Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

Moderators: Elvis, DrVolin, Jeff

Re: Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

Postby semper occultus » Mon Jul 28, 2014 5:33 am

....interesting.....although we always need to preserve a thick red line between non-consenting / paedo stuff & what consenting adults do in private :


Anonymous has restored information censored by the British Government from Chapter 36 of MI6: Inside the Covert World of Her Majesty's Secret Intelligence Service, by Stephen Dorril. It is published here to provide public information on MI6 which Mr. Dorril could not, and has been done so without his knowledge or permission.

** There have been numerous rumours in areas of Whitehall's intelligence community that while in opposition, Mr Cook used a well know high class London based escort agency (A****) [A reader suggests "Adam's"] - apparently the preferred choice of several MP's and Whitehall civil servants.

The Security and Intelligence services keep on file indiscretions, however politically sensitive, of crown servants, MP's etc - An example of that would be the sexual encounter that occurred between Gordon Brown and Peter Mandelson (interrupted accidentally by a member of Michael Meacher's staff) in Gordon Brown's office at the House of Commons while in opposition and is still only known to a very select number of Commons and Whitehall hierarchy. The services are also aware of the sexual relationship between Mr Hague and Mr Coe.

http://cryptome.org/mi6-sd36.htm
User avatar
semper occultus
 
Posts: 2974
Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2006 2:01 pm
Location: London,England
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

Postby Searcher08 » Mon Jul 28, 2014 5:59 am

Semper, your level of understatement has become an art-form. A coffee fountain out of the nostrils ensued from reading that post.

semper occultus » Mon Jul 28, 2014 9:33 am wrote:....interesting.....although we always need to preserve a thick red line between non-consenting / paedo stuff & what consenting adults do in private :


Anonymous has restored information censored by the British Government from Chapter 36 of MI6: Inside the Covert World of Her Majesty's Secret Intelligence Service, by Stephen Dorril. It is published here to provide public information on MI6 which Mr. Dorril could not, and has been done so without his knowledge or permission.

** There have been numerous rumours in areas of Whitehall's intelligence community that while in opposition, Mr Cook used a well know high class London based escort agency (A****) [A reader suggests "Adam's"] - apparently the preferred choice of several MP's and Whitehall civil servants.

The Security and Intelligence services keep on file indiscretions, however politically sensitive, of crown servants, MP's etc - An example of that would be the sexual encounter that occurred between Gordon Brown and Peter Mandelson (interrupted accidentally by a member of Michael Meacher's staff) in Gordon Brown's office at the House of Commons while in opposition and is still only known to a very select number of Commons and Whitehall hierarchy. The services are also aware of the sexual relationship between Mr Hague and Mr Coe.

http://cryptome.org/mi6-sd36.htm
User avatar
Searcher08
 
Posts: 5887
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 10:21 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

Postby semper occultus » Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:43 am

Searcher08 » 28 Jul 2014 09:59 wrote:........A coffee fountain out of the nostrils ensued from reading that post.



....wake up & smell the coffee as they say.....

....& that was just reading it.....Mr Meacher's assistant is still in therapy apparently....
User avatar
semper occultus
 
Posts: 2974
Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2006 2:01 pm
Location: London,England
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

Postby brekin » Tue Jul 29, 2014 1:27 am

Returning to what I was discussing earlier about Jimmy's eyes, public facial mien and how it may have contributed, if at all to his years of public and private hiding in plain sight. A few things have struck me about his particular case which may shed light on such phenomenon in general.

1. First, conspiracy at heart, it could be argued is a mechanism of convincing the majority of society that elite social predators are not predatory and are not preying on the rest of us with impunity.
2. Second, the techniques which persuade and socially condition individuals in modern societies that social predators are not predators must be examined because they in many ways counteract thousands if not millions of years of evolutionary development which assisted social humans in recognizing who was predatory and who wasn't.

Two things about Jimmy tipped me into following a certain line of thought. First, was his perpetual public facial mask: popped, surprised/frightened eyes, open teeth grinned, usually with a long cigar protruding. This facial pose was televised and printed for decades and conditioned the public to see Jimmy in a certain way (consciously and unconsciously no doubt).

