Questioning Consciousness

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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby Ben D » Mon Dec 16, 2013 9:16 pm

Yes my friend Sounder, I understand you understand things that I don't understand, every sentient being does, that's the underlying beauty of the otherwise apparent drabness if life...understanding that every soul one interacts with is bubbling up from the same Cosmic source. I respect this, but my time here incarnate is finite, my ego self serving knowledge and understanding to survive to this point and near future has worked, but I am retired now and face no threats (except the natural attrition that comes with the aging process), so the potential and opportunity for ego purging presents itself.

Your observation and conclusion that your seeker friend's egos still wax strongly behind a pretense of righteous and humility is taken, it has been my general observation also, but it is not my conclusion that it is the end of the story, as there have been examples of people manifesting superior virtue (practically egoless) I have been honoured to have met. It is my understanding that these advanced souls were once in that very state of inferior virtue (ego practicing virtue), until the ego purging process was completed. That's not to say that all your seeker friends will realize the true goal, but certainly souls who never even make the attempt to understand what and who they are in the bigger context of Cosmos, will not find that 'peace that passes understanding' that awaits those who seek to the very end where the conceptual delineation that separates the seeker from that sought....or could we say the...that separates the sounder from the source of all sounds..disappears. :)
There is That which was not born, nor created, nor evolved. If it were not so, there would never be any refuge from being born, or created, or evolving. That is the end of suffering. That is God**.

** or Nirvana, Allah, Brahman, Tao, etc...
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby chump » Tue Dec 17, 2013 12:23 pm

Elvis » Sun Dec 15, 2013 2:30 am wrote:


PS. After getting up from watching the movie and going into the kitchen, my cat peeked at me from around a dark corner. I took the eye-contact opportunity to mentally ask her, "well, sweetie, is there anything on your mind?" Her eyes glowed back at me from the dark.

"You know damn well what I want. More of that good tuna you gave me earlier." She jumped down and came over to me.

"But you just had some tuna," I say, out loud. I remind you, that stuff is expensive! How about a hug instead?"

I pick her up, she settles into my arms. "Purr."

Okay, enough, now she wants back down, onto the chair. I start to walk away and she swipes me with a claw! Well I never!

"You asked me what I want," she glared back, and walks to the refrigerator.

I relent, and a moment later she's at her bowl, chowing down tuna.

"Oh, and that litterbox ain't gonna clean itself."



(edited typos)




Who's a vegetarian?

When I read Elvis' cat story the other day, it reminded me of an encounter I had with a cockroach down in Texas. I told my wife of the experience then, and even wrote of it in a story - many, many, many years ago... Samsara. I couldn't find it, or I would've posted it; so I began to throw it together for you.

My wife woke up, and we watched the full version of Anna's video. We were cryin' like babies. It was funny. She went upstairs to shower and dress, while I continued to write the story. Then, I was thinking in the shower about the story while my wife was cooking breakfast...

A few years ago, I drove my mother to Texas to visit her dying sister in a hospital between Houston and Dallas near their parents' olde mini-mansion where we stayed.

The house was just as I remembered from my childhood: It was a red brick monster with white trim and doors. My mother walked fast ahead of me as I sauntered from the street up the wide concrete and red brick walkway, up those familiar wide red brick steps, and onto the red tiled front porch that was big enough to play hide and seek. We took another step up between two massive pillars that supported a balcony over the doorway. A leaded glass half moon window swept over the top, and you could kinda see through the leaded glass panels on each side of a glorious front door.

Mom unlocked the door and we stepped into the foyer. The only toilet on the main floor was in the back of the house, crammed beneathe the stairs, and a grown man had to hit his head to sit down to pee, or aim from the door.

