Airport Security? More Like TSA GONE WILD

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Re: Airport Security? More Like TSA GONE WILD

Postby Simulist » Fri Nov 26, 2010 6:00 pm

Gallup.com wrote:Travelers Debunk Narrative on Airport Security

Our new findings on air travelers' views on the much-discussed screening procedures now in broader use in U.S. airports are the perfect example of why it's so critical to seek out empirical evidence on the issues of the moment.

While news about air travelers opposing and potentially boycotting the use of full-body scans and pat downs suggests there is widespread anger about the use of these procedures, our survey of 3,018 people -- including 757 people who have flown at least twice in the past year -- tell a different story.

Fewer than one in three frequent air travelers tell us they are angry about the prospect or reality of being asked to follow these procedures. About one in four are bothered but not angry -- and a plurality are not bothered at all.

More at the link.

Yeah, I'd say it's a pretty good bet that the numbness of Americans to the ever-increasing assaults on their privacy and liberty is a quantified "known" well before it happens.

EDITED TO ADD: This poll is about "frequent air travelers." What about the rest of the traveling public? The "spin" being put on this by the polling industry is also a means of further maneuvering the public into accept indignities it does not want.
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Re: Airport Security? More Like TSA GONE WILD

Postby LilyPatToo » Fri Nov 26, 2010 11:08 pm

Poll results like that are very confusing to me. Am I *that* far from the norm in my aversion to having to allow a total stranger touch me intimately?! Are there truly more Americans out there who don't mind that much?

There are a lot of ways that I differ from a person who's had a more conventional life--I realize that--but when I try to imagine that EVER being OK with me, my mind balks. A close friend of mine flew around the same time I did, got the pat-down and seemed surprised that I was still upset and thinking about it a day or so later--that shocked me. But she's never been sexually abused, so I put it down to that. And I also reminded her of the differences between us, particularly concerning boundaries, after which she backed down.

:arrow: I wonder if that poll asked how these bizarrely laid-back travelers felt about having their children felt up by federal "agents"?

Is it perhaps partly denial that's causing them to just passively accept it? Maybe if I had to fly frequently for a living, my tendency to endure an invasion of privacy like this might be greater. Could the incentive of loss of income in a sucky economy be at the root of these people's acceptance?

But denial doesn't protect from trauma, though it may temporarily conceal it from the person who's been violated...at some point, when they're forced to face up to what was done to them, what will it do to them?

I was confused about my flight date--it's tomorrow afternoon, not today. So please think positive thoughts at me then. You cannot imagine how upset I am that my government has decided it's OK to hold the threat of this over my head. It's *wrong*.

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Re: Airport Security? More Like TSA GONE WILD

Postby Project Willow » Fri Nov 26, 2010 11:31 pm

I'll be thinking of you LilyPat.

If the poll was taken of frequent fliers then it should be safe to assume a good number of them have to travel for business. "It's hard to get a man to understand something if his paycheck depends upon him not understanding it."

I agree with you that the damage is being done regardless. A great number of Americans are enthusiastically allowing themselves to be sexually assaulted in order to fly. I suppose when one thinks about all the dangerous, unhealthy, and insidiously abusive situations and actions humans have subjected themselves to for conformity and/or survival throughout history, maybe it shouldn't be such a surprise.
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Re: Airport Security? More Like TSA GONE WILD

Postby Nordic » Sat Nov 27, 2010 12:43 am

At this point I will only fly if a job forces me to. Even then, if it's a short trip, that could be made in 5 or 6 hours by car, I'll drive.
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Re: Airport Security? More Like TSA GONE WILD

Postby Luther Blissett » Sat Nov 27, 2010 1:01 am

82_28 wrote:
Alaya wrote:I feel like they are just practicing now and when the next false flag occurs, the jackboot is coming down hard.


This.

This is exactly what they are paving the way for. There is no other logical explanation. Everything has been set up for all to be ready, not for "the event", but what the plan is. Their cover has been blown and they know it. They're gonna need a big one again. I don't think they have the ratio needed any longer though to pin it on "Muslims" or "terrorists" or "lone nuts" anymore however. But perhaps they do. A staged event larger than anything that has ever come before will be what is needed and/or multiple smaller events in socially sensitive locations.


Staged extraterrestrial threat?
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Re: Airport Security? More Like TSA GONE WILD

Postby slomo » Sun Nov 28, 2010 11:36 pm

I've personally been on the fence about whether to endure the TSA molestation procedure or just go quietly through the backscatter device. What I have read about the scanner made it seem reasonably safe (aside from the letter signed by several UCSF researchers, which was a very brief, non-descriptive cover letter serving as a face page for a dense appendix that I frankly did not have time to read). I sometimes get tired of the knee-jerk "ZOMG radiation" reaction you get from some less-than-fully-educated quarters.

