Cathy, Mark, Colin, Roseanne To Speak on MK in L.A.

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Postby lightningBugout » Sat Jun 06, 2009 5:44 am

Drove by the site of the demolished Ambassador hotel on my way home too.
"What's robbing a bank compared with founding a bank?" Bertolt Brecht
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Postby norton ash » Sat Jun 06, 2009 1:44 pm

Thank you, LBOut and Hugh. There is an RA survivor/activist/writer in my own small city who is dismissed by the few I know familiar with her work (and her unsuccessful approaches to police and failed lawsuits some 10-12 years ago) as "nuts."

Her testimony is eerie and has more than a ring of truth. One of the powerful names she named did actually do some soft, short time for hiring underage prostitutes... but this arrest was a straight cop bust emerging from his being at the wrong party at the wrong time.

I want to introduce a couple of smart, free-thinking local folk I know to her writing... I also think I'd like to talk to her.

She names names, and her written work and testimony is (or was) on the web. And nobody's sued her, and very few locals know anything about all this.

I agree with your sentiments about RI, lightningbugout. It's a privilege to share thoughts and info with people who aren't tiresomely whack-a-doo or have agendae... with that in mind (heh) I don't care WHAT people say about the Manatee either, I always read you with keen interest, Hugh.
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Postby chiggerbit » Sat Jun 06, 2009 2:49 pm

and the other one (is it called Mockingbird? No, couldnt be...what is it called again, the FOX one?)


I don't think this is the one you are talking about, but I didn't realize MKUltra had more or less been re-named:

http://74.125.95.132/search?q=cache:JLm ... clnk&gl=us

While Gottlieb was effecting these changes, his programs were coming
under attack from another quarter. In 1963 the CIA Inspector General did the
study that led to the suspension of unwitting drug testing in the San
Francisco and New York safehouses. This was a blow to Gottlieb, who clearly
intended to hold on to this kind of research. At the same time, the
Inspector General also recommended that Agency officials draft a new charter
for the whole MKULTRA program, which still was exempt from most internal CIA
controls. He found that many of the MKULTRA subprojects were of
"insufficient sensitivity" to justify bypassing the Agency's normal
procedures for approving and storing records of highly classified programs.
Richard Helms, still the protector of unfettered behavioral research,
responded by agreeing that there should be a new charter—on the condition
that it be almost the same as the old one. "The basic reasons for requesting
waiver of standardized administrative controls over these sensitive
activities are as valid today as they were in April, 1953," Helms wrote.
Helms agreed to such changes as having the CIA Director briefed on the
programs twice a year, but he kept the approval process within his control
and made sure that all the files would be retained inside TSS. And as
government officials so often do when they do not wish to alter anything of
substance, he proposed a new name for the activity. In June 1964 MKULTRA
became MKSEARCH.

Gottlieb acknowledged that security did not require transferring all the
surviving MKULTRA subprojects over to MKSEARCH. He moved 18 subprojects back
into regular Agency funding channels, including ones dealing with the
sneezing powders, stink bombs, and other "harassment substances." TSS
officials had encouraged the development of these as a way to make a target
physically uncomfortable and hence to cause short-range changes in his
behavior.

Other MKULTRA subprojects dealt with ways to maximize stress on whole
societies. Just as Gittinger's Personality Assessment System provided a
psychological road map for exploiting an individual's weaknesses, CIA
"destabilization" plans provided guidelines for destroying the internal
integrity of target countries like Castro's Cuba or Allende's Chile.
Control— whether of individuals or nations—has been the Agency's main
business, and TSS officials supplied tools for the "macro" as well as the
"micro" attacks....



...Leaving this broader sort of program out of the new structure, Gottlieb
regrouped the most sensitive behavioral activities under the MKSEARCH
umbrella. He chose to continue seven projects, and the ones he picked give a
good indication of those parts of MKULTRA that Gottlieb considered important
enough to save. These included none of the sociological studies, nor the
search for a truth drug. Gottlieb put the emphasis on chemical and
biological substances—not because he thought these could be used to turn men
into robots, but because he valued them for their predictable ability to
disorient, discredit, injure, or kill people. He kept active two private
labs to produce such substances, funded consultants who had secure ways to
test them and ready access to subjects, and maintained a funding conduit to
pass money on to these other contractors. Here are the seven surviving
MKSEARCH subprojects:

First on the TSS list was the safehouse program for drug testing run by
George White and others in the Federal Bureau of Narcotics. Even in 1964,
Gottlieb and Helms had not given up hope that unwitting experiments could be
resumed, and the Agency paid out $30,000 that year to keep the safehouses
open. In the meantime, something was going on at the "pad"—or at least
George White kept on sending the CIA vouchers for unorthodox expenses—$1,100
worth in February 1965 alone under the old euphemism for prostitutes,
"undercover agents for operations." What White was doing with or to these
agents cannot be said, but he kept the San Francisco operation active right
up until the time it finally closed in June. Gottlieb did not give up on the
New York safehouse until the following year.