I found myself not alone, but no one was there while I admired the tall ceilings, the enormous crystal chandelier that glimmered above the entry, giant Persian rugs on wood floors throughout, leaded and stained glass, 8" trim along the top of the walls and along the floor. Scarlett O'hara would've been proud of the wide, wooden staircase with an ornate dark rail swerving atop a line of white spindles, flowing up to a sitting area beneathe the leaded glass window at the top of the first flight... There was a beautiful antique table, with a white marble top on the landing; and two antique chairs that no one ever sat in. There must've been twenty stairs. I could almost see the slinkie walking down them. The rail curved around and up at the perfect angles, up eight more stairs and along the hallway over the stairwell at the top.

My grandparent's formal dining room, looking as it did in my youth, was to the left of the foyer. Through a swinging door toward the back of the dining room was a utility area, and a side door to the "porte-corchere". My grandmother would park just outside that side entrance. RD would park her car out back, out of the way.

RD was a old black man who worked for my grandparents for as long as I could remember. Geez... I'd follow him around and he'd talk to me as he did chores around the house. RD took me to meet his family once... Regretfully, I had forgotten about him... He was the best of the bunch, I think.

There was a carriage house in the back, where Granddad would work on his Chevy. But the the Imperial was just a little too wide to negotiate those olde timey doors. Someone must've lived in the apartment above it - long before; because I looked up there and saw the few belongings they left beneathe decades of dust.

There was a grandfather clock standing in the alcove between the swinging door into the dining room and the swinging door into the kitchen, and another set of steps that wound up to a second floor blue bedroom where as a kid I found a closet door with steps behind it; the steps that led to an enormous attic with big dormer windows in the front. The top floor was a managerie... A book unto itself.

The house was built by an odd couple who sold it to my grandparents during the 40's. My mother never lived there. She was already married, and then divorced. I visited my grandparents as a kid; but hadn't been there for twenty years at that point. All the rooms and furniture looked the same as it did in the 60's. Every room had it's knick-knacks; every knick-knack was a memory. The innocent memories overwhelmed me.

In the grandiose living room to the right of the foyer, next to the grand piano and between the giant fireplace and mirrors, amidst the high back sofa and chairs, an empty hospital bed sat in the middle of the room. Oxygen tanks were all around.

Just beyond the LR was the card room where Granny and I used to play dominoes in the sunlight that shone through the big windows around the sides. The french doors were hardly ever opened to that red tile porch in the front. She had an elevator in the back of the room, which went through the floor to her bedroom up above. The cardroom was where the open caskets were viewed, one by one, as they all passed away.

Two master bedrooms were separated by the hallway at the top of the stairs; The original owners designed it that way. He slept in one suite, and she on the opposite end of the house. There was a bathroom for each, another few bedrooms and a study between them. The study had french doors that opened onto a noisy sheet metal patio above the front door.

After my grandparents moved in, they slept on one side, and my great grand mother slept in the other suite. She lived there for 22 years. Aunt Kitty slept over the porte-cachere, next to the room with the closet to the attic - atop of those steps to the driveway.

My great grandmother lived to be 99 years old. I remember seeing her in the bedroom in which I was about to sleep. I was too shy to go in there, and never saw her anywhere else - except in the cardroom.

My mother's little sister never lived in another house. She moved into the suite when I was ten. People didn't give her much credit; but she was the mathematician.

My grandfather, a WWI pilot, was maybe the bravest. He didn't talk much, smoked like a fiend, and died of cancer only five years after his mother-in-law passed away.

Twelve years later, when I was supposedly all grown up, I held my grandmother's hand as she lay dying in Aunt Kitty's suite. Kitty wasn't there, and I never asked her why Granny was in the bed in which her mother had passed away. I can still see her. The only time I ever saw my grandmother cry was as I let go of her hand. I wish I'd stayed longer. She took care of her mother for all of those years, but no one was there for her in the end. She was the sweetest.

It was a tough night, that last night we visited Kitty in the same hospital where her father died. As we were about to leave, she asked as if we could bring her a chocolate shake from the local Dairy Queen. Mom was in a hurry, as always; but I insisted... Kitty smiled and held my hand as I gently helped her to the straw...

That night, my mother slept in her parent's olde room accross the house, and I fell asleep in the deathbed with the light and the TV on. My eyes gradually opened as I listened to a noise on the floor. Eventually, I rolled over to look, and spotted the source...