Image

Second, was the description of something Jimmy did with his face in person to one of his unfortunate victims in an abusive encounter:
Other adults reported being humiliated by Savile. One woman said:
He came up and he was stood on my right-hand side of the bed and he came quite close to my face very very quickly so that when I tried to shout or make a noise or do anything, nothing came out… He just stopped [the abuse] and let go.

http://www.thejournal.ie/jimmy-savile-i ... 7-Jun2014/

It seems Savile used his face publicly and privately, methodically or learned through happenstance, for certain malevolent ends. I think he tapped something that goes way back. Here is an excerpt from the book Deadly Powers which I think explains the "predator face" which I think Savile copped, probably reflexively or intuitively, and helped to possibly assist him in his victimization of a nation publicly and privately. I was tempted to bold all the below because I've only selected what I believed is pertinent but didn't want to sacrifice readability.
page 67 Triggers of Fear
How did our ancestors know which animals to fear? Did they learn from experience? Or were they blessed with some sort of inherited memory of specific predators?
Experience certainly taught hard lessons, but evolution also helped by priming our species to react anxiously or fearfully not to specific predators but to a general set of physical stimuli (or "releasers") closely associated with dangerous animals. As Hans Kruuk puts it, "[W]e have a strong instinctive response to the killer attributes of large predators."
....
What were the predator features that triggered the fear reaction of our ancestors? And why should we care? These stimuli are important to us because Paleolithic storytellers likely used them as "stage props" to enact "tales" about predators. The same stimuli are used even today by storytellers to tell their frightening tales.

page 68 The Predator Face
Almost all predators (save raptors) attack headfirst.[...] For ancient primates and for us today, the most powerful signal possible annihilation is a dangerous predator staring us straight in the face.
The Staring Eye
Although the face of the attacking predator is probably experience holistically, evolution has primed us to fear certain features of it, most crucially, "a fixed and direct stare." The reason is simple: before attacking, predators stare at their prey. In the Pleistocene, being stared at by an animal was a strong indication that one was being hunted. As a result, "fear of two staring eyes is widespread throughout the animal kingdom."
page 71
[...]In order to communicate about predators, to create narratives and stories about them, our distant ancestors would have had to imitate--however crudely--the essential features that define predators. In essence, they were coopting the fear-inducing traits of predators to enhance their own survival.

The Predator Mouth
The eyes merely guide the predator to the prey. It is the maw that does the dirty work--rending, tearing, crunching, dismembering, and swallowing prey.[...]Our ancient ancestors probably did not dread "death" or "mortality" in the abstract sense but rather the existential fact of being torn apart and eaten. [...] page 73, The predator face--with its teeth and maw--was imitated in all kinds of cultural productions, from masks worn at ceremonies to architectural elements of buildings. Even when used to "protect" buildings (such as temples) from intruders, such images must have activated at some level the hardwired visceral fear of dying by carnivore.

page 74 Predator Teeth
Exposed teeth trigger fear in all mammals, which then exploit this response to intimidate and frighten even members of their own species. page 76, Primates are especially intimidated by bared teeth. To scare adversaries, baboons actually pull down their lower lips to fully expose their very long upper canines. Early humans, being primates, would have reacted powerfully to the sight of teeth. [...] By using animal teeth and pointed stones, early storytellers probably exploited this innate response to conjure up a semblence of the predator during an enacted performance. Eventually, this fear trigger became a prominent feature of terror masks and of almost all mythic descriptions of predators and monsters.

page 76, The Predator Tongue
Fear is also triggered at the sight of a tongue--especially when it is depicted in the shape of a dagger or shark tooth. [...] page 77, The extended pinkish tongue is a fear trigger because it exposes the teeth and the throat of the mammalian predator and is used to lick up blood.
[In summary:]
Our ancient ancestors were primed by evolution to associate these features with a potential threat to their lives. To feel fear, they did not have to identify the specific kind of animal--they simply had to notice any of these physical features: staring eyes, an open mouth, flashing sharp teeth, a lolling tongue--these all spelled "danger", "predator."


Ok, after reading the above. Look at a photo of Savile again.

Image

Wouldn't you say that is a predator face if you ever saw one? The "staring eyes, an open mouth, flashing sharp teeth, a lolling tongue (the almost ever present cigar acting as a long dark tongue)" which all "spelled "danger", "predator." I believe that when people are presented with this "predator face", even human ones, they can either fight, flight, display or freeze. I think the usual response is to freeze, even if it is holding ones breathe. [side bar anecdotal evidence, I've known people who have had partial to full predator faces and I've noticed that I tend to hold my breathe almost unconsciously around them. One coworker instead of doing the split second eyebrow raise of acknowledgement in the hallway would (mostly unconsciously I would guess) raise his brows and hold them there and smile for ages which was always completely unnerving and off putting. Another acquaintance had a fixed predator face which was his default (my guess was dietary issues or very high anxiety or pharmaceutical issues) and it was extremely hard to be at ease talking to his "rapist eyes" and devilish smile.

