Questioning Consciousness

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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby NeonLX » Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:45 pm

thrulookingglass » Mon Aug 05, 2019 7:06 am wrote:While ensconced in dream we fail to perceive that what's going on around us isn't normal reality. What makes us think that 'normal reality' isn't just a dream as well? It's projected consciousness. The greys once told someone, "life is God's dream." This is also why psychedelics can be helpful as they assist us in understanding the bizarre.


Good question. I've always been drawn towards the bizarre. I suppose it's because I realized early on that I wasn't "normal". I didn't think or act like my peers.

Now back to the regularly scheduled dream program.
America is a fucked society because there is no room for essential human dignity. Its all about what you have, not who you are.--Joe Hillshoist
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby 82_28 » Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:16 pm

coffin_dodger » Tue Jun 18, 2019 8:34 am wrote::rofl2 Chump, you been told.

Please keep posting your thoughts here, they are always interesting.

If the self-appointed pseudo-mods of this board had any power to ban you, they would have done so by now. They have not, because they do not have any power. They are impotent - and this makes them very cross and quick to anger. We shall see a good example of this, in the next few posts.

Consciousness displayed, shall we say.


You're hilarious. First off I'm down with chump. He posts great photos and overall he is a Denver sports fan like me. I guess I am a "pseudo mod" in the sense really I don't step in or nor do I start a new and now defunct forum because I become angry that someone is thinking for themselves. It's some kind of wonder how that site keeled over. Seriously, it is not that hard to be nice.
There is no me. There is no you. There is all. There is no you. There is no me. And that is all. A profound acceptance of an enormous pageantry. A haunting certainty that the unifying principle of this universe is love. -- Propagandhi
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby NeonLX » Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:21 pm

coffin_dodger » Tue Jun 18, 2019 8:34 am wrote::rofl2 Chump, you been told.

Please keep posting your thoughts here, they are always interesting.

If the self-appointed pseudo-mods of this board had any power to ban you, they would have done so by now. They have not, because they do not have any power. They are impotent - and this makes them very cross and quick to anger. We shall see a good example of this, in the next few posts.

Consciousness displayed, shall we say.


Y'know...this is precisely the kind of pettiness that drove me away from RI for so long. Cheap shots being tossed around like what you'd get from a bunch of kids riding the bus to middle school.

I suppose I'm now guilty of taking a cheap shot at a cheap shot.
America is a fucked society because there is no room for essential human dignity. Its all about what you have, not who you are.--Joe Hillshoist
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby BenDhyan » Mon Aug 05, 2019 8:30 pm

thrulookingglass » Mon Aug 05, 2019 10:06 pm wrote:While ensconced in dream we fail to perceive that what's going on around us isn't normal reality. What makes us think that 'normal reality' isn't just a dream as well? It's projected consciousness. The greys once told someone, "life is God's dream."

As I understand it, the ego's perception of, and interaction with, life's experiences is like a dream relative to a non-self centered view of reality. By 'non-self centered'. I mean the state of mind where there are no preferences involved in the observation of life's activities. A mind that has preferences will forever be in a state of disturbance as it has no real power to prevent things from happening outside its control. In a non-self centered mind, there is no preference for having no preferences, just an acceptance of whatever unfolds in the eternally flowing now moment of life..
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby Sounder » Tue Aug 06, 2019 9:17 pm

Ben wrote...
A mind that has preferences will forever be in a state of disturbance as it has no real power to prevent things from happening outside its control.


Sounds a bit hardcore Zen. While I can see preferences as leading to a state of disturbance in the mind, doesn't discrimination do the same thing and yet is considered to have value. Anyway we are humans and do have disturbed minds. Perhaps another alternative to lessen disturbance, (without introducing a recipe for a superiority complex), would be to aspire to an attitude of acceptance.

Within limits of course, not as an absolute.
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby BenDhyan » Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:25 pm

Sounder » Wed Aug 07, 2019 11:17 am wrote:Ben wrote...
A mind that has preferences will forever be in a state of disturbance as it has no real power to prevent things from happening outside its control.


Sounds a bit hardcore Zen. While I can see preferences as leading to a state of disturbance in the mind, doesn't discrimination do the same thing and yet is considered to have value. Anyway we are humans and do have disturbed minds. Perhaps another alternative to lessen disturbance, (without introducing a recipe for a superiority complex), would be to aspire to an attitude of acceptance.