[3]
MKSEARCH Subproject #2 involved continuing a $150,000a-year contract
with a Baltimore biological laboratory This lab, run by at least one former
CIA germ expert, gave TSS "a quick-delivery capability to meet anticipated
future operational needs," according to an Agency document. Among other
things, it provided a private place for "large-scale production of
microorganisms." The Agency was paying the Army Biological Laboratory at
Fort Detrick about $100,000 a year for the same services. With its more
complete facilities, Fort Detrick could be used to create and package more
esoteric bacteria, but Gottlieb seems to have kept the Baltimore facility
going in order to have a way of producing biological weapons without the
Army's germ warriors knowing about it. This secrecy-within-secrecy was not
unusual when TSS men were dealing with subjects as sensitive as infecting
targets with diseases. Except on the most general level, no written records
were kept on the subject. Whenever an operational unit in the Agency asked
TSS about obtaining a biological weapon, Gottlieb or his aides automatically
turned down the request unless the head of the Clandestine Services had
given his prior approval. Gottlieb handled these operational needs
personally, and during the early 1960s (when CIA assassination attempts
probably were at their peak) even Gottlieb's boss, the TSS chief, was not
told what was happening.

With his biological arsenal assured, Gottlieb also secured his chemical
flank in MKSEARCH. Another subproject continued a relationship set up in
1959 with a prominent industrialist who headed a complex of companies,
including one that custom-manufactured rare chemicals for pharmaceutical
producers. This man, whom on several occasions CIA officials gave $100 bills
to pay for his products, was able to perform specific lab jobs for the
Agency without consulting with his board of directors. In 1960 he supplied
the Agency with 3 kilos (6.6 pounds) of a deadly carbamate—the same poison
OSS's Stanley Lovell tried to use against Hitler.

[4] This company president also was useful to the Agency because he was a
ready source of information on what was going on in the chemical world. The
chemical services he offered, coupled with his biological counterpart, gave
the CIA the means to wage "instant" chemical and biological attacks—a
capability that was frequently used, judging by the large numbers of
receipts and invoices that the CIA released under the Freedom of Information
Act.

With new chemicals and drugs constantly coming to their attention
through their continuing relations with the major pharmaceutical companies,
TSS officials needed places to test them, particularly after the safehouses
closed. Dr. James Hamilton, the San Francisco psychiatrist who worked with
George White in the original OSS marijuana days, provided a way. He became
MKSEARCH Subproject #3.

Hamilton had joined MKULTRA in its earliest days and had been used as a
West Coast supervisor for Gottlieb and company. Hamilton was one of the
renaissance men of the program, working on everything from psychochemicals
to kinky sex to carbon-dioxide inhalation. By the early 1960s, he had
arranged to get access to prisoners at the California Medical Facility at
Vacaville.

[5] Hamilton worked through a nonprofit research institute connected to the
Facility to carry out, as a document puts it, "clinical testing of
behavioral control materials" on inmates. Hamilton's job was to provide
"answers to specific questions and solutions to specific problems of direct
interest to the Agency." In a six-month span in 1967 and 1968, the
psychiatrist spent over $10,000 in CIA funds simply to pay volunteers— which
at normal rates meant he experimented on between 400 to 1,000 inmates in
that time period alone.

Another MKSEARCH subproject provided $20,000 to $25,000 a year to Dr.
Carl Pfeiffer. Pfeiflfer's Agency connection went back to 1951, when he
headed the Pharmacology Department at the University of Illinois Medical
School. He then moved to Emory University and tested LSD and other drugs on
inmates of the Federal penitentiary in Atlanta. From there, he moved to New
Jersey, where he continued drug experiments on the prisoners at the
Bordentown reformatory. An internationally known pharmacologist, Pfeiffer
provided the MKSEARCH program with data on the preparation, use, and effect
of drugs. He was readily available if Gottlieb or a colleague wanted a study
made of the properties of a particular substance, and like most of TSS's
contractors, he also was an intelligence source. Pfeiffer was useful in this
last capacity during the latter part of the 1960s because he sat on the Food
and Drug Administration committee that allocated LSD for scientific research
in the United States. By this time, LSD was so widely available on the black
market that the Federal Government had replaced the CIA's informal controls
of the 1950s with laws and procedures forbidding all but the most strictly
regulated research. With Pfeiffer on the governing committee, the CIA could
keep up its traditional role of monitoring above-ground LSD experimentation
around the United States.

