Nuclear Meltdown Watch

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Re: Nuclear Meltdown Watch

Postby eyeno » Mon Mar 21, 2011 12:55 am

I missed who he quoted but shep on fox just said that some official said that if they don't get it under control in two days the official said it would be an "apocalypse". If I could figure out who said that there may be some news ferreted out of that.

I'm no fox news fan but shep does seem maybe the most human among em. He gave em hell about the katrina deal. His emotions are hard for him to hide and he is often an open book. Right now he seems really upset or maybe he is just tired. Some of the nuances in how and what he says don't speak well for what may be coming.
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Re: Nuclear Meltdown Watch

Postby seemslikeadream » Mon Mar 21, 2011 5:05 am

Workers evacuated from Japan nuclear complex after gray smoke rises from reactor
Death toll rises above 18,000 in Japan's triple disaster; smoke rises from reactor No. 3, among the most badly damaged at the six-reactor complex.

By The Associated Press

A spokesman at the Fukushima nuclear plant said Monday that workers have been evacuated from Japan's tsunami-stricken nuclear complex after gray smoke was seen rising from one of its reactors.

Tokyo Electric Power Co. spokesman Hiroshi Aizawa said the company was investigating after the smoke was seen rising from the spent fuel storage pool of Unit 3.


Plant officials have been battling to cool reactors and spent fuel pools to bring the radiation-leaking plant under control after it was damaged in the massive March 11 earthquake and tsunami that devastated northeast Japan.

The toll of Japan's triple disaster came into clearer focus Monday after police estimates showed more than 18,000 people died, the World Bank said rebuilding may cost $235 billion and more cases of radiation-tainted vegetables and tap water turned up.


A helicopter flies past Japan's Fukushima Daiichi Number 1 Nuclear reactor, March 12, 2011.

Photo by: Reuters
The announcement by Japan's Health Ministry late Sunday that tests had detected excess amounts of radioactive elements on canola and chrysanthemum greens marked a low moment in a day that had been peppered with bits of positive news: First, a teenager and his grandmother were found alive nine days after being trapped in their earthquake-shattered home. Then, the operator of the overheated nuclear plant said two of the six reactor units were safely cooled down.

"We consider that now we have come to a situation where we are very close to getting the situation under control," Deputy Cabinet Secretary Tetsuro Fukuyama said.

Still, serious problems remained at the Fukushima Dai-ichi nuclear complex. Pressure unexpectedly rose in a third unit's reactor, meaning plant operators may need to deliberately release radioactive steam. That has only added to public anxiety over radiation that began leaking from the plant after a monstrous earthquake and tsunami devastated northeastern Japan on March 11 and left the plant unstable. As day broke Monday, Japan's military resumed dousing of the complex's troubled Unit 4.

The World Bank said in report Monday that Japan may need five years to rebuild from the catastrophic disasters, which caused up to $235 billion in damage, saying the cost to private insurers will be up to $33 billion and that the government will spend $12 billion on reconstruction in the current national budget and much more later.

The safety of food and water was of particular concern. The government halted shipments of spinach from one area and raw milk from another near the nuclear plant after tests found iodine exceeded safety limits. Tokyo's tap water, where iodine turned up Friday, now has cesium. Rain and dust are also tainted.

Early Monday , the Health Ministry advised Iitate, a village of 6,000 people about 30 kilometers (19 miles) northwest of the Fukushima plant, not to drink tap water due to elevated levels of iodine. Ministry spokesman Takayuki Matsuda said iodine three times the normal level was detected there — about one twenty-sixth of the level of a chest X-ray in one liter of water.

In all cases, the government said the radiation levels were too small to pose an immediate health risk.

But Tsugumi Hasegawa was skeptical as she cared for her 4-year-old daughter at a shelter in a gymnasium crammed with 1,400 people about 80 kilometers (50 miles) from the plant.