Within limits of course, not as an absolute.

Yes, it is Zen understanding, but also Sufism, Taoism, Sanatan Dharma, etc. I stated it in the context of comparing the separate 'dream' type reality experienced by each soul relative to actual reality devoid of filtering through their conceptualizing mind. Now I am not suggesting that it is possible for anyone to suddenly still their mind permanently, and even if they could, they would not be able to function or survive in this world. However for those who ponder that which is beyond the dualistic mind's 'dream' about this reality we call life, stilling the mind is the goal. With practice, and with many errors of good judgment along the way, little by little glimpses are apprehended which alter the mind incrementally in ways that allow the mind to eventually intuitively know when it is appropriate to use the dualistic mind state and when it is appropriate to drop into the oneness state.
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Yes Sounder, acceptance grows as the aspirant's mind is modified by the mindfulness meditation practice, or any other efficacious method. J Krishnamurti used to say the means to an end is end, and so it is with mindfulness/still mind meditation, the mind's true potential will be realized little by little.
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby chump » Wed Aug 07, 2019 7:13 am

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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby thrulookingglass » Wed Aug 07, 2019 8:25 am

In response to BenDhyan post regarding *Buddhist philosophies and the statement: A mind that has preferences will forever be in a state of disturbance as it has no real power to prevent things from happening outside its control

We'd have to dig into what is the "self" in this case, which would take forever to explain or know. Preferences are one thing, but knowing, but still greater, doing right rather than wrong is always the path to enlightenment. This 'stilling of the mind' is an interesting level of control over thought; it doesn't change the fact that children are starving in Africa. Doesn't stop bombs from falling from the skies in Syria. It strikes me as meager, lowly to suggest we cannot or do not have impetus to change events in our world. The more we believe/perceive ourselves 'powerless' the more we become it. Acceptance isn't endorsing either for to make use of violence or evil is to become it. I believe it to be fact that we are all tied together in this medium of life. Thereby, when we refuse to treat other peoples lives as important we degrade them. Life is an activity, not passivity. Righteous social action is VITAL to a healthy society. Being emotionally sound, educated, wise in that which is virtuous for the individual and the whole is one way we conquer ignorant behaviors.

I feel this should have its own topic, but I’ll throw it out here. There has been talk in the media, print mostly about “dark psychic forces” in regards to Trump's rhetoric stirring up hate and animosity. I was surprised to see these terms used in the media for it does launch us into the spiritual. “Dark psychic forces” we have truly entered a new age. Is it a real phenomenon? Yes. A lot of these “dark psychic forces” do make us feel insignificant was one thing I noticed. Making people feel powerless, running scared (terrorism), inadequate is the command of this ‘octopus' that has us in its clutches. The corporate military industrial complex functions to destroy the power of the individual not reinforce it and this is trickery, fuckery, and an ill-mannered way of controlling people. The worker is an axe at the grindstone. Its what we labor at that is important, not how hard we work at given task. Doesn't higher consciousness compel us into existentialism? Perception, it should be a long study for all. A lot of this is emotional control/emotional intelligence as you can see how in society our emotions are used to route us down certain paths, and when I say certain paths I mean vapid endeavors. To the heart of that statement though that Trump’s bolstered attitude created a sympathetic vibration that helped foster hatred amongst his crowd of intellectually imperiled souls. The conscious machine functions much like the worlds, garbage in, garbage out. If our thinking is shit than our world is probably shit. Example, it is wrong to think war is useful, it is wrong to think the Earth’s/Universes resources require money to obtain. When ‘loony’ new-agers, spiritualists, and even some organized religions talk about a ‘shift in consciousness’ this is exactly what we mean, that righteousness shall become our path. Rise up slave, you have nothing to lose but your chains. A house divided cannot stand. Reminds me of the Simpson’s episode where the independent though alarm keeps going off. This fucking world is eating me alive lately. But something is stirring in the mist. If we ever get outta this, drinks are on me…
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby BenDhyan » Wed Aug 07, 2019 7:39 pm

thrulookingglass » Wed Aug 07, 2019 10:25 pm wrote:In response to BenDhyan post regarding *Buddhist philosophies and the statement: A mind that has preferences will forever be in a state of disturbance as it has no real power to prevent things from happening outside its control

