The Way In is the Way Out

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The Way In is the Way Out

Postby cortez » Tue Aug 02, 2005 5:14 am

Found this interview, found it interesting<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.newworlddisorder.ca/issuethree/interviews/pinchbeck.html">www.newworlddisorder.ca/i...hbeck.html</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>Struck by an existential crisis in the late 1990s, Daniel Pinchbeck - co-founder of the Open City literary and art journal as well as editor and journalist for a variety of publications - decided not to sooth his affliction with culturally approved balms such as antidepressants or the therapy du jour, but instead choose to reacquaint himself with the psychedelic substances which he had experimented with and fascinated him in his college years.<br><br>This journey into the centre of the cyclone was documented in his book Breaking Open the Head: A Journey into the Heart of Contemporary Shamanism - a journey of self-discovery which lead him to such locales as Gabon and Oaxaca, the Ecuadorian Amazon and the Burning Man Festival, yet always ended up at the same place: the infinite, strange and beautiful dimensions whose doors to entrance can be found in the fiery heart of being.<br><br>New World Disorder interviewed Daniel about the planetary influence on war, Aleister Crowley and Rudolf Steiner, DMT aliens, the occult meaning of the coming ecological apocalypse, and the great dance beats of 2012, among other things. <br><br>...New World Disorder: It appears that Planet 3 is under the spell of war. The usual economic, political, sociological, religious - even psychological and scientific - reasons are being used to explain the daily mass murder. The war paradigm, however, is rarely looked at from the esoteric perspective. Gurdjieff said about war, "What is war? It is the result of planetary influences. Somewhere up there two or three planets have approached too near to each other; tension results. Have you noticed how, if a man passes quite close to you on a narrow pavement, you become all tense? The same tension takes place between planets. For them it lasts, perhaps, a second or two. But here, on the earth, people begin to slaughter one another, and they go on slaughtering for maybe for several years." The war planet Mars is the closest it's been for 60,000 years. What are your thoughts on Gurdjieff's explanation?<br><br>Daniel Pinchbeck: I think Gurdjieff has the right idea. This type of cosmological understanding was known to most ancient civilizations. I have my own intuition about the Mars proximity event. My theory &#65533; and of course it is only a theory &#65533; is that it signifies the imminent end of the Kali Yuga &#65533; the "age of destruction" &#65533; and the return to a "Golden Age." Although many branches of Hinduism place the dates of the Yugas differently, the Dravidians place the entire cycle at 60,000 years. Perhaps we are approaching the end of the Kali Yuga, which would mean an imminent polarity reversal to a new Golden Age. This may seem farfetched from our current global miasma, but as it says in The Tao: "Reversal is the movement of the Tao."<br><br>I experienced the Mars proximity at Burning Man as a subtle vibrational shift. My hypothesis is that the Earth is currently becoming less materially dense and more psychically responsive. This is happening in phases leading up to the planetary transformation of 2012 that was the focus of Mayan and Toltec cosmology. The Mars event is part of this shift. Occult thinkers like Gurdjieff and Rudolf Steiner consider the planets to be vibrational matrices in the harmonic structure of the solar system, rather than lumps of rock and gas. Jose Arguelles believes that the planets are extrusions of the Sun, grounding information and energies received from distant star systems and Hunab Ku, the galactic center. From this perspective, Mars coming close to us might signify a shift in the vibrational frequency of the Earth. This would have direct effects on human consciousness. I think this is what "2012" indicates: A movement to a higher state of consciousness for humans, a higher vibrational frequency for the planet, and a new Golden Age on the Earth. The tragic aspects of destruction and war we are now undergoing are a kind of clearing of the way for the harmonic or chaordic imprint of post-history. From the Jungian perspective, our misuse of technology is a projection of the unintegrated shadow of the human psyche into material form. By 2012, the shadow must be fully seen for what it is, and integrated, so that we can move on.