The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools

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Re: The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools

Postby FourthBase » Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:42 pm

brekin » 19 Mar 2014 11:55 wrote:Fourthbase, I feel you, as a sweet Irish boy formerly of a little ways outside of Boston. But go talk to some people in Roxbury. Here's a crib sheet for the big city that has been around for a long time, but hasn't been really needed to be updated much: The WASP's own it, the Jews rent it, the Irish run it, and the Blacks live in it.


I work with black people, I'm the minority in the office.
I am exactly where they wound up, lol.

But yeah, I've heard that before, and there's some truth in it.
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Re: The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools

Postby FourthBase » Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:30 pm

norton ash » 19 Mar 2014 12:25 wrote:How the Irish become pink: drink, sunburn, anger, crying.


LMFAO

Image

Hey, don't forget laughing, too, lol! #halfpink
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Re: The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools

Postby FourthBase » Wed Mar 19, 2014 3:06 pm

When people talk about Irish power in Boston, the "running it" side of things, from my limited perspective it meant that Southie got to not be gentrified or blockbusted into oblivion, which was great. I was pretty much the last generation to enjoy the kind of enchanted white-ghetto Sesame Street childhood that Southie kids had enjoyed for, oh, 100 years. That's pretty much gone. The three projects don't have nearly as many Southie families as they used to, the yuppies and hipsters are buying and renting the old-timers out. Everyone loves to talk about communities. Well, that was one. And "progress" fucking killed it. Meanwhile, Southie consistently pumped out blue collar Democrats whose social conservatism was eclipsed by their pro-labor-ness and their decades-long hearty resistance to whoring out Southie to business interests. Fuck, even our sociopath criminal extraordinaire had a whiff of Robin Hood about him. Nobody I had ever heard of got hooked on opiates or hanged themselves until Whitey disappeared. We were collectively well-protected in Southie, but that wasn't because we were white. There was definitely a tribal Irish-y thing to it. And I find little wrong with it. We consistently looked after our own working-class interests better than any locale in the world, I'd wager. We should've been a model for the left, not a pariah.
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Re: The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools

Postby brekin » Wed Mar 19, 2014 6:02 pm

FourthBase » Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:06 pm wrote:When people talk about Irish power in Boston, the "running it" side of things, from my limited perspective it meant that Southie got to not be gentrified or blockbusted into oblivion, which was great. I was pretty much the last generation to enjoy the kind of enchanted white-ghetto Sesame Street childhood that Southie kids had enjoyed for, oh, 100 years. That's pretty much gone. The three projects don't have nearly as many Southie families as they used to, the yuppies and hipsters are buying and renting the old-timers out. Everyone loves to talk about communities. Well, that was one. And "progress" fucking killed it. Meanwhile, Southie consistently pumped out blue collar Democrats whose social conservatism was eclipsed by their pro-labor-ness and their decades-long hearty resistance to whoring out Southie to business interests. Fuck, even our sociopath criminal extraordinaire had a whiff of Robin Hood about him. Nobody I had ever heard of got hooked on opiates or hanged themselves until Whitey disappeared. We were collectively well-protected in Southie, but that wasn't because we were white. There was definitely a tribal Irish-y thing to it. And I find little wrong with it. We consistently looked after our own working-class interests better than any locale in the world, I'd wager. We should've been a model for the left, not a pariah.


This guy has written extensively about this. He's a catholic radical so some of his biases will chafe people, but his analysis is definitely provocative. Boston was one of the four cities he examined.

The Slaughter of Cities: Urban Renewal As Ethnic Cleansing
http://www.amazon.com/The-Slaughter-Cit ... 1587317753
By now, it should be obvious that the government-sponsored initiative to renew this country's large cities which began in the 1930s and continued largely unabated in the East and Midwest through the 1960s and beyond has been a profound and devastating failure. More homes were destroyed than were ever built; once-great metropolises like Detroit lay in ruins; once-thriving neighborhoods were overwhelmed with drugs and crime; buildings that were built to last centuries fell to the wrecking ball mere decades after they were built; an entire generation of young people, both those who came to the cities and those who were driven from the cities into the suburbs, have grown up rootless, in a Hobbesian state in which man's life was "solitary, poor, nasty, brutish and short."

