Area 51: Uncensored History author on NPR Fresh Air

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Re: Area 51: Uncensored History author on NPR Fresh Air

Postby JackRiddler » Wed May 18, 2011 5:11 pm

.

I heard part of this program while doing housework.

But WTF, I completely missed this cockamamie Stalin/Mengele story. That's a pretty funny punchline for a program that included the usual sneers at "conspiracy theory." So, Mengele, who escaped Europe to live incognito in US-backed military dictatorships in Argentina and Paraguay, was actually "enlisted" by the Soviets to "genetically engineer" children into pretend aliens, a full six years before Watson and Crick published The Double Helix and while the USSR was still under the sway of Lysenko. Not bad! Nazis and Soviets teaming up, stealth flight technology, genetic engineering. Sounds like Team B went back in time to try to make up the Soviet threat of their wet dreams.

And now we remember that Jacobsen is the fabricator of the odious 2004 "Muslim big-band terrorists on a plane" hysteria tale.

And she was on Stewart too. Nice roll-out.

Here's my pet theory I don't actually believe: it's an experiment to see how willing people are to believe obvious bottom-of-the-barrel conspiratainment fiction when the liberal radio lady is pushing it as though it were scholarship, rather than calling it crazy.

What I did hear from the program were the even crazier but undeniably true stories about the nuclear tests, including the intentional crashing of a load of plutonium into the ground to see how it would spread, and the resulting irreversible contamination of a large area. Very fucked up stuff. Reminds you we're now in the seventh decade of states justifying piecemeal nuclear holocaust to themselves, part of the reason why such great feats of denial are possible with the ongoing Fukushima meltdowns.

.

And National Geographic! What is wrong with these people (besides that they think this crap makes money)? You could make a great documentary about government and UN plans for extraterrestrial visits, but watch the video clip about the actual invasion scenario: The motherships from Independence Day hover over the cities and drop the kill-bots from War of the Worlds (Spielberg version), and like both of those movies, it's actually about Americans projecting their own inner war monster on to an alien fiction that they can pretend is not them. A military guy even talks about how the Bad Aliens will surely want to use "Shock and Awe" tactics to cow the population. I wonder if that's because it's such an advanced strategy in his mind?

We're told the F16s have no chance in the dogfight with the F16-sized alien fighter vehicles, since the aliens have superior propulsion systems we can't even conceive of. Long as they're pulling everything they say out of their ass, why do they bother having the aliens shoot people on the street? Why not just blindly speculate that such advanced aliens will surely have a way to instantly enslave or kill everyone?

I know, they could pose as God, and command us to kill ourselves. Maybe that's what they've already done?

.
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Re: Area 51: Uncensored History author on NPR Fresh Air

Postby Nordic » Wed May 18, 2011 5:59 pm

What I did hear from the program were the even crazier but undeniably true stories about the nuclear tests, including the intentional crashing of a load of plutonium into the ground to see how it would spread, and the resulting irreversible contamination of a large area. Very fucked up stuff. Reminds you we're now in the seventh decade of states justifying piecemeal nuclear holocaust to themselves, part of the reason why such great feats of denial are possible with the ongoing Fukushima meltdowns.


YES! It's like she's using her own book as a decoy to distract us from what her own book is about!!

Which is just effing WEIRD AS HELL.

Saw her on TDS show last night, too. Same old thing that's being relayed here. She didn't even mention (nor did asshole Stewart) anything about the deliberate Plutonium crash.

Stewart's become such an obvious gatekeeper I can't stand him anymore.
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Re: Area 51: Uncensored History author on NPR Fresh Air

Postby Spiro C. Thiery » Wed May 18, 2011 6:26 pm

I know, they could pose as God, and command us to kill ourselves. Maybe that's what they've already done?
Sounds more plausible than God. Might even explain it. :twisted:

Stewart's become such an obvious gatekeeper I can't stand him anymore.
Ever since that holiday named for a date and emergency telephone number. I only saw that first "post-event" broadcast recently; it reminded me of his tone during that little gathering of his in the Capital. As if the incivility in politics is the most important thing to get people to swarm DC for.

Most pathetic thing is, most disinfo-ers don't even know they are.
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Re: Area 51: Uncensored History author on NPR Fresh Air

Postby Nordic » Wed May 18, 2011 6:39 pm

Pretty sure National Geographic got bought by Murdoch.

http://www.cjr.org/resources/index.php?c=newscorp

Yup, 71% of it.

It's a real shame.
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Re: Area 51: Uncensored History author on NPR Fresh Air

Postby elfismiles » Wed May 18, 2011 6:54 pm

Nordic wrote:
It's like she's using her own book as a decoy to distract us from what her own book is about!!



