Kiev Regime Discredits Itself for All Time

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Kiev Regime Discredits Itself for All Time

Postby JackRiddler » Wed May 30, 2018 3:07 pm

.

This one should be a stickie. If I have time, I'll add more Ukrainian propaganda shit, and of course stuff on the huge Ukrainian angle to "Russiagate."


https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/ ... till-alive

www.theguardian.com

Ukraine reveals it staged 'murder' of Russian journalist Arkady Babchenko | World news

A Russian journalist who was reported to have been shot dead in Kiev has turned up alive at a news conference in Ukraine.


Arkady Babchenko emerged at a police press conference on Wednesday afternoon in front of journalists who had been expecting updates on the investigation into his murder.

Vasily Gritsak, the head of the Ukrainian security service, told reporters the agency had faked Babchenko’s death to catch people who were trying to kill him.

On Tuesday, Ukrainian police had said Babchenko, a Kremlin critic and veteran Russian war correspondent, was shot three times in the back as he left his apartment to buy bread. A government official told the media that Babchenko, 41, died in the ambulance on the way to the hospital.

But on Wednesday, officials said Babchenko had staged his death in coordination with Ukrainian police as part of an investigation into threats made against his life. The plan had been in place for more than a month, they said.

Police said they had made one arrest in connection with the operation.

Speaking to journalists, Babchenko apologised, saying: “I have been forced to bury my friends and colleagues many times and I know the sickening feeling.”

Apparently he had not even told his closest family members about the plan.

“Special apologies to my wife, Olechka – there was no other option,” Babchenko said to a room of visibly stunned journalists. “The operation was under preparation for two months.”

It was not immediately clear how Babchenko faking his death led to the apprehension of the suspect.

The general prosecutor, Yuriy Lutsenko, who appeared alongside Babchenko, said it had been necessary to fake the journalist’s death so the organisers of the plot to kill him would believe they had succeeded.

According to Gritsak, Russian authorities had recruited a former fighter in east Ukraine by offering him $30,000 (£23,000) for the killing.

Wearing a black hoodie and shuffling slightly as he spoke, Babchenko concluded: “I’ve done my work. I’m still alive for the moment.”

Friends had begun planning vigils and fundraising for Babchenko’s adopted children before he emerged alive with a sheepish grin on Wednesday. Fellow reporters had begun investigating his death independently of the government.

A journalist asked about the inquiry into the murder of Pavel Sheremet, an investigative journalist killed in a car bombing in 2016. Journalists have accused Ukraine’s SBU intelligence service of stymieing the investigation. “Please, we have a different topic today,” the government official responded.

The Russian foreign ministry said on Wednesday it was happy Babchenko had turned out to be alive, but said Ukraine had used his story as propaganda. Maria Zakharova, the foreign ministry spokeswoman, said the story was imbued with “propagandistic effect”.

Other Russian officials denounced the staged murder. “It’s a hoax, as well as a provocation, with accusations against Russia of a feigned murder,” Alexey Pushkov, a prominent Russian lawmaker, wrote on Twitter.

A number of observers expressed reservations about the extreme measures taken by Ukrainian officials, and whether they could endanger journalists or hinder investigations in the future. Mark Galeotti, a senior researcher at the Institute of International Relations Prague, wrote online: “Next time there’s some killing, Russia will be able to play the ‘do you know this is real?’ card.”

Some journalists also asked whether police would be required in future to produce a body.

The Committee to Protect Journalists, which had earlier called for an investigation into the killing, demanded on Wednesday that the Ukrainian government explain why it needed to stage Babchenko’s murder.

“We are relieved that Arkady Babchenko is alive. Ukrainian authorities must disclose what necessitated the extreme measure of staging news of the Russian journalist’s murder,” the organisation wrote in a statement.

Babchenko fled Russia in 2017 after receiving threats at home for saying he did not mourn the victims of a Russian military plane crash.

He served in the Russian army during the two wars in Chechnya in the 1990s and became one of Russia’s best-known war reporters.

The murders of a number of journalists and other dissidents in recent years in Kiev remain unsolved.


They should do a reality series about the coming divorce!

Un-fucking-believable. Totally a case of Propaganda Ministry mimicking Hollywood.