The traditional explanation, the one which no one believes anymore, is that all this was done to eliminate "blight." A more recent explanation, only slightly less implausible, is that it all came about because of faulty design, as if a nation of 260 million people, one which had already produced the Columbian Exhibition of 1893, couldn't come up with anything more inspiring that the average strip mall. The real story, it turns out, is different from both previous explanations. What began as the World War II intelligence community's attempt to solve America's "nationalities problem" and provide workers for the nation's war industries degenerated by the early post-war period into full-blown ethnic cleansing.

E. Michael Jones has followed the advice of Christopher Wrenn. Looking around, he saw monuments, but monuments to the folly and malice of social engineering and a government that had declared war on large segments of its own people. In his meticulously documented book, he proves that urban renewal had more to do with ethnicity than it ever had to do with design or hygiene or blight. Urban renewal was the last gasp attempt of the WASP ruling class to take control of a country that was slipping out of its grasp for demographic reasons. The largely Catholic ethnics were to be driven out of their neighborhoods into the suburbs, where they were to be "Americanized" according to WASP principles. The neighborhoods they left behind were to be turned over to the sharecroppers from the South or turned into futuristic Bauhaus enclaves for the new government elites. Using political tactics like eminent domain and "integration," the planners made sure that the ethnic neighborhood got transformed into something more congenial to their dreams of social engineering than the actual communities of people they saw as a threat to their control.

The Slaughter of Cities proposes a new take on familiar territory, e.g., to give just one example, the civil rights movement. Does anyone, for example, really know why Martin Luther King abandoned his southern strategy and came to Chicago during the summer of 1966? Does anyone really know who brought him there? Does anyone know who told him which ethnic neighborhoods he would march through? Hint: it was a religious denomination usually associated with Philadelphia that had been at work trying to "integrate" Chicago's neighborhoods since 1951.

Jones concentrates on four cities - Boston, Philadelphia, Detroit, and Chicago - in a book whose conclusions will be shocking and controversial. The destruction of the ethnic neighborhoods that made up the human, residential heart of these cities was not an unfortunate by-product of a well-intentioned plan that somehow went awry; it was part of the plan itself.
If I knew all mysteries and all knowledge, and have not charity, I am nothing. St. Paul
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Re: The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools

Postby FourthBase » Wed Mar 19, 2014 6:45 pm

I'm gonna find that book asap.
He seems to nail it.

Had an Irish aunt who was a liberation-theology Catholic.
I bet she'd have loved that book.

p.s. Another aunt, Sicilian side, happens to be on the cover of a busing book:

Image
Image

(She was an anti-racist and multiculturalist way before that was cool, at the forefront of that, a special-ed teacher and librarian for decades in the Boston Public Schools, predominantly Southie High. She was also vehemently against busing. That picture was taken at an anti-busing rally in Washington DC. It was pouring that day. She was awesome.)
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Re: The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools

Postby Wombaticus Rex » Wed Mar 19, 2014 8:34 pm

Have hugely appreciated this thread as a transplant from County Sligo.

Haven't been back since we poured my grandpa into the Atlantic, but I do correspond with some family who share a mutual interest in the intrigues of The Troubles, especially in terms of what British intelligence ("intelligence" being a euphemism for shit-weasel death squads, of course) was doing and how the IRA got co-opted and reduced to just another organized crime syndicate.

Thank you for the wealth of context and new information in these five pages.
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Re: The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools

Postby seemslikeadream » Thu Mar 20, 2014 9:41 am

Image


MARCH 19, 2014

The Irish Hunger Striker Who Ignited a Generation
A Prisoner’s Salute to Bobby Sands
by DENNIS O'HEARN
I attended a birthday party last week. It was in Ohio State Penitentiary, on the 60th birthday of Bobby Sands, the Irish political prisoner who died after 66 days on hunger strike back in 1981. He was 27 then and he was followed to his death by nine of his comrades.