I think Savile used his "predator face" to both freeze television viewers and his victims in person to control them to a certain extent. The possible result? By deconditioning people to accept a stalking predator's cues as just eccentric show biz clowning he could behave in apex predator fashion and his preying on others just be dismissed lightly as "that's just Jimmy". It was almost like a wolf who through the sheer repetition of the media was accepted into the sheep fold without any qualms, safeguards of limits.
If I knew all mysteries and all knowledge, and have not charity, I am nothing. St. Paul
I hang onto my prejudices, they are the testicles of my mind. Eric Hoffer
User avatar
brekin
 
Posts: 3229
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 5:21 pm
Blog: View Blog (1)

Re: Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

Postby Col. Quisp » Wed Jul 30, 2014 11:38 am

Interesting theory - explains why a lot of people are instantly creeped out by his appearance. I don't know if people got desensitized though. I think he just couldn't help looking that way, because he WAS a predator. He felt more at ease with his eyes popping out, and teeth biting into a cigar (phallic symbol?), grinning like a devil. I've also known people with that face, and I never understood why I instinctively recoiled from them. One of them has Asperger's (I believe). I suspect he adopted that leer because he thinks it's shows friendliness. He speaks through gritted teeth while staring at you, mouth in an unnatural smile. Very creepy. But he's not a predator, as far as i know, although he is a Republican and works at a former president's library.
User avatar
Col. Quisp
 
Posts: 1076
Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2006 10:43 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

Postby tapitsbo » Wed Jul 30, 2014 12:09 pm

Saville's "upside down sanpaku eyes" are definitely rare. Look at people around you out in public and you'll hardly ever spot such a thing.
tapitsbo
 
Posts: 1824
Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2013 6:58 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

Postby Searcher08 » Wed Jul 30, 2014 12:31 pm

tapitsbo » Wed Jul 30, 2014 4:09 pm wrote:Saville's "upside down sanpaku eyes" are definitely rare. Look at people around you out in public and you'll hardly ever spot such a thing.


Image


Ugh! She is like that madwoman from The Mist.
User avatar
Searcher08
 
Posts: 5887
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 10:21 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

Postby brekin » Wed Jul 30, 2014 5:38 pm

Col. Quisp » Wed Jul 30, 2014 10:38 am wrote:Interesting theory - explains why a lot of people are instantly creeped out by his appearance. I don't know if people got desensitized though. I think he just couldn't help looking that way, because he WAS a predator. He felt more at ease with his eyes popping out, and teeth biting into a cigar (phallic symbol?), grinning like a devil. I've also known people with that face, and I never understood why I instinctively recoiled from them. One of them has Asperger's (I believe). I suspect he adopted that leer because he thinks it's shows friendliness. He speaks through gritted teeth while staring at you, mouth in an unnatural smile. Very creepy. But he's not a predator, as far as i know, although he is a Republican and works at a former president's library.


Just for clarity, I think people didn't get desensitized to his appearance, or even the actual effect his appearance had possibly on many people (trepidation/mild surprise/ alarm causing a momentary to prolong freezing), if anything they were acutely sensitized through repetition. But they did get desensitized to what this effect meant. (I don't know perhaps re-appropriation of affect is a better term to use, instead of desensitized/sensitized?) As you mentioned you've instinctively recoiled from people with such face as have I. Why would we then tune into a show repeatedly if the same person was now on television everyday? Maybe there was a sense of anxiety/excitement his persona created that broke through some of the monotony of regular bland television? Perhaps the safety and built in distancing of the television made viewers feel the predator was caged and they could relinquish some of the self protection they would exercise normally. Perhaps predators carry a promise of violence or the unexpected that is appealing on some level as a spectator- that makes them so familiar and safe- that when the glass comes down and you are in the cage you still imagine you are a spectator and not lunch for Rin Tin Tin.
If I knew all mysteries and all knowledge, and have not charity, I am nothing. St. Paul
I hang onto my prejudices, they are the testicles of my mind. Eric Hoffer
User avatar
brekin
 
Posts: 3229
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 5:21 pm
Blog: View Blog (1)

Re: Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

Postby semper occultus » Thu Jul 31, 2014 5:56 pm

...we have achieved the Grand Unified Theory...!

....well somebody had to do it…..Savile links to ONA...!

..whilst this is 90-ish % certain a piss-take / ARG / mind-f**k of some sort I can’t resist going with it….

