rigorousintuition.ca

Posted: **Sat Dec 12, 2015 12:42 pm**

divideandconquer » Sat Dec 12, 2015 9:43 am wrote:By now shouldn't we know what's going on? Get the big picture and let it go. The details do not matter because we'll never solve it.

That kind "LOL GUYS GIVE UP C'MON" shit is baffling here.

Why are you here?

Posted: **Sat Dec 12, 2015 2:09 pm**

Obtaining evidence from news media is only one avenue; there are others (interacting with witnesses first-hand is one)

Posted: **Sat Dec 12, 2015 7:10 pm**

Wombaticus Rex » Sat Dec 12, 2015 12:42 pm wrote:
divideandconquer » Sat Dec 12, 2015 9:43 am wrote:By now shouldn't we know what's going on? Get the big picture and let it go. The details do not matter because we'll never solve it.
That kind "LOL GUYS GIVE UP C'MON" shit is baffling here.
Why are you here?

I guess I'm playing a little bit devil's advocate here. I ask myself these questions so I thought why not post my opinion/questions to the intelligent people at RI. See if someone smarter than me can find any value in playing Sherlock Holmes each and every time one of these egregious episodes takes over the media. Luther did exactly that when he said:

One positive potential here is that the effects might one day have an aggregate, cumulative outcome. That's an aspiration. Who knows what biscuit crumb from this event might connect to something like the Jejune Institute or some future event. I have confidence this would be the place to uncover that.

Posted: **Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:39 am**

It seems to me that these things are happening more and more often. And that the real perps are getting sloppy. It's like the sophomore album from a band or a successful TV show when the creators start to get a little bored.

This one had a lot of loose ends. People noticed. People who aren't at all in the "conspiracy community" (a term I hate but it's useful so you know what I'm talking about).

Maybe the next one will be even more clearly a Psyop.

Then again these things seem to be used to distract us from big and real news events, like in this case "the USA and its allies are supporting ISIS and even allowing them to get in the oil business".

And the day before the Paris shooting it came out (eerily similar to 9/11) that the pentagon couldn't account for over 6 Trillion dollars. Down the memory hole.

Posted: **Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:46 am**

But Nordic, from a psyop/demoralization perspective, the loose ends could be there intentionally.

I'd buy the idea that the real perps are disorganized, though (working against each other in some cases, I'm sure)

Posted: **Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:48 am**

tapitsbo » Sat Dec 12, 2015 11:46 pm wrote:But Nordic, from a psyop/demoralization perspective, the loose ends could be there intentionally.

I'd buy the idea that the real perps are disorganized, though (working against each other in some cases, I'm sure)

Well yeah, and I thought of that, but I'm getting the feeling that they know the media is totally in the bag for them and will support them 100% so getting sloppy is ok now.

Of course I could be wrong.

Posted: **Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:49 am**

Nordic wrote:People noticed. People who aren't at all in the "conspiracy community"

I certainly am not seeing that; to me it seems as if Americans have swallowed this whole.

I tried to tell Prof. Peabody about it, but he dismissed it, reminding me that "oh, initial reports are always wrong," "it's all about ratings" etc etc.

Posted: **Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:52 am**

I wonder what work "they" are doing with their tools to meta-analyze all the social media signalling about these events.

In this thread even I get the distinct impression that "noticing" what's really off-putting about the rough edges and unsettling details of this sort of event is THREATENING - and of course it would be, I don't blame people for feeling threatened and wanting to stop trying to understand what's going on.

Of course, at the same time, this fear pushes people to certain ideas and choices in other areas of their life.

Posted: **Sun Dec 13, 2015 4:34 am**

Nordic » 13 Dec 2015 04:39 wrote:It seems to me that these things are happening more and more often. And that the real perps are getting sloppy. It's like the sophomore album from a band or a successful TV show when the creators start to get a little bored.

This one had a lot of loose ends. People noticed. People who aren't at all in the "conspiracy community" (a term I hate but it's useful so you know what I'm talking about).

Who noticed?

