The Good News About Mel Gibson

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The Good News About Mel Gibson

Postby Montag » Wed Jul 21, 2010 12:48 pm

The Good News About Mel Gibson
by Frank Rich

July 16, 2010
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/18/opinion/18rich.html

excerpt:

FOR Fourth of July weekend fireworks, even Macy’s couldn’t top the spittle-spangled eruptions of Mel Gibson. The clandestine recordings of his serial audio assaults on his gal pal were instant Web and cable-TV sensations — at once a worthy rival to Hollywood’s official holiday releases and a compelling sequel to his fabled anti- Semitic rant of 2006. A true showman, Gibson offered vitriol for nearly all tastes, aiming his profane fusillade at women, blacks and Latinos alike. The invective was tied together by a domestic violence subplot worthy of “Lethal Weapon.” There was even a surprise comic coda, courtesy of Whoopi Goldberg, who, alone among Gibson’s showbiz peers, used her television platform on “The View” to defend her buddy’s good character.

The Gibson tapes — in plain English and not requiring the subtitles of some of the star’s recent spectacles — are a particularly American form of schadenfreude. There’s little we enjoy more than watching a pampered zillionaire icon (Gibson’s production company is actually named Icon) brought low. The story would end there — just another tidy morality tale in the profuse annals of Hollywood self-destruction from Fatty Arbuckle to Lindsay Lohan — were it not for Gibson’s unique back story.

Six years ago he was not merely an A-list movie star with a penchant for drinking and boorish behavior but also a powerful and canonized figure in the political and cultural pantheon of American conservatism. That he has reached rock bottom tells us nothing new about Gibson. He was the same talented, nasty, bigoted blowhard then that he is today. But his fall says a lot about the changes in our country over the past six years. We shouldn’t take those changes for granted. We should take stock — and celebrate. They are good news.

Does anyone remember 2004? It seems a civilization ago. That less-than-vintage year was in retrospect the nadir of the American war over “values.” The kickoff fracas was Janet Jackson’s breast-baring “wardrobe malfunction” at the Super Bowl, which prompted a new crackdown against televised “indecency” by the Federal Communications Commission. By December Fox News and its allies were fomenting hysteria about a supposed war on Christmas, with Newt Gingrich warning of a nefarious secular plot “to abolish the word Christmas” altogether and Jerry Falwell attacking Mayor Michael Bloomberg for using the euphemism “holiday tree” at the annual tree-lighting ceremony at Rockefeller Center. In between these discrete culture wars came a presidential election in which the Bush-Rove machine tried to whip up evangelical turnout by sowing panic over gay marriage.

t was into that tinderbox of America 2004 that Gibson tossed his self-financed and self-directed movie about the crucifixion, “The Passion of the Christ.” The epic was timed to detonate in the nation’s multiplexes on Ash Wednesday, after one of the longest and most divisive promotional campaigns in Hollywood history.

Gibson is in such disgrace today that it’s hard to fathom all the fuss he and his biblical epic engendered back then. The commotion began with the revelation that his father, Hutton, was a prominent and vociferous Holocaust denier and that both father and son were proselytizers for a splinter sect of Roman Catholicism that rejected the reforms of the Second Vatican Council, including the lifting of the “Christ-killers” libel from the Jews. Jewish leaders and writers understandably worried that “The Passion” might be as anti-Semitic as the Passion plays of old. Gibson’s response was to hold publicity screenings for the right-wing media and political establishment, including a select Washington soiree attended by notables like Peggy Noonan, Kate O’Beirne and Linda Chavez. (The only nominal Jew admitted was Matt Drudge.) The attendees then used their various pulpits to assure the world that the movie was divine — and certainly nothing that should trouble Jews. “I can report it is free of anti-Semitism,” vouchsafed Robert Novak after his “private viewing.”

Uninvited Jewish writers (like me) who kept raising questions about the unreleased film and its exclusionary rollout were vilified for crucifying poor Mel. Bill O’Reilly of Fox News asked a reporter from Variety “respectfully” if Gibson was being victimized because “the major media in Hollywood and a lot of the secular press is controlled by Jewish people.” Such was the ugly atmosphere of the time that these attempts at intimidation were remarkably successful. Many mainstream media organizations did puff pieces on the star or his film, lest they be labeled “anti-Christian” when an ascendant religious right was increasingly flexing its muscles in the corridors of power in Washington.