.
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Re: Kiev Regime Discredits Itself for All Time

Postby JackRiddler » Wed May 30, 2018 3:35 pm

Babchenko-Alive!.jpeg
Babchenko-Alive!.jpeg (23.59 KiB) Viewed 1396 times


NYT news feed on search term "Babchenko" as of 15:29 EDT on 30 May 2018:

EUROPE

Arkady Babchenko, Russian Journalist, Shot and Killed in Kiev
He fled his homeland last year to escape a campaign of intimidation that he said “was so personal, so scary that I was forced to flee.”

May 29
EUROPE
Russian Says Ukraine Used Journalist for Propaganda
The Russian Foreign ministry said on Wednesday it was happy Russian journalist Arkady Babchenko had turned out to be alive after all, but said Ukraine has used his story as propaganda.

4h ago
EUROPE
The Latest: Ukraine Alleges Russia Paid $40K for Death Plot
The Latest on the reported slaying in Ukraine of a Russian journalist: (all times local):
4h ago

EUROPE
Russia Slams Ukraine's Staging Reporter's Murder as 'Anti-Russian Provocation'
Russia's Foreign Ministry on Wednesday slammed Ukraine's staged murder of Russian journalist Arkady Babchenko was an "anti-Russian provocation."
1h ago

EUROPE
Ukraine President Says Will Protect Russian Journalist After Plot
Ukraine will provide protection to the Russian journalist who was the target of an assassination plot by the Russian security services, President Petro Poroshenko said on Wednesday.
3h ago

EUROPE
UK's Johnson Says He's Appalled by Murder of Another Russian Journalist
Britain's foreign minister Boris Johnson said on Wednesday he was appalled by the murder of "another vocal Russian journalist" and it was vital that those responsible were brought to justice.
9h ago

EUROPE
‘Dead’ Russian Journalist Appears at a News Conference in Ukraine
The death in Kiev of Arkady Babchenko appears to have been staged as part of an elaborate sting operation after a $40,000 contract for his assassination.
2h ago

EUROPE
Correction: Ukraine-Journalist Killed Story
In a story May 29 about a Russian journalist killed in Ukraine, The Associated Press and other media organizations reported, based on fabricated information from Ukrainian authorities, that Arkady Babchenko was shot and killed. Babchenko showed up at a news conference on Wednesday, saying that Ukraine's security services faked his death to thwart a plot on his life.
3h ago

EUROPE
Russia's Spy Service Calls Allegations It Murdered Journalist Nonsense-Ifax
Alexander Bortnikov, head of Russia's Federal Security Service (FSB), said Ukrainian allegations the FSB was behind the killing of a dissident Russian journalist in Kiev were nonsense and a provocation, the Interfax news agency reported on Wednesday.
9h ago

EUROPE
Kremlin Critic Turns Up Alive on TV After Reported Murder
A dissident Russian journalist reported murdered in Kiev on Tuesday dramatically reappeared alive on Wednesday during a briefing by Ukrainian state security about the killing, which they then said they had faked.
1h ago
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Re: Kiev Regime Discredits Itself for All Time

Postby JackRiddler » Wed May 30, 2018 3:37 pm

.

Journey!

The Artist Known as Jeff Wells wrote:"A Russian journalist who was reported to have been shot dead in Kiev has turned up alive at a news conference in Ukraine."

Evidently his message to the world is "Don't stop believin'".
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Re: Kiev Regime Discredits Itself for All Time

Postby Harvey » Wed May 30, 2018 6:46 pm

Israel has shot dead 2 journalists in the last two months and wounded more than a dozen a few critically.



Nothing like the fake and selective outrage generated by a fake shooting and its fake attribution to Russia. Fake journalists roll with the story 'it was a sting operation' they faked enthusiastically in their high pitched whining drone. Unfortunately, many were unable to mask their intense disappointment that their colleague is alive and well. Especially after all their pretty eulogies. Never before in the field of human bullshit have so many been lying their sanguine arses off to so many on behalf of so few.
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Re: Kiev Regime Discredits Itself for All Time

Postby JackRiddler » Wed May 30, 2018 10:50 pm

.

