Segregation: A Modest Proposal

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Re: Segregation: A Modest Proposal

Postby Elvis » Mon Nov 02, 2015 8:32 pm

I wonder if some of these rural areas are where you might still hear, "There's no racial strife here -- everyone gets along and knows their place."
"Frankly, I don't think it's a good idea but the sums proposed are enormous."
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Re: Segregation: A Modest Proposal

Postby General Patton » Mon Nov 02, 2015 9:41 pm

Elvis » Mon Nov 02, 2015 7:32 pm wrote:I wonder if some of these rural areas are where you might still hear, "There's no racial strife here -- everyone gets along and knows their place."


I was going to make a separate thread for the rural v. city divide, but we're already balls deep in it and I'm not pulling out.

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I'll start off by saying that going after white rednecks is probably the least risky and safest thing that you can possibly do in this political climate without being worried about being fired by your employer or harassed. Somewhere around the time liberals transitioned from George Carlin's nihilist attacks on everything to John Oliver's "it's the current year! Isn't the opposition stupid?!" they lost a lot of heart.

Not that there isn't humor and violence to be found in some rural areas.



By far my favorite lament is from liberals who can't understand why rural whites despise liberals when it's fairly obvious that they are held in complete contempt by them. Relationships go both ways.
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Re: Segregation: A Modest Proposal

Postby Nordic » Mon Nov 02, 2015 10:00 pm

Elvis » Mon Nov 02, 2015 7:32 pm wrote:I wonder if some of these rural areas are where you might still hear, "There's no racial strife here -- everyone gets along and knows their place."



You mean like this?

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/11/missour ... aping-her/

Missouri townspeople shun sex abuse victim as a liar — even after ‘good man’ admits to raping her



Small towns in the Midwest. Worst experience of my life was living in one. And I was a white kid.
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Re: Segregation: A Modest Proposal

Postby coffin_dodger » Mon Nov 02, 2015 10:27 pm

It's an odd feeling, when suddenly you find yourself out-of-step with the General Concensus of Reality - especially here, at RI.

Here's the thing. I don't hate racists. I don't find them 'vile' or 'evil'.

They are quite simply old-fashioned.

They are remnant particles of a System that is changing.

A stale, past-its-sell-by-date, 'top-down' System - built on intimidation, followed by exploitation.

It's no wonder there's still so many that cling to the old ways - it's a System that worked well, for some, for centuries.
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Re: Segregation: A Modest Proposal

Postby Elvis » Mon Nov 02, 2015 11:18 pm

Nordic » Mon Nov 02, 2015 7:00 pm wrote:
Elvis » Mon Nov 02, 2015 7:32 pm wrote:I wonder if some of these rural areas are where you might still hear, "There's no racial strife here -- everyone gets along and knows their place."



You mean like this?

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/11/missour ... aping-her/

Missouri townspeople shun sex abuse victim as a liar — even after ‘good man’ admits to raping her



Small towns in the Midwest. Worst experience of my life was living in one. And I was a white kid.



Wow:

Missouri townspeople shun sex abuse victim as a liar — even after ‘good man’ admits to raping her
...

[rapist] Paden’s great-aunt said she would “feel sorry for the girl” if she had been abused — but she doesn’t believe the victim’s claims and instead sees the case as a test of the community’s religious faith.

“Our community is one that we deeply believe in God and we’re not going to buckle under anything,” said 82-year-old Dixie Wilson. “We’re not going to let it destroy all of us. We’re going to keep doing our good works and doing what we believe and rely on each other.”



Does God know about this??
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Re: Segregation: A Modest Proposal

Postby Iamwhomiam » Mon Nov 02, 2015 11:26 pm

General Patton wrote,
By far my favorite lament is from liberals who can't understand why rural whites despise liberals when it's fairly obvious that they are held in complete contempt by them. Relationships go both ways.


Bullshit! I don't believe you've ever heard a liberal lament any such thing. Nor do I believe any self-proclaimed liberal is contemptuous of rural whites who do feel contemptuous of liberals.

Most "liberals" have better education than conservative rural whites. (The suicide rate for rural whites is higher than any other segment of society, btw) So, rather than holding rednecks in contempt, liberals look at them as though they are developmentally disabled adults, not to be scorned, but to be pitied.

:partydance:
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Re: Segregation: A Modest Proposal

Postby General Patton » Mon Nov 02, 2015 11:47 pm

Iamwhomiam » Mon Nov 02, 2015 10:26 pm wrote:
Most "liberals" have better education than conservative rural whites. (The suicide rate for rural whites is higher than any other segment of society, btw) So, rather than holding rednecks in contempt, liberals look at them as though they are developmentally disabled adults, not to be scorned, but to be pitied.

