Fuck Obama

[Simulist]

Democratic Party apologists never want to deal with the fact that the Obama Administration is a carbon-copy of the Bush Administration on many constitutional issues — except of course when its clearly even worse, as in the matter of "targeted assassinations" even of American citizens.

Many of those who despised the Bush Administration also now despise the Obama Administration.

And they should.

[Cosmic Cowbell]

DNC Raises $16 Million In September

JIM KUHNHENN | 10/ 4/10 11:35 AM | AP

WASHINGTON — The Democratic National Committee said Monday it raised more than $16 million in September, its best fundraising month in a congressional election cycle that has proved to be challenging for Democrats in every way but financially.

With Election Day four weeks away, party spokesman Brad Woodhouse said the new fundraising numbers suggest a growing enthusiasm among Democrats. That's an emerging argument from party strategists who are eager to counter polls that portray Republican voters as more energized and eager to vote in this election.

"We've found that our supporters are now focused on the election, are responding to the president's message laying out the choice and understand the stakes," Woodhouse said.

Eighty percent of the money came from low-dollar donors online and through the mail, as opposed to big contributions at fundraising events, woodhouse said.

President Barack Obama, however, also headlined four DNC fundraisers during the month, helping make it the highest midterm election haul since 2002 when Congress imposed new limits on party fundraising.

This election cycle, the DNC has consistently raised more money than its counterpart, the Republican National Committee, establishing an advantage that has infuriated Republican strategists and top party fundraisers. Many in the GOP blame RNC chairman Michael Steele for the anemic finances.

The RNC did not announce its September fundraising. The parties are not required to disclose their finances until Oct. 20.

Despite the Democrats' financial edge, Republicans have taken advantage of the weak economy and bubbling voter dissatisfaction to make inroads in a number of House and Senate races, with officials in both parties acknowledging that Republicans will see gains in the November elections.

Moreover, Republicans have made up for the weak party fundraising by establishing a network of outside organizations, many of them nonprofit groups, that do not face the same legal fundraising restraints as the party committees. Those groups have been outspending Democratic-leaning groups by at least a 6-to-1 margin.

American Crossroads and Crossroads GPS, two related groups created at the direction of top GOP strategists Karl Rove and Ed Gillespie, have reported raising a combined $32 million this year, including more than $14 million in just a 30-day period in August and September.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/10/0 ... 48938.html

Keep telling yourself there are no differences....

[Simulist]

Oh, there are differences: the Republican Party does evil shit, and the Democratic Party (sometimes) protests.

Except when it helps them. Or does more evil shit all on its own.

(Which is a lot.)

[Cosmic Cowbell]

Oh, there are differences: the Republican Party does evil shit, and the Democratic Party (sometimes) protests.

Except when it helps them. Or does more evil shit all on its own.

(Which is a lot.)

So what should we do?

[Cedars of Overburden]

Cosmic, sure, what you asked was "did they die," not "were they willing"? So, just to make you happy, I'll instead ask, "is a world where Americans slaughter innocent people by remote control the kind of world they were working for when they were killed?"

The question is: Did they die so that a dark skinned person could be president? Or did they die for a just society?

If they died so that dark skinned people could be president, well here we are. Yippeee!

If they died for a just society, well ......

And, Simulist, I like you too.

[Cosmic Cowbell]

Cosmic, sure, what you asked was "did they die," not "were they willing"? So, just to make you happy, I'll instead ask, "is a world where Americans slaughter innocent people by remote control the kind of world they were working for when they were killed?"

The question is loaded but I'll give er a go anyway. I'd have to answer in the affirmative, because they were actually doing it at the time. Vietnam and the use of Land Mines. And actually I find that an even worse example than what we do currently as land mines were much less discriminate.

The question is: Did they die so that a dark skinned person could be president? Or did they die for a just society?

If they died so that dark skinned people could be president, well here we are. Yippeee!

If they died for a just society, well ......

Two variations of the same mutually inclusive question. Again, the answer would be yes.

But getting back to the original question. It was posed because the idea was put forth that it simply doesn't matter what we do, because we are deluded/delusional that Democracy even exist. Voting is basically for suckers. That working hard for social change - within the system- is a waste of time.

