Global Research, Chossudovsky, Russia, Propaganda

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Re: Global Research, Chossudovsky, Russia, Propaganda

Postby American Dream » Sun Nov 04, 2018 12:17 pm

Russia Watcher’s Field Guide (Essential!)

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Whataboutery: The go-to argument for Kremlin defenders everywhere, e.g. “Okay maybe Russia did start the war in Ukraine but it doesn’t matter because IraqLibyaSyriaAfghanistanVietnamHiroshimaNagasakiPhilippineinsurrectionadinfinitum!”

It is important to understand that when you use a what about argument, you’re not saying Russia and the other country are equal. The “same” thing that the other country did is in fact morally wrong, but the thing Russia did that forced you to resort to whataboutery in the first place is morally right.

Moral equivalence: Used by defenders of Western status quo when an argument isn’t actually whataboutery and is in fact an apt comparison. Basically means: “Yes we do that but it’s different because we have better intentions, or something.”

Soviet Union: Russia.

Hybrid Warfare: A revolutionary new method of warfare developed by Russia which entails invading countries and claiming it’s not really involved in the conflict, fooling absolutely no one at all. Hybrid warfare also involves information warfare, whereby Russia produces massive amounts of contradictory propaganda which is disseminated by so many different sources and is so varied that even the forces waging hybrid warfare have no idea what is going on or what they are doing. Constantly confusing the fuck out of your own forces and keeping them guessing is a terrifying new form of warfare.

RT: A satellite TV network that could have been a respectable alternative media outlet but ended up turning into a propaganda mouthpiece because some idiots decided they were fighting an information war.

Sputnik News: Because RT’s still too objective to fight a proper information war! Expensive too. Be careful on Twitter; Sputnik News is often indistinguishable from its own parody accounts.

Russia Insider: Because even Sputnik News turned down your writing.

Euromaidan Press: Ukraine’s equivalent to Russia Insider.


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I was so inspired by Euromaidan! THE STRUGGLE IS REAL! I must fight for Ukraine's freedom from the comfort of my suburban home in Canada!


CNN:

1. The single source of all negative information about Russia. Everyone in America who does not pay attention to Russian media watches CNN, and it’s all lies! There are no other sources on Russia in the West but CNN.

2. American cable news network known for repeatedly rearranging the borders of Europe and other geographical features via their graphics department. The network is shown in doctors’ offices across America.

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Everything you need to know about Some Ukraines from America’s leading authority in news.

Kremlin Whore: What’s that, something you wrote sounds like something that a pro-Kremlin source said, even if your argument is based on completely different sources or has a completely different motive? Did you acknowledge that in one particular case, Russia (or the Soviet Union because same thing right?), might have had a point? Clearly you are a Kremlin propagandist! Enjoy your blood rubles, presstitute!

State Department/NATO shill: How dare you write about corruption in Russia and the concrete consequences this has for the Russian people!


More: https://nobsrussia.com/russia-watchers- ... essential/
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Re: Global Research, Chossudovsky, Russia, Propaganda

Postby Elvis » Sun Nov 04, 2018 4:23 pm

^^^^ Thanks for bringing that CIA/State Department propaganda to light!
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Re: Global Research, Chossudovsky, Russia, Propaganda

Postby Belligerent Savant » Sun Nov 04, 2018 5:39 pm

.

An insult to the ostensible* pursuits of this board.


*ostensible is a necessary qualifier given how pervasive such postings have been over the years.
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Re: Global Research, Chossudovsky, Russia, Propaganda

Postby Elvis » Mon Nov 05, 2018 6:35 am

It's one thing to report on corruption, but it's a completely different thing to leave out half the story to tell a lie.
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Re: Global Research, Chossudovsky, Russia, Propaganda

Postby American Dream » Tue Nov 06, 2018 8:14 pm

Yes to Alternative Voices, No to Bullshit

First of all let’s just toss out this notion that more diversity in the “mainstream media” would “silence RT.” RT, like Sputnik, are now money making schemes for people like Margarita Simonyan and countless other people on the take. Margarita is on record comparing RT to an information weapon. According to her, it needs funding for the same reason the Ministry of Defense needs funding, to protect the privileged status of Russia’s tiny elite to “defend” against the dastardly West that hates Russia for no reason.

“The information weapon, of course, is used in critical moments, and war is always a critical moment. And it’s war. It’s a weapon like any other. Do you understand? And to say, why do we need it — it’s about the same as saying: ‘Why do we need the Ministry of Defense, if there is no war?’ –Margarita Simonyan


Now I get that the argument in question is actually implying that if people in the West see more anti-war or let’s say “anti-establishment” voices on their mainstream networks, RT’s audience will dry up and then perhaps the Russian government will start cutting its funding and maybe shutting down bureaus. I can tell you this is bullshit just based on the words of Simonyan I alluded to above.