Yeah, but those real-not-fictional shooters were soldiers in uniform with military-issue rifles under orders from a regular chain of command obediently sniping at unarmed civilians standing around wearing flak jackets with PRESS labels in the open in daylight, acting in cold blood and as proudly announced by their superiors beforehand to the world, from a distance of 700-1500 feet and shooting across what the state of Israel calls an international border. So it's okay. Right?

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Re: Kiev Regime Discredits Itself for All Time

Postby JackRiddler » Thu May 31, 2018 11:17 am

To me it appears that by far the most dangerous country for accredited journalists is Mexico. Hundreds of assassinations have occurred during these past years of death squad and gang massacres, and there were many killings before. Seems to be massive impunity. No one can safely report on the drug war or the police.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_j ... _in_Mexico

But I expect the most effective suppression of journalists occurs in China, where reporters don't even achieve that status or get to work for a publication before being arrested just for posting stuff online.
Last edited by JackRiddler on Thu May 31, 2018 2:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Kiev Regime Discredits Itself for All Time

Postby DrEvil » Thu May 31, 2018 12:14 pm

^^China is an "excellent" example of the surveillance and thought police state that people in the west fear is just around the corner. China is already there. They're going all out with tracking people and punishing them for not doing the "right" thing. There's cameras with facial recognition all over the place, police are wearing glasses with facial recognition systems built in and the social credit system is already up and running in some places. All kinds of databases are being connected, so doing something stupid, like getting a parking ticket, will have knock-on effects on all kinds of other things, like not being able to buy a train ticket or using certain services.

The scary part is that it might just work. If they get it fully up and running as intended the end result will be an automated system of self-policing. People who oppose the government will be marginalized, as other people start avoiding them because the system will lower their score just for associating with them, and if the system is tuned just right it will all happen automatically. Dissent will be crushed before it even becomes an issue.

And of course, if it is seen to work it will be very tempting for other countries to start implementing similar systems, starting with the more "benign" functionality, then slowly expanding it, one function at a time. Some US cities already have facial recognition camera systems up and running (thanks, Jeff Bezos), and London is riddled with CCTV cameras.

When they start connecting all the disparate systems you will end up with what you might call an emergent surveillance state. In China it will be in the name of social harmony, in the west it will be in the name of ad revenue, but the results might be very similar.
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Re: Kiev Regime Discredits Itself for All Time

Postby JackRiddler » Thu May 31, 2018 2:35 pm

DrEvil » Thu May 31, 2018 11:14 am wrote:When they start connecting all the disparate systems you will end up with what you might call an emergent surveillance state. In China it will be in the name of social harmony, in the west it will be in the name of ad revenue, but the results might be very similar.


I think in the West it's been underway (not nearly as radical as in China) as a matter of public safety or protection from enemy propaganda.
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Re: Kiev Regime Discredits Itself for All Time

Postby DrEvil » Thu May 31, 2018 3:41 pm

Yeah, definitely. It's years since they started running facial recognition at Super Bowl in the name of security, and I'm sure the AI heads are neck deep in how to combat fake news.

I still remember how surprised I was when I started studying computer science back in '93 and learned that on average every person was registered in over 300 databases. You can probably add a couple of orders of magnitude to that number today, and coupled with recent advances in AI you have the recipe for a fully automated system that knows you better than yourself.

How that system is used will have a big impact on our future. You get everything from the Chinese surveillance dystopia to the more benevolent (so far) plans of my government for push notifications to citizens for benefits they're entitled to (basically, if you have a right to something you should be automatically notified. You shouldn't have to sift through reams of government regulations to figure out if you're entitled to a tax cut or child support).

The problem with any system of this kind is that it's fairly trivial to re-purpose it down the road. Today's nice government can easily become tomorrow's hardliners, and with the upheavals that we know are coming in the not too distant future there will be strong pressure to start adding "functionality". Tracking immigrants and climate refugees, keeping tabs on people who lost their jobs to expanding automation (they might be upset about it), Tracking wasteful behavior if food shortages kick in etc.

It might not even be governments doing it. Corporations could band together to create something that ranks you as a consumer (a credit score on crack). "Good" consumers with "proper" behaviors get discounts and other benefits, bad consumers are barred from certain stores or services or have to pay a premium (can't have homeless people be seen with our product).

Each individual function might not feel so bad, but add them all together and you have a ready-made Stasi, good to go at a moment's notice. You wouldn't even need to keep lists of known subversives anymore, it could be created on the fly, custom made for the issue at hand.

