It is getting popular to think that autism is possibly- of at least in part- of an environmental origin. You suggested such yourself. Can you deny that medicine is one of the absolute mitigated "environments"? I insist that it is. So is diet. If you disagree, please explain. c2w?, I find it curious that you know very little about Offit, while you continue to be so interested in Deers work (laudatory) and in Wakefield's also (critical, derisive). Are you in the located in the UK? Offit is so much more of a high profile figure here than Wakefield, except for his role as public whipping-boy (admittedly, sometimes the whipping boy is guilty).
This scandal does not exist in an ideological or contextual vacuum, as I'm sure you know. I can't help but to feel that you are treating it in such a manner. We are not a court of law, where it is expected that we act in such a manner as to foster reductionism, at least at the judge's insistence. Reductionism, in a manner of speaking, is what evidence based, universal allopathic medicine is all about. Isolate and treat the parts of the person first. It all to often ends there, and sometimes tragically.
It is patently obvious to me that Wakefield would not have had to falsify his data to indicate an association between severe ASD and GI disturbances. They are there. Whether they were in the 8 of 12 clients in his disputed study is of significance. So if he did, why? To cut corners, to corner a market? I admit I have not looked into a your reference(s) as to how much Wakefield SAID he was paid and how much he was INDICATED to have gotten paid. If this were absolutely verifiable it would be damning to his character. Would it put his data at risk? I suppose it would. Would it have set back the cause of ascertaining how to treat the physiological symptoms of autism? Certainly. Would it have discounted or disproven the research that others are doing that corroborates with Wakefield's? Probably in the media's mind, but the numerous families that saw post MMR regressive symptoms and the remission of at least some of those symptoms with GI intervention will most likely not be swayed. Would you expect them to be?
If Wakefield recants his work, then I would be patently able to mollify my opinion. If Deer did the same, perhaps you would be able to modify yours. Short of that I don't foresee either of us changing our views about this anytime soon, certainly not based on the arguments we are presentin here to each other. I have no interest in being judge and/or jury in this matter. My role as an informed citizen is anything but complete, but my role as an effective caretaker and successful health care professional need even more nurturing right now.
Why would I want to bother bashing a Dr. who has (said he) found an associative, possible cause to this epidemic, while that association fits in with my already conceived notions of illness. A huge portion of our nerve endings and our immune system exist in our GI tract. When we have an emotional or psychiatric disorder, our GI tract is affected and very likely compromised. I know this from personal experience, I know this from first hand observation of clients, family and friends. Much specific and valuable research is done in this field. You do not have to consider this point at all if you don't want to. Many people are unable to imagine a connection, medically, even if there bowels or lymph nodes are disrupted when they are depressed, stressed or angry. So perhaps the next thread I start- or the existing one I get back to- can deal with what I am learning and what I already know about this issue on an endocrine and metabolic level. Perhaps you've looked at it?
Very nice that we have been given this opportunity to have this debate pretty much uninterrupted and uncommented-upon by other posters. I only read a handful of threads, even less while involved in one like this. Is this common? It speaks volumes to our tenacity here, and perhaps to the reserve and patience of others. Reserve and patience are not always (hardly ever?) prevalent virtues on threads anywhere, especially on what could be elsewhere a VERY HOTLY CONTENDED issue. Still, I can't help but to ask... "what does anyone else here think?" I certainly have not been posting these items strictly for your (c2w?'s) eyes only, but I do appreciate (that RIer's) your willingness to look at them.
Alwyn I did up this post, double checked the thread activity and saw your recent. there is no other thread on Offit. perhaps there should be if c2w? does not want to approach it here (or at all, for now). But I contend he is a major player in the thread's intent as it was titled, and in the whole MMR story as it plays out. What to do, what to do?
