What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic entail?

Moderators: Elvis, DrVolin, Jeff

Re: What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic enta

Postby Elvis » Mon Mar 30, 2020 12:38 am

I hereby appoint stickdog99 to the position of RI Pandemic Response Coordinator. A budget of 1,000,000 words, to be allocated at the Coordinator's discretion, is hereby appropriated for this and other purposes.

Mind you, RI will not have to recycle words now employed in existing threads, or borrow words from members to meet the word budget. I know a million words sounds like a lot, but RI cannot run out of words, and so long as the words are deployed to organize information & ideas toward the desired outcome, they will retain their value.


brekin wrote:One obvious thing would be to offer employment to everyone who currently is unemployed or underemployed in a national endeavor to fight covid.


This, but make it a permanent feature of the economy—a federal job guarantee. Current FJG proposals include full healthcare and the usual benefits. Workers losing jobs to quarantines would still get paid regardless of unavailability of new 'jobs' (in a pandemic, their new 'job' may be to stay at home).

Any plans right now should include a federal job guarantee. It'll make the coming 'new normal' a better place to Be.

Also, stop pretending that money is something the government has to obtain from somewhere outside itself.
"Frankly, I don't think it's a good idea but the sums proposed are enormous."
User avatar
Elvis
 
Posts: 6598
Joined: Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:24 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic enta

Postby undead » Mon Mar 30, 2020 1:49 am

"What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic entail?"

An orderly transition to a decentralized economy with a minimum of confined spaces, and the abolition of the for profit medical system.
┌∩┐(◕_◕)┌∩┐
User avatar
undead
 
Posts: 996
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 1:23 am
Location: Doumbekistan
Blog: View Blog (1)

Re: What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic enta

Postby MacCruiskeen » Mon Mar 30, 2020 2:29 pm

Some guy on the internet wins the prize for succinctness + correctness:

@mrbeales

1 hour ago
·
Replying to @ClarkeMicah and @piersmorgan

Isolate over 70's and people on the medically vulnerable list and mobilise society to deliver food, books and encouragement
"Ich kann gar nicht so viel fressen, wie ich kotzen möchte." (Max Liebermann, Berlin, 1933)

26 March 2020: US Space Force NatSec Rocket Launch

https://mobile.twitter.com/OffGuardian0

https://mobile.twitter.com/RedKahina
User avatar
MacCruiskeen
 
Posts: 9876
Joined: Thu Nov 16, 2006 6:47 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic enta

Postby stickdog99 » Mon Mar 30, 2020 5:09 pm

brekin » 29 Mar 2020 17:36 wrote:One obvious thing would be to offer employment to everyone who currently is unemployed or underemployed in a national endeavor to fight covid.
Even from home many people could assist remotely in data entry, calling homes and orgs, coordinating efforts to assist with supply procurement and management, testing, relief efforts, distribution of goods, etc. Having everyone holed up at home watching netflix, next door and the news is a waste of human capital. Especially as currently the word is it is just a matter of time before the wave hits many cities and counties. Currently, information is horrible at the local and state level for many about what to do if x or y happens. And there is almost no coordination even though this is historically no surprise (humanity has always had to contend with mass disease outbreaks). For one there should be some version of an unarmed WW2 English Home Guard with a structure to centralize the effort.


How about putting people to work manufacturing or at least trying to obtain the things we need to manage our health crisis, such as masks, gowns, ventilators, oxygen tents. etc?

What is wrong with our "leaders" that they are not leading such an effort right now. All of us sitting on our asses right now are potential Rosies the Riveters. Why aren't we addressing this crisis by setting up a federal jobs guarantee program, at least on an emergency basis?

On edit: I see that Elvis beat me to this.

One thing is perfectly clear. Our leaders' response to this crisis (putting the onus of dealing with it squarely on us and not them) has been coordinated to see exactly what utter bullshit "emergency measures" they can get away with when we face much worse crises in the future.
Last edited by stickdog99 on Mon Mar 30, 2020 5:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
stickdog99
 
Posts: 3732
Joined: Tue Jul 12, 2005 5:42 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic enta

Postby MacCruiskeen » Mon Mar 30, 2020 5:15 pm

^^ Because they don't want people to help other people.

Because, from the USA to the UK to India, our dear Leaders are consciously working to bring about the very public-health disaster they pretend they are doing their best to prevent.

What other rational conclusion can we draw anymore?
"Ich kann gar nicht so viel fressen, wie ich kotzen möchte." (Max Liebermann, Berlin, 1933)

26 March 2020: US Space Force NatSec Rocket Launch

https://mobile.twitter.com/OffGuardian0

https://mobile.twitter.com/RedKahina
User avatar
MacCruiskeen
 
Posts: 9876
Joined: Thu Nov 16, 2006 6:47 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic enta

Postby norton ash » Wed Apr 01, 2020 9:22 pm

https://www.newyorker.com/news/our-colu ... popular4-1

Reality has endorsed Bernie Sanders.
Zen horse
User avatar
norton ash
 
Posts: 3941
Joined: Wed Nov 08, 2006 5:46 pm
Location: Canada
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic enta

Postby Project Willow » Mon Apr 06, 2020 6:15 am

Not sure if this has been posted yet.

“Well, I’m not paid by the government, so I’m entitled to actually do science. If the government, if there had been no intervention, the epidemic would have been over, like every other respiratory disease epidemic.”

Epidemiologist Dr. Knut Wittkowski makes the case that social distancing may result in higher death rates among the elderly as the rest of us are not able to develop herd immunity as we usually do within about 4 weeks of a respiratory epidemic.

User avatar
Project Willow
 
Posts: 4787
Joined: Sat May 07, 2005 9:37 pm
Location: Seattle
Blog: View Blog (1)

Re: What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic enta

Postby minime » Mon Apr 06, 2020 8:15 am

What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic entail?