<br><br>NWD: What are your thoughts on the life and work of Aleister Crowley? While many bash him as a mere degenerate egoist and charlatan, deep readings of his work reveal a genuine and deep engagement with altered states of consciousness. And also, what's you take on the contributions of Timothy Leary?<br><br>DP: Aleister Crowley definitely had elements of genius. His Tarot deck and the accompanying Book of Thoth are extraordinary. However, he was very unbalanced and an egomaniac. There is a strain of power-mad insanity running through his life and work. His attitude toward women was abysmal. It makes perfect sense, considering the adolescent tendencies and imbalances in our culture, that a figure like Crowley remains such a strong influence, rather than Dion Fortune, Rudolf Steiner, or other Twentieth Century occultists who were much more sane and grounded and ultimately helpful. I read an excellent critique of Crowley in the book Demons of the Flesh by Nikolai and Zenia Schreck. They were writing on sex magic, and they felt that Crowley misunderstood the basic ideal of sex magic, which comes from the Tantric tradition, where the goal is to deify the Shakti principle and the women who exemplify it. Crowley had a lot of Victorian prurience and a hatred of women, who he saw as creatures to be used - he was also homosexual. In his OTO, he made the secret rite of homosexual intercourse a higher grade of initiation than any heterosexual contact, which is anathema to the Tantric path. The countercultural fascination with Crowley reveals that many of us are still trapped in the same adolescent complexes and fixated rages that he manifested in his life. It is time to see him for what he was and move on.<br><br>Leary is a bit of a similar story, in that he combined elements of genius with adolescent and egomaniacal qualities that fit the culture, hence helped to make him a cultural icon. (Of course, Leary also theorized he was a reincarnation or "spiritual son" of Crowley). Leary definitely hurt the cause of psychedelic research in the 1960s. He came to the subject late. By the time he discovered psychedelics, there were already many psychiatrists researching it in low-profile experiments. He exploded the discourse into the academic mainstream, and into the media, which was too much and too frightening for the powers-that-be. He advised everyone including teenagers to "Turn On, Tune In, and Drop Out," which was bad advice. It is a bit difficult to judge figures from the 1960s, because after the Cuban Missile Crisis and the Kennedy assassination, everything was in a state of hysteria. Still, it seems that Leary acted without prudence, and with a strong tendency towards self-aggrandizement. However I do like his autobiography and the nine circuit model of the brain he developed with Robert Anton Wilson. Rather than criticize Leary or Crowley, I would say that they were what they had to be in their time. It is our task to take what is good in their work &#65533; as well as many other thinkers and visionaries &#65533; and carry it to another level so that humanity can move forward.<br><br>NWD: One can tell from your work that you have high regard for the turn of the century spiritualist Rudolph Steiner. For those not familiar with his teachings, why the interest?<br><br>DP: Rudolf Steiner was much more than a "spiritualist," first of all. He was a profound philosopher and visionary who offered a vast cosmology and reading of the Akashic Record. I think that Steiner could be as important for the Twenty First Century as Nietzsche was for the Twentieth. He is a kind of prophet or advance man for a new type of thinking and a new type of doing.