More importantly, RT doesn’t have a massive audience or following anywhere. Plenty of people have pointed this out in the past. This is why they constantly harp on their Youtube views, despite the fact that their top hundred most-viewed videos include maybe two that have anything to do with Russian politics, and all their channels combined are dwarfed by the audience of a racist Swedish moron who screams at video games.

No, it’s not a lack of audience or ratings that would kill RT’s funding. If anything keeps it in business it’s alarmist quotes from Western leaders and think tank “information warriors” that make it out at something to be feared. RT’s editors actually collect these quotes and celebrate them, as they did in the end of a video celebrating their 10-year anniversary in 2015.

This is not to say that opening up “mainstream” media to more diverse voices, especially anti-war voices when a possible war looms on the horizon, wouldn’t reduce RT’s audience; it just wouldn’t make RT go away. Even if they were bereft of a significant audience because viewers flocked back to “mainstream media” outlets in droves to see more “anti-war” voices, the Russian government would still need to get out its message in service of its foreign policy goals.

See without outside influence, a lot of American and other Western “dissident” types would tend to ignore many issues of great importance to the Kremlin. Were it not for a major Russian propaganda offensive, very few Americans would pay any attention to Ukraine, for example, because that is simply not important to them. In order to make sure people outside of Russia believe that Ukraine is run by gay Jewish Nazis or that the Russian domestic opposition is a CIA front (controlled by gay Jewish Nazi CIA handlers), the Kremlin would need to keep broadcasting its messaging. And so they would, no matter how few people are actually watching.

But as soon as we debunk that part of the argument we get into the bigger problem- what does it mean to give a platform to “alternative views,” including antiwar views? To dissect this we need to first understand that for the left at least, we still haven’t woken up to the fact that a lot of us have been viewing global politics via the prism of 2002-2003, i.e. the invasion of Iraq, for far too long. It was in the run-up to that war that we saw what future historians ought to call The Great Failure of the American Media (specifically American media since international media, including some international versions of US networks, was often more critical or even-handed). Pretty much everyone above a certain age knows this story- in the aftermath of 9/11 news networks didn’t want to appear “unpatriotic.” Fox News was banging the drums of war as loudly as possible and other networks began tailing them. This led to such disturbing actions such as the firing of Phil Donahue from MSNBC and deliberately stacking talk shows with pro-war guests.

But while US media outlets still have their biases towards military interventions of all kinds, one can’t pretend that the political landscape in regards to war is the same as it was under Bush post-9/11, because it just plain isn’t. In the last presidential election, Hillary Clinton was smeared as the “war-mongering” candidate, while conservatives actually started criticizing the Iraq War (to be fair the far-right paleo-conservatives always did that). Sean Hannity, a man who spent years spewing white-hot vitriol at anti-war voices under Bush and on occasion even claimed Iraqi WMDs had been discovered well after the US government reported that they had not, has become Donald Trump’s biggest defender in spite of his repeated isolationist statements. In fact if we go back to 2013, when Assad’s forces first used chemical weapons on a large scale, we see that while Republicans did mostly back the idea of military intervention to punish the regime, they seemed to be mostly in favor of cruise missile strikes or the use of other weapons that wouldn’t endanger American lives. In the end Obama couldn’t find support for any real intervention and ended up making a deal with Putin that obviously didn’t work. Less than a year later, the Obama administration advised Ukraine’s new government to stand down and not resist the Russian takeover of the Crimea even when Ukrainian forces could have spoiled the annexation plan. Even as Putin expanded his aggression with a war in the Donbas, the US administration held fast to its assertion that there was no military solution to the crisis. Putin clearly didn’t see it that way.

Nowadays the situation is quite different. One day we hear Trump is talking about pulling out of Syria as fast as possible, and then a few weeks later he’s launching cruise missiles at Damascus, but very politely warning the regime’s Russian allies well in advance. Before each of Trump’s strikes on Syria (2017, 2018), much of the radical left went into Iraq-era hysterics about war-mongering, often arguing against an Iraq-like ground invasion that nobody had even seriously suggested. I’m sad to say that around the time of the most recent strikes there was a Chapo Trap House episode on the subject that made me cringe because of the bad arguments. But it’s not their problem- the whole Western left, largely because it is stuck in the Cold War, the Iraq War era, or often a combination of both, just plain sucks when it comes to foreign policy. And here’s where we get to the whole problem of having anti-war guests on mainstream outlets.

