Former Cdn. Def. Minister asks for hearings on alien contact

by **Rigorous Intuition** » Thu Nov 24, 2005 6:28 pm

Hellyer hasn't been regarded as a serious public figure for 30 years. Apparently his recent interest in UFOs (and credulous assumption of the ET hypothesis) was triggered by reading Philip Corso's The Day After Roswell. He then spoke to an old Pentagon friend, who spun him more tales about the space brothers. Former Canadian Minister Of Defence Asks Canadian Parliament Asked To Hold Hearings On Relations With Alien "ET" Civilizations OTTAWA, CANADA (PRWEB) November 24, 2005 -- A former Canadian Minister of Defence and Deputy Prime Minister under Pierre Trudeau has joined forces with three Non-governmental organizations to ask the Parliament of Canada to hold public hearings on Exopolitics -- relations with “ETs.” By “ETs,” Mr. Hellyer and these organizations mean ethical, advanced extraterrestrial civilizations that may now be visiting Earth. On September 25, 2005, in a startling speech at the University of Toronto that caught the attention of mainstream newspapers and magazines, Paul Hellyer, Canada’s Defence Minister from 1963-67 under Nobel Peace Prize Laureate Prime Minister Lester Pearson, publicly stated: "UFOs, are as real as the airplanes that fly over your head." Mr. Hellyer went on to say, "I'm so concerned about what the consequences might be of starting an intergalactic war, that I just think I had to say something." Hellyer revealed, "The secrecy involved in all matters pertaining to the Roswell incident was unparalled. The classification was, from the outset, above top secret, so the vast majority of U.S. officials and politicians, let alone a mere allied minister of defence, were never in-the-loop." Hellyer warned, "The United States military are preparing weapons which could be used against the aliens, and they could get us into an intergalactic war without us ever having any warning. He stated, "The Bush administration has finally agreed to let the military build a forward base on the moon, which will put them in a better position to keep track of the goings and comings of the visitors from space, and to shoot at them, if they so decide." Hellyer’s speech ended with a standing ovation. He said, "The time has come to lift the veil of secrecy, and let the truth emerge, so there can be a real and informed debate, about one of the most important problems facing our planet today." Three Non-governmental organizations took Hellyer’s words to heart, and approached Canada’s Parliament in Ottawa, Canada’s capital, to hold public hearings on a possible ET presence, and what Canada should do. The Canadian Senate, which is an appointed body, has held objective, well-regarded hearings and issued reports on controversial issues such as same-sex marriage and medical marijuana, On October 20, 2005, the Institute for Cooperation in Space requested Canadian Senator Colin Kenny, Senator, Chair of The Senate Standing Senate Committee on National Security and Defence, “schedule public hearings on the Canadian Exopolitics Initiative, so that witnesses such as the Hon. Paul Hellyer, and Canadian-connected high level military-intelligence, NORAD-connected, scientific, and governmental witnesses facilitated by the Disclosure Project and by the Toronto Exopolitics Symposium can present compelling evidence, testimony, and Public Policy recommendations.” The Non-governmental organizations seeking Parliament hearings include Canada-based Toronto Exopolitics Symposium, which organized the University of Toronto Symposium at which Mr. Hellyer spoke. The Disclosure Project, a U.S.– based organization that has assembled high level military-intelligence witnesses of a possible ET presence, is also one of the organizations seeking Canadian Parliament hearings. Vancouver-based Institute for Cooperation in Space (ICIS), whose International Director headed a proposed 1977 Extraterrestrial Communication Study for the White House of former U.S. President Jimmy Carter, who himself has publicly reported a 1969 Close Encounter of the First Kind with a UFO, filed the original request for Canadian Parliament hearings. The Canadian Exopolitics Initiative, presented by the organizations to a Senate Committee panel hearing in Winnipeg, Canada, on March 10, 2005, proposes that the Government of Canada undertake a Decade of Contact. The proposed Decade of Contact is “a 10-year process of formal, funded public education, scientific research, educational curricula development and implementation, strategic planning, community activity, and public outreach concerning our terrestrial society’s full cultural, political, social, legal, and governmental communication and public interest diplomacy with advanced, ethical Off-Planet cultures now visiting Earth.” Canada has a long history of opposing the basing of weapons in Outer Space. On September 22, 2004 Canadian Prime Minister Paul Martin declared to the U.N. General Assembly,” "Space is our final frontier. It has always captured our imagination. What a tragedy it would be if space became one big weapons arsenal and the scene of a new arms race. Martin stated, "In 1967, the United Nations agreed that weapons of mass destruction must not be based in space. The time has come to extend this ban to all weapons..." In May, 2003, speaking before the Canadian House of Commons Standing Committee on National Defence and Veterans Affairs, former Minister of Foreign Affairs of Canada Lloyd Axworthy, stated “Washington's offer to Canada is not an invitation to join America under a protective shield, but it presents a global security doctrine that violates Canadian values on many levels." Axworthy concluded, “There should be an uncompromising commitment to preventing the placement of weapons in space.” On February 24, 2005, Canadian Prime Minister Paul Martin made official Canada's decision not to take part in the U.S government’s Ballistic Missile Defence program. Paul Hellyer, who now seeks Canadian Parliament hearings on relations with ETs, on May 15, 2003, stated in Toronto’s Globe & Mail newspaper, “Canada should accept the long-standing invitation of U.S. Congressman Dennis Kucinich of Ohio to launch a conference to seek approval of an international treaty to ban weapons in space. That would be a positive Canadian contribution toward a more peaceful world.” In early November 2005, the Canadian Senate wrote ICIS, indicating the Senate Committee could not hold hearings on ETs in 2005, because of their already crowded schedule. “That does not deter us,” one spokesperson for the Non-governmental organizations said, “We are going ahead with our request to Prime Minister Paul Martin and the official opposition leaders in the House of Commons now, and we will re-apply with the Senate of Canada in early 2006. “Time is on the side of open disclosure that there are ethical Extraterrestrial civilizations visiting Earth,” The spokesperson stated. “Our Canadian government needs to openly address these important issues of the possible deployment of weapons in outer war plans against ethical ET societies.” <a href="http://www.prweb.com/releases/2005/11/prweb314382.htm">www.prweb.com/releases/2005/11/prweb314382.htm</a>

by **maggrwaggr** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:54 am

over at Dailykos. And I'm looking for a link. Does anyone have a link regarding a woman who used to work for ...... shit, I can't remember who. She worked with someone of some high status who told her that not far in the distant future we would be told of aliens, and that the world would be threatened by them. But it would all be a lie, an excuse to militarize space. I can't find the link. I can't remember her name. Anybody know what the heck I'm talking about?