<br><br>There are several aspects of Steiner that make him so crucial, in my opinion. I first became involved with his thought because his articulation of the "subtle realms" completely matched and helped to explicate my own experiences and visions. For instance, he splits the Christian "Devil" into two sets of forces or beings that work on humanity all the time - the "Luciferic" forces (Lucifer means, literally, 'light bringer') that seek to pull us up and away into brilliance, imagination, genius, but also hubris and arrogance and pride; and the "Ahrimanic" forces that try to pull us down into minerality, materiality, materialist technology, and death. This age of materialism represents the ascendance of Ahriman, the malevolent earth spirit. Psychedelics are very Luciferic - and Steiner believed that humans needed a renewed impulse from Lucifer to balance out the negating forces of Ahriman.<br><br>Another important aspect of Steiner, for me, is the philosophical underpinnings he provides for thinking about cognition, and about human freedom. An amazing early book of his is Philosophy of Freedom, where he refutes Kantian dualism. He notes that you can't really make a final distinction between our thoughts about things and the things themselves. Thinking, for him, is a part of reality - as much a part of reality as any physical object. He points out that we have no right to consider a plant's ability to produce leaves, roots, and blossoms as separate from the thoughts we have about that plant. It may be that our thoughts about the plant are as much a property of that plant as its blossoms, stems, and leaves. If thinking is recognized as a part of the world in this way, then we can also see that thought is neither subjective nor objective, but a universal world process in which we participate. Thinking is different than all other processes, because it is the only activity that we experience from the inside - when we use our thinking to investigate anything else, we are looking at something outside of out thought. But when we investigate our thinking, we have to use our thinking to do so. One beautiful aspect of thoughts is that they can be shared - once I have a thought, and write it down or express it, anybody else can also experience that thought from their own perspective. Hence, you can neither call thinking subjective or objective. This perspective is incredibly liberating. If thinking is a part of reality, and it is neither subjective or objective, then, for Steiner, there can be no limits to cognition. There is also no possibility of nailing down a "Final Theory" of everything. This is just a delusion of a certain mindset.<br><br>Thinking becomes the effort of reconciling "percepts" - those entities and things we perceive as outside of ourselves - and "concepts" &#65533; the elements of our cognition - and there can be no conceivable endpoint to this work of reconciliation. It is an infinite task - and an infinite play. Steiner relieves us of the burden of thinking we can establish some absolute knowledge about the world, and also allows us to move into a more open and even infinite frame of reference in thinking about our own possibilities. For Steiner, everything in the universe is in a constant state of evolution &#65533; including our thinking about it. He is much more of a strict evolutionist than the scientists now associated with the term.<br><br>Another reason I find Steiner so important, is his legacy. He created extraordinary institutions that have continued to flourish to this day. This includes Waldorf Schools, Biodynamic Agriculture, Anthroposophic Medicine, and of course the Anthroposophic Movement itself. When you read his works and realize how incredibly "far out" his esoteric ideas are, it seems even more incredible that he left behind such stable and sensible institutions - the Waldorf Schools are the largest independent education movement in the West. Steiner believed that the best way to oppose "evil" is not through strident protest and negativity (which tends to be the monotonous approach of the Left), but by simply creating what is "good."<br><br>He is also trippy as hell: Check out his books Cosmic Memory, Outline of Esoteric Science, and Man as Harmony of the Creative Word, they will astonish you. He goes into great depth in describing cosmic evolution and the workings of elemental beings. I feel I am still an amateur in understanding the full extent of his thought.... <p></p><i></i>
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Anthroposophia

