Closer to Mars

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Re: Closer to Mars

Postby Wombaticus Rex » Sat Aug 06, 2022 10:49 am

Harvey » Fri Aug 05, 2022 6:56 pm wrote:
Don't forget they were written some time ago. I think he's rowing back from some of his earlier positions on things, we live and learn. And he has been rustling some feathers in the hard SF community with one or two of his recent novels...


FWIW, my verdict was motivated by his recent op-ed opus in the Financial Times as much as by his work in the 90's. "A Climate Plan for a World in Flames."

He puts great stock in .... central banks .... talking of "carbon quantitative easing" and "financial innovation" and even "growing food in vats." All done democratically, of course: "Of course, legislatures and citizens will need to urge their central banks, and ultimately to instruct or order them, to do these things." A cinch indeed. His closer:

Carbon quantitative easing won’t be enough to do all of that but, when combined with regulation and taxation channelling private capital into useful, survival-oriented projects, we might squeak through. And, by the way, full employment is very much implied in all this; there’s that much work to be done. Can we leverage all that needed work toward climate equity between nations and to the lessening of the grotesque inequality between rich and poor? It seems like we could.

This array of new policies means returning to some kind of Keynesian balance of public and private. Good. We need that. But this big shift naturally adds to the feeling of dread in our time. What — a new political economy? Didn’t that kind of change last happen in 1980, or 1945, or in the 18th century’s great democratic revolutions? Surely it’s impossible now? Easier to imagine the end of the world than the end of capitalism?

No. The time has come to admit that we control our economy for the common good. Crucial at all times, this realisation is especially important in our current need to dodge a mass-extinction event. The invisible hand never picks up the cheque; therefore we must govern ourselves.


That is perhaps the single most whopping "We is a hell of a drug" incident I have seen in print; certainly recently. The ruling class that controls our economy for their common good is also the same invisible hand that fed him his understanding of "1980, or 1945" and "the 18th century's great democratic revolutions." But that's just my opinion.
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Re: Closer to Mars

Postby Harvey » Sat Aug 06, 2022 1:24 pm

Yes, I see your point.
And while we spoke of many things, fools and kings
This he said to me
"The greatest thing
You'll ever learn
Is just to love
And be loved
In return"


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Re: Closer to Mars

Postby Belligerent Savant » Sat Aug 06, 2022 2:40 pm

Wombaticus Rex » Sat Aug 06, 2022 9:49 am wrote:That is perhaps the single most whopping "We is a hell of a drug" incident I have seen in print; certainly recently. The ruling class that controls our economy for their common good is also the same invisible hand that fed him his understanding of "1980, or 1945" and "the 18th century's great democratic revolutions."


Double-plus good!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak
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Re: Closer to Mars

Postby DrEvil » Sat Aug 06, 2022 5:14 pm

BenDhyan » Sat Aug 06, 2022 2:01 pm wrote:The thing about evolution is that it is only ever happening in the here and now, it does not depend on a contemporary observer's opinion at any stage. The space age has begun, no one can stop its inevitable evolution, per ardua ad astra.


Yeah, evolution is ongoing, it didn't stop just because we invented logistics and fast food, it just looks like that to us because it's so slow. But who knows what evolutionary pressures will be applied by some hard vacuum, low-g and a healthy dose of radiation, not to mention technological evolution. If nothing else more people in space will lead to more cancer research.
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Re: Closer to Mars

Postby Wombaticus Rex » Sat Aug 06, 2022 6:16 pm

DrEvil » Sat Aug 06, 2022 4:14 pm wrote:Yeah, evolution is ongoing, it didn't stop just because we invented logistics and fast food, it just looks like that to us because it's so slow. But who knows what evolutionary pressures will be applied by some hard vacuum, low-g and a healthy dose of radiation, not to mention technological evolution. If nothing else more people in space will lead to more cancer research.


One of my all-time favorite weirdo websites goes into this at great length, I recommend this material to anyone reading:

The Star Larvae Hypothesis

Nature's Plan for Humankind, Beyond Darwin and Intelligent Design

The Hypothesis:
Stars constitute a genus of organism.
The stellar life cycle includes a larval phase.
Biological life constitutes the larval phase of the stellar life cycle.