:partydance:


There is an interesting relationship between contempt and pity. Liberals are in an arranged marriage and they expect the other half to change for their own benefit, in much the same way they expect criminals to change to make them feel safer. Lots of waiting involved in that.
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Re: Segregation: A Modest Proposal

Postby kool maudit » Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:45 am

Much of the taboo against racism, and the victories of the Civil Rights era, were achieved through an understanding of the term that allowed ordinary, non-academic people to consider racial differences and hierarchies as illusory, cruel and distorting ("the content of a man's character etc") in light of the need for a broader meritocratic conception of who and what we are.

The other more academic definition (the power one) has more to do with Marxist thought and analysis and, whatever its merits, was never behind what came to be the common person's rejection of the phenomenon.
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Re: Segregation: A Modest Proposal

Postby backtoiam » Tue Nov 03, 2015 7:27 am

I'm almost sure you're trolling me and so I feel like a fool for responding, but I had to anyway.


I wasn't trolling you. Also I really don't have the energy or desire to get into an extended debate about this. I am only replying to you because I like you and I want to be respectful to you. Sometimes I just get tired of reading about how people want to figure out a way cure rural peoples disgust and mistrust for each other. People seem to think rural dwellers of different colors eyeball each like rabid dogs always on the verge of wanting to kill each other. We don't live that way. I just need to skip the sorts of threads and stop reading them.
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Re: Segregation: A Modest Proposal

Postby Luther Blissett » Tue Nov 03, 2015 11:06 am

backtoiam » Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:27 am wrote:
I'm almost sure you're trolling me and so I feel like a fool for responding, but I had to anyway.


I wasn't trolling you. Also I really don't have the energy or desire to get into an extended debate about this. I am only replying to you because I like you and I want to be respectful to you. Sometimes I just get tired of reading about how people want to figure out a way cure rural peoples disgust and mistrust for each other. People seem to think rural dwellers of different colors eyeball each like rabid dogs always on the verge of wanting to kill each other. We don't live that way. I just need to skip the sorts of threads and stop reading them.


Thanks, and my apologies for not believing you outright. The main thrust of my argument was really just to support community organization and community building as a tactic (one which I totally believe is able to be scaled out) because despite all the criticisms leveled against black and brown people, they are remarkably good at building strong neighborhoods where I live. I don't think I even mentioned rural areas first - I think I just said that proximity and cooperation has proven to work.

I love my neighborhood and fully believe it could represent a model for future communities, no hyperbole intended.

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Re: Segregation: A Modest Proposal

Postby Wombaticus Rex » Tue Nov 03, 2015 12:02 pm

Iamwhomiam » Mon Nov 02, 2015 10:26 pm wrote:Bullshit! I don't believe you've ever heard a liberal lament any such thing. Nor do I believe any self-proclaimed liberal is contemptuous of rural whites who do feel contemptuous of liberals.


He's basically describing my entire childhood growing up in Vermont, so I'd vouch for it. The gulf is huge and the laments, they happen.

Indeed, the totality of your phrasing makes me suspect I'm failing to grasp your sarcasm.

In fact, liberal Thomas Frank wrote an entire motherfucking book called "What's the Matter With Kansas?" back in the middle of the Bush Administration about that precise subject.
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Re: Segregation: A Modest Proposal

Postby norton ash » Tue Nov 03, 2015 12:20 pm

It's only natural to be frustrated with the poor who vote for banksters. Or choose hostility as a personal brand, from the truck on down to the T-shirt to the nightly bar fights. So the laments, they happen.

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Re: Segregation: A Modest Proposal

Postby Luther Blissett » Tue Nov 03, 2015 2:58 pm

Oh yeah, sometimes I forget that people refer to me as a liberal even though I am not.

I witnessed a great conversation between two young radicals online the other day. One was criticizing Trotsky and Trotskyites and invoked the Kronstadt Rebellion. The other admitted they didn't know what that was, apologized and said "I know I sound like a liberal right, but I literally have never heard about that," and asked for it to be explained.

I love that. It really sums liberalism up to me. Non-awareness. I don't consider any poster here a liberal. Obviously it's okay for people to use the word to describe themselves, I mean who cares.
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Re: Segregation: A Modest Proposal

Postby General Patton » Tue Nov 03, 2015 3:18 pm

Luther Blissett » Tue Nov 03, 2015 1:58 pm wrote:Oh yeah, sometimes I forget that people refer to me as a liberal even though I am not.

I witnessed a great conversation between two young radicals online the other day. One was criticizing Trotsky and Trotskyites and invoked the Kronstadt Rebellion. The other admitted they didn't know what that was, apologized and said "I know I sound like a liberal right, but I literally have never heard about that," and asked for it to be explained.

I love that. It really sums liberalism up to me. Non-awareness. I don't consider any poster here a liberal. Obviously it's okay for people to use the word to describe themselves, I mean who cares.


I don't think of you as a liberal either. The hallmark of liberals, beyond what they hate, is that they are lukewarm and comfortable.
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Re: Segregation: A Modest Proposal

Postby zangtang » Tue Nov 03, 2015 3:31 pm

This is not the 1st thread where I've had to go back to the beginning........

I'm completely lost.
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