anything about ancients (not talking about the aboriginies, here), are the completely different conclusions arrived at. I've reached the point where I think it's impossible to know. That would be to DE, too. You could spend the rest of your life trying to sort through it, and not know the answers.

I became interested in the MK ULTRA abuses from a (modern) human rights perspective. Ultimately, I don't care what the belief systems and motivations are that drive these people, I just want them shut down and put in prison. I don't think understanding their cult roots and beliefs is as important as recognizing that it's there, as a means of identifying them as dangerous.
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Postby slimmouse » Sun Mar 18, 2007 6:14 pm

11:11 wrote:
I became interested in the MK ULTRA abuses from a (modern) human rights perspective. Ultimately, I don't care what the belief systems and motivations are that drive these people, I just want them shut down and put in prison. I don't think understanding their cult roots and beliefs is as important as recognizing that it's there, as a means of identifying them as dangerous.


MK ultra is obviously the spawn of the CIA, and has a lot of Nazi baggage.

The parallels between the Third Reich and its Axis - Germany Japan, and Italy, and the current Fourth Reich - USA, UK and Israel, are as plain as the nose on your face - without even going into the subtext !

I can only assume that is why my previous post was ignored by those 'liberals' in our midst who invoke the brilliant oxymoronic race card faster than you can spit, whilst conveniently ignoring the said obvious.

Has anyone here worked out why yet ? I keep asking these people, but the silence is deafening. But anyone who's been here long enough, will know this already.

The CIA meanwhile are one of the principal agent provocateurs of war in the modern age - with their accomplices Mossad, and their mentors, MI6.

War is the method allowing those who rule the world to continue to rule it.
The proles do the paying, and the proles do the dying, whilst the usual suspects reap the profits. Not that they need the money you understand - hell some of them cant even spend it if they have it. They just want control. And taking the fruits of your labour is to control you. The organised religion scam is another control mechanism

Calculating cold blooded killers, territorial hoarders.......the ultimate Reptillians - except that they are a clearly sophisticated variety of the species. Anyone see those traits in MC perps ????????

But of course, none of this is obvious to certain "intellectuals" on this board. So they pour scorn upon the "Ancient bloodlines" themes , the ties of these brotherhoods to Egypt, The importance of the structure of Freemasonary in all of this - (And yes the Coptic new year does begin on Sept 11th ). They hope that their intended audience are ignorant to these kinda truths.

Bush - Freemason. Cheney - Freemason. Blair - Freemason. Olmert - Freemason. This isnt really rocket science.

Whatever, I guess.

Educate yourselves is my best advice, and ignore the divide and rule/ distraction tactics of these guys.
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Postby philipacentaur » Sun Mar 18, 2007 6:48 pm

Philip A. Centaur - Freemason. Fred Flintstone - Freemason. Slimmouse - Freemason. Mohandas K. Ghandi - Freemason. This isn't really brain surgery -- it's more like creative writing, or rather, something slightly resembling it.

See, anyone can just make up whatever they want! If you're incredulous about unsubstantiated claims prevailing over facts and truth, then something must be wrong with you, or maybe -- you're one of them.

Whatever, indeed. Anything goes! Cast aspersions! Make vague insinuations! Facts are a distraction! David Icke was right!
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Postby slimmouse » Sun Mar 18, 2007 6:54 pm

philipacentaur wrote:Philip A. Centaur - Freemason. Fred Flintstone - Freemason. Slimmouse - Freemason. Mohandas K. Ghandi - Freemason. This isn't really brain surgery -- it's more like creative writing, or rather, something slightly resembling it.

See, anyone can just make up whatever they want! If you're incredulous about unsubstantiated claims prevailing over facts and truth, then something must be wrong with you, or maybe -- you're one of them.

Whatever, indeed. Anything goes! Cast aspersions! Make vague insinuations! Facts are a distraction! David Icke was right!



Which of my facts are unsubstantiated ?
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Postby 11:11 » Sun Mar 18, 2007 10:07 pm

From what I've learned about mind control, I've always thought it was much more complex than Nazi and fascist. When I observe the results of these mass manipulators, I see globalism, and highly centralized power, two things the left has always been in love with. I have always thought the left/right pradigm/matrix to be false, and the rise of the totalitarian globalist NWO bears that out. Fascism and communism eventually meet when you go full circle. All ideologies seem to be represented, here, yet it's the leftist that is ignored, just as Stalin's and Mao's killings are glossed over, while the holocaust is remembered. I also have observed this with the left being the biggest supporters of the Bush/Fox agenda, an irony that seems to escape BushCo's supposed critics. Anyway, I ran across the following which delves into the Marxist connections of the mindfuckers. Turns out it's from EIR, which I know DE will not approve of as a reliable source, though I have found their writings to be interesting. As one who worked for several Democrats, I know it's not PC to refer to LaRouche, but then I don't like the left's mc any more than the right's.

From Cybernetics to Littleton -- Techniques in Mind Control

http://american_almanac.tripod.com/steinb.htm
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Postby kristinerosemary » Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:33 pm

slimmouse wrote:Divide and Rule. Bait and switch. Muddy the waters.

[...]

Meanwhile, the New Fourth Reich marches on, older and wiser from Adolfs earlier escapades.

[...]

What has this got to do with MC ?

Well, of course, anyone worth their salt would know that the MC programmes developed by the CIA/NSA find many of their roots in the work of the Third Reich in Nazi Germany.

Im sure Prof Pan, DE and Philip might back me up on such assertions ?

Or perhaps they arent familiar with Project Paperclip ?


Anyone else see the new fourth reich yet ?


certainly mouse, and paperclip origins, third reich influences,
seem to be fairly well documented.
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no good guys

Postby kristinerosemary » Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:38 pm

11:11 wrote: ...but then I don't like the left's mc any more than the right's.


exactly.
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Postby Dreams End » Mon Mar 19, 2007 1:48 am

Larouche PRACTICES mind control.

you know what...

nevermind.
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Postby 11:11 » Mon Mar 19, 2007 2:38 am

DE, say what you think! There's a lot about La Rouche that I don't like, though I am no expert on him. I'm not a socialist, for one, and he is. I know he's been accused of mind control, too. How about the link I posted - do you find anything of value in that?
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Postby Dreams End » Mon Mar 19, 2007 2:55 am

Here.

http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board/v ... php?t=1361

None of this gets into the actual mind control practices. But it gives you a sense of his politics.
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