You see, back in the run-up to the invasion of Iraq this was a pretty straightforward thing. You could find highly qualified critics of the Bush administration’s case for war who weren’t even necessarily motivated by an anti-war or pacifist ideology. It was a simple matter of the administration trying to make the case that Iraq posed a credible threat to the US and its allies due to its possession of WMDs and programs to acquire bigger, more powerful WMDs, ie nuclear weapons. Many of the claims they would put forth could be roundly debunked at the time, such as the case of the aluminum tubes. Sure they could have brought on ideological opponents of the war like Noam Chomsky or Chris Hedges (who by my research appeared on Charlie Rose’s program prior to the invasion), but there were plenty of guests they could have brought on to debunk administration claims based on technical expertise alone. They did not, with disastrous consequences for the whole world.

Today, however, the situation is quite different. Today many people who call themselves anti-war, be they left or right, are often cheering for or at least excusing some other war, either in Syria or somewhere else. If a self-proclaimed “anti-war” guest engages in rationalizing Bashar al Assad’s violence (arguably aggression since he started retaking territory in 2016 rather than suing for peace) or Putin’s aggression in Ukraine, how can they honestly be called anti-war? Oh sure, they’re against the wars you don’t like, but you can’t call them “anti-war.” More importantly for the network, they can’t honestly claim such a guest is anti-war.


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Re: Global Research, Chossudovsky, Russia, Propaganda

Postby Elvis » Tue Nov 06, 2018 11:00 pm

I am responding to an Alert and other member complaints. Doubling down on this kind of material may meet with consequences you won't like. Cagey sophistry attempting to justify it won't help either. I'm letting you know as a courtesy.


American Dream wrote:First of all let’s just toss out this notion that more diversity in the “mainstream media” would “silence RT.” RT, like Sputnik, are now money making schemes for people like Margarita Simonyan and countless other people on the take. Margarita is on record comparing RT to an information weapon. According to her, it needs funding for the same reason the Ministry of Defense needs funding, to protect the privileged status of Russia’s tiny elite to “defend” against the dastardly West that hates Russia for no reason.


American Dream wrote:Hillary Clinton was smeared as the “war-mongering” candidate, while conservatives actually started criticizing the Iraq War (to be fair the far-right paleo-conservatives always did that). Sean Hannity, a man who spent years spewing white-hot vitriol at anti-war voices under Bush and on occasion even claimed Iraqi WMDs had been discovered well after the US government reported that they had not, has become Donald Trump’s biggest defender in spite of his repeated isolationist statements. In fact if we go back to 2013, when Assad’s forces first used chemical weapons on a large scale, we see that while Republicans did mostly back the idea of military intervention to punish the regime, they seemed to be mostly in favor of cruise missile strikes or the use of other weapons that wouldn’t endanger American lives. In the end Obama couldn’t find support for any real intervention and ended up making a deal with Putin that obviously didn’t work. Less than a year later, the Obama administration advised Ukraine’s new government to stand down and not resist the Russian takeover of the Crimea even when Ukrainian forces could have spoiled the annexation plan. Even as Putin expanded his aggression with a war in the Donbas, the US administration held fast to its assertion that there was no military solution to the crisis. Putin clearly didn’t see it that way.


American Dream wrote:Today, however, the situation is quite different. Today many people who call themselves anti-war, be they left or right, are often cheering for or at least excusing some other war, either in Syria or somewhere else. If a self-proclaimed “anti-war” guest engages in rationalizing Bashar al Assad’s violence (arguably aggression since he started retaking territory in 2016 rather than suing for peace) or Putin’s aggression in Ukraine, how can they honestly be called anti-war? Oh sure, they’re against the wars you don’t like, but you can’t call them “anti-war.” More importantly for the network, they can’t honestly claim such a guest is anti-war.
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Re: Global Research, Chossudovsky, Russia, Propaganda

Postby American Dream » Tue Nov 06, 2018 11:14 pm

So the violation of board guidelines would be what?

I get that you don't agree with the content but nothing about board principle.
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Re: Global Research, Chossudovsky, Russia, Propaganda

Postby Elvis » Tue Nov 06, 2018 11:39 pm

American Dream wrote:So the violation of board guidelines would be what?

I get that you don't agree with the content but nothing about board principles.



I'll quote the Alert: "This is an anti-fascist board, isn't it?"

I am not speaking for myself alone, I'm responding to a growing chorus. It's not a matter of whether or not I "agree with the content," it's a matter of the content.

This thread is a good example. Locking.
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