The cockroaches in Colorado are little bitties compared to those in Texas. This one was as big as my big toe! It was eating something next to the bed... It wasn't poison, thank God. I watched because I had never seen a roach this large... The bug noticed me and suddenly stopped chewing. We weren't going to hurt each other, just passing in the night. I laid back on my pillow, listening again... When I rolled over to look again. Much to my delight, my little buddy looked up; and it was a most gracious and glorious moment when he continued to chew. I rolled out of the other side the bed to turn out the light accross the room. I turned off the TV and laid in the dark as we talked silently in the night.

Yes, we conversed as those mandibles kept chewing; pausing now and then to ponder what was said... Next thing I knew, we were face to face...

Kind olde wisened compound eyes gazed through plasticky chitin (or whatever it is) into mine. "You're okay...", the olde soul told me, followed by something I didn't hear... Then I heard , "Ya' gotta a long, long way to go kid... " .

I'll never forget the spiney embrace!

----------------------
When I returned downstairs for breakfast following my shower, I spotted a fly bouncing against our front window. For the last few years, I typically trap such a fly in a plastic cup, slip a sheet paper beneathe it, so I can easily take it outside in the cup. Why smear it all over the glass? I also do this for spiders and bees.

The spiders and I now have a repore, and they don't even hardly come in anymore.

My wife, who is unaware of almost anything I write, watched from the kitchen as I trapped the fly, opened the door and set it free.

Out of the blue she asked me, "Did he talk to ya'?"

"What?", I replied.

"Weren't you the one who told me the story about the cockroach next to the bed?"
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby BrandonD » Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:42 pm

tapitsbo » Mon Dec 09, 2013 8:21 am wrote:my admittedly uninformed mind doesn't understand how mechanism isn't just an evolved response to qualia

it seems easier to trace the origin of the physical world back to information and sensations than it is to do the reverse.

so why is there a consensus that matter causes consciousness and not the other way around?

i mean, besides any hypothetical mind control enslavement conspiracy (which if it existed would naturally not be the whole story. right?)


My point of view exactly.

It is a by-product of religious oppression that scientific authorities still doggedly cling to the idea that matter is the fundamental basis of reality, and that consciousness is "generated" by matter.

Give it a few generations, and we will likely be seeing things differently.
"One measures a circle, beginning anywhere." -Charles Fort
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby DrEvil » Tue Dec 17, 2013 7:25 pm

An interesting piece about Google's job-scheduling software "Omega" (Predecessor is called "Borg" :o ). It's so big and complex it's starting to show emergent, unpredictable behaviors.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/11/04 ... ega_cloud/

IT'S ALIVE! IT'S ALIVE! Google's secretive Omega tech just like LIVING thing
'Biological' signals ripple through massive cluster management monster

One of Google's most advanced data center systems behaves more like a living thing than a tightly controlled provisioning system. This has huge implications for how large clusters of IT resources are going to be managed in the future.

"Emergent" behaviors have been appearing in prototypes of Google's Omega cluster management and application scheduling technology since its inception, and similar behaviors are regularly glimpsed in its "Borg" predecessor, sources familiar with the matter confirmed to The Register.

... more at link.
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby Allegro » Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:45 pm

chump » Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:23 am wrote:Who’s a vegetarian?

When I read Elvis’ cat story the other day, it reminded me of an encounter I had with a cockroach down in Texas. I told my wife of the experience then, and even wrote of it in a story - many, many, many years ago... Samsara. I couldn’t find it, or I would’ve posted it; so I began to throw it together for you.
chump, I LOVE your family story! Which can be read here or at the above link.

Thank You :sun:.

~ A.

(I too have a respectable camaraderie with cockroaches. Wherever we’ve met, I say something like ‘skedaddle’, and they just move along out of sight.)
Last edited by Allegro on Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby Saurian Tail » Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:51 pm

I attended an Ishwar Puri meditation conference in Garrison NY in August and this video is from the Saturday morning session. Having heard Ishwar speak twice since and watched dozens of his talks on youtube, I feel this is one of his quintessential presentations.