"I still have no idea what the numbers they are giving about radiation levels mean. It's all so confusing," said Hasegawa, 29, from the small town of Futuba in the shadow of the nuclear complex. "And I wonder if they aren't playing down the dangers to keep us from panicking. I don't know who to trust."

All six of the nuclear complex's reactor units saw trouble after the disasters knocked out cooling systems. In a small advance, the plant's operator declared Units 5 and 6 — the least troublesome — under control after their nuclear fuel storage pools cooled to safe levels. Progress was made to reconnect two other units to the electric grid and in pumping seawater to cool another reactor and replenish it and a sixth reactor's storage pools.

But the buildup in pressure inside the vessel holding Unit 3's reactor presented some danger, forcing officials to consider venting. The tactic produced explosions of radioactive gas during the early days of the crisis.
"Even if certain things go smoothly, there would be twists and turns," Chief Cabinet Secretary Yukio Edano told reporters. "At the moment, we are not so optimistic that there will be a breakthrough."

Growing concerns about radiation add to the overwhelming chain of disasters Japan has struggled with since the 9.0-magnitude quake. The resulting tsunami ravaged the northeastern coast. All told, police estimates show more than about 18,400 died. More than 15,000 deaths are likely in Miyagi, the prefecture that took the full impact of the wave, said a police spokesman.

"It is very distressing as we recover more bodies day by days," said Hitoshi Sugawara, the spokesman.

Police in other parts of the disaster area declined to provide estimates, but confirmed about 3,400 deaths. Nationwide, official figures show the disasters killing more than 8,600 people, and leaving more than 13,200 people missing, but those two lists may have some overlap.

The disasters have displaced another 452,000, who are living in shelters.
Fuel, food and water remain scarce. The government in recent days acknowledged being caught ill-prepared by an enormous disaster that the prime minister has called the worst crisis since World War II.

Bodies are piling up in some of the devastated communities and badly decomposing even amid chilly rain and snow.

"The recent bodies — we can't show them to the families. The faces have been purple, which means they are starting to decompose," says Shuji Horaguchi, a disaster relief official setting up a center to process the dead in Natori, on the outskirts of the tsunami-flattened city of Sendai. "Some we're finding now have been in the water for a long time, they're not in good shape. Crabs and fish have eaten parts."

Contamination of food and water compounds the government's difficulties, heightening the broader public's sense of dread about safety. Consumers in markets snapped up bottled water, shunned spinach from Ibaraki — the prefecture where the tainted spinach was found — and overall expressed concern about food safety.

Experts have said the amounts of iodine detected in milk, spinach and water pose no discernible risks to public health unless consumed in enormous quantities over a long time. Iodine breaks down quickly, after eight days, minimizing its harmfulness, unlike other radioactive isotopes such as cesium-137 or uranium-238, which remain in the environment for decades or longer.

High levels of iodine are linked to thyroid cancer, one of the least deadly cancers if treated. Cesium is a longer-lasting element that affects the whole body and raises cancer risk.

Rain forecast for the Fukushima area also could further localize the contamination, bringing the radiation to the ground closer to the plant.
Edano tried to reassure the public for a second day in a row. "If you eat it once, or twice, or even for several days, it's not just that it's not an immediate threat to health, it's that even in the future it is not a risk," Edano said. "Experts say there is no threat to human health."

No contamination has been reported in Japan's main food export — seafood — worth about $1.6 billion a year and less than 0.3 percent of its total exports.

Amid the anxiety, there were moments of joy on Sunday. An 80-year-old woman and her teenage grandson were rescued from their flattened two-story house after nine days, when the teen pulled himself to the roof and shouted to police for help.

Other survivors enjoyed smaller victories. Kiyoshi Hiratsuka and his family managed to pull his beloved Harley Davidson motorcycle from the rubble in their hometown of Onagawa. The 37-year-old mechanic said he knows it will never work anymore. "But I want to keep it as a memorial."
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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Re: Nuclear Meltdown Watch

Postby eyeno » Mon Mar 21, 2011 5:24 am

Damn. Thanks for that slad. That is the MOX fuel reactor and it sounds like they blew a belch out of it in the air. That means about six days from now it will pass over the u.s.

on edit they also they vented it a week ago so whatever came out should be passing bout now.


