The Man in the High Castle - PKD on Amazon video

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The Man in the High Castle - PKD on Amazon video

Postby PufPuf93 » Sat Dec 12, 2015 9:46 pm

I thought this production warranted a thread of its own at RI.

In general, I have found movies / TV made from PKD writings disappointing.

While TMITHC won PKD's only Hugo award, I do not rate TMITHC in the top ten of PKD novels.

However, I subscribed to Amazon Prime so as to watch TMITHC.

The production is quite nice but would be hard to follow if one did not already know the book/story and read about this production on the internet.

So far I have watched the first two and part of the third episodes. Despite the fine production, I have had a hard time not falling asleep (repeatedly).

There is a good but critical article on PKD and THITHC at Counterpunch. Note the Amazon production of TMITHC has received lots of PR and general attention.

I am not nearly as negative about Amazon's TMITHC as Welzenbach at Counterpunch. IMHO much effort and $$$ went into the production and the mood of oppression is overpoweringly stark (maybe why I keep falling asleep :lol: ) .

Welzenbach notes that movies are being made of The Three Stigmata of Palmer Eldritch and Flow My Tears The Policeman Said which is news to me anyway. TTSPE and FMTTPS are two of the finest PKD novels. John Lennon once had a movie option of TTSPE prior to the creation of Bladerunner.

December 4, 2015

The Further Nullification of Philip K. Dick

by Chris Welzenbach



Philip K. Dick fans who love movies are damaged people. I recall my horror on first seeing Ridley Scott’s Blade Runner (1982), which was promoted as a film version of Do Androids Dream Of Electric Sheep and was the first major studio release inspired by what until then was Dick’s long-neglected body of work, but arrived onscreen shorn of Mercerism and the Buster Friendly Show—essentially the heart and soul of his 1968 novel. The special effects were marvelous and the imagery extraordinary, but I left the theater feeling cheated and betrayed. Ridley Scott had chewed up a profound piece of science fiction and expectorated a bloated over-produced riff on an Outer Limits episode titled Demon With A Glass Hand. (Scripted by Harlan Ellison, Demon With A Glass Hand starred Robert Culp and was shot in the Bradbury Building—a Los Angeles landmark—where Ridley Scott filmed much of Blade Runner. The similarities do not end with choice of location, but for the sake of those who haven’t yet seen it I shall not divulge any more.)

Paul Verhoeven’s Total Recall (1990) is based on a 1966 short story by Philip K. Dick called We Can Remember It For You Wholesale, but is essentially a vehicle for Arnold Schwarzenegger featuring unnumbered shoot-em-up action sequences that bears little resemblance to the story on which it is based. A later 2012 production boasting the same title is equally remote from its source material.

Blade Runner initially bombed at the box office but later grew in stature—particularly after the release of a director’s cut—while Total Recall was box office gold from the getgo. Its success assured a flood of scripts inspired by the work of Philip K. Dick that universally lack his spiritualism and his desperately sad humanity, his emphasis on empathy and the transcendent nature of love, and all too often use his stories as springboards for savage violence and eye-catching CGI. Such “adaptations” include Steven Spielberg’s chase movie Minority Report (2002), a forgettable Ben Affleck flick called Paycheck (2003), an examination of pre-cognition with Nicholas Cage called Next (2007), a playful romance featuring Matt Damon called The Adjustment Bureau (2011), and a number of other features that can collectively be summed up by P.L. Travers, who’d authored Mary Poppins in 1934 and had witnessed its cruel appropriation by Walt Disney: “It was as if they took a sausage, threw away the contents but kept the skin, and filled the skin with their own ideas very far from the original substance.”

One bright spot is Richard Linklater’s A Scanner Darkly (2006), which closely adheres to Philip K. Dick’s 1977 novel—a dark dystopic journey into madness. Linklater employs a technique called interpolated rotoscope to present the action from an animated remove and uses a subdivision pocked by neglect as the film’s location, and does actually capture Philip K. Dick’s nightmarish conception.