ImageImageImage

http://orderofnine.wordpress.com/2014/04/20/jimmy-savile-and-the-founding-of-the-order-of-nine-angles/

....the Orthodox Temple of the Prince was known as just that afaik, led by a certain Ray Bogarde although, rather oddly, one of the few hits on them throws this up :

Anon, Niger Liber Benelus, Exoteric Lex, Orthodox Temple of the Prince 1986 Revised Ed LF 253 leaves printed on one side, some hand coloured diagrams, duplicated sheets in card binder. Introduction associates it with Prof R. Shareth & Ramon, in fact written by Ray Bogarde. It is substantial account of teachings & practices of Orthodox Temple of the Prince, or New Order of Satanic Templars or Benelist Satanists. Through George Brooke (from W.B.Crow) these may have had some Gnostic Catholic Church succession though this is not mentioned. The author joined the Order a few years after the Second World War.

There appears to have been some conflict with the branch represented by this work parting company with other temples associated with coloured scenes operating prostitution rings and sex clubs.

There is an attempt to codify the practice of different temples with this work, which was first written in 1972, this being a greatly revised version. A curious, and rare, item. Chapter headings include Comp0arative Witchcraf and Benelism; Traditional Witchcraft; Gardnerian Wichcraft; Orthodox Benelism; Organisation of the Temple; Piresthood Offices; Temple layout; Altar Faith; Initiation and Baptism; Degrees and Tests; Need for Trianing in Occult Study; Three Levels of Consciousness; Pentacle and Pentagram; First Three Silver Paths; Sigilogy; Sigils of the Spirits; Tanith & Atoroth; Rituals; Black Mass; Probationer to Neophite; Consecration of Higher Piresthood; Convocation of Higher Priesthood VG Order No. 510018 £475


http://www.lashtal.com/portal/news/1051-1050-old-news.html

...also...whilst the pro-Jewish angle seems mighty weird in the context of the hard core Hitler=worship stuff I will say is that there is a definite Leeds connection in Myatt's background....& the whiff of paedo around his group…

Image
User avatar
semper occultus
 
Posts: 2974
Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2006 2:01 pm
Location: London,England
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

Postby Searcher08 » Thu Jul 31, 2014 8:36 pm

The stuff said about the UDA is really out of wack - they arose as an amalgamation of very grass-roots local loyalist associations. They were a huge paramilitary group with over 40,000 members at one point.

brekin, have alisten to the last interview Savile did.
He comes across to me as extremely intelligent, focused on service to his network and with an underlying love of death (true necrophilia) and corruption. His life was very Thelemic - he arranged and orchestrated it to always be doing what was his Will.
User avatar
Searcher08
 
Posts: 5887
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 10:21 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

Postby semper occultus » Fri Aug 01, 2014 3:12 am

...yeah it does look out-of-whack and yet.......and yet.......Loyalist : Masonic links - check Loyalist : Neo-Nazi links - check....
User avatar
semper occultus
 
Posts: 2974
Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2006 2:01 pm
Location: London,England
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

Postby brekin » Fri Aug 01, 2014 4:43 pm

searcher08 wrote:
brekin, have alisten to the last interview Savile did.
He comes across to me as extremely intelligent, focused on service to his network and with an underlying love of death (true necrophilia) and corruption. His life was very Thelemic - he arranged and orchestrated it to always be doing what was his Will.


Only had time to listen to about half (I think). What struck me is the duplicity, compartmentalization, hypocrisy in much of what he says. He said numerous times, obviously supremely ironic in retrospect now, almost as his main coda: "I only wanted to have a bit a fun, but I never had it at anyone's expense." "I never had it at anyone's expense." He sounded sincere to where I think that is what he wanted to believe for self image management. Also it was very ironic when the interviewer kept on alighting to how Jimmy was so unlike the usual hedonistic London crowd! To which Jimmy played along painting his life as one of hum drum charitable service, while dismissing his 5 houses spread throughout the UK. Most peculiar was the angle the interviewer pursued about how different Jimmy is from everyone else, how he seeks attention with his antics and persona. Jimmy dismisses this saying he doesn't try to be different, he's just a normal guy from the pits in Leeds.

I do get the sense that he is very conscious of the stage management of his public self. Very little doesn't seem to be orchestrated to some end. The interviewer is trying to blow him up, while the whole time Jimmy is playing humble pie. I think he comes across as genuine because he's chosen to eat his own garbage. I agree, though, he comes across as very intelligent. I'm not sure about how Thelemic he is though. I can see it, but I'm not sure his creeds elevate higher than his reptilian brain. (By this I mean the tripartite human brain, I don't think Jimmy was anything Ickian.)