by **anotherdrew** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 8:25 am

the woman was Dr. Carol Rosin, his spokesperson for the last 4 years of his life. <blockquote>Quote:<hr>It is not about money as you and I think of it, but about geo-political power - the very centralized power on which the current order in the world runs. The world is kept in a state or roiling wars, endless poverty for most of Earth's denizens and global environmental ruin, just to prop up this evil world order. As immense as that game is, there is a bigger one: Control through fear. As Werner Von Braun related to Dr. Carol Rosin, his spokesperson for the last 4 years of his life, a maniacal machine - the military, industrial, intelligence, laboratory complex - would go from Cold War, to Rogue Nations, to Global Terrorism (the stage we find ourselves at today) to the ultimate trump card: A hoaxed threat from space. To justify eventually spending trillions of dollars on space weapons, the world would be deceived about a threat from outer space, thus uniting the world in fear, in militarism and in war.<hr></blockquote> rest is here: Pentagon plans ET Hoax Qaeda to ET's - The Search For Bogeymen by Steven M. Greer MD Director, The Disclosure Project <a href="http://www.greatdreams.com/disclosure_project.htm">www.greatdreams.com/discl...roject.htm</a> ...also... remember ray-gun's speech at the UN where he hoped the world could come together as one if we faced the threat of aliens from another world. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=anotherdrew>anotherdrew</A> at: 11/26/05 5:32 am

by **maggrwaggr** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 4:06 pm

Thanks!

by **Dreams End** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 4:11 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>Apparently his recent interest in UFOs (and credulous assumption of the ET hypothesis) was triggered by reading Philip Corso's The Day After Roswell.<hr></blockquote> I'd like some background on this guy. I doubt it was triggered by an innocent reading when he'd been Defense Minister with access to far more information 30 years ago. These revelations or pseudo revelations come every so often, with promises that soon, for good or ill, the aliens will reveal themselves. It's interesting you post this now, because in the flames of the firepit, I had just reminded people how Jaques Vallee kept finding sophisticated UFO hoaxes that track back to government and intelligence agencies. This led him to believe that a fake landing might be used as a way to justify a sudden authoritarian takeover or fascist agenda of some kind. It would be interesting to know who this guy's been hanging with in the last three decades. Oh, reading closer, I see this: <blockquote>Quote:<hr>The Disclosure Project, a U.S.– based organization that has assembled high level military-intelligence witnesses of a possible ET presence, is also one of the organizations seeking Canadian Parliament hearings.<hr></blockquote> It is my unproveable assumption that these guys are an intel operation. My primary reason for thinking this is that Daniel Sheehan, formerly of the Christic Institute, is now working for them and using the alien theme to push a different "secret government" conspiracy theory. I've talked about Sheehan before. Former legal counsel for the Jesuits, his MO used to be to come into legal cases with blockbuster political implications and screw them up through a combination of incompetence and, more importantly, the expansion of the case to include unsupported assertions of a "secret government." This did a couple of things, for example, with the Iran Contra stuff when he handled the case of the La Penca bombings. First, the plaintiffs lost. Secondly, much of the information in there that was real and vital to investigate was surrounded by murkier, secret government conspiracies that invited a more sinister political perspective and did some damage to the credibility of this information. Anyway, I don't know if this will turn out to be relevant in this case, but I don't trust the Disclosure Project much. Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=dreamsend@rigorousintuition>Dreams End</A> at: 11/26/05 1:40 pm