Postby Seventhsonjr » Tue Aug 02, 2005 10:03 am

Thanks for this Cortez.<br><br>My father, who worked with the resistance in Europe during WWI, including many of the surrealists and great political thinkers like Chagall, Andre Breton, Lion Feuchtwanger, became an anthroposophist in his later years, having lived and worked in China and Japan and studied Oriental and Buddhist teachings in the 20's and 30's.<br><br>My mother was a traditional Christian and not so into the esotericism --- so I grew up with a lot oif interesting dinner discussion and literally hundreds of Steiner's books (which i still read frequently - currently trying to read the Gates of Knowledge).<br><br>The word anthroposophy (which Steiner began using when he split off from Blavatsky and annie besant and the theosophists) means, literally, the (divine) wisdom of man --- meaning all human beings possess inherently the divine knowledge within themselves if they can only develop their intuitive powers (their "lotuses" of perception, of cognition and feeling -- based on esoteric Tibetan Buddhist teachings). His ideas stemmed in part from his study of Goethe who, as a botanist, proposed that plants and all living things (and elements, actually) have divine inherent knowledge or energy which make them evolve and grow as they do: the "map" of the gene code is a divine construction as is the entire universe.<br><br>I do have some diffficulties at times with Steiner because he is vary starkly Germanic (often thought to be antiSemitic in his discussions of racial karma, for example --- but the Nobel Laureate Saul Bellow, A Jew, was an anthroposophist too) --- and I believe may well be as fallible as any human being (prophet or visionaries included) whose own egos may get in the way of their clairvoyance and clarity of perception.<br><br>Since my mother was not really into this stuff (why add anything to the Bible was her philosophy , it is all right there already) I had the opportunity to grow and look very critically at the teachings.<br><br>But many of them are truly astonishing.<br><br>Mediations on the sunrises and sunsets and the life cycle of a flower or plant, for example, is one of the most powerful ways to develop your lotus centers of perception. That is beautiful.<br><br>My Dad's spiritual philosophy made it possible for him to overcome the fear of death and evil and help the underground, especially the artists and writers, who were in danger from the Fascists. I find it also a beautiful thing that these folks who worked together as leaders in the resistance and underground (for there were militants AND pacifists, Quakers for example, among them - so some joined the Macqui and others worked nonviolently in resistance and opposition movements) were very much into Synchroinicity, Jung, pyschic energy, the collective unconscious, even the Taroh and definitely karma. This gave them a strengthening fearlessnes that is often not found or very rare in these current times of crisis.<br><br>This is the subject of the book and the work I do on Holocaust research and lecturing and even some film/documentary projects.<br><br>One of the reasons I am so "cautious" (i.e. perceived as being paranoid) is that the powers that be who killed and abused tens of millions in WWII, before and after as well, actually frightened my father towards the end of his life when my father saw the age of Kali Yuga coming to a head in an apocalyptic battle between good and evil - between the Christ (the divine in humanity supported by the angels of light and love) and the antiChrist (the evil in mankind, supported by elemental powers and powers set forth by the Creator to sort the wheat from the chaff (Ahriman and the Angels of Destruction, i.e. the Devil)).<br><br>These elements made him a fierce opponent of evil, but also caused him to draw fire from these fascists such that his knowledge made him a potential target (as well as my family) for death or destruction.<br><br>The dark agents of the extreme right and evil in humanity (he called simply the fascists and totalitarians, but also referred often to the Illuminati, the Bilderbergers, the CFR, Trilaterlists, International bankers and the corrupt religious institutions like the fundamentalists), he feared, would destroy as many of those enlightened beings and the righteous activists opposing them as they could.<br><br>He made me a warrior for peace and righteousness (NOT self-righteousness and judgmentalism as like the Fundies and the lying hypocrites of the BFEE) and taught me to be a very discerning one (another important Steiner term). The evil is tricky. The balance of creation and the VALUE of human existence and the development of the soul relies on the balance of all the powers, bboth creative and destructive, in the Creation. It is ALL divine and serves the purpose of illuminating and evolving the soul of humanity and the earth, but also of the Creator in Its infinite love of the Creation and all its complexity, magic and extremes.<br><br>But that is one thing that makes it so dangerous in this physical plane.<br><br>The souls who fall prey to the negative elemental energies (like Bush et al) - the Arhimanic influences of materialism, lust for abominable power and lucre and mammon, will be devoured. <br><br>Those who embrace the love will flourish in divine immortality.<br><br>That is a pretty cool thought from my point of view. That really the bad people cannot hurt us if we hold fast to the teachings of love and truth, even if they can torture and kill us en masse. They cannot win.<br><br>But they CAN win one by one if they can cause us to devour our own souls in a rejection of the love.<br><br>It is some pretty deep and wonderful and astonishing stuff.<br><br>But such knowledge is dangerous in some ways because the evil energies do not want us to understand this: because it will destroy their power, which is, even though created by the Creator, - a spirit of desire and crudity in the material world.<br><br>Human existence is wonderful. Scary, but wonderful. <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p097.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=seventhsonjr>Seventhsonjr</A> at: 8/2/05 10:01 pm<br></i>
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Re: Anthroposophia

Postby Connut » Tue Aug 02, 2005 10:44 am

Thank you, thank you, Seventhsonjr - you just started my day off into the path of light and love - Bless you for that and for your enlightened post. Love, peace and joy! Connut <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Anthroposophia