A mix of "permissionary" thought provocation and probes, as well as earnest evangelizing for the cause. Of particular interest to this thread:

Space Migration: Ascent to Heaven

Neuroplasticity and the Enrichments of Weightlessness

The Proton Crisis and the Heat Death of the Universe
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Re: Closer to Mars

Postby Harvey » Sat Aug 06, 2022 8:39 pm

Whoah. Many thanks Rex, I think I'll enjoy seeing somone elses take on this. I thought it an amazing coincidence that some Egyptians believed the great souls would travel to the constelation of Orion to be reborn as stars, and it just happens to be the nearest stellar nursery to earth, described by a John's Hopkins University Hubble proposal as "the Rosetta stone of star formation".

:thumbsup

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(edit- removed 'become')
And while we spoke of many things, fools and kings
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And be loved
In return"


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Re: Closer to Mars

Postby Grizzly » Sat Aug 13, 2022 2:38 am

Betelgeuse goes nova - star explodes like “nothing we’ve ever seen before”… and is now recovering
"I’m of the belief all stars are on some sort of novae cycle - see Doug Vogt, suspicious observers"
Betelgeuse is a red giant in the Orion constellation, and it novaed experiencing a “never before seen” (in a star) “titanic surface mass ejection”.
https://www.cnn.com/2022/08/12/world/betelgeuse-star-recovery-scn/index.html
“We've never before seen a huge mass ejection of the surface of a star. We are left with something going on that we don't completely understand," said Andrea Dupree, an astrophysicist at the Center for Astrophysics | Harvard & Smithsonian in Cambridge, Massachusetts, in a statement.”

"It's a totally new phenomenon that we can observe directly and resolve surface details with Hubble. We're watching stellar evolution in real time."

“Astronomers have measured Betelgeuse's rhythm for 200 years. This star's pulse is essentially a dimming and brightening cycle that restarts every 400 days.”

“This wasn’t some sort of supernovae finale event, though. Betelgeuse—one of the most prominent stars in the Milky Way, a part of the Orion constellation—still seemingly acts like a normal star, and may even be recovering. After analyzing the 2019 data, astronomers have concluded that this is behavior we’ve never seen before in a normal star.”

Here are some links if what scientists thought would happen to the star back in and around 2015:
https://www.foxnews.com/science/dying-star-betelgeuse-wont-explode-in-2012-experts-say
https://www.universetoday.com/36173/close-look-at-betelgeuse-reveals-its-fiery-secret/

Anyone have any Orion or Betelgeuse conspiracies, thoughts, comments? Anyone know about the origin of the name? Google keeps suggesting articles about the movie beetle juice…


Anyway, are all cycles connected? I believe Orion and Sirius are important and have connections to earth, many of our ancestors put great importance on them. Does anyone know anything of this star in particular?

I suspect this could be a terrible/beauty for some and or a much needed vibratory-frequency to push us towards a/the divine providence humanity so desperately needs right now. Things have become so dark, and unreal, we need a paradigm shift or a spiritual Ænima/Enema.

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“The more we do to you, the less you seem to believe we are doing it.”

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Re: Closer to Mars

Postby BenDhyan » Wed Apr 12, 2023 5:50 am

NASA unveils ‘Mars habitat’

NASA has unveiled its new Mars-simulation habitat, in which volunteers will live for a year at a time to test what life will be like on future missions to the Red Planet.

Image

The facility, created for three planned experiments called the Crew Health and Performance Exploration Analog (CHAPEA), is located at the US space agency’s massive research base in Houston, Texas.

Four volunteers will begin the first trial this summer during which NASA plans to monitor their physical and mental health to better understand humans’ fortitude for such long isolation.

With that data, NASA will better understand astronauts’ “resource use” on Mars, said Grace Douglas, lead researcher on the CHAPEA experiments.

“We can really start to understand how we’re supporting them with what we’re providing them, and that’s going to be really important information to making those critical resource decisions,” she said on a press tour of the habitat.

Such a distant mission comes with “very strict mass limitations”, she added.