If you have any interest at all in exploring your own consciousness by going within, I feel watching this video will be worth your time. Each little story he tells has such a subtle lesson and message designed to communicate something about the nature of consciousness and the spiritual path.

I hope you enjoy it as much as I did.

"Taking it in its deepest sense, the shadow is the invisible saurian tail that man still drags behind him." -Carl Jung
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby Saurian Tail » Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:51 pm

Sorry for the double post ...
"Taking it in its deepest sense, the shadow is the invisible saurian tail that man still drags behind him." -Carl Jung
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby Elvis » Wed Dec 18, 2013 1:05 am

Allegro » Tue Dec 17, 2013 7:45 pm wrote:
chump » Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:23 am wrote:Who’s a vegetarian?

When I read Elvis’ cat story the other day, it reminded me of an encounter I had with a cockroach down in Texas. I told my wife of the experience then, and even wrote of it in a story - many, many, many years ago... Samsara. I couldn’t find it, or I would’ve posted it; so I began to throw it together for you.
chump, I LOVE your family story! Which can be read here or at the above link.

Thank You :sun:.

~ A.

(I too have a respectable camaraderie with cockroaches. Wherever we’ve met, I say something like ‘skedaddle’, and they just move along out of sight.)


Chump, thanks for telling that story, and so well with such detail!

I recently made a deal with a large spider -- who would normally freak me out. One reason I keep a cat is that most cats catch and eat spiders and generally keep the moths & other bugs down. But my cat was asleep when a large spider emerged from the dark recesses behind my desk monitor. I moved, it noticed me and stopped. I figured he'd (she'd?) run away if I made a threatening move, so I just said, out loud, "Okay, look, I know it's cold outside, so I'll leave you alone if you leave me alone, out of sight when I'm in here, m'kay...?" He or she calmly walked back into the shadows and I didn't see them again. I added, "If the cat sees you, you're on your own...m'kay?"
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby Sounder » Wed Dec 18, 2013 7:14 am

Thanks for that well told story chump. I wonder how many folk toy with the idea that all our fellow creatures not only display consciousness but indeed participate in the larger web of signals more effectively than humans because their conceptual structures are less rigid.

Panpsychism has appeal in that it would seem to tend to engender respect for our fellow travelers.

Thanks Saurian tail for the Ishwar Puri vid, -that guy is very sharp.

Happiness is contagious, catch the bug today. :bigsmile :partydance:
All these things will continue as long as coercion remains a central element of our mentality.
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby minime » Thu Dec 19, 2013 2:37 pm

To understand consciousness and its evolution, we need to ask the right questions.


What is consciousness?

Can it even be defined, or merely described. You cannot hope to contain it.

It reminds me of the apocryphal Sufi tale of the eight blind priests and the elephant in the temple of Solomon.

Via Wikipedia...

"Mind and Mental Factors: the Fifty-one Types of Subsidiary Awareness". Berlin, Germany; June 2002; revised July, 2006: The Berzin Archives. Retrieved 14 February 2013. "Unlike the Western view of consciousness as a general faculty that can be aware of all sensory and mental objects, Buddhism differentiates six types of consciousness, each of which is specific to one sensory field or to the mental field. A primary consciousness cognizes merely the essential nature (ngo-bo) of an object, which means the category of phenomenon to which something belongs. For example, eye consciousness cognizes a sight as merely a sight. The Chittamatra schools add two more types of primary consciousness to make their list of an eightfold network of primary consciousnesses (rnam-shes tshogs-brgyad): deluded awareness (nyon-yid), alayavijnana (kun-gzhi rnam-shes, all-encompassing foundation consciousness, storehouse consciousness). Alayavijnana is an individual consciousness, not a universal one, underlying all moments of cognition. It cognizes the same objects as the cognitions it underlies, but is a nondetermining cognition of what appears to it (snang-la ma-nges-pa, inattentive cognition) and lacks clarity of its objects. It carries karmic legacies (sa-bon) and the mental impressions of memories, in the sense that both are nonstatic abstractions imputed on the alayavijnana. The continuity of an individual alayavijnana ceases with the attainment of enlightenment."
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby Elvis » Sun Dec 22, 2013 7:40 pm