It seems his Will was ultimately enslaved to malevolent passions which damaged a great many, which from all victim accounts he was aware of. There is no denying Jimmy did what he wilt, but I'd be very surprised if Jimmy really had any desire of ever really justifying his crimes as his right. Why all the harping about never having his fun at others expense then? Granted he had no bones about intimidating and trying to destroy victims who would possibly come forward, but seems more like regular criminal self preservation. I think at the end of the day he knew what he did was wrong and no criminal or occult creed could justify it. It seems evident that he wanted to be seen, and remembered, as a light bringer of fun, comfort and relief to those who needed it. Some of that was no doubt to have greater access to the vulnerable, but a large part also seemed to serve no other purpose but to assuage his conscience and to be generally seen as what the majority of people judge to be good. I don't see Jimmy as a unapologetic Crowley or Marquis De Sade figure who was living a grand dark philosophy, but just another opportunist who knew what he did was wrong and constantly sought to manage that with "good works". That type of hypocrisy is the pillar to many traditional religions. I'm sure Jimmy was just at home with the dark mass as he was the regular mass, and while it wouldn't be surprising to find Jimmy had links certain occult lodges, would it be any more surprising to see how deep Jimmy's links were with certain Bishops and Cardinals who committed the same heinous acts while still being aligned (publicly and privately) with Christ and not Crowley?

I'd have to research more of the above whether Jimmy was selected, inducted, and groomed initially into a lodge or cabal of sort that influenced him to a greater degree then he did them. I think there is obviously a trail and network to elite co-perpetrators and conspirators, but the BBC culture of his heyday may have been a bigger entree and governing mindset for all we know, to say nothing of seedy dance hall organized criminal sorts.

Oh, and I believe Jimmy when he said "I came from the pit." To the pit hopefully he returned.
If I knew all mysteries and all knowledge, and have not charity, I am nothing. St. Paul
I hang onto my prejudices, they are the testicles of my mind. Eric Hoffer
User avatar
brekin
 
Posts: 3229
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 5:21 pm
Blog: View Blog (1)

Re: Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

Postby AhabsOtherLeg » Sat Aug 02, 2014 10:27 pm

Read an interview with Myatt not too long ago, where he was asked to speculate upon if he had ever been involved (unwittingly...ahem) in Gladio type operations.

He wondered aloud if one of the groups he had been involved with by invitation (Column 88), which was far more organized and sober than the traditional British fash mobs he was used to hanging around with, might have had NATO/Gladio links, due to C88's professional-class membership, apparent close links to international Nazi groups, and generally high level of competence, fitness, and equipment (maps, files, comms, etc.) - at least, in comparison to the kind of hapless alcoholic hobgoblins who generally populate far-right groups.

But Myatt is a liar and a fraud, so we can only take his word for what it's worth. Not much.

This is some useful old news footage about Kincora. The uploader clearly has a political agenda on this issue, as do most of his commenters, but his agenda can't alter the old news footage from the time, which is well worth seeing:



This is what's going to make Kincora so hard to deal with though. All the competing agendas that will be flowing around it - not just the politics of back then, but the politics of now, and all the attendant tribalism, bigotry, fierce community-selfprotection, and outrageous black propaganda from both sides that has characterised the underside of NI life for far too long. Even if we leave British intelligence out of the picture altogether (as the official inquiry no doubt will) it's still going to get very messy very quick.

Or maybe not. Both sides have grown up a lot in recent decades. Decency and justice may now be possible. Here's hoping.
Last edited by AhabsOtherLeg on Sat Aug 02, 2014 10:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"The universe is 40 billion light years across and every inch of it would kill you if you went there. That is the position of the universe with regard to human life."
User avatar
AhabsOtherLeg
 
Posts: 3285
Joined: Sun Dec 30, 2007 8:43 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

Postby American Dream » Sat Aug 02, 2014 10:40 pm

Yeah- it's hardly news at this point that such GLADIO links likely exist- that shit has been on the street for years now. Myatt is just (kinda sorta) admitting to what is already known.
American Dream
 
Posts: 19946
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2007 4:56 pm
Location: Planet Earth
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Jimmy Savile: I'd like to comment but I can't...

Postby AhabsOtherLeg » Sat Aug 02, 2014 11:00 pm

True, it's actually his involvement with the occult - whatever it actually amounts to in the end - that he seems most keen to keep a secret (while still hinting/flirting/leaking about it the whole time, so that we all know about it). He's an odd chap, to say the least.
"The universe is 40 billion light years across and every inch of it would kill you if you went there. That is the position of the universe with regard to human life."
User avatar
AhabsOtherLeg
 
Posts: 3285
Joined: Sun Dec 30, 2007 8:43 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

PreviousNext

Return to General Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 10 guests