Yes, but ... I think we can all agree that, without even invoking media cover-up conspiracy, the media always go for the most sensationalistic angle to a story AND tv-media folk and the publishing community know that UFOs are always a popular subject.

From the NPR interview they made it sound like the UFO / Roswell stuff was just a small afterthought within the book - I think she literally says the bit about Roswell is at the very end of the book.

I can't imagine the publisher wanting to put that book out WITHOUT SOME SORT of UFO angle. I mean, it IS about AREA-freaking-51 which has ALWAYS been linked in the public's consciousness with UFOs.

I think it is just as likely that, she is just the latest line in a slow-deliberate-leaking of info on this episode of American history and I wouldn't be surprised if Redfern's take was closer to the truth but that there have been several deliberate campaigns over the years to do the preparatory work for the time when some day the info finally really comes out; that WE brought back the Unit-731 research and CONTINUED it and merged it with our remote control, atomic aviation, atmospheric testing. And this latest twist is either just something her contact was told so that he'd participate or just another false lead to divert a little away from the WE JUST DID ALL THIS EVIL SHIT meme.

I mean clearly the whole Mengele engineered kids thing is not as credible as the Japanese and Americans experimenting on kids with progeria idea.

And yeah, how the fuck could the Ruskies get a horton wing remotely piloted here? Again, Redfern's take seems more reasonable; that the Americans brought Unit-731 back to the US and just continued where they left off / were stopped.
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Re: Area 51: Uncensored History author on NPR Fresh Air

Postby Nordic » Wed May 18, 2011 8:44 pm

I'd say it's far more likely that her story would be true if it were an American project that went awry and crashed. Maybe something that was gonna be used against the Russians or something.

Either way, it just muddies the already opaque waters of the whole event.
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Re: Area 51: Uncensored History author on NPR Fresh Air

Postby Luther Blissett » Wed May 18, 2011 9:27 pm

Wait, the Redfern take really is about experimenting on children with progeria? "Experimenting" how exactly? Wasn't DNA not even discovered until the 50's?
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Re: Area 51: Uncensored History author on NPR Fresh Air

Postby justdrew » Wed May 18, 2011 9:54 pm

Image

nordic - good point, a reverse might be plausible, and would at least give a reason to keep it secret.

BTW - it was mentioned up thread... there was something about Russian experiments on making a human/gorilla soldier about a year ago IIRC.
see here

Wait, the Redfern take really is about experimenting on children with progeria? "Experimenting" how exactly? Wasn't DNA not even discovered until the 50's?


true, no DNA back then, but the Russians were really big into natural selective breeding, and there's things that could have been done with radioactivity to induce mutation (the vast majority of which would have been immediately fatal, such a blind, radiation based mutation program would have required vast numbers of dead human children. probably they'd take sperm and expose it to radiation, select the still viable sperm and artificially inseminate.)

I don't know, if they were really up to such things, I guess I can almost see the desire of all parties to hide that info, because it could be a little TOO inflammatory. I could easily see US citizens demanding immediate attack to stop such atrocities.
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Re: Area 51: Uncensored History author on NPR Fresh Air

Postby JackRiddler » Wed May 18, 2011 10:38 pm

.

Not only is this ascribing super tech to the Nazis, in a way it's almost ennobling their murderous experiments on human beings as though they would have yielded magic body-morphing capabilities. It's also stupid as hell: Why is the Nazi-Commie axis (just two years after the war) crashing their supposed hysteria bomb in a remote, easily-controlled spot? Wouldn't a city be a touch more effective? If not Times Square, then Levittown? And haven't they considered that the autopsy will reveal the creatures are human? The whole story bleeds with stupid.

elfismiles wrote:WE brought back the Unit-731 research and CONTINUED it and merged it with our remote control, atomic aviation, atmospheric testing. And this latest twist is either just something her contact was told so that he'd participate or just another false lead to divert a little away from the WE JUST DID ALL THIS EVIL SHIT meme.


There's no shortage of that! The NatGeo special fits this thread well.

I mean clearly the whole Mengele engineered kids thing is not as credible as the Japanese and Americans experimenting on kids with progeria idea.


In fact, I'm not sure if it's more credible than extraterrestrials.

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Re: Area 51: Uncensored History author on NPR Fresh Air

Postby elfismiles » Thu May 19, 2011 9:52 am

Luther Blissett wrote:Wait, the Redfern take really is about experimenting on children with progeria? "Experimenting" how exactly? Wasn't DNA not even discovered until the 50's?