Now comes Amazon’s “adaptation” of his 1962 novel, The Man In The High Castle, produced by Ridley Scott and developed by Frank Spotznitz. An alternative history set in 1962, The Man In The High Castle imagines a world where Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan won the Second World War and the former U.S. has been divvied up into the Pacific States, controlled by Japan, the Rocky Mountain States, ostensibly under Japanese control but where actual authority remains ambiguous, and the United States, composed of the midwest and the eastern states, that is firmly under the Nazi Reich. In its original form, The Man in the High Castle is an intriguing examination of the I-Ching and the role fate plays in deciding human affairs. By contrast, Frank Spotznitz’s television series is Spy v. Spy with swastikas and rising suns.

skip a bunch

Philip K. Dick can no longer defend his work, so the rest of us must step up to the plate. One way of expressing our displeasure is not to go along, not to rent or to view this abomination, to simply ignore its dreadful existence. Rumor has it two of Dick’s most important novels, The Three Stigmata of Palmer Eldrich and Flow My Tears, The Policeman Said are set to become motion pictures. Brace yourselves.

See entire article at: http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/12/04/ ... ip-k-dick/
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Re: The Man in the High Castle - PKD on Amazon video

Postby Nordic » Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:02 am

I'm watching it and am almost done with the season. I like it quite a bit. A great deal of tension and suspense. Great production values. Rufus Sewell is pretty mesmerizing. Not sure why it put you to sleep!

I haven't read the book, so I have zero idea as to how true to the book it may or may not be.
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Re: The Man in the High Castle - PKD on Amazon video

Postby PufPuf93 » Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:39 am

Nordic » Sat Dec 12, 2015 9:02 pm wrote:I'm watching it and am almost done with the season. I like it quite a bit. A great deal of tension and suspense. Great production values. Rufus Sewell is pretty mesmerizing. Not sure why it put you to sleep!

I haven't read the book, so I have zero idea as to how true to the book it may or may not be.


I actually like it quite a bit as well and totally agree on "A great deal of tension and suspense. Great production values.".

Maybe the "tension and suspense" and general oppressive nature is what makes me so sleepy. :lol:

The actors are all excellent but so far (into episode 3) there are none that are particularly attractive to me.

Also (again so far) there is not the trademark PKD humor and much more overt violence.

Above I stated that TMITHC is a good novel but I would not rate in my personal top tier; however, the film underscores the oppression in a manner lacking in the novel.

Amazing how the topics that PKD wrote about decades ago pertain to today's world.
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Re: The Man in the High Castle - PKD on Amazon video

Postby Nordic » Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:43 am

IMO it gets even more pertinent as it goes along.
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Re: The Man in the High Castle - PKD on Amazon video

Postby esotericmetal » Sun Dec 13, 2015 8:15 am

I finished watching the whole thing recently. On the whole I thought it was pretty good, even if it is not faithful to the book (not a bad thing IMO; I think it would be impossible to capture PKD's style in another medium).The overall themes and tone of it were pretty palatable. I definitely did also fall asleep a few times though. Just started listening to the audiobook as it has been a long time since I read the book and I don't really remember it all that well.
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Re: The Man in the High Castle - PKD on Amazon video

Postby Grizzly » Sun Dec 13, 2015 7:41 pm

of the best novels, and most important to understanding of the nature of our world, is Ursula Le Guin's The Lathe of Heaven, in which the dream universe is articulated in such a striking and compelling way that I hesitate to add any further explanation to it; it requires none."
Philip K. Dick


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Re: The Man in the High Castle - PKD on Amazon video

Postby RocketMan » Mon Dec 14, 2015 6:24 am

I like the series. I think it is at its best when it posits a Nazified USA without much underlining it, as a natural historical progression. It's pretty basic stuff, but I think it's good that that point of view is out there in the culture, considering how deeply American exceptionalism is ingrained in the US generally.

