Military Plane Flying Low over the Hudson River?

[crikkett]

playing devil's advocate he asked me how it would look if advance warning were given and some crackpot showed up with their rocket launcher to knock the plane out of the sky.

That, he said, would be some spectacular footage.

He has a point.

Sure, crikket, but the obvious conclusion to draw is: Don't do it at all. Not under any circumstances. Neither with nor without a warning.

Also, as several people have already noted, the "photo-op" excuse is a load of crap. What's more, the "apology" issued by that White House drone is a load of even stinkier crap, for the FAA memo makes it perfectly, unambiguously clear that they knew this outrageous stunt would cause a panic.

So, to sum up: The FAA and the USAF fully intended to cause a panic at Ground Zero, and then they did so.

Mission Accomplished, message received and understood.

What utter bastards.

I'm not disagreeing with you, but trying to think about this objectively. And yes, I did notice how it was staged on Day 99 of Obama's presidency.

[nomo]

Okay--the other story sounded possible, but this one's garbage. No one--not even an inexperienced set of idiots (and mostly I haven't seen that Obama's hired any such--like or hate him, he does good PR) would do a $60,000 hr. and hour (plus the jets' costs) PR disaster for souvenir photos.

Not to mention that you usually don't take pictures from an F-16. Who's gonna take them, the freaking pilot? More likely, you'd hire a professional crew with one of them helicopters and the camera hanging in one of those stabilizer balls. The photo shoot story is bullshit.

[Percival]

It is completely understandable why they wouldnt the public to know about this in advance, as indicated by another poster it would be very easy to take that plane out with a shoulder fire missile launcher.

However, this does not excuse the fact that flying that plane over NY as they did was the stupidiest fucking thing they could have done, but it doesnt surprise me at all that they do stupid shit and it could very well be a psy op of some sort but where a lot of you want to see conspiracy theory I think stupidity is just as much a viable answer.

[MacCruiskeen]

stupidity is just as much a viable answer.

No, Percival, nobody is that stupid. (The Incompetence Excuse, Vol. 958...) And this carefully-planned and beautifully-executed stunt required the coordination of several different highly-placed experts in several different government, military and municipal agencies. Stan Laurel was not in charge.

Besides, you are simply ignoring the fact that the FAA admitted beforehand that they knew exactly how the plebs would respond.

But they knew they'd get away with it. How could they not?

[seemslikeadream]

http://militarytimes.com/forums/showthread.php?p=218676

Any pilots here? Posts: n/a

Re: Obama vows no repeat of Manhattan photo flight

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I post on another board where someone asked the following. Perhaps there are some pilots or ATC peeps who address this:


Hello................perhaps it would help if someone were to ask the right questions...........such as:

Was the aircraft in question over New York Harbor on 27. April, 2009, Special Air Mission 28000?

If the aircraft over New York Harbor on 27, April, 2009 was not Special Air Mission (SAM) 27000, or 28000, why was it refered to as a back up to Air Force One (AFO).


Sending Special Air Mission 28000 to New York at 2000 feet requires shutting down LaGuardia, Newark and Teterboro airports while SAM 28000 is withing 25 Nautical miles of each airport. Insofar as EWR is the 3rd most busy airport in the United States, did anyone take into account the impact this would have?

The minimum legal altitude for fixed wing operations in the New York ATCZ (PC) is 1000 feet vertical altitude above the tallest obstruction (Empire State Building at ~1400 feet). Insofar at SAM 28000 was operating within the NYC ATCZ (PC) at 2000 feet, did they apply for, and were they granted a waver of the FAR? (keeping in mind that only qualified law enforcement Rotor Craft, Media Rotor Craft declaring 99.99, and Tactical Air Command flights squacking 0000 qualify for such an exemption).

Did SAM 28000 declare FAR 99.99?

Did SAM 28000 Declare VFR? (Keeping in mind that VFR operations are prohibited within the NYC PCZ).

The videos of SAM 28000's flight in the NYC PCZ clearly show no Fixed Wing or Rotor Craft Camera Platform accompanying its flight. Please explain how an F-16 was equipped to do a "Photo Shoot"? (keeping in mind that F-16s are only equipped with gun cameras and cannot shoot high quality video in any direction other than straight ahead).


Please state, when, ever, in that past, any Special Air Mission (SAM) aircraft were engaged in a low level photo shoot. (Keeping in mind that all such collaretal materials have been produced the past using a Matte Photo Process or a digital insertion process).