The venting is an “unavoidable measure to protect the containment vessel,” nuclear safety agency official Hidehiko Nishiyama told reporters. He warned that a larger amount of radiation would have to be released than when similar venting was done a week ago because more nuclear fuel has degraded since then.
Last edited by eyeno on Mon Mar 21, 2011 6:03 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Nuclear Meltdown Watch

Postby 82_28 » Mon Mar 21, 2011 5:47 am

Could this be the "global economic" equivalent of making a "third wheel" out of a neighbor?

The "third wheel" refers to the person who is the outsider when there is a group of three. Example: "You two go on ahead without me. I don't want to be the third wheel." An analogy can be made to a two-wheeled bicycle or cart; adding a third wheel would not be helpful and would limit mobility. To be the "third wheel" is to be the extra, unnecessary person in a group of three people. Example: "Missy and I were going to go to the dance with another couple, but when I got sick she decided to stay home also. She didn't want to be the third wheel."


Japan was the "3rd largest economy". Somebody stepped the fuck up and got rid of the third so it can be binary once more and probably places Russia into this "third" distinction. Does this also suggest that it all has been planned since the 1940's that a true "third" or "fourth reich" as been in the subliminal making for well, forever? Japan signed their lives away to the business interests of the Smedley Butler of war as being a racket days back then. Do "they" possibly have 50-100-1000 year plans insofar as this enslavement we know now as "capitalism"? I've read enough PKD to think that yes, they do. "They" know our minds inside and out.
There is no me. There is no you. There is all. There is no you. There is no me. And that is all. A profound acceptance of an enormous pageantry. A haunting certainty that the unifying principle of this universe is love. -- Propagandhi
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Re: Nuclear Meltdown Watch

Postby eyeno » Mon Mar 21, 2011 6:15 am

seemslikeadream wrote:
Workers evacuated from Japan nuclear complex after gray smoke rises from reactor
Death toll rises above 18,000 in Japan's triple disaster; smoke rises from reactor No. 3, among the most badly damaged at the six-reactor complex.

By The Associated Press

A spokesman at the Fukushima nuclear plant said Monday that workers have been evacuated from Japan's tsunami-stricken nuclear complex after gray smoke was seen rising from one of its reactors.

Tokyo Electric Power Co. spokesman Hiroshi Aizawa said the company was investigating after the smoke was seen rising from the spent fuel storage pool of Unit 3.


Plant officials have been battling to cool reactors and spent fuel pools to bring the radiation-leaking plant under control after it was damaged in the massive March 11 earthquake and tsunami that devastated northeast Japan.

The toll of Japan's triple disaster came into clearer focus Monday after police estimates showed more than 18,000 people died, the World Bank said rebuilding may cost $235 billion and more cases of radiation-tainted vegetables and tap water turned up.


A helicopter flies past Japan's Fukushima Daiichi Number 1 Nuclear reactor, March 12, 2011.

Photo by: Reuters
The announcement by Japan's Health Ministry late Sunday that tests had detected excess amounts of radioactive elements on canola and chrysanthemum greens marked a low moment in a day that had been peppered with bits of positive news: First, a teenager and his grandmother were found alive nine days after being trapped in their earthquake-shattered home. Then, the operator of the overheated nuclear plant said two of the six reactor units were safely cooled down.

"We consider that now we have come to a situation where we are very close to getting the situation under control," Deputy Cabinet Secretary Tetsuro Fukuyama said.

Still, serious problems remained at the Fukushima Dai-ichi nuclear complex. Pressure unexpectedly rose in a third unit's reactor, meaning plant operators may need to deliberately release radioactive steam. That has only added to public anxiety over radiation that began leaking from the plant after a monstrous earthquake and tsunami devastated northeastern Japan on March 11 and left the plant unstable. As day broke Monday, Japan's military resumed dousing of the complex's troubled Unit 4.