Another thing I most like about it is Cary-Hiroyuki Tagawa's Mr. Tagomi. Excellent under-acting right there. Rufus Sewell is also quite good but in a more traditional, banality of evil kind of way.
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Re: The Man in the High Castle - PKD on Amazon video

Postby lucky » Mon Dec 14, 2015 8:55 am

Seen the whole thing....now waiting for series 2..3...4.... which is my main problem with all American series, they just run and run with no ending bar a very few - Fargo/True Detective but even they are riffing on the same meme.
But as a stand alone production its pretty good and leaves no doubt that Hitler is the geezer in the castle.
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the holes are small
that's why rain is thin.
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Re: The Man in the High Castle - PKD on Amazon video

Postby Luther Blissett » Mon Dec 14, 2015 10:23 am

Here's a previous thread on the adaptation background: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=29732
Funny how it was dead in the water there.

Amazon went about this in a way different than traditional television - as far as I recall, they pit several pilot episodes of series against one another to compete to see who would be picked up, based on total viewership. I loved the Man in the High Castle pilot but also liked a weird black market gun smuggling pilot, Cocked. I was glad that Man in the High Castle was picked up, but what struck me was that they basically front-loaded the big reveal of the book into the pilot. I assumed they did this in order to draw viewers in with an interesting premise.

Someone had told me — and I thought it was on that old Man in the High Castle thread, but it looks like I was wrong — that Dick was soaked in booze throughout writing this book, and couldn't even remember much of the plot after his editor had at it. Which in and of itself is pretty astounding. That could only be a rumor or a story, but his long passages about the details of every I Ching divination were trying, like Bolaño's passages about the deaths in 2666.

By front-loading the big reveal, and letting the I Ching factor in as a running background theme rather than total foreground plot device, the series really freed up the storytelling. I also thought the show improved greatly upon the Frank - Ed - Childan relationship, another patience-testing subplot of the book. While it probably could have been shorter or a little more faithful to the story, it essentially tells the same tale but in a different way, or by using different characters.

There were a few moments in the book that I missed not seeing, some big, some small, but other than that I thought it was great.
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Re: The Man in the High Castle - PKD on Amazon video

Postby PufPuf93 » Wed Dec 16, 2015 9:31 pm

Just finished watching Episode 3 The Illustrated Woman and did not fall asleep much less get sleepy. :yay

My enjoyment went up many fold. The story and characters have more substance (to me) now.

The character of the Marshall is relentless. The characters in general are strong.

The Nazis use lsd for interrogation.

The three settings - Canon City, CO, New York, and San Francisco - are fleshed out (and beautiful in a stark and deadly way.

Lots of suspense. Closes (again) on cliffhanger.

Much more excited about watching the remaining episodes rather than slogging through trying to stay awake.

If the adaptation continues on high of Episode 3, TMIHC will be my favorite PKD film adaptation (from a good but IMO most overrated PKD novel).

This as an aside but an odd thought from yesterday. What if JFK had militarily backed the Bay of Pigs failed invasion? We would likely have now nearly 55 years of an integrated and Americanized Cuba. Unlike the foolish and evil misadventures in Viet Nam and Iraq, the outcome for Cuba would likely have been more like Japan, Germany, South Korea, or Taiwan; the Americanization would more likely have been feasible and successful. There would not have been a Cuban Missile Crisis. In general, IMO Castro's Cuba has been a unique type of success against long odds but still the world would have been a better place had Cuba been integrated with the World and a first world nation in economic terms. The USSR may have developed a client relations with another country in the western hemi-sphere.