The volunteers will live in a 1,700-square-foot (160-square-metre) home dubbed Mars Dune Alpha, which includes two bathrooms, a vertical farm to grow salad, a room dedicated to medical care, an area for relaxing and several workstations.

An airlock leads to an “outdoor” reconstruction of the Martian environment – though still located inside the hangar.

Several pieces of equipment astronauts would likely use are scattered around the red sand-covered floor, including a weather station, a brick-making machine and a small greenhouse.

There is also a treadmill on which the make-believe astronauts will walk suspended from straps to simulate the Red Planet’s lesser gravity.

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Re: Closer to Mars

Postby Belligerent Savant » Thu Apr 20, 2023 1:57 pm

.

The latest spetacle for plebe consumption.

This is just a test, folks. Only a matter of time before we land on [The Moon/Mars]. Only a matter of time. Keep waiting. It will happen.

Also: per the commentary at the tail-end of the video (uttered by the blonde female "play-by-play" announcer), this was NOT an "explosion". It was a "rapid unscheduled disassembly" .

Satire is ded.

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Re: Closer to Mars

Postby DrEvil » Thu Apr 20, 2023 3:08 pm

God forbid someone should use a joke term for something that pretty much everyone expected to go wrong in some way.
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Re: Closer to Mars

Postby Belligerent Savant » Thu Apr 20, 2023 3:49 pm

Yes, ‘joke’ is an apt descriptor of these programs.
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Re: Closer to Mars

Postby DrEvil » Thu Apr 20, 2023 5:16 pm

Nice dodge.

But of course, space programs are a joke. What did they ever give us, huh?
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Re: Closer to Mars

Postby Belligerent Savant » Thu Apr 20, 2023 5:27 pm

.
What, exactly, did the space programs provide for the common man? Of course, the answer depends on the extent you subscribe to the charade presented before us, right?

Also: How does one that subscribes to 'net zero' and/or 'green initiatives' resolve the amount of emissions involved in the space programs?

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/2022 ... %20biomass.

It's becoming cartoonish, really, the amount of contortions required to continue to swallow these narratives at face value.

And yet you continue to do so. And by all accounts, will continue to do so.

By all means, proceed. As you have. Your mindsets, at face value, are well received in this current zeitgeist.
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Re: Closer to Mars

Postby stickdog99 » Thu Apr 20, 2023 6:30 pm

August 2021: NASA has no plans to exchange lunar samples with China

November 2021: China's fresh moon rocks are younger than the Apollo samples and no one knows why

...

A first paper published in Science in early October dated a fragment of the samples at about 1.97 billion years old. Now a second,(opens in new tab) published in Nature on Oct. 19, uses a similar dating method but on a different sample, gives an age of 2.03 billion years — very close, geologically speaking. The pair of dates confirms that volcanic activity was taking place in this area of the moon around a billion years after the areas sampled by the Apollo and Soviet Luna missions had become geologically dead.

That finding, in turn, tells scientists about the layer of the moon below the crust. "This means that the mantle had sufficient internal deep mantle heat 2 billion years ago to continue to melt mantle material and produce extrusive mare basalts," James Head III, a professor of geological sciences at Brown University and coauthor on the first paper, told Space.com in an email.

Why the mantle beneath this patch of the moon was still active relatively late in the moon's history remains a mystery, however. Two additional new papers examining the composition of Chang'e 5 samples go against previous thinking on the causes. Existing theories have focused on the heat-producing elements potassium ("K" in the periodic table), rare Earth elements, and phosphorus, together abbreviated as KREEP. Scientists had thought these materials would be relatively abundant in the area, helping to generate the heat required to make the late volcanic activity possible.

But Head's paper and a new study(opens in new tab) in Nature both examined the composition of a portion of the Chang'e 5 samples and found only moderate KREEP content, suggesting the materials are not required for the late volcanism that created these rocks.

"The jury is still out on how and why the late-stage volcanism occurred," Joshua Snape, a planetary scientist at the University of Manchester, told Space.com. "The lack of a KREEP signature that we identified in the Science paper is definitely significant and seems to be confirmed by the studies published in Nature," he added while noting that low KREEP levels cannot yet be wholly ruled out as a factor.