Add in augmented reality and you get something like this:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJg02ivYzSs
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Re: Kiev Regime Discredits Itself for All Time

Postby JackRiddler » Thu May 31, 2018 6:38 pm

Getting back to the Babchenko case...



https://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2018/05 ... t-ifj.html

IFJ Calls Russian Journalist Babchenko Affair 'Intolerable'
By Reuters
May 31, 2018

BRUSSELS — The International Federation of Journalists (IFJ) described on Thursday the staged murder of a Russian dissident journalist who dramatically reappeared alive a day later as "intolerable" and "inadmissible".

Ukrainian authorities had said that Arkady Babchenko, a 41-year-old critic of President Vladimir Putin and of Russian policy in Ukraine and Syria, had been shot dead at his flat on Tuesday. But Babchenko reappeared on Wednesday in the middle of a press briefing about his own murder.

"Arkady Babchenko is still alive and can continue to do his job as a critical journalist: the news is excellent," said Philippe Leruth, the president of the IFJ, in a statement.

"But in falsely spreading the news of his murder, the Ukrainian authorities have gravely harmed the credibility of information, and their brief communication risks being seen as a propaganda operation."

(Reporting by Julia Fioretti, editing by Robin Emmott)
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Re: Kiev Regime Discredits Itself for All Time

Postby JackRiddler » Thu May 31, 2018 6:52 pm

Unfortunately The Sun provides the only material I can find so far on the arrest of the alleged would-be hitman (and it is unclear that it is even alleged). Various pictures at link, including one released of Babchenko's bloody body while he was still dead.

www.thesun.co.uk

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/6420248/k ... eath-plot/

‘Kremlin assassin sent to kill’ journalist Arkady Babchenko arrested after Putin critic came back from the dead

THIS is the moment a suspect accused of ordering the assassination of back from the dead journalist Arkady Babchenko is arrested in the street.

Image
Dramatic footage shows masked Ukrainian cops pin the man against a car bonnet before leading him away in handcuffs.

Ukrainian cops are seen reportedly arresting a man suspected of ordering Babchenko's murder on behalf of the Russian secret service

Babchenko, 41, stunned the world by faking his own assassination.

The Kremlin critic was reported to have been shot dead on Tuesday - and a picture showed him lying in a pool of blood.

But yesterday he emerged alive at a press conference as the Ukrainian secret service admitted to staging his death to fully investigate a Russian plot to kill him.

The arrest video reportedly shows undercover Ukrainian cops detain the man suspected of ordering Babchenko's murder on behalf of the Russian FSB secret service.

Masked cops lead the suspect away in handcuffs during the dramatic arrest in a Kiev street
AFP or licensors

Ukrainian authorities are today investigating claims a hitman was hired by the Russian secret service to murder Babchenko.

They claim an identikit drawing shows a striking similarity between the man who allegedly ordered the murder of the Moscow journalist and "Chechen hitman" Valid Lurakhmanov.

He is reported to have been in Ukraine and using false documents under the name Alexander Smirnov.

Police Chief Andrii Kryschenko refused to confirm whether Lurakhmanov is in custody as the video of an unnamed suspect was released.

He told reporters: "We will verify this information."

Meanwhile, Babchenko has vowed to live until he's 96 after "dancing on Vladimir Putin's grave".

The war reporter said: “They will never get me.

"(I will) die at 96 having danced on Putin’s grave."

The world thought Putin-critic Arkady Babchenko had been assassinated by Russian hitmen. The ruse was so secret not even his wife Olechka was in on it
Central European News

The world was shocked when Babchenko showed up to a press conference on Wednesday smiling
AFP or licensors

Babchenko was slammed by worried pals for duping them into the fake death plot.

In a Facebook message a furious friend wrote: "You're a b****** of a rare description, of course you almost gave your granny a heart attack, but f*** I'm glad that you're alive".

But the dissident Russian reporter told British media to go “f*** themselves” over criticism of the stunt.

He said: 'The British media is questioning whether there is really more harm than good that came from what I did? Dear British press, would you please go and f*** yourselves?

'If you want to do something useful however, you can give me a British passport and British protection. Then you will have the right to teach me how I should save myself and my family. F***ing smart-a***s!'