by **Dreams End** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:01 pm

Here's an interview with Stephen Greer of the Disclosure project. Notice how his project caught the "attention" of Lawrence Rockefeller. He claims to have briefed the President and members of the CIA. And yet, if you look at the stuff they've actually put out, including the big press conference they had some time ago, it's not that probative of anything. It's interesting stuff, but it is not the proof of a systemic, mj-12 style coverup. Notice also his take on William Colby and his claim that Colby was about to transfer money and technology related to their project when he was killed. And notice the emphasis on Peak Oil (also shared by Richard Dolan, a UFO researcher I have recommended but whom I think may now be part of the same disinfo network.) Will the "big reveal" actually happen this time? Well, I doubt it. I must say that as a big UFO enthusiast for many, many years, I'm growing rather suspicious that almost everything we know about them has been released or created merely to serve this larger, "plan nine" style agenda. By the way, the emphasis on zero point energy (hey, I'm all for that) reminds me of the very mysterious Joe Firmage, who sold his computer program 8 or 10 years ago to promote his special message of the alien presence and zero point energy. I've never gotten much info on Firmage, and even the site he had put up was a bit confusing if you just wanted to find out why he was doing it all. Evidently he had some sort of UFO experience which led to it. I wouldn't be surprised to see that he'd joined forces with the Disclosure Project, but if anyone has more info I'd love to hear it. <blockquote>Quote:<hr> Aliens, Coverups, and Free Energy - an interview with Dr. Steven Greer by Richard M. Dolan Phenomena Magazine Issue #4 September 10, 2004 Click here to Download MS Word Document File Earlier in 2004, Phenomena Editor Richard Dolan interviewed Dr. Steven Greer. Greer is the founder of the Center for [the] Study of Extraterrestrial intelligence (CSETI), which claims to have initiated communication and contact with extraterrestrials on Earth. In addition, Greer has founded the Disclosure Project, dedicated to ending official secrecy regarding UFOs. Dolan (D): In 1990, you formed the Center for the Study of Extraterrestrial Intelligence (CSETI),and within three years you're getting an invitation to meet with Laurence Rockefeller. How did that happen so quickly? Greer (G): To be honest with you, I think it was the force of the message. Not only had we put together an enormous amount of documentation about the phenomenon, but we had also formulated teams that were going all over the world, and had reproducible results with hundreds of witnesses - who had been able to signal to these objects. We had different teams in England, or Belgium, or Mexico, or places in the United States. From a number of them we got videotapes, photographs, or other witnesses who saw the event happening. D: Some of the stories are extraordinary. G: Yes, and they're all absolutely true. In fact they're way understated. This is what caught the attention of people like Laurence Rockefeller, Mrs. Buttros Ghali [wife of the former UN General Secretary], former head of Army Intelligence General Stubblebine, and eventually friends of the President [Clinton]. Some very good friends of the President became cognizant of what we were doing and urgently wanted us to get information to the President, to his science advisor, as well as to some of the senior military intelligence people in his administration after he got elected in 1993. So we put together briefing materials and had meetings. The main thing is that this is an inside game. I hate to use that term, but this has mainly been a process of educating two classes of people who are "insiders." One are the people who are on the inside, who should know, but don't, such as Presidents, CIA directors, and so on. The other part of it is educating, from a new paradigm, the national and international security control group - which some call MJ-12 - that deals with these issues. That is a committee of about two or three hundred people, and I know a number of them. The issue here is to educate them to the need for disclosure, for safe applications of technologies, and for this matter to be handled wisely. We feel that it has been handled promiscuously and dangerously. If you look at some of the things that have happened over the last fifty years, aside from it eroding the rule of law and democracy, the actual handling of the subject itself has been dangerous. It's a very dangerous thing for example, for the Commander in Chief of Atlantic Command, Admiral Harry Trane, not to have had adequate information on the subject and to scramble jets up and down the eastern seaboard trying to force down one of these objects. [This refers to an alleged military-UFO encounter from May 1981 - Ed.]. This kind of behavior, which has mainly taken place in a vacuum of secrecy, is a danger to the national security. You have people who have a need to know who can't find out anything. And then you have other people who do know and are controlling it, but they're in a cult of secrecy that becomes hermetically sealed. D: You briefed CIA director Woolsey, and there's talk that you briefed some other very high-level Clinton officials. I'm wondering who those were. For example, the name Al Gore came up. Did you in fact brief Al Gore on UFOs? G: Well, there are a number of people in public life that I don't want to comment on, who we are currently meeting with. They are and extensive group of people. They include people who are currently friends with every living president. There's not a living president who doesn't have a close associate on our advisory team. So from that, you can extrapolate. D: Can you give a sense of when these briefings were happening, the kinds of things what were said? What do you think of Bill Clinton himself, and his sense of all this? G: First of all, for the most part, very few people in most administrations knew anything about the subject. They knew what they saw on a badly-done documentary on the Discovery Channel. It's a sad statement, but that is really true. This is not just the executive branch. I met with a member of the intelligence community back in the 1990's. That was Senator Richard Bryan, and it was traumatic. I use that word because there's this sense that [these officials] know this is the truth. But the problem is that if you make the case this is real, and you're talking to someone who is the head of the CIA, or is a high official in the intelligence community, you find they have been denied access. They've made an inquiry through channels and have been told no such project exists. This is frightening. Not in the sense that the phenomenon is is frightening, but that people could be at those levels of responsibility and operational divisions where they really do have a need to know, and where they are completely left in the dark. I would say that none of the reactions have been, "oh this is silly, it's nonsense." This is important to hear: I haven't had a single meeting with a high official, either scientific, political, or military, who has had that reaction. Not in the least. D: What were some of the other types of reactions? G: Dismay, deep concern, and great interest. D: Would you say they generally believe there's some kind of cover up going on? G: Oh yeah. I had with a member of congress who is on the House National Security Committee who said to me, bluntly: "We of course are window dressing." I'll never forget the poignant moment when we were finishing the nearly three-hour meeting with CIA Director [James] Woolsey and his wife, Dr. Sue Woolsey (who at the time was the Chief Operating Officer at the National Academy of Sciences). He was getting ready to leave, Secret Service were out front, and I gave him a summary packet with a set of recommendations for the Clinton Administration. This was in the December of 1993. He looked at me and said, "Dr. Greer, how can we disclose what we are being denied access to? What would that say to the world?" It's a very sobering thought, because part of the illusion here is that people we elect are actually in control. They're not. This is something that most people don't discuss. These [government officials] are not stupid or naive. Clinton was a very bright man. Cohen was a very brilliant man. Woolsey was a very smart man. They know there's something going on. When we did our first briefing for members of Congress in 1997, we gathered about a dozen military witnesses of UFO events. Following that, I had a meeting over at the Pentagon with a senior official, an admiral at the Joint Chiefs of Staff level. My military advisor, a man with great access to the senior flag officers, was a friend of this gentleman. We went over there with a couple of these witnesses. Prior to the meeting, I had given him some documents, code names, and numbers. These were current code names and code numbers. He took them and made inquiries at the Pentagon into these projects, and he hit pay dirt. He actually located these projects. When he made an inquiry, wanting to know what these projects were doing, he was flat out told, "Sir, you don't have a need to know." This is an admiral with the Intelligence