To cover some of the more exotic behavioral fields, another MKSEARCH
program continued TSS's relationship with Dr. Maitland Baldwin, the brain
surgeon at the National Institutes of Health who had been so willing in 1955
to perform "terminal experiments" in sensory deprivation for Morse Allen and
the ARTICHOKE program. After Allen was pushed aside by the men from MKULTRA,
the new TSS team hired Baldwin as a consultant According to one of them, he
was full of bright ideas on how to control behavior, but they were wary of
him because he was such an "eager beaver" with an obvious streak of
"craziness." Under TSS auspices, Baldwin performed lobotomies on apes and
then put these simian subjects into sensory deprivation—presumably in the
same "box" he had built himself at NIH and then had to repair after a
desperate soldier kicked his way out.

There is no information available on whether Baldwin extended this work to
humans, although he did discuss with an outside consultant how lobotomized
patients reacted to prolonged isolation. Like Hamilton, Baldwin was a
jack-of-all trades who in one experiment beamed radio frequency energy
directly at the brain of a chimpanzee and in another cut off one monkey's
head and tried to transplant it to the decapitated body of another monkey.
Baldwin used $250 in Agency money to buy his own electroshock machine, and
he did some kind of unspecified work at a TSS safehouse that caused the CIA
to shell out $1450 to renovate and repair the place.

The last MKSEARCH subproject covered the work of Dr. Charles
Geschickter, who served TSS both as researcher and funding conduit. CIA
documents show that Geschickter tested powerful drugs on mental defectives
and terminal cancer patients, apparently at the Georgetown University
Hospital in Washington. In all, the Agency put $655,000 into Geschickter's
research on knockout drugs, stress-producing chemicals, and mind-altering
substances. Nevertheless, the doctor's principal service to TSS officials
seems to have been putting his family foundation at the disposal of the
CIA—both to channel funds and to serve as a source of cover to Agency
operators. About $2.1 million flowed through this tightly controlled
foundation to other researchers.[6] Under MKSEARCH, Geschickter continued to
provide TSS with a means to assess drugs rapidly, and he branched out into
trying to knock out monkeys with radar waves to the head (a technique which
worked but risked frying vital parts of the brain). The Geschickter Fund for
Medical Research remained available as a conduit until 1967. ...[7]
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Postby chiggerbit » Sat Jun 06, 2009 3:12 pm

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Postby lightningBugout » Sat Jun 06, 2009 3:25 pm

Thanks Chigger. I actually meant the TV show - "Dollhouse," Hugh says its called. Btw - thanks for all the Gittinger stuff in the archive. I hadn't understood his significance until Ross' talk last night.
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Postby sw » Sat Jun 06, 2009 5:08 pm

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Postby lightningBugout » Sat Jun 06, 2009 6:02 pm

While I am not entirely sure what to make of Colin Ross, I will say that watching his presentation and hearing him put it out there in a public setting that the FMSFs primary purpose is to enable plausible deniability about MK Ultra and related projects, was very affirming.

Personally I'm just not interested in questioning the believability of survivor's accounts. It seems like a waste of time. Just thinking about various threads on this board about RA, MC, McMartin, etc. and the degree to which FMSF propaganda continues to hold vastly undue weight and continues to define the terms of the discussion makes me realize that we (as in the general public) have a long, long way to go. And continuing to hover in the space that the FMSF has basically created for us - where we try to assess the stories of others for validity is a waste of valuable time and energy.

This afternoon, to me, it feels rather like being tricked into a textbook divide and conquer strategy.
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Postby sw » Sat Jun 06, 2009 6:38 pm

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I learned alot...

Postby sw » Sat Jun 06, 2009 10:05 pm

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Postby lightningBugout » Sat Jun 06, 2009 11:43 pm

[error corrected]
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Postby Project Willow » Sun Jun 07, 2009 12:12 am

Why would you not go Project Willow?


Because the whole thing smells of set-up, and my system is not yet completely immune. LBO is brave. Only 4 handlers? I'm surprised. I'd guess 40% to 50% slave audience, conservative. It's always surprised me, the percentage of perps and slaves at 911 Truth activities also, though it shouldn't. It is ridiculously easy to make a mess of this area, absolutely easy. This would be a good opportunity for non-survivors to chime in with advice about activism, but then, they haven't figured out how to prevent agent provocateurs yet.