Younger people won’t remember it but anyone over fifty should remember how the name Bobby Sands went round the world. The New York Times editorialized how Bobby “bested” British Prime Minister Maggie Thatcher because he and his comrades showed real moral courage as they fought for their rights as political prisoners with nothing but their bodies, while she just showed vengeance and spite. When Bobby Sands ran and won election to British parliament, while dying on hunger strike, he won 30,493 votes. The most Thatcher ever got was 29,697. Bobby spent the last five years of his life in supermax confinement: 24 hours a day, seven days a week, in an 8X10 foot cell. When I tell young Irish Americans about this they are shocked that an Irishman would be treated so cruelly by British jailers.

Last week I was visiting my brothers Bomani Shakur and Jason Robb. Bomani and Jason, along with three others, are awaiting execution for their parts in a prison uprising in Lucasville, Ohio in 1993. There is no evidence that any of the five was involved in any killings that took place during the uprising but they led a movement to convince prisoners not to inform on other prisoners regarding any events that took place during the uprising. Bomani and Jason were offered deals by the state of Ohio to get very reduced sentences if they testified against other prisoners but they refused to do so and chose to save their souls at the possible cost of their lives. As punishment, the state fabricated evidence of guilt and withheld evidence of their innocence and stage-managed a series of trials that resulted in death penalties. The five men remain steadfast friends and comrades. Two are white, two black, one Sunni Muslim.

They lived the past twenty years in supermax confinement: 23 hours a day, seven days a week, in an 8X10 foot cell. One hour they spend alone in a bigger cell, exercising. That is, until recently.

In January 2011, after reading accounts of the Irish hunger strikes of 1980-81 and of the life of Bobby Sands, three of the men went on hunger strike to demand contact with each other and open visits, where they could touch their friends and family and break bread together with them. This we have been doing since the victorious end of their hunger strike, although Bomani and Jason remain chained to separate picnic tables during the visits.

Bobby birthday

Jason Robb with friends Bilge Firat and Denis O’Hearn in Ohio State Penitentiary. Bomani Shakur is in the background.

Yesterday, we bought a small cake from the vending machine in the visiting room. Jason, who is an accomplished artist, used the crayons and paper from the children’s play area of the visiting room to make birthday cards reading “Happy Birthday Bobby” and “Always Remember.” He constructed a birthday candle from paper, with a “flame” on the top, to decorate the cake. Together we celebrated Bobby’s life and his ongoing contribution to freedom everywhere.

After the victorious hunger strike in Ohio, other prisoners around the United States read about Bobby and the Irish hunger strikers. Last year 30,000 men in California’s prisons went on hunger strike against solitary confinement. They organized the strike from a small area of isolated confinement called the short corridor that resembles nothing so much as the H-Blocks at their height of inhumanity, although these men do not even have windows in their cells. The men who organized the strike are African-American, Latino, and White. According to one recent report the men held all kinds of lively debates in their “pod” in Pelican Bay State Prison, but whenever the subject of Bobby Sands and the Irish hunger strikes came up the talk changed. “Every time we’d start talking about it, we’d notice the pod going quiet—we knew people were listening.” The state says that they are leaders of gangs that are at war with each other yet they have shown the deepest comradeship. The hunger strike lasted some 60 days and it may resume again if rights are not granted.

Last month, dozens of prisoners in Menard “administrative segregation” (solitary) unit in the state of Illinois went on a hunger and then thirst strike for their rights. Again, they cited the example of Bobby Sands who, among others, has been responsible not only for politicizing large segments of the US prison population but for showing them a way that they can fight for their rights through nonviolent resistance.

Soon, I believe, there will be a nation-wide hunger strike in the prisons here to protest against the inhumane policy of long-term solitary isolation, which since 1983 has put tens of thousands of men into total solitary isolation, some of them unable to touch another human being for decades.

Now we hear that hundreds of undocumented migrants who are being detained in Tacoma in the state of Washington launched a hunger strike – on Bobby’s 60th birthday!

All of the Irish hunger strikers and their families, those still with us and those who have passed from us, can take great pride in the fact that their struggle continues and that their example has given hope to tens of thousands of men who are still being held in “concrete tombs” in the richest nation in the world.