Both George and Laura Bush expressed eagerness to see “The Passion.” There were reports (spread by the film’s producer and never confirmed) that the very frail Pope John Paul II had given a thumbs-up after his own screening at the Vatican. The Wall Street Journal editorial page, which would publish several encomiums to “The Passion,” ran a sneak preview likening the film to “a documentary by Caravaggio.” Even The New Yorker ran a deferential profile of Gibson — in which the star said he wanted to kill me and my dog (though, alas, I had no dog) and have my “intestines on a stick.” Far more troubling was the article’s whitewashing of Gibson’s father’s record as a Holocaust denier. In the America of 2004, Mel Gibson, box office king and conservative culture hero, was invincible.
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Re: The Good News About Mel Gibson

Postby norton ash » Wed Jul 21, 2010 1:03 pm

And all it took was some blackmailing Russian slut to put it in daylight!

Things are much better now.
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Re: The Good News About Mel Gibson

Postby Montag » Wed Jul 21, 2010 1:22 pm

norton ash wrote:And all it took was some blackmailing Russian slut to put it in daylight!

Things are much better now.


I took that the Christian right in the U.S. might be dead, from the article. The Rethugs go back and forth, though, one day they are the party of fiscal conservatism, the next they are the God squadron.
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Re: The Good News About Mel Gibson

Postby compared2what? » Wed Jul 21, 2010 4:56 pm

norton ash wrote:And all it took was some blackmailing Russian slut to put it in daylight!

Things are much better now.


Link? Or something?

Because I'd have said that Oksana Grigorieva was more the Hollywood-wife type than she was a slut. And kind of a high-end one in terms of independent accomplishment and interests, at that. Nor am I aware of any evidence that she's attempting to blackmail him. It's not even at all clear that she's the person who's responsible for leaking those tapes, more on which after the pertinent part of her wiki bio, which I excerpt for your convenient reference below:

    Early life

    Grigorieva was born in Saransk, Russia. Her parents were both music professors. She grew up in Ukraine, and at the age of 15 moved to Moscow to attend university in order to learn piano. She said of the experience learning music as a child, "Diplomas were everything. It wasn't unusual for students to play ten hours a day. Our skin would start to crack. We'd literally have bleeding fingers." Grigorieva finished conservatoire studies in Kazan.

    She moved to London where she continued her studies and taught music to others. Grigorieva studied music at the Royal College of Music. While in London she worked as a model; having been spotted by photographer Patrick Anson, 5th Earl of Lichfield. Grigorieva noted, "In order to support myself I started to model. I did a lot of it, print, mostly. I've always looked after myself. I've never been dependent on anyone financially." Grigorieva subsequently moved to the United States, and spent time living in New York and Los Angeles, California. She taught music in the U.S., and patented a technique of teaching musical notation to children. Grigorieva composed and performed music, and produced works for theatre and advertisements.

    Music career

    Grigorieva gained attention as a songwriter in 2006, after the song that she wrote, "Un Dia Llegara", became popular on the Josh Groban album, Awake.]

    [snip (Of several graphs in which someone has taken the trouble to list every single positive mention of the song "Un Dia Llegara" that's ever appeared in the press anywhere, no matter how obscure the venue, the suggestion of bias makes it worth noting.)

    Personal life

    Grigorieva was married in 1989 to a fellow Russian who was a drug addict. In 1992, she married British artist Nicholas Rowland. She had a relationship with actor Timothy Dalton, and the two married in 1997. Grigorieva met Dalton while she was employed as a translator for filmmaker Nikita Mikhalkov. Dalton and Grigorieva had a son together, Alexander.

    Grigorieva was romantically involved with actor Mel Gibson, and their daughter Lucia was born on October 30, 2009.[19] The couple separated in 2010. In June 2010, Grigorieva obtained a restraining order against Gibson, stating he had physically assaulted her. Gibson was barred from coming near Grigorieva or their daughter. In July 2010, Gibson was identified as a possible suspect in a domestic violence investigation initiated after detectives spoke in Malibu to Grigorieva. Grigorieva and Gibson are involved in a child custody dispute involving their daughter in a confidential court case in 2010


So, you know. She doesn't exactly appear to be the very portrait of female autonomy, but nor does her background suggest that she's an exceptionally avaricious or slutty. The story as I understand it is that she left him after he knocked two of her teeth out while she was holding the baby, to which he responded by harassing her with extremely violent threats, including death threats. Which is what I gather happened based on statements made by both parties, but mostly by him, in the taped conversations. (Some people just shouldn't drink, incidentally.)