Please state who was in command of SAM 28000 during the events of 27, April, 2009. Colonel Mark Tillman, USAF, retired, has stated that such a flight is outside the operational parameters of the SAM 27000/ 28000 primary and secondary flight crew and would have been rejected out of hand by the currently assigned AFO PIC (who has operational control of both aircraft).

Was a NOTAM published for this flight? (Keeping in mind that hazarding air traffic in now an act of terrorism under the Patriot Act).

Insofar as NORAD (North American Areospace Defense Command) requires that all SAM Flights be under PC (Positive Control) at all times, and that all civilian air traffic be restricted from close proximity from all SAM's ( expect in cases of a validly declared FAR 99.99 exception), how was the SAM / NORAD required NOTAM communicated to the following:

New York Center (ATC NYC Long Island)
EWR Approack (Newark Airport Approach Control)
TEB Tower (Tereboro Tower)
LGA Approach and Departure Control
JFK Approach and Departure Control (Kennedy Airport, formerly known as Idlewilde Field)
The General Aviation Population (via standard NOTAM (Notice to Airmen (assuming women don't fly)))


This is just the tip of the Iceberg folks.

It also shows you why you should never trust the media in an aviation situation.

They have no idea.

[Percival]

stupidity is just as much a viable answer.

No, Percival, nobody is that stupid. (The Incompetence Excuse, Vol. 958...) And this carefully-planned and beautifully-executed stunt required the coordination of several different highly-placed experts in several different government, military and municipal agencies. Stan Laurel was not in charge.

Besides, you are simply ignoring the fact that the FAA admitted beforehand that they knew exactly how the plebs would respond.

But they knew they'd get away with it. How could they not?

Well hey I am a big advocate of them trying to scare everyone in to submission, no argument from me there. I am just saying that they do often do stupid things and it isnt always some secret/occult ritual or psyop. But you may be right, I am not arguing your point at all.

[StarmanSkye]

SLAD -- Thanks for that VERY interesting blogger repost w/ most important questons being asked re: critical protocol airflight permission issues; Many of those issues also bugged me about this whole incident, esp. that the 747 was being operated beyond its allowable & aceptable performance envelope -- more like dangerous airshow stuntflying than anything remotely resembling a duty routinely performed by airforce crews. I think this was done beyond the chain of command, carefully shielding those directly responsibility, to discredit Obama's regime and/or send a message that Obama ONLY rules by agreement with hidden powers, and he can be brought down anytime if he deviates from the script. Or MAYBE: That's the indirect message being sent to the public, that Obama is a pawn who is NOT the supreme commander.

I'm still really puzzled by the significance of the verical stabilizer fin of the F16 escorts being painted as if they were target drones. (I'm assuming both F16s were painted the same -- haven't seen any side-by-side images, all the videos I've seen only showed one escort plane.)

[Col. Quisp]

I wish someone from the media would ask these questions, or send a FOIA request. Something's rotten.

[MacCruiskeen]

By the way, IF that red tail was a tribute to the Tuskegee Airmen, then it was -- to say the least -- a pretty damn back-handed compliment.

I mean, what's all that about? Obama is not only the first Black president, but the first new president since 9/11. So, just in time for the world's media to report it on his 100th day in office, Air Force One (the Black president's personal plane), accompanied by two "Black" fighter planes, performs reckless aerial manouevres directly over Ground Zero in the middle of the working week, thereby terrifying thousands if not millions of New Yorkers, emptying office buildings and construction sites, and in some cases bringing business to a complete halt. Without warning, and without any remotely credible explanation after the fact.

What's the message there?

(Note: All this while an Air France passenger plane, in the very same month, was abruptly denied entry to US airspace because a US-critical journalist was on board. That's the context.)

[stickdog99]

This is a test of the psyop system. This is only a test. Repeat, this is only a test. If this had been a real psyop you would have been given further conditioning.

[justdrew]

hmm, wonderful timing...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hb6tM4o94gA

NEW YORK (AP) — A 5-story building has collapsed at a lower Manhattan construction site, but New York City fire officials say it appears no one was inside.

Emergency crews with a dog are sifting through the building's rubble. They also are going through a neighboring building as a precaution.

A wall is peeled away from the building. A pile of bricks is on the ground, and pieces of wood are hanging from what remains of the structure. A car on the street is covered in rubble.

The Buildings Department has inspectors at the scene, which is seven blocks north of the World Trade Center site.

[xsicbastardx]

So.... supposedly this was a photo op of some kind?


What if this Photo Op wasn't for now.....but in the Future....AFTER some event happens.......meaning......what if something were to happen to Air Force One....or the Statue of Liberty?....