HAPPY BIRTHDAY BOBBY! ALWAYS REMEMBER!



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Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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Re: The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools

Postby seemslikeadream » Mon Oct 12, 2015 11:43 am

Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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Re: The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools

Postby seemslikeadream » Mon Mar 21, 2016 10:06 am

Human history in Ireland rewritten as scientists get down to bear bones
Animal remains indicate humans existed in Ireland 12,500 years ago, much earlier than previously thought
An ancient fragment of bone from a bear which shows marks made by humans.

Agence France-Presse
Sunday 20 March 2016 23.30 EDT Last modified on Sunday 20 March 2016 23.32 EDT
ar bone found in an Irish cave has provided evidence of human existence in Ireland 2,500 years earlier than previously thought, academics have announced.

For decades, the earliest evidence of human life in Ireland dated from 8,000 BC.

But radiocarbon dating of a bear’s knee bone indicated it had been butchered by a human in about 10,500 BC – some 12,500 years ago and far earlier than the previous date.

Marion Dowd, an archaeologist at the Institute of Technology Sligo who was part of the team that made the discovery, said: “This find adds a new chapter to the human history of Ireland.”

The knee bone, which is marked by cuts from a sharp tool, was one of thousands of bones first found in 1903 in a cave in County Clare on the west coast of Ireland.

It was stored in the National Museum of Ireland since the 1920s, until Dowd and Ruth Carden, a research associate with the National Museum of Ireland, re-examined it and applied for funding to have it radiocarbon dated.

The team sent a second sample to the University of Oxford to double-check the result. Both tests indicated the bear had been cut up by a human about 12,500 years ago.

The new date means there was human activity in Ireland in the Stone Age or Palaeolithic period, whereas previously, scientists only had evidence of humans in Ireland in the later Mesolithic period.

Dowd said: “Archaeologists have been searching for the Irish Palaeolithic since the 19th century, and now, finally, the first piece of the jigsaw has been revealed.”

Three experts further confirmed that the cut marks on the bone had been made when the bone was fresh, confirming they dated from the same time as the bone.

The results were revealed in a paper published in the journal Quaternary Science Reviews.

As well as pushing back the date of human history in Ireland, the find may have important implications for zoology, as scientists have not previously considered that humans could have influenced extinctions of species in Ireland so long ago.

From a zoological point of view, this is very exciting
Ruth Carden, research associate with the National Museum of Ireland
“From a zoological point of view, this is very exciting,” Carden said. “This paper should generate a lot of discussion within the zoological research world and it’s time to start thinking outside the box... or even dismantling it entirely!”

The National Museum of Ireland noted that approximately two million more specimens are held in its collections and could reveal more secrets.

“All are available for research and we never know what may emerge,” said Nigel Monaghan, keeper of the natural history division of the National Museum of Ireland.

“Radiocarbon dating is something never imagined by the people who excavated these bones in caves over a century ago, and these collections may have much more to reveal about Ireland’s ancient past.”
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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Re: The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools

Postby brekin » Mon Mar 21, 2016 12:21 pm

Kind of surprised there isn't a Spotlight thread on RI. (Or is there somewhere?)

Anyways, we were talking about how conspiracy has gone mainstream, like we do, and film Spotlight is probably the shining example of this.
And they did it in a smart, empathetic and effective way. Winning best picture and screenplay I think shows also that people get it, there are large institutional conspiracies and those who hit them hard in the beginning will be dismissed as cranks for years (if not worse) and for a large scale conspiracy to operate, those with some power to bring it to light will have to be complicit to some degree, where it becomes more of a cultural norm than anything. I think Spotlight shows how the intersections of culture, ethnicity, faith, journalism, politics, the law, family, peer group, education, neighborhood, etc. all contribute to maintaining or exposing a conspiracy.

If I knew all mysteries and all knowledge, and have not charity, I am nothing. St. Paul
I hang onto my prejudices, they are the testicles of my mind. Eric Hoffer
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Re: The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools

Postby PufPuf93 » Tue Mar 22, 2016 3:21 pm

I am Irish surnamed and have more Irish in family tree than any other origin (Irish, Scotch-Irish, English, Swede, Dutch, French, French-Basque Heinz 57, my Swedish great grandfather was the last to come to California when he jumped ship in San Francisco in the 1870s).