Had the Nazis and Japan been successful in WWII, the world would have been a much darker place. The success would have only come because the Axis would have developed and employed nuclear weapons first. The Nazis and Japan would have used eugenics and population planning such that the population would not be so out of control. There would be slaves. The Abrahamic religions would have less impact. There would be hostilities (like in TMIHC) between the Nazis and Japan. There would have been a subsequent and more extensive nuclear war by now.
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Re: The Man in the High Castle - PKD on Amazon video

Postby Nordic » Wed Dec 16, 2015 9:39 pm

lucky » Mon Dec 14, 2015 7:55 am wrote:Seen the whole thing....now waiting for series 2..3...4.... which is my main problem with all American series, they just run and run with no ending bar a very few - Fargo/True Detective but even they are riffing on the same meme.
But as a stand alone production its pretty good and leaves no doubt that Hitler is the geezer in the castle.



Just watched through to the end. It seems like that's it. I don't think there will be any more seasons. How could there be?
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Re: The Man in the High Castle - PKD on Amazon video

Postby PufPuf93 » Wed Dec 16, 2015 10:20 pm

Grizzly » Sun Dec 13, 2015 4:41 pm wrote:
of the best novels, and most important to understanding of the nature of our world, is Ursula Le Guin's The Lathe of Heaven, in which the dream universe is articulated in such a striking and compelling way that I hesitate to add any further explanation to it; it requires none."
Philip K. Dick




The Lathe of Heaven has been said was Ursula Le Guin writing a PKD novel. Le Guin and PKD attended Berkeley High School concurrently but did not know of each other then (according to the Sutin PKD bio). There is correspondence between them in the published PKD letter collections. Both were/are concerned about the environment. Late in PKD's life (according to Sutin), there was some hurt feeling between them because of comments Le Guin made about PKD's treatment of female characters. Maybe this was why Angel Archer in PKD's last novel, The Transmigration of Timothy Archer, is IMO by far PKD's best female character.

I had read LOH, The Word for the World is Forest, The Dispossessed, and The Left Hand of Darkness contemporary to their publication and then bought Always Coming Home. I thought Always Coming Home had borrowed heavily from two anthropology books, Karuk Myths and Yurok Myths. The was the last Le Guin book I have ever read but by happenstance not because of my initial negative reaction. I was to find out Le Guin's father was the anthropologist Alfred Kroeber who wrote The Handbook of California Indians, Yurok Myths, and Karuk Myths (among hundreds of publications) and the anthropology building at Cal is Kroeber Hall. Le Guin's mother is author of the book Ishi. I grew up (and now live) within the boundaries of the Karuk World Renewal Ceremony / Pichi a 'vich ceremonial site (actually owned large parts of the active site until recently) and just adjacent to the Yurok Reservation.

As an undergrad at Cal, I worked at the US Forest Service Range and Experimental Station in Berkeley in the 1970s. This was the same USDA office where PKD's mother worked for many years but before my time. My live in girl friend from 1972 to 1977 was a prominent federal archeologist, now retired. Attended a boarding school in San Rafael (Marin county) 1966-1968, 8th and 9th grade. First took lsd and smoked pot (at base of cross in Boyd Park behind Mission San Rafael) while living in San Rafael. In 1970, like PKD, took mescaline for first time but, unlike PKD who reportedly did once, took 15 or so times 1970-1972 (all same batch). I have never used speed though.

I had been reading both Le Guin and PKD for years (in late 60s and 70s) before realizing their Berkeley connection. I realized PKD first based upon the opening of Dr Bloodmoney where the initial walk down Shattuck Avenue was close to my own walk from a flat on Durant Avenue to the USFS PSW lab (near Berkeley High School).

Odd coincidences.
Last edited by PufPuf93 on Wed Dec 16, 2015 10:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Man in the High Castle - PKD on Amazon video

Postby PufPuf93 » Wed Dec 16, 2015 10:44 pm

Luther Blissett » Mon Dec 14, 2015 7:23 am wrote:Here's a previous thread on the adaptation background: http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/view ... =8&t=29732
Funny how it was dead in the water there.

Amazon went about this in a way different than traditional television - as far as I recall, they pit several pilot episodes of series against one another to compete to see who would be picked up, based on total viewership. I loved the Man in the High Castle pilot but also liked a weird black market gun smuggling pilot, Cocked. I was glad that Man in the High Castle was picked up, but what struck me was that they basically front-loaded the big reveal of the book into the pilot. I assumed they did this in order to draw viewers in with an interesting premise.