I mean, it would be very, very surprising if she didn't want every penny of the most bounteous a child-support deal that she could get under the circumstances, given what he can afford, as well as the way of the world generally. So I do assume that's what she's asking for, although I don't actually know. But that's not blackmail, or even close to it.

Apart from that, I think she very probably taped those calls because she wanted a restraining order for very well-justified reasons. And that someone who dislikes Mel Gibson-- either in her sphere or that of the police, on whose behalf she taped them -- then leaked them to the press.

And that someone might have been her, granted. However, the cops in Malibu don't exactly harbor any warm and loving feelings toward Mel Gibson and neither do a very large crowd of other people in a very small industry town in which there aren't many secrets. Because he's been a total asshole (to put it mildly) to more than a few of them for decades.** So there isn't really enough information on which to calculate the odds on that score. Furthermore, as far as I can see, the question of sluttiness simply doesn't arise one way or the other.

I'm not speaking with a whole lot of confidence here, obviously. Because I don't have a whole lot to go on. But per what little there is, that's the story, attached assumptions fully en suite.

Anyway. On what are your assumptions based, exactly, norton ash? That's my question.
_____________________

FWIW, incidentally, I'd also say that there's not a whole lot of evidence that the larger cultural truth Frank Rich sees (or possibly is just saying that he sees) in the whole sordid brouhaha actually is one. He's kind of got a personal axe to grind wrt Gibson. As he discloses, to be scrupulously fair. Just not in any form that it's very easy to recognize as disclosure.

Which is more or less true to form, in my estimation. He's always had a mean streak, at least as a writer, that Frank Rich. It doesn't show as clearly on the Op-Ed page as it did back when he was a theater critic or on the 1992 Clinton campaign trail beat, for sure.

Doesn't mean it's not still there, though.
_____________


**Although he also has a long, long track record of quiet and true charity, both on a personal and an institutional level, I feel obligated to mention. Because I don't know the man, myself. And besides that, his personal offenses (as opposed to his movies) wouldn't be any of my business to judge irrespective of what my vague impression of him has always been.

As it happens, though, it's always been my vague impression -- which is based on absolutely nothing, and which I do not therefore assert as fact or even really as opinion -- that he was probably pretty badly abused in some way by his rabidly insane father. So I've actually always felt nothing but tender sympathy for the imaginary person whom I think of in connection with the name "Mel Gibson," insofar as I feel anything. Which I don't much.
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Re: The Good News About Mel Gibson

Postby norton ash » Wed Jul 21, 2010 5:28 pm

You're right, I shouldn't stereotype just because it fits my own puppet-show version of a Hollywood morality play. Even if everybody else does.

She had a baby with a rich old crazy man. That was good of her.
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Re: The Good News About Mel Gibson

Postby compared2what? » Thu Jul 22, 2010 4:11 am

norton ash wrote:
She had a baby with a rich old crazy man. That was good of her.


She had a baby with an exceptionally charismatic, very wealthy, charming, intelligent, interesting and good-looking 54-year-old man.

Whom I certainly wouldn't have thought of as old when I was her age. By which I mean both when I was her Hollywood age, (which is 40) or when I was however much older than that she probably actually is. Especially if we'd loved each other well enough to have a baby together. At forty (or a few years older than it) one is kind of naturally aware that one probably isn't going to meet all that many more guys with whom one feels (at least at the time) that one can share a lifetime bond of some sort.

Although needless to say, I don't know whether that's what she felt about him or not. I haven't got the first fucking clue as to whether her motivations were/are "good" or "bad," in fact. Because I don't know the woman. I pretty much just know that there is such a woman.

I mean, I guess that if (for some reason) I was absolutely obligated to derogate her moral character in some way, an inferential argument could be made that since that since she's from the Ukraine and she had an intimate long-term relationship with Mel Gibson, the odds that she thinks of Jews as fully human are probably somewhat lower than chance.

But I'm not really making that argument, I should hasten to add. Because in reality, I not only don't have any obligation to say demeaning and hostile things about Oksana Grigorieva's moral character, I don't have any interest in it and can't even begin to think of any circumstance in which it would be somehow gratifying to me to do so. Like I said, I don't know the woman. I pretty much just know (etcetera).

norton ash wrote:You're right, I shouldn't stereotype just because it fits my own puppet-show version of a Hollywood morality play. Even if everybody else does.