I visited my family in County Down and the night arrived there was the night that Bobby Sands died. My paternal great grandfather came to the California goldfields in the 1870s reportedly with the aim to move his family here but failed. He had sold the family store in Hilltown. My grandfather came to California in 1888, aged 18, to find his father who essentially abandoned his family. I have some long generations as my Dad was born when his father was 44 and I was born when my Dad was 43. My paternal grandfather passed away several years before I was born.

My Dad's oldest brother was somewhat the family historian and was more like a grandfather to me. He was the one that kept track as he still had a first cousin that lived on and still owned the family farm near Hilltown. They wrote once or twice a year and he shared and gave me copies of some of their correspondence. My grandfather was the youngest of three sons and there were also 3 daughters. The three sons went to California (my grandfather), Ontario, and Australia while the daughters remained in Ireland. My Dad's cousin Mary was the last and she married the neighbor's son near Hilltown and they combined the two small farms.

My exe wife #1 / university sweet heart and I made a nearly 2.5 month trip to Europe in Winter / Spring 1981 (All countries of Yugoslavia except Montenegro, Romania, Greece (and Corfu), Italy, France, Republic of Ireland, Northern Ireland, and England). We had rented a car in Rosslare after taking a ferry from Le Harve and traveled by back roads to Galway and County Mayo than went to County Down to meet my family.

I knew close to nothing about Irish culture or history including the "Troubles". My Jewish wife played fiddle in a Berkeley based band called the Nearly Gaelic Ceili Players when we lived in Berkeley so I had come to be familiar with Irish music and part of our travel in Ireland was for the music. She actually played a set with an Irish band at a club on the railroad square in Galway.

So we went to the family farm and met the elderly Mary and four of her children, two lived with her on the farm. I found out I was part Irish Catholic and this was an awkward moment. That night Bobby Sands died. Northern Ireland went on a general strike and Mary's other two surviving children and families came down from Belfast to meet their American relative. They were all pro-IRA. The daughter that lived on the farm was an IRA widow with a teen age son. We went to visit the parish priest and to wander the ruins of a flax mill where my ancestors had worked. In the countryside a Brit helicopter landed and we were stopped; we were in an overloaded rental car from Republic of Ireland. There were troops manning road blocks near just about any concentration of population but there was very little traffic during the five days we were there. The second night we went to a bar in Hilltown that was officially closed but there were local Catholics drinking and talking and singing and coming and going through the back door. While we were there, a group came through Hilltown and painted pro IRA graffiti on many of the buildings in the one street Hilltown.

We left to go to Dublin the day of Bobby Sand's funeral. My relatives went with us to the border where there was almost no traffic but we were pulled over and questioned by troops and then went through a check point at the border. The travel was slow as there were funeral parades in each town along the route, the Republic of Ireland was every bit as boisterous over Bobby Sand's death as the North was closed down. Once in Dublin, where we had hotel reservations and were to drop off the rental car, the crowds were so intense we could not reach our hotel nor the car rental place. We abandoned the car and walked with luggage to car rental office and then the hotel and took the first available courtesy van to the airport and flew to London.

My relative in Hilltown had a photo of my grandfather and great grandfather posed in a film studio in Eureka, CA in late 1870s and they mailed me a negative after the visit. I questioned my Dad and uncle about being my surprise in that they were Catholic and also about my great grandfather and the story I had been told about his selling the family store and then disappearing. I have a piece of the tile roof off the home built in the 1700s where my grandfather and great grandfather were born and raised and an old black thorn shillelagh from the farm. I found great grandfather's grave in an adjacent (Siskiyou) county. Mt Dad did not even know of his grandfather's existence in California and knew less than I about Irish history (even though he had spent over a year near Salisbury in England before D-Day during WWII). Unfortunately Mary passed away not long after the visit and we quit writing so I have no direct contact anymore. Probably Mary's oldest son or his son have the Hilltown farm now.