The World Bank said in report Monday that Japan may need five years to rebuild from the catastrophic disasters, which caused up to $235 billion in damage, saying the cost to private insurers will be up to $33 billion and that the government will spend $12 billion on reconstruction in the current national budget and much more later.

The safety of food and water was of particular concern. The government halted shipments of spinach from one area and raw milk from another near the nuclear plant after tests found iodine exceeded safety limits. Tokyo's tap water, where iodine turned up Friday, now has cesium. Rain and dust are also tainted.

Early Monday , the Health Ministry advised Iitate, a village of 6,000 people about 30 kilometers (19 miles) northwest of the Fukushima plant, not to drink tap water due to elevated levels of iodine. Ministry spokesman Takayuki Matsuda said iodine three times the normal level was detected there — about one twenty-sixth of the level of a chest X-ray in one liter of water.

In all cases, the government said the radiation levels were too small to pose an immediate health risk.

But Tsugumi Hasegawa was skeptical as she cared for her 4-year-old daughter at a shelter in a gymnasium crammed with 1,400 people about 80 kilometers (50 miles) from the plant.

"I still have no idea what the numbers they are giving about radiation levels mean. It's all so confusing," said Hasegawa, 29, from the small town of Futuba in the shadow of the nuclear complex. "And I wonder if they aren't playing down the dangers to keep us from panicking. I don't know who to trust."

All six of the nuclear complex's reactor units saw trouble after the disasters knocked out cooling systems. In a small advance, the plant's operator declared Units 5 and 6 — the least troublesome — under control after their nuclear fuel storage pools cooled to safe levels. Progress was made to reconnect two other units to the electric grid and in pumping seawater to cool another reactor and replenish it and a sixth reactor's storage pools.

But the buildup in pressure inside the vessel holding Unit 3's reactor presented some danger, forcing officials to consider venting. The tactic produced explosions of radioactive gas during the early days of the crisis.
"Even if certain things go smoothly, there would be twists and turns," Chief Cabinet Secretary Yukio Edano told reporters. "At the moment, we are not so optimistic that there will be a breakthrough."

Growing concerns about radiation add to the overwhelming chain of disasters Japan has struggled with since the 9.0-magnitude quake. The resulting tsunami ravaged the northeastern coast. All told, police estimates show more than about 18,400 died. More than 15,000 deaths are likely in Miyagi, the prefecture that took the full impact of the wave, said a police spokesman.

"It is very distressing as we recover more bodies day by days," said Hitoshi Sugawara, the spokesman.

Police in other parts of the disaster area declined to provide estimates, but confirmed about 3,400 deaths. Nationwide, official figures show the disasters killing more than 8,600 people, and leaving more than 13,200 people missing, but those two lists may have some overlap.

The disasters have displaced another 452,000, who are living in shelters.
Fuel, food and water remain scarce. The government in recent days acknowledged being caught ill-prepared by an enormous disaster that the prime minister has called the worst crisis since World War II.

Bodies are piling up in some of the devastated communities and badly decomposing even amid chilly rain and snow.

"The recent bodies — we can't show them to the families. The faces have been purple, which means they are starting to decompose," says Shuji Horaguchi, a disaster relief official setting up a center to process the dead in Natori, on the outskirts of the tsunami-flattened city of Sendai. "Some we're finding now have been in the water for a long time, they're not in good shape. Crabs and fish have eaten parts."

Contamination of food and water compounds the government's difficulties, heightening the broader public's sense of dread about safety. Consumers in markets snapped up bottled water, shunned spinach from Ibaraki — the prefecture where the tainted spinach was found — and overall expressed concern about food safety.

Experts have said the amounts of iodine detected in milk, spinach and water pose no discernible risks to public health unless consumed in enormous quantities over a long time. Iodine breaks down quickly, after eight days, minimizing its harmfulness, unlike other radioactive isotopes such as cesium-137 or uranium-238, which remain in the environment for decades or longer.