DrEvil » Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:00 pm wrote:Serious question(s): Life is weird. What makes us so special? Why does our consciousness have to be somehow "outside" the material universe, or spiritual, if you will? Is it "just" another religious belief based on subjective experience, or is there something more tangible (bad choice of word, I know) to it (research, reproducible results, etc.)?


Hi DrEvil, I've been wanting to reply to this, but at first glance it seemed like a lot of work to fully cite the origins of my thinking about conciousness. So rather than write here about all the reasons I think consciousness exists "outside" of, even precedes, physical/tangible bodies and brains, I'll start with one aspect of it: reincarnation; I think reincarnation is pertinent to this dicussion since it implies a persistence of consciousness across across different physical manifestations ("lives"). We can include the "NDE" (Near Death Experience) phenomena since that seems to be related.

I was prompted to post today when I saw that this fellow Jim B. Tucker was going to be interviewed on the radio tonight (on the "Coast to Coast AM" program). Dr. Tucker has been studying the accounts of children who talk about previous lives. This from his website bio:

JIM B. TUCKER, M.D. is Bonner-Lowry Associate Professor of Psychiatry and Neurobehavioral Sciences at the University of Virginia. He is continuing the work of Dr. Ian Stevenson at the UVA Division of Perceptual Studies with children who report memories of previous lives. A board-certified child psychiatrist, Dr. Tucker worked with Dr. Stevenson for several years before taking over the research upon Dr. Stevenson’s retirement in 2002.
...
Dr. Tucker, who was raised Southern Baptist, had never seriously considered the idea of reincarnation before reading one of Dr. Stevenson’s book. After learning about the work, he became intrigued both by the children’s reports of past-life memories and by the prospect of studying them using an objective, scientific approach. He contacted the Division and in 1999 began working there half-time. A year later, he gave up his private practice completely to work at the university. He has now published two books and numerous papers in scientific journals.
http://www.jimbtucker.com/bio.html


So far so good? An MD, a professor of psychiatry at a recognized university (University of Virginia rated #2 Top Public School by US News), who was intrigued enough by the findings of his predecessor to undertake, rather admirably I think, a full-time scientific approach to understanding what is, in any case, a curious phenomenon.

I'll listen to the interview if I can, and maybe it'll be posted online later. (Find a station here: http://www.coasttocoastam.com/stations)

I've heard and read many instances of young children spontaneously speaking of another life they lived, often in sharp detail. It's easy to search them out on the internetz. (The memories, if that's what they are, seem to 'erase' as the child grows older.) I believe Nordic here on RI has related how his son did pretty much the same thing. So I'm looking forward to hearing this show to see what, if anything, new has been learned.


More research at University of Virginia -- worth having a look around this page:

The Division of Perceptual Studies

Information about the Division of Perceptual Studies

The Division of Perceptual Studies (DOPS), formerly the Division of Personality Studies, is a unit of the Department of Psychiatry & Neurobehavioral Sciences at the University of Virginia, in Charlottesville, VA. The Division of Perceptual Studies (DOPS) was founded as a research unit of the Department of Psychiatric Medicine at UVA by Dr. Ian Stevenson in 1967. (see History and Description for more information about the founding of DOPS).

Utilizing scientific methods, the researchers within The Division of Perceptual Studies investigate apparent paranormal phenomena, especially:

Children Who Claim to Remember Previous Lives (reincarnation)

UVA Alumni Magazine, winter 2013, Read the article which focuses on the research of Children Who Claim to Remember Previous Lives being conducted by Dr. Jim B. Tucker. Click here to read "The Science of Reincarnation: UVA psychiatrist Jim Tucker investigates children's claims of past lives" by Sean Lyons.