[OpLan]

Not sure if it was one of you folks who mentioned the stock market dropping briefly because of this stunt..I wonder if those in the know shorted the airlines a la 9/11 for a quick boost to their pensions.Would that qualify as illegal insider trading?

[Nordic]

http://militarytimes.com/forums/showthread.php?p=218676

Any pilots here? Posts: n/a

Re: Obama vows no repeat of Manhattan photo flight

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I post on another board where someone asked the following. Perhaps there are some pilots or ATC peeps who address this:


Hello................perhaps it would help if someone were to ask the right questions...........such as:

Was the aircraft in question over New York Harbor on 27. April, 2009, Special Air Mission 28000?

If the aircraft over New York Harbor on 27, April, 2009 was not Special Air Mission (SAM) 27000, or 28000, why was it refered to as a back up to Air Force One (AFO).


Sending Special Air Mission 28000 to New York at 2000 feet requires shutting down LaGuardia, Newark and Teterboro airports while SAM 28000 is withing 25 Nautical miles of each airport. Insofar as EWR is the 3rd most busy airport in the United States, did anyone take into account the impact this would have?

The minimum legal altitude for fixed wing operations in the New York ATCZ (PC) is 1000 feet vertical altitude above the tallest obstruction (Empire State Building at ~1400 feet). Insofar at SAM 28000 was operating within the NYC ATCZ (PC) at 2000 feet, did they apply for, and were they granted a waver of the FAR? (keeping in mind that only qualified law enforcement Rotor Craft, Media Rotor Craft declaring 99.99, and Tactical Air Command flights squacking 0000 qualify for such an exemption).

Did SAM 28000 declare FAR 99.99?

Did SAM 28000 Declare VFR? (Keeping in mind that VFR operations are prohibited within the NYC PCZ).

The videos of SAM 28000's flight in the NYC PCZ clearly show no Fixed Wing or Rotor Craft Camera Platform accompanying its flight. Please explain how an F-16 was equipped to do a "Photo Shoot"? (keeping in mind that F-16s are only equipped with gun cameras and cannot shoot high quality video in any direction other than straight ahead).


Please state, when, ever, in that past, any Special Air Mission (SAM) aircraft were engaged in a low level photo shoot. (Keeping in mind that all such collaretal materials have been produced the past using a Matte Photo Process or a digital insertion process).

Please state who was in command of SAM 28000 during the events of 27, April, 2009. Colonel Mark Tillman, USAF, retired, has stated that such a flight is outside the operational parameters of the SAM 27000/ 28000 primary and secondary flight crew and would have been rejected out of hand by the currently assigned AFO PIC (who has operational control of both aircraft).

Was a NOTAM published for this flight? (Keeping in mind that hazarding air traffic in now an act of terrorism under the Patriot Act).

Insofar as NORAD (North American Areospace Defense Command) requires that all SAM Flights be under PC (Positive Control) at all times, and that all civilian air traffic be restricted from close proximity from all SAM's ( expect in cases of a validly declared FAR 99.99 exception), how was the SAM / NORAD required NOTAM communicated to the following:

New York Center (ATC NYC Long Island)
EWR Approack (Newark Airport Approach Control)
TEB Tower (Tereboro Tower)
LGA Approach and Departure Control
JFK Approach and Departure Control (Kennedy Airport, formerly known as Idlewilde Field)
The General Aviation Population (via standard NOTAM (Notice to Airmen (assuming women don't fly)))


This is just the tip of the Iceberg folks.

It also shows you why you should never trust the media in an aviation situation.

They have no idea.

SLAD ... you fucking rock.

That's all I have to say.

I love it when I see something and, well, my intuition tells me that it's all wrong. And my intuition tells me that the stories being given about it are all lies. But I can't put my finger on it. Have no "evidence". Then? Someone like SLAD comes up with it.

Awesome.

[Hugh Manatee Wins]

The next day, the Tues. 4/28/09 CIA-NYTimes had a front page above-the-fold photo of 'the plane' overhead with a building in the foreground (one of two similar buildings visible thus evoking the Twin Towers with a big sign on it reading "77 Hudson.com".

Only the multi-faceted building has the "77" quite apart from the rest of the sign giving the appearance of an address.

So they managed to get a highly publicized decoy of WTC 7 out of the deal, too.

It takes some planning to pull off a photo op like that and make it page 1 of the CIA-NYTimes.

The headline directly below this photo read:
"U.S. Plans Attack and Defense in Web Warfare"

...well, DUH. 9/11 Truth is an ongoing problem that can only be diluted with time and generating decoy psycho-political events like this one.