Posted: **Sun Dec 13, 2015 4:52 am**

stickdog99 » Sun Dec 13, 2015 3:34 am wrote:
Nordic » 13 Dec 2015 04:39 wrote:It seems to me that these things are happening more and more often. And that the real perps are getting sloppy. It's like the sophomore album from a band or a successful TV show when the creators start to get a little bored.

This one had a lot of loose ends. People noticed. People who aren't at all in the "conspiracy community" (a term I hate but it's useful so you know what I'm talking about).
Who noticed?

People I know, at work and on Facebook. When I work these days I'm really surprised how many people he come around. But then again we're not exactly a cross section of America, perhaps because we're all in the business of creating media that people swallow. But I noticed several people on FB sharing the eyewitness story about the three male shooters and asking basically "wtf" and talking about how things were just weird and not adding up.

Posted: **Sun Dec 13, 2015 4:52 am**

Wombaticus Rex » 12 Dec 2015 08:42 wrote:
divideandconquer » Sat Dec 12, 2015 9:43 am wrote:By now shouldn't we know what's going on? Get the big picture and let it go. The details do not matter because we'll never solve it.
That kind "LOL GUYS GIVE UP C'MON" shit is baffling here.

Why are you here?

I got burned in the whole 9/11 truth BS. Then Sandy Hook and that bottomless pit of conjecture just sealed it for me.

Obviously the media narrative is entirely fake, but it's impossible to ever know what the real truth is. It will drive you crazy trying. It's like that Keel/Leek character in Mothman Prophecies:

Leek: In the end it all came down to just one simple question. Which was more important - having proof, or being alive? Trust me. I turned away years ago, and I've never looked back.
Klein: Didn't you need to know?
Leek: We're not allowed to know.

Why am I here? Why do I keep coming back? I just want some confirmation that other people are experiencing the same acid trip I am.

Posted: **Sun Dec 13, 2015 6:27 am**

FWIW. ABC video at link.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/fbi-concludes- ... d=35729211

FBI Concludes Search of San Bernardino Lake; Items Recovered

By KAYNA WHITWORTH
Josh Margolin
EMILY SHAPIRO
JULIA JACOBO
DAVID CHIU

Dec 12, 2015, 10:39 PM ET

The FBI has concluded it search of a San Bernardino lake after agents -- who have spent days searching for clues to last week’s mass shooting -- recovered a number of items.

The FBI would not say what items were found or if they were related to the terror investigation. Authorities say Syed Farook and Tashfeen Malik may have gone to Seccombe Lake Park -- 2.5 miles from the site of the shooting -- after the Dec. 2 massacre and before the police shootout that left them dead.

The FBI believes the couple may have gone to the lake to dump evidence after the shooting, officials said.

The FBI told ABC News they can go back to the lake if they need to, but have no plans to do so at this time.

The search comes after the FBI received information that the couple spent time at the lake, according to a senior official with knowledge of the investigation. The dive teams were looking to see if they left or stored anything there, the senior official said.

The FBI would not discuss specific evidence, but officials said Thursday investigators were seeking "anything that had to do" with the shooting.

Federal authorities are looking for Farook's hard drive, which is a key focus of the investigation, according to a senior law enforcement official.

Meanwhile, the San Bernardino Division of Environmental Health Services will reopen Monday for the first time since the massacre at the Inland Regional Center, the department said Friday.

The division's employees will remain on leave and temporary staff will take over duties, the department said, adding that the Dec. 2 tragedy "deeply affected the other employees."

Farook and Malik stormed the Inland Regional Center during a Department of Public Health training session and holiday party last week. Nearly all of those who were killed or injured worked for the county.

208 Comments

Posted: **Sun Dec 13, 2015 1:35 pm**

tapitsbo » Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:46 am wrote:But Nordic, from a psyop/demoralization perspective, the loose ends could be there intentionally.

I'd buy the idea that the real perps are disorganized, though (working against each other in some cases, I'm sure)

As I've said many times before, I believe the real perps are very competently incompetent for all of the reasons I stated before. It's all a part of the psychological warfare that is clearly working. In other words, they know what they're doing.