SW, good to hear from you, and good to know of all the work you're doing. I haven't heard bloodline talk from you, is this a new thread you're following, or? Just checking.

I will repeat my mantra here, and it is for me as much as anyone else willing to listen, the most revolutionary thing to do, the most audacious, courageous, productive thing to do is clear the system, free all controled parts, undo the programming and conditioning. All the research in the world, all the activism, speaking out, looking into other cases can't top it. That is job #1.

The whole picture would fill a few volumes, the number of subjects, perps, facilities, it's so large, but yes, the lack of more readily apparent and overlapping info goes to show just how successful the bastards were. I used the word WERE and I mean it, WERE.

The Ford stuff, targeted disinfo, though somewhat subtle.
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pw

Postby sw » Sun Jun 07, 2009 12:50 am

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Postby Hugh Manatee Wins » Sun Jun 07, 2009 2:39 am

lightningBugout wrote:.....
Personally I'm just not interested in questioning the believability of survivor's accounts. It seems like a waste of time.
......
This afternoon, to me, it feels rather like being tricked into a textbook divide and conquer strategy.


The versions of mind-control being marketed by Brice and O'Brien are meant to discredit the whole topic precisely because the topic is valid and worth understanding.

The science of trauma and dissociation they describe is valid.
But it is the description of what they allegedly did with who that is whack.
And for the historical decoy reasons I laid out.
(I've found the EXACT same trick being used in many disinfo tales from the likes of Greer, Hoagland, Targ, Backster, Silva, Emoto, Radin, etc.)

There are two possible reasons for their false presentations about being "presidential models"-
> they are knowingly lying.
> they are hypnoprogrammed to believe the lies they are telling.

But we can be certain they are lying.

What I've been hammering at for a few years now is that psyops and disinfo are also understandable because they are also designed on scientific principles of memory recall - interference theory and inoculation theory using keyword- or meme-jacking to exploit what's called
"the similarity paradox."

This similiarity paradox phenomenon goes:
It is easy to remember and identify things that are
> entirely alike
> or entirely different
...but things that have components partly similiar/partly exactly opposite...create maximum confusion.
CIA runs mainstream media since WWII:
news rooms, movies/TV, publishing
...
Disney is CIA for kidz!
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Postby Hugh Manatee Wins » Tue Jun 09, 2009 2:09 am

Found copies of Brice's book and O'Brien/Philips' book.
Both books are a little info but mostly sewage, like William Cooper's 'Behold a Pale Horse.' They are written as conspiracy self-satire to evoke disbelief on every topic mentioned.

The O'Brien/Philips show started in 1988 because of a lawsuit against CIA for MKULTRA experiments with a documentary on the way-
http://www.ctka.net/pr300-mkultra.html
Orlikow v. United States (1988)


Chew on this and spit it out as proof they are disinfoteers with whom Dr. Colin Ross and Rosie O'Donnell should never have shared a stage-

'Trance Formation of America' (O'Brien/Philips)
page 212
"Most of my traumatic encounters with [Senator Patrick] Leahy were alien-themed..."


page 156
"Hilary Clinton is the only female to be sexually aroused by the sight of my sexually mutilated vagina."


Recall that I lined out how Bing Crosby helped the CIA make a porn film with someone in a latex mask impersonating Indonesian strong man Sukarno and this why Brice's title and cover meme-hijack Crosby's film partner, Bob Hope, and his theme song, 'Thanks for the Memories.'

Brice Taylor claims to have been a sex slave to every politician and celebrity you've ever heard of. So of course there's a description of her session with Bing Crosby. Y'see, Bob Hope put her naked in Bing's closet as a gift. Y'see.

Note meme-jacking of the CIA's latex-mask impersonator.

'Thanks for the Memories' (Brice Taylor)

page 149
"Bob [Hope] put me in a 'stay stiff like a mannequin' instruction mode."
.....
"Bing started laughing and read a portion of the card out loud, "a f**k me doll?" "
.....
"[Bing] treated me like I wasn't real..."






:roll: :x :idea:
CIA runs mainstream media since WWII:
news rooms, movies/TV, publishing
...
Disney is CIA for kidz!
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Postby lightningBugout » Tue Jun 09, 2009 4:00 am

I tend to agree Hugh. Although I think Cathy may well be a real survivor, just not in the way her book claims. Same for Brice.
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