It's entirely up to you, honey. I was really just asking what information or perspective unknown to me was making your take on her so different from mine.

I mean, clearly, I personally don't feel as serene about the implications of calling an adult woman a slut and a felon when I know nothing about her except that she'd had a mutually consensual romantic and sexual relationship with an adult male movie star about whom I knew some gossip as you do. And I'm not trying to pretend otherwise.

But that's a political issue as far as I'm concerned, not a moral one.

And that makes it a whole other story, by my lights. Because by my lights other people's moral standards are their business, not mine. Assuming that I don't know them to be egregiously and destructively immoral people who pose a danger to the welfare of another or the community, obviously. Which (equally obviously) is not an operative factor in this particular instance. Your soul would still be beautiful in my eyes no matter what the details of the system of green-light-means-good, red-light-means-bad traffic signals that guide it through life were.

So....I don't know. I guess that it just didn't occur to me that your seemingly unaccountable hostility might be due to your deep-seated and reflexive assumptions about the participants in Hollywood morality plays. Probably because such things simply don't have enough of presence in my own internal justice system to prompt such a harsh condemnation. Hollywood morality plays barely mean anything to me at all one way or the other, in fact. You won't think the less of me for that, I hope.

Anyhow. In any and all events:

Oh. Okay.

Well, if that's the case, except that it's my position that the preferred remote and generalized objects of your reflexive morally damning assumptions aren't something that I -- rather than you -- either can or should be "right" about, I'm done.

Because if they make you remotely and generally happy, they're good with me, whatever they are. The snail is on the thorn, the bird is on the wing, etcetera.
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Re: The Good News About Mel Gibson

Postby norton ash » Thu Jul 22, 2010 1:33 pm

So I guess it's really a more nuanced matter of alcoholic christofascist racist movie stars and the women who love them.

I've got a little popsicle-stick Mel in a kilt holding a jug of root beer schnapps chasing popsicle-stick Oksana who's saying "Mel! Mel! Don't be hitting me, I'm holding baby! And you are on candit camera anyway, which I will be showing to the Jews!"

(I'm claiming Punch-and-Judy precedent and how it affects me when I regress to childhood, because my adult self knows that spousal abuse isn't funny.)

My celebrity puppets give me hours of enjoyment. If mocking the miseries of the rich and poorly-behaved is wrong, I don't wanna be right.
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Re: The Good News About Mel Gibson

Postby Nordic » Thu Jul 22, 2010 3:56 pm

norton ash wrote:So I guess it's really a more nuanced matter of alcoholic christofascist racist movie stars and the women who love them.

I've got a little popsicle-stick Mel in a kilt holding a jug of root beer schnapps chasing popsicle-stick Oksana who's saying "Mel! Mel! Don't be hitting me, I'm holding baby! And you are on candit camera anyway, which I will be showing to the Jews!"

(I'm claiming Punch-and-Judy precedent and how it affects me when I regress to childhood, because my adult self knows that spousal abuse isn't funny.)

My celebrity puppets give me hours of enjoyment. If mocking the miseries of the rich and poorly-behaved is wrong, I don't wanna be right.




:rofl:
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Re: The Good News About Mel Gibson

Postby crikkett » Thu Jul 22, 2010 4:15 pm

norton ash wrote:You're right, I shouldn't stereotype just because it fits my own puppet-show version of a Hollywood morality play.


I hope you think twice before bandying the label 'slut' around again.
:rofl:
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Re: The Good News About Mel Gibson

Postby compared2what? » Thu Jul 22, 2010 5:38 pm

norton ash wrote:So I guess it's really a more nuanced matter of alcoholic christofascist racist movie stars and the women who love them.

I've got a little popsicle-stick Mel in a kilt holding a jug of root beer schnapps chasing popsicle-stick Oksana who's saying "Mel! Mel! Don't be hitting me, I'm holding baby! And you are on candit camera anyway, which I will be showing to the Jews!"

(I'm claiming Punch-and-Judy precedent and how it affects me when I regress to childhood, because my adult self knows that spousal abuse isn't funny.)

My celebrity puppets give me hours of enjoyment. If mocking the miseries of the rich and poorly-behaved is wrong, I don't wanna be right.