Videos on the topic of Reincarnation Research:

Watch a video of Dr. Jim Tucker describing a young boy who has memories of a previous life in which he was his own grandfather. In this video, Dr. Tucker discusses his own research as well as the research conducted by the esteemed founder of DOPS, the late Dr. Ian Stevenson. Click here to view the video.


Radio Interviews on the topic of Reincarnation Research:

Listen to Dr. Jim Tucker describe some of the findings, including unusual play, behavior patterns, specific phobias, and birthmarks or birth defects specifically related to the life and death of a previous personality. He discusses the interpretation of the data and details about the methodology as well as possible pitfalls of individual cases. This interview was conducted by Dean Radin Ph.D. on December 8, 2010. This interview was done for the IONS Telseminars series. Dean Radin is well known for his best selling books The Conscious Universe (HarperOne, 1997) and Entangled Minds (Simon & Schuster, 2006). Dr. Radin is currently Senior Scientist at the Institute of Noetic Sciences (IONS) and Adjunct Faculty in the Department of Psychology at Sonoma State University.


Dr. Tucker appeared on the syndicated Wisconsin Public Radio program "To the Best of Our Knowledge" in November of 2005 to discuss his book and research in the area of reincarnation. Follow this link to hear Dr. Tucker in segment two of the program entitled The Meaning of Life: In the Beginning.


Near-Death Experiences

Read an article from the UVA Alumni Magazine, summer 2007 ,focusing on the research into Near-Death Experiences being conducted by Dr. Bruce Greyson. Click here to read "Altered States: Scientists analyze the near-death experience" by Lee Graves.
Dr. Greyson presented the DOPS research on NDE's to His Holiness the Dalai Lama and to the monks of Dharamsala, December, 2011 at the conference titled Cosmology and Consciousness: A Dialog Between Buddhist Scholars and Scientists on Mind and Matter . Dr. Greyson's talk was titled, "Is Consciousness Produced by the Brain?" Click here to learn more about the conference and to view photos of Dr. Greyson presenting the DOPS research to His Holiness the Dalai Lama and to the monks of Dharamsala.
Video on the topic of Near Death Experience Research:

This video is an excerpt of a Nour Foundation panel discussion at the September 11, 2008 United Nations Symposium, "Beyond the Mind-Body Problem: New Paradigms in the Science of Consciousness," In this video, Dr. Bruce Greyson is discussing "Near Death Experiences-Beyond the Mind Body Problem". Click here to view the video.
Here is another excerpt from the same Nour Foundation panel discussion in 2008. In this portion of the video, Dr. Greyson is discussing the idea of consciousness beyond physical brain activity. Click here to view the video.


Radio Interviews on the topic of Near Death Experiences:

Listen to Dr. Bruce Greyson discussing how cumulative research into Near Death Experiences challenges both a classical physical view of reality and an exclusively neuroscience-based view of consciousness. This interview was conducted by Dean Radin Ph.D. on October 13, 2010. The interview was done for the IONS Teleseminars series. Dean Radin is well known for his best selling books The Conscious Universe (HarperOne, 1997) and Entangled Minds (Simon & Schuster, 2006). Dr. Radin is currently Senior Scientist at the Institute of Noetic Sciences (IONS) and Adjunct Faculty in the Department of Psychology at Sonoma State University.


Listen to Dr. Bruce Greyson discussing Near Death Experiences in an interview from November, 2006, hosted by Sarah McConnell on the award winning public radio program With Good Reason .