... supposedly the US, when it raided the labs of Unit-731 in the Pacific theater, brought back its "worse than Mengele scientists" AND their disabled test subjects (Japanese and Chinese handicapped folk including kids/people with Progeria) and CONTINUED experiments using those poor victims. AND when the US ran out of test subjects they supposedly began BODY-SNATCHING similarly disabled kids/people from American asylums, orphanages, etc.

The experiments were not GENETIC manipulation per se but the utilization of people already disabled or abandoned for atomic aviation experiments ... using these people to test the effects of high-altitude exposure, exposure to atomic materials etc. These victim/test subjects were basically strapped into remotely controlled Nazi Horton Brother and other craft that were both towed behind manned aircraft or remote controlled to fly through nuclear explosions and/or test craft with atomic materials onboard - they were trying to see what the effects of atomic aircraft would be upon their pilots.

Redfern's book does not mention DNA experimentation as far as I remember. Aside from the probable genetic effects of radiation exposure.
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Re: Area 51: Uncensored History author on NPR Fresh Air

Postby elfismiles » Thu May 19, 2011 10:00 am

JackRiddler wrote:.

Not only is this ascribing super tech to the Nazis, in a way it's almost ennobling their murderous experiments on human beings as though they would have yielded magic body-morphing capabilities. It's also stupid as hell: Why is the Nazi-Commie axis (just two years after the war) crashing their supposed hysteria bomb in a remote, easily-controlled spot? Wouldn't a city be a touch more effective? If not Times Square, then Levittown? And haven't they considered that the autopsy will reveal the creatures are human? The whole story bleeds with stupid.

.


Yes, I agree this new Russian hoax angle is stupid as hell, but it's interesting in the context of Redfern's angle.

JackRiddler wrote:.

There's no shortage of that! The NatGeo special fits this thread well.
.


What is this National Geo special you all keep talking about ? Guess I'll trawl back thru the thread for the link...

JackRiddler wrote:.
I mean clearly the whole Mengele engineered kids thing is not as credible as the Japanese and Americans experimenting on kids with progeria idea.


In fact, I'm not sure if it's more credible than extraterrestrials.

.


How the hell can you say that Jack? As a member of the RI forum you are familiar with MK-Ultra and related projects. You are no doubt familiar with the various publicly verified radiation experiments on unwitting human subjects. That's all this story is, within the Redfern thread ... that is Americans continuing Mengele-like research on human test subjects in much the same way we already know they did under Mkultra etc.

Why is that less credible than ETs?!
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Re: Area 51: Uncensored History author on NPR Fresh Air

Postby The Consul » Thu May 19, 2011 11:01 am

JackRiddler wrote:.

Here's my pet theory I don't actually believe: it's an experiment to see how willing people are to believe obvious bottom-of-the-barrel conspiratainment fiction when the liberal radio lady is pushing it as though it were scholarship, rather than calling it crazy.
.


Like a rumor that Jim Marrs is going to replace Katie Couric is a viable Mockingbird strategy.
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Re: Area 51: Uncensored History author on NPR Fresh Air

Postby JackRiddler » Thu May 19, 2011 11:35 am

elfismiles wrote:
JackRiddler wrote:.
I mean clearly the whole Mengele engineered kids thing is not as credible as the Japanese and Americans experimenting on kids with progeria idea.


In fact, I'm not sure if it's more credible than extraterrestrials.

.


How the hell can you say that Jack? As a member of the RI forum you are familiar with MK-Ultra and related projects. You are no doubt familiar with the various publicly verified radiation experiments on unwitting human subjects. That's all this story is, within the Redfern thread ... that is Americans continuing Mengele-like research on human test subjects in much the same way we already know they did under Mkultra etc.

Why is that less credible than ETs?!


I didn't say your ideas are less credible, I said the Jacobsen-transmitted story is "less credible," which is just a manner of speech in which I compare a ridiculous new idea to an older idea that has already been established as ridiculous, as a way of saying that both have zero credibility, in my view. However, while some people actually believe the aliens story, the Mengele-Stalin story of the Roswell incident is an obvious and pathetic strategem to cover up whatever was really going on, so it's far more worthy of contempt. Anyway, no critique of your ideas was intended. Peace.

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Re: Area 51: Uncensored History author on NPR Fresh Air

Postby yathrib » Thu May 19, 2011 12:36 pm

These days it's less about the veracity of the story itself than what the story reveals about how "they" think and/or how they want us to think. But this story is so crazy--especially coming from someone who wants to explain away all the "conspiracy theories"-- that it tops the Saudi Arabian Doomsday Machine conceived by Gerald "Oswald Acted Alone But Saudi Arabia has a James Bondesque Doomsday Machine" Posner.
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Re: Area 51: Uncensored History author on NPR Fresh Air

Postby justdrew » Thu May 19, 2011 12:43 pm

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