Director. They told him he didn't have a need to know. He was furious. D: These are the code words for UFO related programs? G: Yes. They're actually ETV, extraterrestrial vehicle, related. No one uses the word UFO, by the way. UFO was coined after they knew they weren't unidentified and they knew they didn't fly. (Laughs). By the end of this briefing, this admiral said to me, "If this is true, and I have no reason to doubt it, you're dealing with some of the most powerful technologies. These are things that could do circles around my B-2 stealth bombers." He also said, "Unless the civilian authorities authorize me to push further, there's not much I can do." I then told him what we were planning to do with the Disclosure Project. To the extent that we could get people and documents and other things, we were going to put them out there. He looked at me and said, "If you can do it, do it." I was in Britain meeting with the Ministry of Defence, and also the former head of the Ministry of Defence, Lord Hill Norton. He's a Sea Lord, a Five Star Admiral. At one point he asked, "Why the hell wasn't I told about this when I was head of the Ministry of Defence?" I said "Sir, what would you have done while you were head of the MoD, and you found out that there was a clandestine group that was transnational - e.g. transcended national borders - that had this information. That had lied to the Presidents, Prime Ministers, and high officials. that had used hundreds of billions of taxpayer dollars to work on thies projects, and had sequestered them inside private corporate structures. And had also, literally, engaged in elimination - murder - in order to keep it secret?" He looked at me and said, "I wouldn't have stood for it for one bloody minute!" I said, "That's why they weren't going to tell you, and that's why they will never tell you." You see, the first thing these folks do is a soul biopsy. By that I mean they're going to take a reading of you as a person. Your whole person. If they don't think you'll go along with the game, they're not going to tell you. Or they'll tell you disinformation, or set you on the wrong track. Whether or not you know has nothing to do with your position. This is the big mistake that the UFO research community has made. Assumptions have been make, [like] "oh, you're the head of the National Security Agency, you know." Some NSA chiefs have known, some haven't. [Former NSA Director] Bobby Ray Inman knew. Others haven't. Some CIA directors had knowledge, others didn't. Bill Colby knew a great deal. D: Is that why Bill Colby died? G: Yeah, basically, I mean that's an untouched story. D: He died in 1996, in what was described as an 'unfortunate boating accident.' G: [long pause] Well, I have never said this publicly, but I'll say it now because this is now many years gone. The week that he died, he was scheduled to meet with a member of our board, to transfer an enormous sum of money and actual hard material. Proof of this whole matter. Because he was sick of the secrecy, he was old, and he wanted it to come out. He very much supported what we wanted to do. One of his best friends, who was an old colonel, was our go-between. And it was under very suspicious circumstances, that's as far as I'll go. I will say that this colonel, who was good friends with Bill Colby, came to the wake of a good friend of mine who died - there were three of us who got metastatic cancer the same month, and I'm the only one left living, all under rather strange conditions, that's all I'll say about that. He said to me, "You know, we can't look back. We've got to to forward." These are tragic losses that both of us have had. It's very emotional I can't talk about this and not get choked up. Some of the things that have happened to keep this secret are really unconscionable. D: I've been suspicious of Colby's death for a long time. I think a lot of people are. G: We know exactly what happened. I know when it happened, how it happened, who ... but the whole point is that I'm not one of these take a pound of flesh, revenge kind of guys. I'm more like, "let's keep our eye on the ball." The ball is the future of civilization we have here on this planet. We're running out of time to do some of the right things that should have happened in the 1950s. D: What about your efforts regarding Zero Point Energy? G: From the Disclosure Project and the CSETI work we met a number of scientists from places like Murray Hill, Lockheed, and Northrop. They worked on some of these exotic propulsion and energy systems, and had not already been gobbled up by the military-industrial-intelligence complex. We concluded that there was actually enough science and invention to form an effort to bring it out. So a spinoff of the Disclosure Project became Space Energy Access Systems, Inc. It's not so much that we're trying to bring out antigravity, electrogravity, or magnetogravitic technologies to the public at the first blow. But revealing science and physics behind energy generation capabilities that would explain the behavior of UFOs. We've developed a collection of some two dozen or maybe three dozen inventions and inventors. Some are bench-type prototypes. Some are a little more developed, dealing with energy and propulsion systems that merit further research and development. My opinion is that it will take ten or twenty million dollars to take most of those things into anything of commercial value. By that, I mean something you could put into your house, start operating off the grid, extracting energy from the quantum vacuum space, the so-called zero-point energy field. We can now state with some confidence that we have observed and tested systems out there that are far enough along that they're not decades away. Maybe 12 to 24 months away from having at least Generation One energy devices that could completely replace oil, gas, coal, and nuclear power. Of course, we have a basic R&D need that is going to be rather expensive. Large corporations will not fund this, and if they do, they're doing to "black box" it. These technologies have been known since the 1940s and 1950s, and it's been "black shelf" for that long. But there are some cracks of light coming out. One of them is a powerful member of the Senate that we're meeting with. He's showing a tremendous amount of interest in this area - and I think I can open some doors for some basic science R&D funding. D: Do you have a device, or a blueprint of a device, that actually would produce excess energy? G: Well, of course, Tom Beardon and his MEG [Motionless Electromagnetic Generator] is being developed that does this. It's not ready for commercialization. It needs quite a bit of further R&D. But, yes there are. We visited another gentleman who's got a device, more old fashioned, kind of a Tesla-type rotary system. But this device was putting out 400-500 watts of usable power at 60 hertz and 110 volts from basically the quantum vacuum field. It was quite remarkable when this person had some threats, he was frightened. For many of these inventors, unfortunately, the currency of fear goes a long way to keeping them from being too bold. But, yes, we have seen these things, and I'm optimistic that it can be done. My big concern is will it take longer than the earth will allow. There are some serious problems going on right now. D: Yes. We're in the middle of a natural gas crisis in North America and we're maybe a decade away from hitting the petroleum wall. G: Correct, and the people I work with at the Department of Energy have pointed out maybe less than a decade from now, particularly if there's any economic development at all in Russia,China, and India. D: Plus, there's evidence OPEC's cooked their books, so there's really not telling how much is left. G: Yes, and also what the refining and shipping capabilities are. This is a very complex, centralized, energy supply line trying to feed six billion people. One of the problems with the whole fossil fuel game is that its very zero sum. Meaning that there's only so much of it to go around. It almost requires that about 80 percent of the world's population be impoverished, while maybe twenty percent, if we're lucky, can live something of a civilized lifestyle. When, locked away in these black boxes of covert industry and military intelligence, are the solutions for this. D: Unfortunately it does not look as though we are even close to moving in that direction. G: Well, I wouldn't be so sure. There's the outside game and the inside game. The inside game that I see going on is encouraging. I would estimate upwards of 40 or 45 percent of the policy group that deals with these issues are in favor of this coming out. I know there are preparations being made for that to happen. I think a number of people in circles around the world are beginning to look at this problem, and are thinking there are serious secrecy issues that need to get resolved. There are also some promising technologies that they are just beginning to be made aware of. That's why I tell people, part of this is an educational and "consciousness raising" process. But part of it also is being bold enough to say "we're prepared to provide the leadership to do this."<hr></blockquote><a href="http://www.disclosureproject.org/PhenomenaMagazineSGInterviewSept102004.htm">www.disclosureproject.org...102004.htm</a>