Other areas we are interested in studying at the Division of Perceptual Studies:

Out of Body Experiences
Apparitions and After-Death Communications
Deathbed Visions
Psychophysiological Studies of Altered States of Consciousness and Psi
EEG Imaging Lab: Experimental Research of Psi Effects and Altered States of Consciousness


We welcome written accounts of experiences of these kinds. See What We Study and Contacting Us .

http://www.medicine.virginia.edu/clinic ... /cspp/dops



And their site has a killer bibliography:

Recommended Books

Books Recommended by Division Staff
The following is a list of books on various aspects of psychical research (also known as parapsychology) that are recommended by the faculty at the Division of Perceptual Studies. There are books on psychical research in general, many of which cover a variety of topics, and books on various specific topics as well.

http://www.medicine.virginia.edu/clinic ... books-page



I'm tempted to post the whole bibliography but don't want to clog the post too much. So concluding for now, there is some research by serious folks. Needless to say, I haven't reviewed it all myself, but overall I think it's a good direction. Recall that Carl Sagan, Mr. "Extraordinary Claims Require Extraordinary Proof" himself, traveled to India in investigate a case of a child claiming to have lived a previous life; long story short, Sagan came away convinced that something he couldn't explain was going on there, and that the phenomenon demanded closer study.


Lastly, DrEvil, I admire your clarity of mind, your knowledge, your great sense of humor and your contributions here at RI generally -- so I look forward to any discussion that might follow from this. That goes for one and all, of course!
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby Sounder » Mon Dec 23, 2013 7:16 am

Reincarnation is a word that carries implications that may trace back to ‘hopes’ for the long term existence of a particular expression of being. If I remember correctly, Buddhists consider, in a typically elitist manner (sorry), that the only ones that really ‘reincarnate’ are the Tulku’s, because they are the only ones that can maintain focus in the radically different environments of life and death. Still, the idea may hold a kernel of truth in that the impressions that many report as being memories of past lives, may represent lets say, resonance with the (vibrational) residue of prior efforts to organize the information signals and patterns that are our sources for understanding.

We are all receivers with attenuated signal processing capabilities.

Sorry about the brevity, but I gotta get back to the lab to work on my resonance accelerator devise. :eeyaa
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby slimmouse » Mon Dec 23, 2013 10:55 am

Hey Elivis , Dr tucker appearerd in this podcast I recently posted in another thread.


http://mysteriousuniverse.org/2013/12/10-22-mu-podcast/

I wrote a section on proof of reincarnation in my own little book, What I principally focused on was the work of Dr Ian Stevenson. As tazmic pointed out in the other thread, Stevenson wrote a book listing the six best cases, based not only on testimony but physical evidence. He studied around 2000 cases.

I had the book up in pdf format on my website which is down temporarily, but there must be many sites where the book can be found.

Living in south East Asia as I do, I can tell you that faith in the phenomenon is almost legion around here. In the podcast I posted , at one point, Tucker refers to the scientifically unreliable nature of many the claims, because for instance they used to put soot paste on their babies as a form of birthmark in order that if they lost their child young , they might subsequently recognise them in reincarnated form.

I almost fell of my chair, because this was exactly what my girlfriend told me happened to her, (at least according to the parents of her previous incarnation). When she was born with a big brown birthmark on her back, another family claimed to have made that mark on their own lost daughter.

I think you will find that Dr Stevensons cases are far more scientifically compelling however.
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby minime » Mon Dec 23, 2013 1:15 pm

Sounder » Mon Dec 23, 2013 6:16 am wrote:Reincarnation is a word that carries implications that may trace back to ‘hopes’ for the long term existence of a particular expression of being. If I remember correctly, Buddhists consider, in a typically elitist manner (sorry), that the only ones that really ‘reincarnate’ are the Tulku’s, because they are the only ones that can maintain focus in the radically different environments of life and death. Still, the idea may hold a kernel of truth in that the impressions that many report as being memories of past lives, may represent lets say, resonance with the (vibrational) residue of prior efforts to organize the information signals and patterns that are our sources for understanding.

We are all receivers with attenuated signal processing capabilities.

Sorry about the brevity, but I gotta get back to the lab to work on my resonance accelerator devise. :eeyaa


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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby Elvis » Mon Dec 23, 2013 3:00 pm

Thanks for the reincarnation comments, I'll consider anything. I listened to the interview and I must say the work is pretty damn compelling! It definitely confirmed my bias, anyway. :mrgreen:

More later whan I have time (and more coffee).
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