PS I also recommend How the Irish Saved Civilization mentioned above. When I came back from that trip, I read Uris's historical novel Trinity and have re-read several times since and also Redemption that continues the story. I never made the trip back to Ireland though have been in England 3X (2X London only) since, last in 1994.
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Re: The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools

Postby divideandconquer » Fri Mar 16, 2018 1:40 pm

Ireland 1845-1850: the Perfect Holocaust, and Who Kept it 'Perfect.' by Christopher Fogarty

'I see clearly that man in this world deceives himself by admiring and esteeming things which are not, and neither sees nor esteems the things which are.' — St. Catherine of Genoa
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Re: The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools

Postby seemslikeadream » Fri Mar 16, 2018 2:05 pm

At least the Irish have a history of survival and a tradition of sweet revenge.


AlicetheKurious » Sun Mar 18, 2012 1:29 pm wrote:
peartreed wrote:At least the Irish have a history of survival and a tradition of sweet revenge.

My Irish ancestors moved off the farm during the potato famine and migrated to the coast where, during storms, they built huge bonfires and, with lanterns, lured and guided passing ships onto the rocks, where they then salvaged the wrecks for the precious food and goods that the English Lords were exporting.

My Great Grandfather and Great Uncles then found work in the Belfast shipyards where they became steel platers, building the Titanic. After the sinking, my Grandmother still had the courage to cross the Atlantic to Canada as a Lady’s Companion, and married the English Lord’s landscape gardener there. They raised a family of four on the produce and proceeds of that estate, acquiring a subdivided portion of the land when the nobleman died. Apparently he died of drink, but not before my forebears finessed his signing a generous will while previewing his wake.

So today I raise a Guiness to the indominatable spirit of the adaptive, surviving souls.

peartreed


I like that. Slainte!
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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Re: The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools

Postby peartreed » Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:08 pm

Before it was locked and sent to the fire pit, the article on “The Real Irish American Story” was an interesting take on how actual Irish history and Irish American descendants can also become somewhat distorted by stereotypes of the annual celebrations of charming leprechaun imagery under the shamrocks, especially on St. Patrick’s Day.

There’s little gold at the end of the rainbow when attempts are made to link genetics to false, stereotypical behavior and folkloric political expectations by racial origin.

I think this thread, “The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools” is more complete and better-informed in following the Irish across the pond and connecting to their kin, and their multi-faceted migrations in many directions – including diverse politics, professions and progress - despite past root poverty.

While some seem fixated on labeling and attacking opponents and adversaries, it is more likely that it’s just Irish temper.

As I confessed on this thread (above), I’m also of Irish descent and I can relate to both Irish wit and ill-tempered witlessness in trying to justify wielding a sheleighly at shadows. But I also appeal to the softer soul of the oppressed Irish for empathy.

The endless prodding, provoking and baiting of SLAD by bullies is getting boring.

Her prime motivation in prolific posts here appears to be an advocate for political change, particularly the removal of Trump by citing his never-ending violations of decency, office responsibility and role performance. That, by itself, contributes to a state of rage, frustration and super-sensitivity to attacks while attempting to share the demanding, voluminous evidence in support of the campaign to impeach. It takes a lot of energy to research, find and post related coverage from multiple newsfeeds. I get riled just reading the outrages of Trump, let alone sourcing it.

The reason members copy and paste to post news articles is because they cannot retype it all personally, yet feel it is still highly informative to the topic threads. It is driven by passion. That same intense effort can erupt in outrage when it is met with derision.

Not all of the Irish have a way with words. They are known to hurl invective curses.

But the pathetically obvious bullying, baiting and attempted belittlement is cruel and uncalled for. Only emotionally immature sadists enjoy cutting down colleens.

Regardless of the form of her retaliatory reactions, gallant, mature and appreciative Irish gentlemen approve. Even if Trump has some Irish on his mother’s side, any remaining milk of human kindness has curdled and soured by his paternal poison.
Last edited by peartreed on Fri Mar 16, 2018 8:16 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: The Real Irish American Story Not Taught in Schools

Postby Jerky » Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:12 pm

Thoughtful rebuttal as usual, Peartree. Thank you for your even-handedness and your sense of fair play.

J.
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