by **Dreams End** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:29 pm

Well, this is weird. Stephen Greer's own precursor to the Disclosure Project was "CSETI". These guys went around with flashlights allegedly bringing themselves into contact with UFO's on command. No pics, of course. There were allegations that this group was just another millenial cult and that Greer said that an impending catastrophe (asteroid) was heading to the earth which is part of the reasons the aliens were visiting us. (Can't find that documented yet.) He also was alleged to have been a TM instructor and to have helped on the fake "levitation" video they made. Can't confirm that yet, either. Yet, here is Stephen Greer warning of the very influences within UFO research that I was accusing him of being part of. Go figure. Does this mean he's clean? No. I don't know what it means, actually, but here's the relevant portion. For what it's worth, I don't trust Greer, but this is a pretty accurate summation about my view of what's going on. And for the record, I think his claims he's met with Clinton's people and high level CIA folks are bull shit...unless he's getting his paycheck from them or something. I'm putting all this out here because a) the synchronicity of me having just posted about the use of UFO cults for laying the groundwork for some sort of fascist program and b) the fact that a rather famous politician has just thrown in with these folks. <blockquote>Quote:<hr>The UFO matter is not so much a mystery as a matter deliberately obfuscated and mystified. Confusion and a lack of clarity serves the larger covert goal of keeping it off the long- range radar of society while power and plans are consolidated quietly. And the one thing more dangerous to society than all this secrecy is a planned, contrived disclosure run by the keepers of the secrets. For years such plans have been made - to be unfurled at just the right time. During a time of great expectation. Of social confusion. Perhaps of millennial madness? I have personally met with a number of people who are very involved with such plans. I do not speculate here. Be aware: The disclosure of UFO reality is being planned very carefully. It will assiduously follow a scheme to spin the subject in just the right way - the only way which will further redound to the glory and power of the secret-keepers. It will be a false disclosure - one born out of the age-old bane of human existence: selfishness and greed. Greed for power. Greed for control. Greed for domination. We must be mature and informed on such matters. Only a vigilant and informed public can see through such deceit - and correct it should such a plan be unfurled. Every citizen needs to know that great good can come from the truth being known. But the mature citizen must also recognize that the 'truth' can be spun and spun again -until the goals of those who crave secret and overt power are met. Consider: One scenario for disclosure is that the UFO and Extraterrestrial subject is acknowledged in a way which is scientific and hopeful. Excessive secrecy which lacks executive branch and congressional oversight is ended. Humanity begins to entertain open contact with other civilizations, with peaceful engagement as the goal. Technologies which are currently suppressed are allowed to be disseminated: Pollution ends. An economy of abundance and social justice is firmly established. Global environmental destruction and mind-numbing world poverty become a faint memory. Zero-point based energy devices transform the world. Electro-gravitic devices permit above ground travel without paving over the world's precious fertile farm land. As an ET once told Colonel Philip Corso, " Its a new world, if you can take it...". This is the disclosure which we are working for. But the disclosure envisioned above could have happened in 1950. It did not - Why? For such a disclosure would lead to the total transformation of the status quo. Centralized energy systems would be obsolete. Oil would be useful only for lubricants and synthetics. The geo-political order of today would be a thing forgotten: Every country and people on earth would have such a high degree of progress and advancement that all nations would have a seat at the global table. Power would need to be shared. Peaceful acknowledgment of life from elsewhere would make the earth seem like the very small, organic homeland which it is. The vast trillion dollar global military - industrial sector would be reigned in. And a universal spirituality might dawn... But remember, there are hugely powerful interests who dread this scenario. For them, it is the end of the world as they know it. The end of centralized, elite power. The end of a controlled geo-political order which today leaves nearly 90% of the people of earth barely one step out of the stone age. And they do not wish to share the power they wield. Now, let me describe the 'disclosure' which would make these covert control programs happy. This is the false or contrived 'disclosure' which has only one clear goal: The further consolidation of their power and their paradigm. It has to do with fear, not love. With war, not peace. With division and conflict, not unity. It is the dominant paradigm - but it is slipping away slowly. And a carefully orchestrated disclosure of the 'facts' of the UFO and ET subject could secure their power. This is the disclosure which is to be dreaded. This is the disclosure to watch out for. This is the disclosure which is already occurring. My meetings over the past 9 years with covert operatives who have worked on UFO related programs have introduced me to some characters right out of a spy novel - and then some. Whether in private high tech industry, at the Pentagon or at a midnight meeting in a private mansion, a theme has emerged. It is one of immense, though currently hidden, power. It transcends government as we know it (at this point the government of 'We the people...' has been made irrelevant on this issue). And the theme has two main strands - the eventual covert militarization of the ET subject and a weird covert religious strain which can only be viewed as bizarre. Here, we find some very strange bed-fellows indeed. War mongers and militarists in cahoots with industrialists who share a certain bizarre eschatological bent: A dark view of the future, featuring an extraterrestrial Armageddon - or at least the threat of it. Such a theme supports retrograde and fanatical religious causes as well as deeply covert military-industrial plans to expand the arms race into space. In fact, the big players in the so-called 'civilian UFO community' are tied into such beliefs and agendas. It strains credulity, I admit, but here is what we have found by penetrating these operations. From a military-industrial perspective, the disclosure of choice is one which frames the UFO/ET issue in a threatening manner. If a threat from space can be established ( as President Reagan liked to say) then the entire world can be united around the need to fight such a threat. This would ensure trillion dollar plus military - industrial spending well into the next century, and beyond. If you think the cold war was costly, wait until you see the price tag for this ' protection' from the 'threats' in space: The trillions spent on the cold war will look like a blue light special. Retrograde and fanatical religious groups, similarly, have great vested interests in fulfilling the promise of Armageddon. An eschatological paradigm, well enshrined in the belief systems of those running covert UFO projects, is supported