Someone had told me — and I thought it was on that old Man in the High Castle thread, but it looks like I was wrong — that Dick was soaked in booze throughout writing this book, and couldn't even remember much of the plot after his editor had at it. Which in and of itself is pretty astounding. That could only be a rumor or a story, but his long passages about the details of every I Ching divination were trying, like Bolaño's passages about the deaths in 2666.

By front-loading the big reveal, and letting the I Ching factor in as a running background theme rather than total foreground plot device, the series really freed up the storytelling. I also thought the show improved greatly upon the Frank - Ed - Childan relationship, another patience-testing subplot of the book. While it probably could have been shorter or a little more faithful to the story, it essentially tells the same tale but in a different way, or by using different characters.

There were a few moments in the book that I missed not seeing, some big, some small, but other than that I thought it was great.


PKD was said to have written TMITHC using the I Ching to plot.

Bought a Wilhelm translation of the I Ching when I first read TMITHC (1974?). Over a period of about 25 years (last in 2001) I used the I Ching with Chinese coins and for some time yarrow sticks I gathered in the wild. I recorded during this time about 30 sessions the specific questions asked and the results of the toss; I employed the Oracle more as a meditation aid than oracle. I would be highly embarrassed if anyone should read my I Ching diary as I was a whiny bitch typically. The decisions attendant to the sessions were serious (left girl friend lived with from 72-77, decided to marry 1st wife, left US Forest Service employment of 16 years, left corporate employment of 7 years, changed my mind and attended Cal instead of UCLA for MBA, dumped my live in fiancée and moved in my secretary, moved to Oregon, divorced my 2nd wife, etc.). Besides being a whiny bitch (and frivolous too), my interpretations were silly to be brief. I am not saying the decisions were wrong; the results of the decisions were all over the map. The interpretations did not bear the test of time as good reasoning; humbling and self-humiliating.. That said I was not woo but used the I Ching as a meditating structure and thought I was good at opening and closing doors. :oops:
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Re: The Man in the High Castle - PKD on Amazon video

Postby Joao » Wed Dec 16, 2015 10:49 pm

PP93: Do you use the I Ching at all anymore? I've tried to "get into" it (via a Jungian projection-of-the-unconcious approach) but have never been able to really take it seriously. YMMV.

As an aside, PKD also often placed the the "critical event" of a story at the narrative's golden section point (ie, 62% of the way through the text).
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Re: The Man in the High Castle - PKD on Amazon video

Postby PufPuf93 » Wed Dec 16, 2015 11:18 pm

Joao » Wed Dec 16, 2015 7:49 pm wrote:PP93: Do you use the I Ching at all anymore? I've tried to "get into" it (via a Jungian projection-of-the-unconcious approach) but have never been able to really take it seriously. YMMV.

As an aside, PKD also often placed the the "critical event" of a story at the narrative's golden section point (ie, 62% of the way through the text).


I have not done an I Ching reading since 2001.

I do pick up the I Ching and browse on occasion. Also my I Ching copy has Jungs's essay on Seven Sermons to the Dead and I seem now to read every several years. I initially skimmed and then ignored Jung's essay for many years until I read Memoires Dreams and Reflections circa 2002.

I bought the I Ching because of TMITHC. My use of the I Ching was to establish a quiet space and define the question. I quit using the I Ching because my notes were humbling to self-humiliating and juvenile in hindsight. For a time post 2001, I actually would read my I Ching diary for humility. Now changes in life provide more than enough opportunity for humility and humiliation. :grumpy

My library has mass quantities of spiritual and metaphysical books but the only "scripture" I ever actually "use" is Lao Tzu. I find reading the passages aloud calming and aligning to nature. The I Ching led me to Lao Tzu.

I have never heard that about PKD using the golden section to place the "critical event" of a story. Do you have a cite?
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