Moscow claims the entire saga was a Kiev plot to embarrass Russia ahead of the World Cup which it hosts next month.

Kremlin supporters are using the stunt to challenge other assassinations, including the poisoning of Sergei and Yulia Skripal and the downing of MH317.

Both attacks have been blamed on Russia.

Moscow experts also warned that Ukraine has used its one and only opportunity to dodge an immediate threat.


Image
Ukrainian authorities claim there is a striking likeness between the e-fit of the man allegedly ordered to murder the Moscow war correspondent and a notorious 'Chechen hitman'
East2west News

Ukrainian authorities claim there is a striking likeness between the e-fit of the man allegedly ordered to murder the Moscow war correspondent and a notorious 'Chechen hitman'

Video showing the colleagues of Russian journalist Arkady Babchenko celebrating after it's announced he is alive
Edward Lucas told BBC Newsnight: “I think the difficulty here is this is a card you can only really play once and I wonder what will happen next time there’s an assassination."

After announcing he was still alive Babchenko apologised to his wife "for the hell she had to go through in the past two days”.

But he claimed there was “no choice” if his would-be assassins from Russian were to be nailed.

He apologised to his grieving wife Olechka, who was not in on the ruse.

The faked assassination was based on a Sherlock Holmes plot, a Ukrainian MP claimed on Wednesday.

Putin-critic Babchenko was on Tuesday reported to have been gunned down in the Ukrainian capital Kiev — apparently the latest of a string of suspected Kremlin hits.

But Babchenko on Wednesday emerged at a press conference to reveal the killing had been staged to flush out a gunman plotting a genuine hit.

The journalist had to keep the ruse from his own family and later apologised
East2west News

She had found him face-down near their home covered in blood from what seemed to be three gunshot wounds to the back. She was later told he died in an ambulance.

MP Anton Gerashchenko, who was in on the ruse, said it was inspired by a Sherlock Holmes story in which the famous detective fakes his death to throw his enemies off his trail. Mr Gerashchenko said: “Sherlock Holmes successfully used the method of faking his own death so he could effectively investigate complex and intricate crimes.

“Even so, it was painful for his relatives and for Dr Watson.”

The were gasps of disbelief as Babchenko emerged at Wednesday’s press conference — just 24 hours after his death had been announced to the world along with grisly pictures of his apparently blood-covered body.

He tearfully said sorry to Olechka, saying: “I want to apologise to my wife for the hell that she has been through.

Babchenko reportedly failed to tell his wife Olga about his faked murder plot
East2west News

Babchenko reportedly failed to tell his wife Olga about his faked murder plot

It was revealed at the press conference that the killing was staged to catch a gunman who was plotting to actually kill Babchenko
Reuters

“Olechka, I am terribly sorry but there were no other options. I have buried many friends and colleagues and I know the sickening feeling.”

Babchenko said he had been working with the SBU after he was told a month ago about an alleged Russian plot to kill him.

He said: “They said that there is an order for you to be killed. They money had been transferred — $40,000 (£30,000).

“They showed my passport details, my documents, my photo, but it was a passport which was issued when I was 25, so it was clear the information had come from the Russian Federation.

“The information could only have come from Russian governmental services.

“I was invited to take part in this special operation. I agreed and for a month we were preparing this special operation.

“And the man was detained. He is already in custody, the crime has been proven and all the evidence is clear.”

Babchenko said he learned the Russian plotters were desperate to have him killed by a hired Ukrainian hitmen before last Saturday’s Champions League Final in Kiev. He said “They were given three weeks to complete the order.

Tributes had been laid to Babchenko on a Moscow pavement
EPA

'Assassinated' journalist Arkady Babchecko reveals death was faked to smoke out 'Russian-hired hitman'

“Then they started to hurry and rush them, apparently fitting to the Champions League final.”

Ukraine intelligence sources said the elaborate sting had been necessary to flush out all those involved in the plot — the hitman, the Ukrainian middleman who hired him and the Russian paymasters.

The country’s SBU security services had got wind of the planned hit and knew the identity of one of the two Ukrainians involved.

But they feared if they simply arrested him the rest of the trail would go cold.