I disagreed and posed the question - WHICH CURRENTLY STILL REMAINS UNANSWERED.

As does the question I asked and re-asked wrt withdrawal from our current engagements upthread. Care to give er a go?

[Simulist]

Oh, there are differences: the Republican Party does evil shit, and the Democratic Party (sometimes) protests.

Except when it helps them. Or does more evil shit all on its own.

(Which is a lot.)

So what should we do?

We should stop pretending.

We should stop pretending that any president who covers up for the torturers of children is someone worthy of our support. We should stop pretending that any political party which continues to support unnecessary wars resulting in millions of dead and ruined lives is worthy of our support.

Stop pretending. Until that first step is taken, the next steps of radical non-violent non-cooperation with this evil system will not be taken and, in fact, will not even be recognized as necessary.

[Bruce Dazzling]

Oh, there are differences: the Republican Party does evil shit, and the Democratic Party (sometimes) protests.

Except when it helps them. Or does more evil shit all on its own.

(Which is a lot.)

So what should we do?

We should stop pretending.

We should stop pretending that any president who covers up for the torturers of children is someone worthy of our support. We should stop pretending that any political party which continues to support unnecessary wars resulting in millions of dead and ruined lives is worthy of our support.

Stop pretending. Until that first step is taken, the next steps of radical non-violent non-cooperation with this evil system will not be taken and, in fact, will not even be recognized as necessary.

[Cedars of Overburden]

What Simulist said.

[ninakat]

Thanks Simulist.

[Cosmic Cowbell]

the next steps of radical non-violent non-cooperation with this evil system will not be taken and, in fact, will not even be recognized as necessary.

I didn't ask you what we should do first, I asked you what we should do. So...we've stopped pretending (would that be all of us, half of us, just democrats?) and we've moved on to non-violent, non-cooperation. In exactly what form and, if you could, what century might this take place?

Or does this need to be done prior to 2012? 2016?

How do you see the revolution taking place, since one can only assume that democracy won't be on the table? Specifics please.

While your at it, please attempt to answer the hypothetical I posed earlier. We have come to our senses and withdrawn from Iraq, Pakistan and Afghanistan.

Now what?

Here is the problem as I see it. While you are all waiting for the stopping of pretending and the US to come to it's senses wrt to conflict, the world marches on, the rich get richer, our resources become further diminished and the opportunity for social progress (in reality) diminishes with every donation the Koch brothers (and those like them make) to those who wish to control you life (abortion, marriage, health care etc) and wallet. While you are marching (non-violently and non-confrontationally- which is a joke BTW), your losing even more ground.

There is a difference. Unfortunately, those that sit out won't be the ones making it count. Unless you at least take a defensive position while you are gathering resources from an offensive push, you've lost before you've written "Fuck Obama" on the placard. While he is most likely NOT your "friend" (show me a politician who truly is), he is not the enemy. Even if you consider him to be, you really have to ask yourself if he's your worst enemy. It may be a matter of degrees, like it or not. If your suffering from Gangrene (Republicans/Tea Baggers) and at the same time the Flu (Obama), my advice would be to address the first and deal with the second after it's been determined that you'll live. Focusing on the Flu while allowing the Gangrene to spread just seems, well, unwise (IMO).

[Cosmic Cowbell]

.

[norton ash]

While your at it, please attempt to answer the hypothetical I posed earlier. We have come to our senses and withdrawn from Iraq, Pakistan and Afghanistan.

No 'you' f**king haven't. If you think 'you' have, you're illustrating the chasm between Obama-Democrat words and deeds.

(Simulist, well done, thumbs up here as well.)

[Cosmic Cowbell]

While your at it, please attempt to answer the hypothetical I posed earlier. We have come to our senses and withdrawn from Iraq, Pakistan and Afghanistan.

No 'you' f**king haven't. If you think 'you' have, you're illustrating the chasm between Obama-Democrat words and deeds.

(Simulist, well done, thumbs up here as well.)

Read the question I posed upthread if your able. And then attempt to answer it.

[Cosmic Cowbell]

Really Simulist ...well done. Stop pretending and don't vote.

THAT IS FUCKING AWESOME!!!!!