High levels of iodine are linked to thyroid cancer, one of the least deadly cancers if treated. Cesium is a longer-lasting element that affects the whole body and raises cancer risk.

Rain forecast for the Fukushima area also could further localize the contamination, bringing the radiation to the ground closer to the plant.
Edano tried to reassure the public for a second day in a row. "If you eat it once, or twice, or even for several days, it's not just that it's not an immediate threat to health, it's that even in the future it is not a risk," Edano said. "Experts say there is no threat to human health."

No contamination has been reported in Japan's main food export — seafood — worth about $1.6 billion a year and less than 0.3 percent of its total exports.

Amid the anxiety, there were moments of joy on Sunday. An 80-year-old woman and her teenage grandson were rescued from their flattened two-story house after nine days, when the teen pulled himself to the roof and shouted to police for help.

Other survivors enjoyed smaller victories. Kiyoshi Hiratsuka and his family managed to pull his beloved Harley Davidson motorcycle from the rubble in their hometown of Onagawa. The 37-year-old mechanic said he knows it will never work anymore. "But I want to keep it as a memorial."



IAEA promoting a rosier picture, but not like i am surprised.


Unit 3

Coolant within Unit 3 is covering about half of the fuel rods in the reactor, and Japanese authorities believe the core has been damaged. High pressure within the reactor's containment led operators to vent gas from the containment. Later, an explosion destroyed the outer shell of the reactor building above the containment on 14 March.

Following the explosion, Japanese officials expressed concerns that the reactor's containment may not be fully intact. White smoke has been seen emerging from the reactor, but on 19 March it appeared to be less intense than in previous days.

Efforts to pump seawater into the reactor core are continuing.

Of additional concern at Unit 3 is the condition of the spent fuel pool in the building. There are indications that there is inadequate cooling water level in the pool, and Japanese authorities have addressed the problem by dropping water from helicopters into the building and spraying water from trucks. Spraying from trucks continued on 20 March. There is no data on the temperature of the water in the pool.





http://www.iaea.org/newscenter/news/tsu ... ate01.html
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Re: Nuclear Meltdown Watch

Postby eyeno » Mon Mar 21, 2011 7:47 am

http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/0 ... d=6cd0fcc1

another reference to reactor 3. says having pressure problems but does not say if they vented it or not.
--------------------------

this seems to indicate they have a planned release and may have to vent it.

Japan prepared another risky venting of radioactive gas to relieve a new spike in pressure in one of its troubled nuclear reactors Sunday, a setback in efforts to bring the crippled, leaking plant under control just after some signs of improvement.

The planned release into the air of what officials said would be a densely radioactive cloud comes as traces of radiation are turning up well beyond the leaking Fukushima Dai-ichi plant after its cooling systems were knocked by the massive March 11 quake and tsunami on Japan's northeast coast.


http://www.businessweek.com/ap/financia ... 2QMCG0.htm
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Re: Nuclear Meltdown Watch

Postby eyeno » Mon Mar 21, 2011 8:11 am

http://english.kyodonews.jp/

flashing in the kyodo breaking news ticker

Breaking News Tokyo Fire Department Stops Spraying water after smoke at reactor 3

-------------------

And this makes it seem likely that the spent fuel is burning maybe.
http://english.kyodonews.jp/news/2011/03/79951.html

The amount of smoke later decreased, but it was still rising above a pool housing spent nuclear fuel at the No. 3 reactor as of 5:15 p.m., according to TEPCO and the Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency. The level of pressure in the No. 3 reactor's containment vessel also did not change dramatically, they added.