Adding to the mystery is a lack of water found by a team behind a third(opens in new tab) new paper, which looked at hydrogen isotope compositions in the rocks. A relatively high water content would have helped lower the melting point of the rock, making volcanic activity easier. But this paper finds the rocks are dehydrated, suggesting that abundant water in the mantle can't explain the moon's youngest confirmed volcanism either.

...

October 2022: Returned samples from Chang'E-5 mission shed new light on moon's surface makeup and geologic history

...

"Near-side lunar soil samples we analyzed turned out to be primarily pyroxene," said Prof. Li. "This came as a surprise to us, because earlier remote sensing-based studies indicated a high abundance of olivine—another common volcanic mineral composite in the basalt category."

Studies based on Apollo and Luna-era missions suggested lunar mare (a term for the dark basaltic plains formed by volcanic activity triggered by ancient large asteroid impacts on the far side of the moon) was shaped by active volcanism between 4.3 billion and 3.1 billion years ago, with most of that activity between 3.6 billion and 3.8 billion years ago. Those older studies were based on data collected from Earth-based telescopes as well as moon orbiters, such as NASA's Moon Minerology Mapper.

"Though we can infer a lot about mineral composition of the moon remotely, having actual lunar soil samples here on Earth in our lab for analyses opened up the possibility of a much more thorough and precise compositional analysis," Li said.

Li and his team first analyzed their three soil samples using spectroscopic techniques. "The overall spectral shape of the samples was essentially consistent," Li said. They went on to deploy XRD, which demonstrated the samples were composed of the minerals augite, pigeonite, plagioclase, forsterite, fayalite, ilmenite, quartz, apatite, and glassy materials. The XRD result showed that the samples were composed of mostly pyroxene, not olivine, as earlier studies indicated.

"Preliminary works have identified that the CE-5 returned soil sample is basically comprised of a type of lunar basalt that have never been sampled before," Li and his team wrote in their Oct. 10 paper. "In comparison with the mare samples collected from previous missions, the bulk composition of pyroxene in CE-5 samples is relatively iron and calcium-rich based on electron microprobe analysis."

...

March 2023: Water on the Moon stored in glass beads, Chang'e-5 samples reveal

Glass beads on the surface of the Moon could provide a readily accessible source of water for future missions, a new study suggests.

The researchers, led by Huicun He of the Chinese Academy of Sciences, estimate between 300 billion and nearly 300 trillion kilograms of water is held in tiny glass beads strewn across the Moon.

According to their analysis, published today in Nature Geoscience, water forms from hydrogen delivered in the stream of charged particles flowing from the Sun called the solar wind.

"These findings indicate that lunar soils contain a much higher amount of solar wind-derived water than previously thought," they wrote.

This suggested the beads played a central role in the water cycle of the Moon and could be an important reservoir for space bases to tap.

It was once thought that the Moon was dry, but over the past 20 years orbiting spacecraft have detected hydrogen and ice in deep craters at the lunar poles.

In 2020, a team of NASA scientists detected molecules of water in sunlit areas of the Moon for the first time.

They proposed the water could be trapped in glass beads, which would explain why it hadn't evaporated.

Hints of water had previously been found in glass from samples collected by the Apollo missions 40 years ago.

...

Dr Norman said the higher water concentration in the Chang'e-5 sample compared with the Apollo samples may be due to the different types of rocks.

While Apollo beads were volcanic glass, Chang'e-5 beads are impact beads.

"A lot of the Apollo missions went to impact craters, [and drilled] into the deeper sub-surface, so a lot of the samples would probably not have been exposed for as long as the Chang'e-5 samples were," he said.

*****

LOL at the all of the rewriting of scientific history that Apollo return samples also found significance evidence of water on the Moon.
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Re: Closer to Mars

Postby DrEvil » Thu Apr 20, 2023 7:20 pm

Not sure what you're trying to say. At first they found little or no evidence of water. More recently they did find water in the samples from the later Apollo missions when using more sensitive instruments than what was available earlier. If by "rewriting history" you mean "gaining new knowledge with better equipment" then I don't see what's so funny. That's how it's supposed to work.
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