by the portrayal of a cosmic conflict in the heavens. Voila! We have the necessity of spinning the UFO/ET issue in the evil invading aliens (translates in religious terms as demons) direction. Indeed, this has already been accomplished , courtesy of the 'civilian UFO community' and the tabloid media (which at this point is virtually all media...). Additionally, there is a subtext which can only be viewed as thinly veiled racism. You will note that part of the 'new myth' regarding UFOs involves the 'good ET s' , which invariably are described as 'Pleidians' who are 'handsome' white, blue-eyed Aryan appearing types. Naturally, those 'evil, bad ET s' are darker, shorter, look funny and smell funny. Please. Such clap-trap would have us trade age-old human racism for an extraterrestrial variety. This nonsense and propaganda could only make Hitler proud. In one lengthy meeting with a multi-billionaire, I was told that he gave great support to UFO activities which propel the so-called 'alien abduction' subject into public awareness because he wanted humanity to unite around fighting this 'alien threat'. Later, this very influential figure informed me that he believed these demonic ET s were the cause of every set back in human history since Adam and Eve. Sound familiar? Military interests, which are heavily involved in covert projects which hoax ET events, such as human military- related abductions, have a shared goal of demonizing the UFO/ET phenomenon. Doing so lays the foundations for the fear and dread necessary for an organized opposition to all things ET. And this subserves the long - term need to provide a rationale for an expanding global military even should world peace emerge. In fact, under this scenario, 'world peace', or strictly speaking peace on earth, could be secured by the world uniting, eventually, against the 'threat from space' referred to by President Reagan. (By the way, personally I believe Reagan was the victim of disinformation specialists who surrounded him and who manipulated him into the statements he made on this subject.) Under this scenario, currently being gamed and 'disclosed' courtesy of the trial - balloon UFO 'community', we would get peace on earth - in exchange for inter-planetary conflict. One step forward, ten steps back. Wonderful. Such a false and contrived 'disclosure of the truth' regarding UFOs and ET s would, then, subserve agendas held by powerful covert interests in both the military - industrial sector and those of a strange collection of religious fanatics, who pine for Armageddon - and the sooner the better. Lest the reader think such a strange amalgam of militarists and cult-like religious interests are unlikely, remember the weird views of the Third Reich. Or more recently, the views of one US Department of the Interior cabinet secretary during the Reagan years named James Watts. It was he who, not knowing a microphone was still on and recording his comments, stated in the 1980s that we did not need to worry about all these environmental problems since Armageddon was coming soon and the world would be destroyed anyway...This bizarre view, held by a man who shaped and applied policy for the Interior Department of the US Government, was later reported in the general media. At the time a comical footnote perhaps. But what does it say about the degree to which such beliefs may be shaping covert UFO policy - and specifically disclosure plans? We have found that such views - bizarre as they may seem to most - are heavily represented in covert policy development on the UFO subject. And most disconcerting of all: This strange mixture of military cosmic saber - rattling and bizarre religious beliefs are the dominant forces shaping both the 'civilian UFO community' and the planned eventual 'spin' on UFO disclosure. Let the buyer beware. To the rational and intellectual, such views seem ridiculous. Why, you might ask, would anyone want a cosmic war in space, an Armageddon and the destruction of the earth? To comprehend this, you have to get inside the head of people who hold such beliefs - people like James Watts. In his case, why worry about a little bit of deforestation, air pollution and areas of dead oceans if the entire world is going to be destroyed in a couple of years anyway? But the thinking goes further than this. Because such fanatical thinking has within it the concept that as a result of the Armageddon we will see the return of Christ- and with it the good people's salvation. Now, people are free to believe what they want. But what we have found is a deliberate influencing of covert policy on UFOs by such beliefs. Some of these people want Armageddon - and they want it ASAP. Strictly speaking, the militarists and war-mongers, itching to 'kick some alien butt' as it was said in the movie Independence Day, may actually only want a pretext to justify their existence and get the world to eventually spend huge sums of money on a perceived (if contrived) threat from space. But in some cases - high up on the food chain of the covert entity running UFO secrecy - the two views meet. A place where militarism and eschatology merge. Where Star Wars and Armageddon join. In tracing the history of both the UFO civilian community and the covert policy-making group concerned with UFOs, we have found a growing penetration of the latter into the former. So much so that at this point there are projects which ostensibly are innocent civilian initiatives but which in reality are totally controlled and financed by 'cut-outs' from ultra-secret projects. Moreover, our careful penetration of such projects yielded the disturbing finding that deep-cover black project operatives are working closely with alleged civilian researchers, journalists and UFO glitterati. CIA and military intelligence operatives are working with civilian 'think tank' heads, alongside very wealthy business people who are eschatologists, and being advised by 'civilian' technologists and scientists - who are themselves proponents of bizarre religious belief systems involving the end of the world and ET s.... Thus, the new 'chosen ones' have been assembled. They are planning your disclosure on the UFO/ET subject. They are owned by the money whores and power brokers doing the bidding of the secret entity which runs UFO projects to begin with. And it all looks like a civilian initiative. So innocent. So well-intended. So 'scientific'. And by the way, the sky is falling courtesy of ET and we need your money and your souls to defend against it. Do not be deceived. You need to be awake to the darker scenarios which some would like to thrust upon the world. And you need to know that there are alternatives. If a 'disclosure' is unleashed on the world which is xenophobic, militaristic and terrifying, know that it comes from the spinmeisters of secrecy - regardless of how respectable the person or group may appear to be. And remember: Part of this disclosure plan involves the use of UFO look-alike devices made by humans in an attack on earth or military assets of earth. This would be a well-orchestrated use of advanced human technologies to hoax an ET attack - all for the purpose of disclosing the truth with the desired military-oriented spin. In such a scenario, most of humanity will be deceived into believing the threat from space has arrived - and that we must fight it at all costs. This is nothing more than long-term social security for the military-industrial complex. There must be people who can expose this fraud.<hr></blockquote><a href="http://www.raven1.net/greer1.htm">www.raven1.net/greer1.htm</a>