Hidehiko Nishiyama, a spokesman for the nuclear safety agency, said the cause of the smoke remains unknown, but that it is unlikely that an abnormality had developed in the spent fuel pool, stating that levels of radiation did not surge.
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Re: Nuclear Meltdown Watch

Postby seemslikeadream » Mon Mar 21, 2011 9:35 am

I'm just going to throw this in here, a bit interesting even though who the speaker is

Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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Re: Nuclear Meltdown Watch

Postby eyeno » Mon Mar 21, 2011 9:48 am

zamg updated today, shows a big xenon-133 gas cloud on us


http://translate.google.com/translate?h ... MT08%3A26;
--------------------------------------------------------

this quote is from the global research article on page 30 of this thread written by keith harmon snow

Large amounts of xenon 133 are released at operating reactors, and although it has a relatively short half-life of 5.3 days, it remains radioactive for 106 days.
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Re: Nuclear Meltdown Watch

Postby crikkett » Mon Mar 21, 2011 9:56 am

eyeno wrote:zamg updated today, shows a big xenon-133 gas cloud on us


http://translate.google.com/translate?h ... MT08%3A26;
--------------------------------------------------------

this quote is from the global research article on page 30 of this thread written by keith harmon snow

Large amounts of xenon 133 are released at operating reactors, and although it has a relatively short half-life of 5.3 days, it remains radioactive for 106 days.


Is it that the Xenon remains radioactive for 106 days and then it decays to Cesium 137 (half-life of 30 years?)
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Re: Nuclear Meltdown Watch

Postby seemslikeadream » Mon Mar 21, 2011 10:32 am

please excuse if this was already posted


Another good radiation map
http://www.targetmap.com/viewer.aspx?reportId=4870
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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Re: Nuclear Meltdown Watch

Postby eyeno » Mon Mar 21, 2011 10:48 am

has anybody checked the radnet system to see if they uncorked it?
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Re: Nuclear Meltdown Watch

Postby tazmic » Mon Mar 21, 2011 10:55 am

"although it has a relatively short half-life of 5.3 days, it remains radioactive for 106 days."

That doesn't even make sense. Perhaps they mean remains detectable? Anyway, with such a short half-life, it's mean life time will be just over a week.

Crikket, the half life means you can expect half of the stuff to have decayed, in this case in 5.3 days, and according to wiki, into caesium 133, not 137. (133Cs is a stable isotope.)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenon-133

"It is a radionuclide that is inhaled to assess pulmonary function, and to image the lungs. It is also often used to image blood flow, particularly in the brain."

(Wolfram agrees with wiki: xenon_133)

"133 Cs is the only naturally occurring and only stable isotope. It is also produced by nuclear fission. It is also used to define the second."

Heh, from the Global Research article:

"Xenon 135 decays to cesium 135 with an incredibly long half-life of 3 million years. "

Nope, "Caesium-135 [...] is mildly radioactive, undergoing low-energy beta decay to barium-135 with a half-life of 2.3 million years."

Probably why it's mildly radioactive, if it takes that frigging long to decay...

"135Cs's low decay energy, lack of gamma radiation, and long half-life, make this isotope much less hazardous than Cs-137 or Cs-134."

What happened to Global Research?
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Re: Nuclear Meltdown Watch

Postby eyeno » Mon Mar 21, 2011 10:57 am

crikkett wrote:
eyeno wrote:zamg updated today, shows a big xenon-133 gas cloud on us


http://translate.google.com/translate?h ... MT08%3A26;
--------------------------------------------------------

this quote is from the global research article on page 30 of this thread written by keith harmon snow

Large amounts of xenon 133 are released at operating reactors, and although it has a relatively short half-life of 5.3 days, it remains radioactive for 106 days.


Is it that the Xenon remains radioactive for 106 days and then it decays to Cesium 137 (half-life of 30 years?)



That seems to be what Keith Harmon is saying the best i can tell.

Xenon 137, with a half-life of 3.9 minutes, converts almost immediately to the notoriously dangerous cesium 137 with a half-life of thirty years.
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Re: Nuclear Meltdown Watch

Postby eyeno » Mon Mar 21, 2011 11:03 am

One thing I am trying to figure out is which isotopes the different gamma energy ranges track. There are several ranges.
Anybody know? On the epa site there is about 8 ranges but i do now what they correlate to.

http://blog.alexanderhiggins.com/2011/0 ... ties-9228/
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