However, this blog post (via Cryptogon) is both brief and detailed enough to be informative, and it has moved me into the camp that will opt out of the scanner:

http://myhelicaltryst.blogspot.com/2010 ... anner.html

Review of the TSA X-ray backscatter body scanner safety report: hide your kids, hide your wife
I am a biochemist working in the field of biophysics. Specifically, the lab I work in (as well as many others) has spent the better part of the last decade working on the molecular mechanism of how mutations in the breast cancer susceptibility gene, BRCA2, result in cancer. The result of that work is that we now better understand that people who have a deficient BRCA2 gene are hypersensitive to DNA damage, which can be caused by a number of factors including: UV exposure, oxidative stress, improper chromosomal replication and segregation, and radiation exposure. The image below shows what happens to a chromosome of a normal cell when it is exposed to radiation. It most cases, this damage is repaired; however, at high doses or when there is a genetic defect, the cells either die or become cancerous.
...
With that being said, because the scanners have both a radiation source AND a detector in the front AND back of the person in the scanner, it is actually possible for the hardware to conduct a classic, through-the-body X-ray. The TSA claims that the machines are not currently being used in that way; however, based on the limited engineering schematics released in the safety documents, they could be certainly be easily reconfigured to do so by altering the aluminum-plate (or equivalent) filter or by changing the software. So the hardware has the capability to output quite high doses of radiation, however a biological dose is a function of the time of exposure as well as the proximity to the source and the power of the power of the source. Unfortunately, it is difficult to determine which zones in the scanner are 'hottest' because that information is masked in the document. An excerpt of the safety evaluation from Johns Hopkins is shown below to give you sense of how much other information is being withheld. Ultimately my point is this: even though the dose may actually be low, these machines are capable of much higher radiation output through device failure or both unauthorized or authorized reconfiguration of either hardware or software.
...
With respect to errors in the safety reports and/or misleading information about them, the statement that one scan is equivalent to 2-3 minutes of your flight is VERY misleading. Most cosmic radiation is composed of high energy particles that passes right through our body, the plane itself without being absorbed. The spectrum that is dangerous is known as ionizing radiation and most of that is absorbed by the hull of the airplane. So relating non-absorbing cosmic radiation to tissue absorbing man-made radiation is simply misleading and wrong.
...

Go read the whole thing, it's definitely worth it ....
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Re: Airport Security? More Like TSA GONE WILD

Postby Twyla LaSarc » Mon Nov 29, 2010 3:33 am

Been away then hosting guests this week. No air travel involved, thank goodness. Thanks everyone for the links to the stories I was hearing mentioned by others all week.

LilyPatToo wrote: But, over-all, I really do feel that the fascists are currently running a serious test of our current levels of resistance to unreasonable intrusions. I don't know about you guys, but I'm becoming really alarmed at how many people are in "herd mode" and just mouthing platitudes, rather than becoming outraged. Stockholm syndrome is becoming a national disorder.

LilyPat


I made the mistake of browsing a couple of threads on supposedly progressive boards today. The comments were abysmal. There were quite a few folks who were quite supportive of the scanners. I picked out several reasons that seemed to form the undercurrent of their thought:

1) It's OK to shred the constitution when Obama does it.
2) If it just catches one potential bomber it'll be worth it, personal liberty be damned. (The recent set-up Pseudo-bomber in Portland is often cited)
3) This is a teabagger plot to discredit Obama.
4) What? Are you a pussy crybaby?



Slippery Slope? This 'tipping' point seems to be emptying into an abyss.
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Re: Airport Security? More Like TSA GONE WILD

Postby LilyPatToo » Mon Nov 29, 2010 4:30 pm

Thank you for doing that research and posting a summary, Twyla, since between jet-lag and general sleep-deprivation, I've been incapable of doing it myself. Yet I really am interested in how the Left is handling it. I observed 2 interesting responses among Lefties I know personally over the past week: One seemed to have fallen for the "death of a thousand cuts" excuse and was amazed that I was still concerned about it several days after having flown (as though A. I'm not a sexual trauma survivor with boundary issues and B. I didn't have a 2nd effing flight coming up in a few days) and the other person did some fancy footwork to avoid discussing it at all by immediately stating that this was an issue only because I was White and that it had been happening to People of Color for quite a while...! :shock:

My reaction to both was basically WTF?!

So I reminded the first person to whom she was speaking and decided it wasn't worth engaging the second person (a lawyer) on an issue where she obviously really needed to sustain her coping strategy. Maybe if I'd been feeling better, I might have used my usual response to Lefties who attempt to shut me down--ie. innocently asked, "So because I'm White I'm not entitled to my outrage?" That at least would have launched a ferocious volley of recriminations that might have served to enlighten her about the fallacy in her reasoning. But I wasn't up to it.