Here's just on example of too many to count. A couple of days ago, after the San Bernadino shooting, I was at the library when this woman, who appeared and sounded like she might've been from India--probably a Sikh, not even Muslim--stood at the circulation desk and argued with one of the staff over when she returned a book (happens all of the time). After she left, the next woman standing in line walked up and told this staff member that she was sure she was going to pull out a gun and start shooting, that maybe the staff shouldn't argue with these people. About a half hour later, a white woman asked if the library had a copy of the Quran. She insisted that she wasn't a terrorist but just wanted to see what it said. She even declined to check it out because she didn't want to alert whoever was watching.

Posted: **Sun Dec 13, 2015 1:53 pm**

Nordic » Sun Dec 13, 2015 4:52 am wrote:
stickdog99 » Sun Dec 13, 2015 3:34 am wrote:
Nordic » 13 Dec 2015 04:39 wrote:It seems to me that these things are happening more and more often. And that the real perps are getting sloppy. It's like the sophomore album from a band or a successful TV show when the creators start to get a little bored.

This one had a lot of loose ends. People noticed. People who aren't at all in the "conspiracy community" (a term I hate but it's useful so you know what I'm talking about).
Who noticed?
People I know, at work and on Facebook. When I work these days I'm really surprised how many people he come around. But then again we're not exactly a cross section of America, perhaps because we're all in the business of creating media that people swallow. But I noticed several people on FB sharing the eyewitness story about the three male shooters and asking basically "wtf" and talking about how things were just weird and not adding up.

Clearly you are part of an especially fucked up conspiracist tribe

Posted: **Sun Dec 13, 2015 2:18 pm**

slomo » Sun Dec 13, 2015 3:52 am wrote:
Wombaticus Rex » 12 Dec 2015 08:42 wrote:
divideandconquer » Sat Dec 12, 2015 9:43 am wrote:By now shouldn't we know what's going on? Get the big picture and let it go. The details do not matter because we'll never solve it.
That kind "LOL GUYS GIVE UP C'MON" shit is baffling here.

Why are you here?
I got burned in the whole 9/11 truth BS. Then Sandy Hook and that bottomless pit of conjecture just sealed it for me.

Sealed what, exactly?

Obviously the media narrative is entirely fake, but it's impossible to ever know what the real truth is.

You've just contradicted yourself. If the media narrative is "obviously" fake, then that proves that we can, very often, know the truth. E.g. we know that we are being sold a fake narrative, in this case (yet again) about a mass murder used as a casus belli. We can pretend not to know it, and we can also decide (on the basis of that knowing pretence) not to act on that knowledge. But that is a very different issue, one that is well worth talking about.

it's impossible to ever know what the real truth is

That is a deeply comforting untruth, and people only ever state it when it's prudent or convenient for them to do so. They never doubt, for example, that it's possible to know whether their salary has in fact been transferred to their bank account this month, or to know whether a red light really does mean "stop", or to know whether the wine in their glass is not in fact mercury.

It will drive you crazy trying. It's like that Keel/Leek character in Mothman Prophecies:

Leek: In the end it all came down to just one simple question. Which was more important - having proof, or being alive? Trust me. I turned away years ago, and I've never looked back.
Klein: Didn't you need to know?
Leek: We're not allowed to know.

I don't know why you would insist on muddying the waters by injecting fiction into a discussion of facts, and light entertainment into an examination of real murder and mendacity.

wiki: The Mothman Prophecies is a 2002 American supernatural thriller-horror film

^^We know that movie is a work of fiction, one of the many that America is steeped in.

Why am I here? Why do I keep coming back? I just want some confirmation that other people are experiencing the same acid trip I am.

Sorry, Slomo, but I can't offer you that confirmation. What we are experiencing is neither an acid trip nor a supernatural thriller-horror film. I know this, and so do you.

- tl;dr: The difficulty we are confronted with is not an epistemological difficulty.

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