But when news of the fake assassination was broadcast worldwide it triggered a series of messages and contacts between the genuine conspirators that the SBU monitored.

SBU chief Vasyl Hrytsak said they now had evidence that Russian security services had recruited a Ukrainian citizen to source a hitman to take out Babchenko in Kiev. The plot had been initially uncovered when a Ukrainian war veteran was offered the job and alerted the SBU.

Police last night said both the would-be assassin and the middleman were in custody.

The block of apartments where Babchenko was 'killed'
Getty - Contributor

Ukrainian Prosecutor General Yuriy Lutsenko said that investigators will “work to identify the person who ordered this crime which was planned but not carried out, thanks to the SBU.”

He added: “Yesterday, today, even as we speak, inquiries are underway to obtain more information about who ordered this murder.

“According to preliminary data, we have enough facts pointing towards Russia as the party that ordered the murder.”

The fake assassination, said to have occurred as Babchenko returned to his apartment after going out for bread, triggered worldwide anger and revulsion.

Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson tweeted after the news that the journalist 'had been killed'

Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson tweeted: “Appalled to see another vocal Russian journalist, Arkady Babchenko, murdered.

"My thoughts are with his wife and daughter.

“We must defend freedom of speech.

"It is vital that those responsible are now held to account.”

While Ukraine knew Babchenko was still alive they accused Russia's 'totalitarian machine' of murder
AP:Associated Press

Babchenko’s family — unaware of the sting — paid tribute to his courageous anti-Kremlin stance.

The Ukrainian government, knowing he was still alive, accused Russia's “totalitarian machine” of murder.

Russia, blamed for the attempted murder of ex-double agent Sergei Skripal and daughter Yulia in Salisbury in March, again denied any involvement.

After Wednesday’s ruse was revealed the Foreign Office declined to comment.

But one minister said: “It’s quite extraordinary.

Russia again denied any involvement
Alamy Live News

"But there is nothing I wouldn’t believe any more.”

Others warned Russia will use the ruse to brand any future suspicious deaths of Putin enemies as fake news.

One Tory MP said: “I hope this doesn’t backfire.”

Russia’s Foreign Ministry would only say it was “happy” to see Mr Babchenko was still alive.

How caper unfolded
MAY 29: 8.24pm News breaks in Ukraine media of Babchenko’s murder.
9.00pm Ukraine police release a photo drawing of a possible suspect and cops pictured outside Babchenko’s home.
11pm UK media reports death.
MAY 30 10.24am Ukraine PM Volodymyr Groysman blames Russia for the murder.
11am Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson tweets he is appalled.
11.05am Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov rejects Ukrainian allegations that Moscow was behind the killing of Babchenko, calling it part of an anti-Russia campaign.
12.23pm Ukraine Information Policy Ministry calls murder an “onslaught on truth”.
1.02pm Russia offers to help Ukraine track down killers.
1.50pm Council of Europe slams killing as a “serious violation of media freedom”.
15.25pm Babchenko appears alive and well at a press conference.
15.48pm Russia says happy to see him alive.

Babchenko revealed he was inspired to carry out the ruse after watching Sherlock. The Sherlock fake death plot was featured in the TV version of his exploits.

In Season Two’s The Reichenbach Fall episode Sherlock, played by Benedict Cumberbatch appears to leap to his death from a London hospital roof.

He returned unharmed in Season Three.

British Putin critic Bill Browder was on Wednesday arrested in Spain on an international warrant issued by Russia, only to be freed when Interpol told Madrid to ignore it.

GOT a story? Ring The Sun on 0207 782 4104 or WHATSAPP on 07423720250 or email exclusive@the-sun.co.uk.

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Re: Kiev Regime Discredits Itself for All Time

Postby DrEvil » Thu May 31, 2018 7:24 pm

Sorry for all the technobabble. I get carried away.

On topic, this is such a monumentally stupid stunt to pull off. If they knew about the plot then why didn't they just have Babchenko tweet something that would make it look like he was at home, stash him and his wife in a hotel somewhere and then arrest the hitman when he shows up and catch him in the act?

Instead he can now plead innocence, at worst getting nailed for minor issues (compared to attempted murder), and the credibility of Ukrainian authorities is down the drain.
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Re: Kiev Regime Discredits Itself for All Time

Postby JackRiddler » Thu May 31, 2018 8:55 pm

.