Mocking the miseries of the rich and poorly behaved isn't necessarily any kind of problem at all, I don't think. It really depends on what you mock them for, in what context, and why. That's just by the way, though, obviously. Because you weren't in fact mocking a rich and poorly behaved person. You were casually and comfortably expressing your contempt for a woman for pretty much no reason other than that she's a woman whom you perceive as sexualized and therefore, a priori, a degraded and lesser being than yourself.

But as you say, everybody does that. So honestly, there's really very little reason for you to give it another moment's thought if you don't want to. In reality, your quick wit and appealing refusal to take your knee-jerk misogyny seriously will almost certainly always and forever be more than enough to shield you from whatever few and far-between objections the latter might occasion.

And the beautiful thing is that nobody whom you recognize as having the ordinary rights and feelings that automatically attach to personhood will get hurt!

In short, realistically speaking, there's no problem here at all unless you care that there is. Which, evidently, you don't. That just being life in the world as we've all always known and loved it, far be it from me to continue futilely to harsh your mellow. And/or draw your attention to an unwitting transgression of what I know to be your real and true-hearted integrity and compassion for the sick, the suffering and the oppressed of this diseased world. Depending on how you look at it.

Therefore, please accept my sincere congratulations for sticking to your guns and (in all likelihood) successfully retaining the moral high ground of this thread in the eyes of the majority of the forum. Per all the rules of life in the world as we've all always known and loved it, that was good of you.

Let's have a party, in fact. Here. I'll start:







Good times!
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Re: The Good News About Mel Gibson

Postby Nordic » Thu Jul 22, 2010 6:04 pm

You were casually and comfortably expressing your contempt for a woman for pretty much no reason other than that she's a woman whom you perceive as sexualized and therefore, a priori, a degraded and lesser being than yourself.


No. No no and no.

Major strawman alert here.

The only possible crime Norton was committing was assuming, in a joking way, that she just MIGHT be a "gold digger".

But maybe you're right, C2W, there have NEVER been, in the history of wealthy men, females known as "gold diggers". And women have never EVER trapped men into financial obligations by getting pregnant. Because women are perfect, and pure, and never do anything wrong.

It simply never happens.

Norton was having a good cynical laugh over the whole thing.

Now, you can assume she's not a gold digger, or you can assume she is, or you can just do neither. It doesn't matter. But if you can't have a good laugh over the whole tawdry trainwreck, well, you might want to get your blood-humor levels checked.
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Re: The Good News About Mel Gibson

Postby compared2what? » Thu Jul 22, 2010 6:10 pm

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Re: The Good News About Mel Gibson

Postby barracuda » Thu Jul 22, 2010 6:29 pm

Nordic wrote:But maybe you're right, C2W, there have NEVER been, in the history of wealthy men, females known as "gold diggers". And women have never EVER trapped men into financial obligations by getting pregnant. Because women are perfect, and pure, and never do anything wrong.


Did you say strawman?

Nordic wrote: But if you can't have a good laugh over the whole tawdry trainwreck, well, you might want to get your blood-humor levels checked.


Oh hell yeah. Let's have a good laugh about a woman getting her teeth knocked out.

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Re: The Good News About Mel Gibson

Postby crikkett » Thu Jul 22, 2010 6:36 pm

compared2what? wrote:Therefore, please accept my sincere congratulations for sticking to your guns and (in all likelihood) successfully retaining the moral high ground of this thread in the eyes of the majority of the forum.


By my count one person weighed in to support Norton and I weighed in to support you. I may not have done a good job of it. I'll try again.

c2w, I loved how you fricasseed Norton Ash. That was fantastic. But I thought the point was made and so didn't pile on.

Norton, Nordic, I take offense in calling the woman a 'slut'. I don't care how rich a man is, if he lays a hand on me or a child of mine I too would wring every penny out of him that I could as I did my best to ruin him.

Nordic, you have a daughter. I'm surprised at your attitude. 'Gold digger' is the straw man here. And Norton, sexist crap still stinks behind finger puppets. Shame on you two.

:fingerwag:
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Postby Perelandra » Thu Jul 22, 2010 6:53 pm

FWIW, I'd be surprised if norton ash was actually sexist. As I read the comment in question, he's sarcastically assuming another's voice in a cynical way. Correct me if I'm wrong, norton.
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