Postby cortez » Tue Aug 02, 2005 6:16 pm

Seventhsonjr that was really a wonderful post,<br><br>I feel a true lack of words to describe what I feel on these subjects. <br><br> Steiner's writings (of what I've read) have been very helpful in explaining these concepts. He is not alone in good explanation, but he has a long legacy as a testament of sorts.<br><br> What you wrote of the deep fears during the war I believe we are again at the point where we, the new underground need to push forward. I have found strength in knowing there is nothing we should fear in death, I should add I have not totally lost it yet. Strangely there seems to be a fear of writing of it, of communicating what I really feel in my heart is necessary. That we build now a sort of network of love, we speak of truth. We have exposed what the other side is now, we need attention on what is right. What will bring more and more courage.<br><br>I have felt the fear that is strangling tongues now, the doubt, the fear that they will stand out, or be laughed at, fear they will be killed in the future. It will only be that way if we say and do nothing.<br><br>I'm betting the light side has much more to offer, that these arhimanic forces have in some sense already lost (I call it an intuition), and all we must do it speak of it.<br><br>I know something has changed, the message is being received more and more now. <br><br>Love is the real force, we need allot of it out there now. <br> <p></p><i></i>
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Re: the way in, the way out...

Postby BlueCherub » Tue Aug 02, 2005 7:09 pm

Thank you cortez and seventhson for your posts. I may not know all that you are talking about but found it very interesting. One thing I do understand is love and the power of love. <br><br>It was this last part that really spoke to me and is what I needed to hear today:<br><br><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>I have felt the fear that is strangling tongues now, the doubt, the fear that they will stand out, or be laughed at, fear they will be killed in the future. It will only be that way if we say and do nothing.<br><br>I'm betting the light side has much more to offer, that these arhimanic forces have in some sense already lost (I call it an intuition), and all we must do it speak of it.<br><br>I know something has changed, the message is being received more and more now. <br><br>Love is the real force, we need allot of it out there now.</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> <br><br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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Great thread

Postby robertdreed » Tue Aug 02, 2005 7:25 pm

IMO, the only way to deal with the guards posted at the Door Of The Law: ignore their dire warnngs, and pass through the gateway. If you must, you must. <br><br>All I can say is that it's worked surprisingly well thus far, for me. Even when running on empty, with a flat tire.<br><br>Laziness has given me more trouble than challenging the guardians. <br><br>Beyond that, I feel no particular need to contribute on this thread, other than offering a general note of concurrence. <br><br>It's always encouraging to me to read or hear commentators speaking on these topics so eloquently, and in such accord with my own interpretations, as if we had been comparing notes all these years... <p></p><i></i>
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...

Postby robertdreed » Tue Aug 02, 2005 7:29 pm

...ignore previous reference in this post to "synchonicity", never mind...I was originally referring to hanshan's post 83 in the Peak Oil thread, but I had the stamp date wrong- 5:26pm, instead of the actual 5:18pm. That's insufficiently uncanny...startled me, though. <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p097.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=robertdreed>robertdreed</A> at: 8/2/05 5:34 pm<br></i>
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"Busshist teachings"

Postby robertdreed » Tue Aug 02, 2005 7:39 pm

say it ain't so...<br><br>[ swoon of dismay ]<br><br> <p></p><i></i>
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re: sophias/ whit her anthroi

Postby hanshan » Tue Aug 02, 2005 7:52 pm

<br><br><br>well, robert; guess runnin' on <br>empty works to be the best solution,<br>sometimes.<br><br>timestamps...<br><br><br>interesting ,seventhson & thanks for the <br>history <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>lived</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> vignette. Marvelous<br><br>Not much of a manchean/endtimes template <br>subscriber, but, it has it's lens value, as you have <br>so artfully described.<br>Steiner was able to vividly delineate energy patterns<br>& put them into an intelligent context sufficiently so that<br>many who were caught up in the maelstrom of the times<br>had a road map, both within & out, of the darkness. <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>Touche.</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> The job, well done, of any mapmaker worthy of the name.<br><br>.... <p></p><i></i>
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yes, a great thread