We'd have to dig into what is the "self" in this case, which would take forever to explain or know. Preferences are one thing, but knowing, but still greater, doing right rather than wrong is always the path to enlightenment. This 'stilling of the mind' is an interesting level of control over thought; it doesn't change the fact that children are starving in Africa. Doesn't stop bombs from falling from the skies in Syria. It strikes me as meager, lowly to suggest we cannot or do not have impetus to change events in our world. The more we believe/perceive ourselves 'powerless' the more we become it. Acceptance isn't endorsing either for to make use of violence or evil is to become it. I believe it to be fact that we are all tied together in this medium of life. Thereby, when we refuse to treat other peoples lives as important we degrade them. Life is an activity, not passivity. Righteous social action is VITAL to a healthy society. Being emotionally sound, educated, wise in that which is virtuous for the individual and the whole is one way we conquer ignorant behaviors.

My comments have as their context the idea that normal awake state consciousness is like a dream, as per your..."While ensconced in dream we fail to perceive that what's going on around us isn't normal reality. What makes us think that 'normal reality' isn't just a dream as well? It's projected consciousness."

This understanding is common to many religious traditions, and the basis of the concept of 'maya'. For those who take normal awake state consciousness as the ultimate reality, a deep peace of mind will never be realized. I am not suggesting that people who think their personal conceptual reality is truly reality should stop projecting, only that so long as they do, their mind will always be disturbed by happenings in life that they see as right and/or wrong. I am not saying there are not very wrong events occurring, just that the eternal conflict between opposites is an underlying principle of the universe, and thus the wise have another way of dealing with it, remove the mote from their own eye first, ie., cease setting up in their own mind ideas that they are for, against thsose which they are not for.
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby minime » Wed Aug 07, 2019 8:59 pm

BenDhyan » Wed Aug 07, 2019 6:39 pm wrote:I am not saying there are not very wrong events occurring, just that the eternal conflict between opposites is an underlying principle of the universe


Is that so?
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby BenDhyan » Wed Aug 07, 2019 11:02 pm

Yin Yang...positive negative...high pressure low pressure...
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby minime » Thu Aug 08, 2019 12:28 am

BenDhyan » Wed Aug 07, 2019 10:02 pm wrote:Yin Yang...positive negative...high pressure low pressure...


I recall we have crossed paths before. Well, you were on the path, worn and trod by others. I was merely crossing it.
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby BenDhyan » Thu Aug 08, 2019 1:16 am

minime » Thu Aug 08, 2019 2:28 pm wrote:
BenDhyan » Wed Aug 07, 2019 10:02 pm wrote:Yin Yang...positive negative...high pressure low pressure...


I recall we have crossed paths before. Well, you were on the path, worn and trod by others. I was merely crossing it.

Many apparent paths, one real ending I understand, my best wishes.
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby thrulookingglass » Thu Aug 08, 2019 8:28 am

Not meant as a personal critique. I do think Buddhism is short sighted. All religions and belief systems fostered thereby always seem to preach, "free beer tomorrow". You'll attain enlightenment once you pass this point but not before. I'd like to think the answers to life are simple. If what we're doing in society isn't producing a peaceful, loving world, then things need to change. The streets of Venezuela, South Korea and Puerto Rico are showing that when people get organized they can affect change in their world. That seems like a cop out too, fix yourself before you fix anyone else. We're all connected and if your tribe is murdering, making war with another, robbing and pillaging it effects me and many others as well. We do have to stand for principled beliefs. This can be thrust into the 'force of modifying behavior' thread too. Enforcing law often becomes vengeful. Discipline doesn't have to be demeaning (see black man being trotted down main st in ropes). We all make mistakes, setting someone up at the pillory as an example for the rest of the community to shame is depraved. Compassion is our greatest gift.
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Re: Questioning Consciousness

Postby minime » Thu Aug 08, 2019 9:15 am

glass,

Compassion is the basic tenet of Mahayana Buddhism. Enlightenment is incremental.

The streets of Venezuela, South Korea and Puerto Rico et al are showing that when people get organized, they can die en masse.

Reverse your use of affect/effect.
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