My favorite of your listed responses was #3--I actually heard that trotted out twice during the week-long visit, though not as baldly as that. Amazing.

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Re: Airport Security? More Like TSA GONE WILD

Postby Project Willow » Mon Nov 29, 2010 7:25 pm

^^ But... what happened? Did you make it through alright??
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Re: Airport Security? More Like TSA GONE WILD

Postby LilyPatToo » Tue Nov 30, 2010 1:13 am

We were uncharacteristically lucky going both ways. Normally, I'm the one who's *selected* for extra attention in airport security lines. My theory is that it's the small metal clips implanted in both breasts after an extremely irregular mammogram followed by biopsies 6 or so years ago. The radiologist's 1st question was "When and where were you exposed to a massive dose of ionizing radiation?" I wanted to say something along the lines of "Oh, it might have been in childhood during experiments conducted on me in Pittsburgh, PA OR it might have happened during my 1st marriage to a sociopathic government atomic physicist, but I'm not sure..." Of course I didn't say that, because I have no proof.

However, this time we were motioned through by *smiling* TSA agents, our luggage wasn't searched and I really regretted the sedatives I popped before getting in line, because they rendered me unable to use the long flight to catch up on my writing. No idea why the big change--?--but I kept waiting for the other shoe to drop right up until we cleared the line in Ft. Lauderdale. :?:

Barring a significant family emergency, I wont' be flying until the groping is stopped. I like trains better anyway...trains and the Fourth Amendment.

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Re: Airport Security? More Like TSA GONE WILD

Postby Project Willow » Tue Nov 30, 2010 1:21 am

Glad to know you were relatively unscathed! I too will be exploring train travel.
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Re: Airport Security? More Like TSA GONE WILD

Postby 82_28 » Tue Nov 30, 2010 1:36 am

Luther Blissett wrote:
82_28 wrote:
Alaya wrote:I feel like they are just practicing now and when the next false flag occurs, the jackboot is coming down hard.


This.

This is exactly what they are paving the way for. There is no other logical explanation. Everything has been set up for all to be ready, not for "the event", but what the plan is. Their cover has been blown and they know it. They're gonna need a big one again. I don't think they have the ratio needed any longer though to pin it on "Muslims" or "terrorists" or "lone nuts" anymore however. But perhaps they do. A staged event larger than anything that has ever come before will be what is needed and/or multiple smaller events in socially sensitive locations.


Staged extraterrestrial threat?


Who knows? It could be. One half hour span with the "Nightly News" tonight showed me that I think, anything is possible anymore.

Glad to hear you got through, LilyPat. And I completely agree.
There is no me. There is no you. There is all. There is no you. There is no me. And that is all. A profound acceptance of an enormous pageantry. A haunting certainty that the unifying principle of this universe is love. -- Propagandhi
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Re: Airport Security? More Like TSA GONE WILD

Postby AlicetheKurious » Tue Nov 30, 2010 7:36 am

"If you're not careful the newspapers will have you hating the oppressed and loving the people doing the oppressing." - Malcolm X
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Re: Airport Security? More Like TSA GONE WILD

Postby 82_28 » Tue Nov 30, 2010 8:11 am

Thing I don't get, well, actually I do, but these TSA people don't give a shit whether you go on to live or die anyways. The government doesn't give a shit if you live or die. The general public doesn't give a shit whether anybody at any given moment lives or dies.

This is because the desensitization process has been successful. It gives corporations and the totalitarian regimes which bow to them more breathing room. It's like getting an offsides penalty on the one yard line on a punt in (American) football. Just more playing room, a new market, a new demographic, a new bubble, etc. . .

One must wonder after watching Alice's little video there, whether Chertoff and RAPiscan aren't just sitting on a shit ton of inventory that was unusable for the directives placed upon the military in the Middle East. Pawn that shit off on the idiot Americans. Use the working components in the "detecting" devices and throw them into something that looks like a metal detector or chamber of "safety".

But, at the end of the day, my point is, all these people who are supposed to give a fuck about you won't lose one wink of sleep if you go on that day and wind up dying in a terrorist attack. All they'll do is show up for the next meeting/orientation and learn the new procedures which is doubtless just waiting in the wings.
There is no me. There is no you. There is all. There is no you. There is no me. And that is all. A profound acceptance of an enormous pageantry. A haunting certainty that the unifying principle of this universe is love. -- Propagandhi
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Re: Airport Security? More Like TSA GONE WILD

Postby tazmic » Tue Nov 30, 2010 2:39 pm

"It ever was, and is, and shall be, ever-living fire, in measures being kindled and in measures going out." - Heraclitus

"There aren't enough small numbers to meet the many demands made of them." - Strong Law of Small Numbers
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