Postby AnnaLivia » Tue Aug 02, 2005 7:55 pm

yes, delightful to find this, thanks all!<br><br>"For Steiner, everything in the universe is in a constant state of evolution; including our thinking about it."<br><br>this brought to mind something i ran across recently that made me smile: "The only completely consistent people are the dead ones." <p></p><i></i>
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Pinchbeck statement

Postby robertdreed » Tue Aug 02, 2005 8:01 pm

"The destruction seems to be necessary to force our evolution, as humans are very good at finding a comfort zone and staying in it."<br><br>This statement resonates neatly with my own Patented Anthropological Insight (I have a B.A. in Cultural Anthro!) <br><br>I call it Inertial Functionalism- my term for the propensity of human groups to find a cultural-ecological niche, adapt to it, reach something resembling a "peak" of power and collective expression, and then cling to it despite changing conditions. They fall in love with their models, settle into stasis and self-satisfaction, eventually experience cognitive dissonance in the face of inevitable changes, and all too often resort to all sorts of evasions, rather than being flexible enough to update their games. Creating a romanticized mythology of nostalgia, scapegoating and sacrificing within, making war without...all sorts of reflexive activities, increasingly desperate...even the intellectuals fall prey. Consider Oswald Spengler, and his acolytes. <br><br>If human societies simply fall back on their drives and desires rather than nurturing their "noetic" divine spark, they eventually tend to lose big. And in organized and stratified "civilizations", ordinary folk have often been mislead by those at the top of the heap, who ignore their stewardship in favor of insulating themselves, manipulating, attempting to keep their status secure. While "Rome burns", so to speak...<br><br>That's Inertial Functionalism, in a nutshell. Described by many, but the label is mine ;^)<br><br>Not a model to emulate, but to escape... <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p097.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=robertdreed>robertdreed</A> at: 8/2/05 6:19 pm<br></i>
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re: Inertial Functionalism

Postby hanshan » Tue Aug 02, 2005 8:24 pm

<br><br><br>warp speed/ critical mass<br><br>two <br>concepts dear to my heart <br><br>did someone say <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>Kurtz ?</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--><br><br>robert - it's the psycho analogue<br>to biological homeostasis<br><br>with a mythological arabesque<br>as the opium for the techno/dead<br><br>y'know, <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em> stylin' zombies</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> <br><br>good coinage<br><br><br>.... <p></p><i></i>
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Re: NOT "Busshist teachings" but "Buddhist&q

Postby Seventhsonjr » Wed Aug 03, 2005 12:17 am

My finger slips, but it is corrected in the original post. And my eyes are getting worse working on this ddamn keyboard all day for years. Embarrasingly I often hit the damn S instead of the D - especially when I write the word Buddhist, on my current cheapo keyboard.<br><br>Mea Culpa. It isn't so much laziness it is the fact that my computer is so slow and weird that I usually don't bother to spell check.<br><br>Just wanted Y'all to be sure.<br><br> <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p097.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=seventhsonjr>Seventhsonjr</A> at: 8/2/05 10:20 pm<br></i>
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hanshan

Postby robertdreed » Wed Aug 03, 2005 12:18 am

"not much of a manchean/endtimes template <br>subscriber.."<br><br>I'm right with you on that. Many of my best days have been when nothing particularly dramatic happens. I'm not craving cataclysm, by any means. <p></p><i></i>
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Seventhson

Postby robertdreed » Wed Aug 03, 2005 12:20 am

Not to worry, I considered the context.<br><br>And I know where the "s" and "d" keys are on the QWERTY keyboard. :^)<br><br>Ah, those alphabetic errors...so meaningless. <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p097.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=robertdreed>robertdreed</A> at: 8/2/05 10:51 pm<br></i>
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