It could be the first rational response would be to decide what a rational response even means.

In particular, do you mean what can any individual (e.g. the poster) do as a rational response, or what can the government do?

If you mean the government, I suggest that is an irrational response itself, as you are not the government, you are not talking to the government, and the government will never read your words, will never respond to you, doesn't care about you except in theory.

If you mean what can I, the individual, do, well that's a whole nother thing entirely.

It might be the first (the second?) time such a question has ever been asked in earnest in this place.

For Elvis... start with just one word.
User avatar
minime
 
Posts: 1095
Joined: Sun Aug 18, 2013 2:01 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic enta

Postby Joe Hillshoist » Mon Apr 06, 2020 9:21 am

minime » 06 Apr 2020 22:15 wrote:What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic entail?

It could be the first rational response would be to decide what a rational response even means.

In particular, do you mean what can any individual (e.g. the poster) do as a rational response, or what can the government do?

If you mean the government, I suggest that is an irrational response itself, as you are not the government, you are not talking to the government, and the government will never read your words, will never respond to you, doesn't care about you except in theory.

If you mean what can I, the individual, do, well that's a whole nother thing entirely.

It might be the first (the second?) time such a question has ever been asked in earnest in this place.

For Elvis... start with just one word.


I've been asking people what can and what are they gonna do about specific situations since I joined this board.
Joe Hillshoist
 
Posts: 9553
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 10:45 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic enta

Postby minime » Mon Apr 06, 2020 9:37 am

Cheers big ears, Joe. I'm all ears.
User avatar
minime
 
Posts: 1095
Joined: Sun Aug 18, 2013 2:01 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic enta

Postby Sounder » Fri Apr 10, 2020 4:41 am

Systems strive for homeostasis because that is what makes them work. We however, in our arrogance seek to maximize certain elements while we bury other important elements. The people running this rodeo give the game away when they promote pharma interests and never mention vitamins, etc. that serve to maintain a vital immune system.

Dr. Shiva or Deep state Dr. Fauci?

All these things will continue as long as coercion remains a central element of our mentality.
Sounder
 
Posts: 4018
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2006 8:49 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic enta

Postby 0_0 » Fri Apr 10, 2020 4:56 am

Right? If those in power (and the mainstream media) really wanted the best for all of us you would expect them to give detailed and neutral information on what this virus might be and what you can do to boost your immune system. Instead it's fearporn 24/7, the only advice offered is to #washyourhands and #stayathome, and the proposed solution is draconian measures of control and oppression, which i think are always bad medicine.
playmobil of the gods
0_0
 
Posts: 589
Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2012 9:13 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic enta

Postby DrEvil » Fri Apr 10, 2020 3:30 pm

Sounder » Fri Apr 10, 2020 10:41 am wrote:Systems strive for homeostasis because that is what makes them work. We however, in our arrogance seek to maximize certain elements while we bury other important elements. The people running this rodeo give the game away when they promote pharma interests and never mention vitamins, etc. that serve to maintain a vital immune system.

Dr. Shiva or Deep state Dr. Fauci?



Ooh, tough choice! The guy who claims to have invented email (he didn't) and sued everyone who disputed the claim, or the immunologist who has been working in the field his entire life?

Why do you think Dr. Fauci is part of the deep state btw? Hopefully not because of that video you posted the other day that was so obviously taken out of context a five year old could spot it, where their only supporting "evidence" was that he had *dramatic music* worked for the government for a long time.
"I only read American. I want my fantasy pure." - Dave
User avatar
DrEvil
 
Posts: 2925
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2010 1:37 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic enta

Postby JackRiddler » Fri Apr 10, 2020 6:09 pm

Project Willow » Mon Apr 06, 2020 5:15 am wrote:Not sure if this has been posted yet.

“Well, I’m not paid by the government, so I’m entitled to actually do science. If the government, if there had been no intervention, the epidemic would have been over, like every other respiratory disease epidemic.”

Epidemiologist Dr. Knut Wittkowski makes the case that social distancing may result in higher death rates among the elderly as the rest of us are not able to develop herd immunity as we usually do within about 4 weeks of a respiratory epidemic.



Well this is really damn interesting. I want to see a board of antagonists try to take it apart. (I first doubt at 7:00, when he's certain about the number of symptomatic cases and death rate.) An open discussion ain't gonna happen however.

.
We meet at the borders of our being, we dream something of each others reality. - Harvey of R.I.

To Justice my maker from on high did incline:
I am by virtue of its might divine,
The highest Wisdom and the first Love.

TopSecret WallSt. Iraq & more
User avatar
JackRiddler
 
Posts: 15060
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 2:59 pm
Location: New York City
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: What would a rational response to a deadly pandemic enta

Postby Belligerent Savant » Fri Apr 10, 2020 7:35 pm

^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Didn't listen to the video yet (and yet here i am typing...), but:

1. Is it actually a respiratory disease, or -- as has been suggested increasingly in certain circles over the last ~couple weeks -- a form of apoxia, i.e., lack of oxygen in the bloodstream, which leads to impact on the lungs in later stages but explains the 'shortness of breath' symptom (side-note: this also renders ventilators a deadly/dangerous option for attempting to save lives);
2. If the latter, how would that change the doctor's comments on social distancing impact?
3. Standard commentary about the unreliability of the death toll figures (further tainted by reports - reliable or not - that any respiratory-related death is being attributed to covd-19, which of course will inflate numbers).

Disregard the above if already covered in the video. Indeed, a mod can delete this if so.
User avatar
Belligerent Savant
 
Posts: 2639
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:58 pm
Location: North Atlantic.
Blog: View Blog (0)

PreviousNext

Return to General Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 10 guests