by **slimmouse** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 7:55 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>Yet, here is Stephen Greer warning of the very influences within UFO research that I was accusing him of being part of. Go figure. Does this mean he's clean? No. I don't know what it means, actually, but here's the relevant portion. For what it's worth, I don't trust Greer, but this is a pretty accurate summation about my view of what's going on. And for the record, I think his claims he's met with Clinton's people and high level CIA folks are bull shit...unless he's getting his paycheck from them or something.<hr></blockquote> Glad we got that all cleared up.

by **Dreams End** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 8:26 pm

Interesting. Just barely getting into this and all kinds of familiar things start popping up. Danny Sheehan is counsel for Disclosure Project. He also represented John Mack. He also is with the Gorbachev State of the World Forum Out of this work comes his "New paradigm Institute." I'll be damned if I can figure out what that's about. It may have grown out of the John Mack Institute. Not sure. Here's their link: <a href="http://www.newparadigminstitute.org/index.html">www.newparadigminstitute.org/index.html</a> He also is on the board of one of the other sponsors of this, the Institute for Co-operation in Space (ICIS). Sheehan worked on the Kucinich campaign. He also has some relationship to the Natural Law Party (i.e. Transcendental Mediatation. In the speech I quote below he talks about harvesting potential TM votes for Kucinich (there's a landslide in the making, huh?) and says "we must get Kucinich to run (for Democratic party, not TM which no longer runs candidates). Curioser and curioser. He shares that board with the other person who "independently" confirmed Sheehan's story of a UFO investigation program under Jimmy Carter: Alfred Lambremont Webre. Webre is also the founder of the third organization on the list, the exopolitics symposium. Oh yeah, and he used to work for Stanford Research Institute as a "futurist". (Is it just me or are others beginning to think that the job title "futurist" just means spook?) The president of ICIS is Carol Rosin...the spokesperson for Werner von Braun mentioned above. Here's a speech by Sheehan <blockquote>Quote:<hr> Now, this is in fact the call that goes out. This is the sixth paradigm. This is the natural law paradigm of quantum reality. This is the task that were getting set to undertake at Harvard University now as a continued process of the Gorbachev Foundation Strategic Initiative to Identify the New Post-Cold War Paradigm. This is what we are going to be doing in Boston, at Harvard, over the next year and a half. And were going to be identifying the principles and the policies in a concrete program that flows from this to put it into the field. And this is why were hoping that, in addition to the candidacy of George W. Bush and the candidacy of John Kerry, that we can convince Dennis Kucinich to actually run for the Democratic nomination for the Presidency. Because Dennis Kucinich is a man who understands the natural law principles. He understands these gifts that we are talking about. And if we can do that, if we can articulate a full platform out of the institute at Boston, the principles and policies and programs, make these available to everybody in the country to all candidates on every issue from agriculture all the way to welfare, and the defense program, and alternative energy sources. For example, the alternative energy source of understanding the quantum field, and possibly drawing zero-point energy out of the quantum to replace petroleum, would not require us to be in the Middle East and try to bomb and kill people, to lay claim to the petroleum resources. These are ideas that are up out of the traditional box. This is a new world-view. This is a new paradigm to bring to this octave of paradigm world views. This is what we are going to be doing, and were going to be providing these to people, asking people to run for political office. Do not stand by and allow simply the conservative or liberal or moderate options to be put to the people. Stand up and offer yourself for candidacies. When you get these new principles and policies and programs, be tough and look at these. What does the alternative budget look like? How much is this going to cost? What is the defense policy going to look like? It is time for our generation to stand up, to get over the most protracted adolescence in the entire history of the human family, and stop thinking that all we have to do is protest what our parents generation wants to do. You know, we have to get over this. We have to think in the affirmative. We have to think positively about what it is that were going to do: what type of military policy are we going to have, what type of defense strategy are we going to have, what type of energy policy, what type of agricultural policy, what type of health policies are we going to have. These are going to flow from the new paradigm, and theyre going to be answered. And other candidates have to step out. And I want to tell you: the fact of the matter is that on every single ballot in every single voting booth in our country, theres a ballot slot for the Natural Law Party. And it turns out that the Natural Law Party that got these on the ballot, the TM group thats all out of Iowa, are no longer going to be offering candidates. It turns out that the Maharishi Mahesh Yogi has told them that was all just a sidda, and theyve learned all their lessons and theyre no longer going to be running. John Hagelin isnt going to run; nobodys going to be running. Theyre not going to be offering the candidates. So Ive been meeting with the executive committee of the Natural Law Party and negotiating with them so that, if people come forward and say, Look at this platform. Look at this new mandate for leadership of the new paradigm politics, all of its policies. I want to stand for this, and I want to be the Natural Law Party candidate. And we can make that happen. We can make that happen all across the country, in every Congressional seat that we run for, every Senate seat that we run for, in every single town council and school board that we can run for, on the basis of the new paradigm politics. And if Dennis Kucinich will choose to run, he can run for the Presidency on the Democratic Party ticket and still adopt all of these policies. He doesnt have to become a member of anything but the Democratic Party, but he can in fact become the progressive voice, the chair of the Progressive Caucus in the House of Representative, the man who in fact organized 133 votes against the war resolution of George W. Bush, when they expected 15 votes in the House of Representatives against that resolution. And he led the floor fight and got 133 votes. In fact, a majority of Democrats in the House of Representatives voted against the war resolution. Unlike Gephardt, unlike John Kerry, they voted against it. In fact, it was Dennis Kucinich that controlled the majority of the Democratic Party in the House of Representatives, which led directly to Gephardt resigning, because he had plighted his troth with being able to pull those votes in support of his position on the war resolution so he could be President. And they would not follow him. They followed Dennis Kucinich, because this was the right thing to do. And Dennis and even the supporters of the war resolution said that it was the most intelligent, the most responsible debate they had ever participated in in their entire experience in the Congress. That is Dennis Kucinich, and what I am saying is we need to draft Dennis Kucinich to run for the Presidency for the Democratic primary. And we need to raise up the independent candidates to support this new platform. That Im going to be going from here to Boston, to the new office, the Institute for the Study for Alternative World-Views, which is going to have a project called the New Paradigm Project. And in that were going to elucidate the principles and policies and programs of this new paradigm. Were going to make it available for you all to run for independent office on the Natural Law platform, if you want to, and we need to you need to understand that all we need to secure is seven seats in the House of Representatives. And it is the balance of power in the Congress: seven seats out of the 435 seats across the country. That is the balance of power in the House of Representatives. <hr></blockquote> Not sure where all this leads. I checked out one magazine that Greer said he had an article in called World Affairs. <a href="http://www.worldaffairsjournal.com/">www.worldaffairsjournal.com/</a> I recognized a few names of writers or people on the board. Gorbachev is an easy one to spot. Alain de Benoit, a French writer who promotes a "third way" sort of "new rightism" writes for them. Then there was an ecologist who also promoted an economic "third way." Several defense related people on that site. George Soros. Catherine Austin Fitts is there. Might be worth looking at their author pages and board pages for those who have knowledge in these areas. I bring it up because of the "third way" or "third position" theme that bubbles beneath the surface of the "new paradigm" and this World affairs journal, but I haven't read either closely enough. Just a line of enquiry to pursue. Also, larouche refers to the Kapur foundation and JC Kapur who publishes the magazine several times. Kapur has appeared on Larouche's radio show and Kapur was one of the conveners of "World Public Forum DIaloge of Civilizations" which I know little about except that a write up about it right on the website was by Hilda Zepp-Larouche. <a href="http://www.wpfdc.com/eng/news.php?tab_id=1&p=1&b=6&id=132">www.wpfdc.com/eng/news.ph...b=6&id=132</a> Since Sheehan was rumored to be working with larouchians on the La Penca bombing, Iran-contra case, I thought it might be interesting.