We are not them, we aren't there, we don't know what they knew, etc. etc. But we're clever buggers, probably not suffering Dunning-Kruger, and I submit, first, that it's very hard to conceive any scenario that literally compels an enactment of Babchenko's death so as to avoid his actual death as a necessary binary. However, second, it is very easy to predict the international effect that would follow such a stunt, and we have seen it. If I had asked anyone, what if Babchenko shows up alive at a press conference and says it was all a trick to fool the killers? Almost anyone would know the answer: The credibility of those who present the stunt is down the drain. So for now I'm going with a combination of competence in the execution, a love of setting up this stunt, getting those Sherlockian details right-- combined with total incompetence for understanding strategy past one's own very short nose. They had fun doing it? Maybe he even finagled them into it? What is one to think of his reaction to the totally predictable reaction of "British journalists" (and all of the rest of the journalists, real and otherwise?). His answer to this is "Fuck off"? He didn't think of anything better to say, prior to the stunt? It didn't occur to him how it was going to go over? He doesn't care that he can't be taken seriously again by anyone who remembers this? The Ukrainian authorities don't, either? Are they clinking glasses and celebrating a coup well pulled? Now I'm confused!

(Then again, just go to Democratic Underground and you'll see just that: echo chamber of guys admiring what a clever trick was pulled on the evil Uncle Vladimir.)

.
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Re: Kiev Regime Discredits Itself for All Time

Postby DrEvil » Thu May 31, 2018 10:34 pm

I'm very curious to know what they expected to get out of this. Who planned it and what the hell were they thinking?
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Re: Kiev Regime Discredits Itself for All Time

Postby JackRiddler » Thu May 31, 2018 10:42 pm

Negative German coverage? What should Babchenko say to that? Fuck off?

Note second bolded bit: If this is routine practice (!) then why don't they name a specific precedent?

Also, Poroshenko fool enough to actually pose for a photo with the resurrected man.

Because, basically, who cares, right? The current standard for billionaire buffoon presidents is Trump, after all.

Addendum: Actually, this nonsense makes sense. They can do no wrong, and that's it. The modern state has nothing to prove, nothing to show. To say that it does would be to scratch its great but always fragile authority. Things are true because they are said. They do not have to be logical or evidentiary. Credibility is not conditional on its maintenance. It is a matter of identity. It is essential. You believe this is so and that was justified because the speaker is the good guys, divinely blessed. Done. Did I say modern? Sorry, feudal. I meant feudal.


http://www.dw.com/en/arkady-babchenkos- ... a-44022686

Arkady Babchenko's faked death seen as a blow to independent journalism

Journalists in Moscow and Kyiv criticized their colleague Arkady Babchenko for faking his death. They said the stunt has undermined trust in independent journalism and thrown his own credibility into question.

Journalists in Moscow and Kyiv were shocked twice over the last two days. On Tuesday it was reported that Arkady Babchenko, a Russian journalist and a staunch Kremlin critic, had been killed near his apartment in the Ukrainian capital. But then the following day he suddenly appeared safe and sound at a press conference organized by the Ukrainian security services.

Babchenko's colleagues in Russia and Ukraine took his "resurrection" with mixed feelings. Some of his colleagues in Moscow said that faking his death undermined the trust in independent journalism. Faking Babchenko's assassination was part of the operation by Ukrainian security services to seize the real killers.

"All of us who are journalists felt cheated," Irina Borogan, a Moscow-based investigative journalist, told cable broadcaster TV Rain. "All we know is it was faked and that no credibility will be given to Arkady Babchenko anymore."

Political journalist with Kommersant FM radio in Moscow Dmitry Drize pointed out on Thursday that in Russia critics of the Kremlin were "still shocked." People were in the process of expressing their condolences – including Babchenko's opponents – when the news came. "They were fooled, cheated," he said.


Read more - 'Killing' of Babchenko raises a lot of questions

'I will tell him that he is a moron'

Some of their colleagues in Kyiv echoed this sentiment, saying they felt fooled, too. Andrei Palchevsky, who hosts a prime time talkshow on Ukrainian public broadcaster UA: First noted that those involved in the imitation of Babchenko's death had "made fools out of journalists." Calling the operation by the Ukrainian security services "the biggest blow to the government's authority," Palchevsky said the move had undermined the trust in Ukrainian authorities, while handing a win to the Kremlin.

However many of those who knew Babchenko personally cared less about the political side of the stunt, although they criticized the way the secret services had carried out the operation.

Image
Ukrainian President Poroshenko meets with Babchenko(Reuters/Ukrainian Presidential Press Service/M. Lazarenko)

Ukrainian President Poroshenko met with Babchenko soon after the shocking news that he was, in fact, alive

"When I see him again, I'm going to tell him that he's a moron. Seriously!" Moscow photojournalist Pyotr Shelomovsky told DW right after the news of Babchenko's "resurrection" emerged. "Nobody does things this way, you should care for the people who love you. There should have been another way to carry this operation out."

Shelomovsky also said that Babchenko's friends had already collected money for his funeral.

Another Moscow journalist Roman Popkov said he buy into reports that Babchenko's wife had not been aware of the operation. He also added that he didn't feel any resentment, just relief. "The first thought I had was that the man had lived out an elusive dream. He has in fact been to his own funeral and will see his own obituaries. Can you imagine how lucky he is in this sense?" said Popkov, who had written one of the obituaries himself.

Read more - Arkady Babchenko: The man who came back from the dead

Business as usual for security services

Many of those who talked to DW after the revelation about the journalist's faked death noted that faking a murder is a standard trick used by security services. According to Oleg Eltsov, a crime reporter in Kyiv, it was necessary in order for the instigator of the crime to transfer the last tranche of money to the killer, which facilitated the arrest.


"I heard such stories in the 90s when this kind of attempted assassinations of crime bosses were carried out," Moscow opposition politician Dmitry Gudkov told DW. The news that Babchenko is alive had come a few hours before a memorial organized by Gudkov was supposed to start in the center of Moscow. "This all looks like a Hollywood story," Gudkov said. "My wife called me and said that Babchenko is alive. I thought she was trolling me."


Also, on DW... did they really pull this trick on the guy's wife?! He acted this out?

'Killing' of Babchenko: A big show raises lots of questions

It had all the makings of a Hollywood story in Ukraine. Well-known Russian war correspondent Arkady Babchenko was declared dead in Kyiv and then appeared on TV very much alive. Will the incident erode trust in Ukraine?

Ukrainian police protect a memorial to Babchenko, when the public still thought he was dead (Reuters/V. Ogirenko)
There were condolences and tears for nearly 24 hours. Politicians from around the world commented on the tragedy. Journalists have been working non-stop. Then it turns out that there was no assassination after all.

Instead, it was a special operation conducted by Ukraine's security services that has left more questions than answers.

Was it necessary for Ukraine's security services to fake the death of Russian journalist Arkady Babchenko in order to foil a genuine assassination attempt?

Solving a crime does not require such a performance. Perhaps, Kyiv wanted a wider audience for what was planned and felt a staged assassination could ensure the international publicity it wanted. Kyiv can use the case to blame Russia for organizing Babchenko's murder, but, on the other hand, the Kremlin now is accusing Kyiv of manipulating the international community with a fake story.

Can the Ukrainian authorities be trusted?

How will the world react now if a tragedy in Ukraine really happens? Wait a day or two just in case? Kyiv is driving itself into a blind corner if it does not present solid evidence in the future. Even if there is comprehensive support for allegations against the alleged organizer of the planned crime on behalf of Russia, Ukraine runs the risk of losing whatever trust and credibility it has.



Could Babchenko's wife had been kept in the dark?

As stated at a press conference after the special operation, Babchenko'sfamily was not informed of the plan. The journalist apologized in a live broadcast to his wife: "Special apologies to my wife, Olechka, there was no other option." Earlier it was reported in a police statement that his wife has found Arkady wounded and called the police and an ambulance. This is a contradiction that needs to be clarified.

How did Ukraine's security services manage to reach an agreement with the perpetrator of the crime?

The man who allegedly killed a journalist collaborated with Ukraine's security services. According to Ukrainian Prosecutor General Yuriy Lutsenko, after Ukraine's security services found out about the assassination plans, they managed to achieve cooperation with the perpetrator. But so far there have been no more additional details. That's not enough information to get the full picture of what really happened.
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