by **Qutb** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 9:00 pm

To make the circle complete: It bears repeating that Sheehan's old colleague at the Christic Institute, Jim Garrisson (no realations to the JFK guy), who has also worked with George Shultz, and who is a central figure in the Gorbachev Foundation's State of the World Forum, has also been involved in "9/11 Truth". He co-hosted a "9/11 Truth Convergence Conference" last year (his co-host Byron Belitsos is involved in the bizarre Urantia cult, which was founded by a Skull & Bones member). Controlled demolition snake oil salesman Jim Hoffman attended.

by **Dreams End** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 10:25 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>his co-host Byron Belitsos is involved in the bizarre Urantia cult, which was founded by a Skull & Bones member<hr></blockquote> Get outta here! I tried to get some kind of handle on Urantia the other day. I couldn't really get a sense of what it was teaching...guess you have to get the book which, if I remember, is rather thick. I have no idea what sent me looking for information on Urantia but I may go another round and see what turns up.

by **anotherdrew** » Sun Nov 27, 2005 7:22 am

urantia is basically the bible re-conceptualized to be "cosmic". It's got some nice aspects... kind of good, mostly bad in that it seems to me to lead to another "limiting control form" in the end. It's sure a fully crafted thing though, and those who made it must have put a lot of time in it. One fear would be that it is basically a beta version of the next "official dogma" in the "post-2012/post-transition" world. As for Greer and the Disclosure project: I think it's significant that he's got so many credible witnesses stating their experiences openly. These are each people that if they said: "I say an old WW-I bi-plane with the red baron in it land and talk to me and take off" we would think, "well, I guess there was some dude with an old airplane flying around that day," but since they say they saw a UFO, we no longer take them at their word. If there aren't mechanical UFO type craft, then these people MUST be being paid to lie. I don't think one answer fits all the data, some experiences are surely "metaphysical/extra-dimensional/spiritual" in nature, but it seems also that some are surely "real" physical craft piloted by an intelligence. This is an area that makes ufo-researchers uncomfortable, because it implies that the hidden reality is so spectacularly at odds with accepted reality that 'disclosure' would indeed risk human civilizational breakdown. If that were the real case, what crusader wouldn't back off and go along? If exposing the truth could only lead to doom? This is what I call “the worst case scenario.” god help us if true, but it's just possible that Roswell or some such event, gave us a scout ship, piloted by a slave race, and they warned us that their masters would be passing trough our neighborhood of the galaxy soon. The masters love to en-slave and/or eat human type animals, in fact, they may have seeded us on this planet. Now all these decades, the government has been working their assess off in total secrecy to reverse engineer and build us a defense capability. If they just came out and told the truth, would civilization have been able to continue, and build a defense fleet? Trillions are missing from all accounting in decades of defense budgets, not to mention off the books funding from the drug trade, etc. It's just possible that everything since the early fifties has been a lie, designed to hide the reality of impending doom, that at best we only have a small hope of being able to defeat. It's “worst-case” because not only is it “bad news” it shows us all to be wrong about “the government” Anyway, that's all just one possible scenario, who knows what, if anything, is the truth. This just goes to show how protean and malleable this mythology is I suppose.

by **Dreams End** » Sun Nov 27, 2005 12:36 pm

Don't get me wrong...there are many unexplained UFO sightings. However, from what I've seen, the testimony is more of the "I saw something flying around" variety and very little, "I worked on a government program to reverse engineer a UFO and here are some pictures and a little gizmo I swiped from the dashboard" type. His big press conference in '01 was disappointing and he hasn't put out enough in my view to warrant Presidents and other big wigs to ask for personal briefings. Who knows anything about TM? Does it have intel connections?

by **starroute** » Sun Nov 27, 2005 1:23 pm

General Stubblebine's name caught my eye up there in the Greer interview, because he's the fellow who shows up early on in "The Men Who Stare at Goats," wondering why he doesn't have the strength of will to walk through walls. A quick google on stubblebine+ufos turns up many links. #1 is <a href="http://www.think-aboutit.com/ufo/aviary_the_aquarium.htm">www.think-aboutit.com/ufo...uarium.htm</a> -- which seems to be highly relevant to the current discussion on UFOs and eschatology. (As well as dealing with the Aviary, which also popped up in a thread here a few days ago.) It's long, and I don't have time to read through it completely at the moment, but here's an intriguing quote: <blockquote>Quote:<hr>So there you have it... UFOs plus psychic adepts equals End of the World. Of course, one could dismiss Dames as a bunko artist selling his $6,000-$8,000 a week services to an affluent but gullible clientele. But before dismissing Dames' claims, readers should be aware of a few other pertinent facts. On the Psi-Tech board of directors are two fairly high-level players; General Albert Stubblebine (US Army Intelligence, ret.), and Colonel John Alexander (ret.) both formerly of the US Army's Intelligence and Security Command (INSCOM). . . . Stubblebine, former commander of INSCOM, gave a presentation at the International Symposium on UFO Research (sponsored by the International Association for New Science, Denver CO, May 22-25, 1992) on the subject of "Remote Viewing as a Research Tool." . . . On the subject of RVing UFOs, Stubblebine said: "As far as UFOs are concerned, they can be accessed, they can be tracked, we have looked at the propulsion system for them, that's not a hard job, you can track them back to where they come from, whether they come from a place here on this planet or whether they come from a place on another planet, they are trackable and you can take a look inside as well as outside, so again, it is a tool that is available to be used for the UFO research and I guess, I guess that's the reason that I am standing on this platform in spite of my misgivings and feeling a little bit nervous like a tree in a Lassie movie." Stubblebine also claimed that his remote viewing of the planet Mars had revealed structures and machines operating both on and below the Martian surface. . . . Surprisingly, Army Intelligence RV operations has become married, literally, with some prominent figures in UFO abductions research. Albert Stubblebine is now married to Dr. Rima Laibow, whose scholarly paper on the abduction phenomenon was the first (as far as I know) to address the issue in the mental-health community. John Alexander is now married to the former Victoria Lacas, Dr. Laibow's close associate. This list of strange bedfellows gets even stranger when you add the name of CSETI founder and head honcho, Steven Greer, M.D., into the mix. As it turns out, Greer, whose modus operandi incorporates shining blinking lights and laser beams at UFOs in the hopes of establishing communications with the ufonauts, was trained in remote viewing by Ed Dames. In fact, it was Dr. Greer who introduced Stubblebine at the Denver symposium.<hr></blockquote>

Former Cdn. Def. Minister asks for hearings on alien contact

Former Cdn. Def. Minister asks for hearings on alien contact

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