Alien Abductions and the Monarch Project

[LilyPatToo]

How *exactly* have I "discredited myself"?

Edited to add: I was on my way out the door and checked this thread, only to find that astonishing post by Terry...with whom I cannot recall having any unpleasantness in the past. Yet, according to him I've discredited myself--?!

WTF?!

You'd think that if I had, someone would have called my attention to it immediately. There are some bone-deep mean, hostile, hateful people online and surely one of them would have leapt at the chance to pronounce me "discredited" about 2 nanoseconds after it had happened

LilyPat

PS My story and I stand alone. My defense of other survivors is done from loyalty, empathy and compassion. But when it comes to any credit or discredit I may have, my own story is the only basis upon which my credit should rest.

[Username]

LilyPat,

I'm sorry. I got all caught up in the heat of the moment. This board was getting pretty tense earlier today on various threads and I took a shot at DE through you because...because...because...

(damn), because I haven't got the highest opinion of DE and you keep praising him and his research, and directing people to check out his website and it made me reflect on what he had said to you about your relationship with OSR. So, I used his own words taken from the quotes above to say that, in my eyes, you are discrediting yourself again by standing with him.

Sorry lady, and sorry DE. I really don't know either one of you, and maybe sometimes it would be better if I just troll about in the lounge until I learn the art of blogging.

Peace?
Terry (female)

[Dreams End]

You can just talk to me directly, Terry.

My blog is not a "place for healing". I never said it was and I warn survivors still reeling from their abuse that it may not be the best place to go.

But the information and evidence is there to dispute...blanket rejection of it tells no one anything.

[hanshan]

....


DE - haha - basking in the 25 watt glow of internet/blog
attention - kudos

LPT - re: Greer. As DE has already mentioned Greer
is a huge proponent of TM (meditation), which, to his credit,
I think has helped keep him grounded in the cacaphony
of madness that is the UFO crowd. I don't know him, have
never been to one of his lectures, nor have I heard any
of his CDs. But from reading a couple of his books he seems
earnest, sincere, & he seems to have done his homework -
thoroughly. That said, I'm surprised he's still alive.

Some of the conclusions he draws are misguided,
others are just downright off the mark. I give him the benefit
of the doubt - it's a changling subject. When he's on, he's square
on the mark; his overall thesis, I think, is accurate

Frankly, I think he's a bit naive. Endearingly so.

I don't have the time at the moment to quote from his book
Hidden Truth: Forbidden Kknowledge.
Maybe some time this week.

The last 100 pages or so, he devotes to the wonders of TM.
Not a meditator, so I just have to shuffle over the chapters.
Whatever turns your clock, I guess .



...

[LilyPatToo]

Thanks for clarifying, Terry. I wasn't aware of your opinion of DE, so it was very confusing for a while there. In my own opinion, he's trying to expose a very hidden thing and he cannot allow survivors' potential reactions to what he uncovers to influence him. Took me a bit to figure that out, but now that I have, I fully understand why he stays a bit detached from us. We've been seriously messed-with in ways that might end up compromising his work--entirely without our meaning to do so.

We're unsettling to be around anyway. Right now, on another board, I'm being sniped at by someone I believe I met here...we tend to be attractive to people with a lot of free-floating hostility, I'm beginning to think. Survivors are perceived by them as being "fair game" since our stories are so bizarre and unlikely. Thing is, the sniper is playing off their little tricks on a thread where two very vulnerable people are just now discovering evidence of MC in their lives and that, to me, is un-cool in the extreme.

But it's Life On The Internet, c. 2007. Maybe if DE's and other activists' blogs suceed in waking enough people up to the absolute reality of the programs, online life will change for the better--more posters will come to our defense when we're attacked/invalidated and we'll be listened to with a bit more courtesy. Thing is, we ourselves cannot--dare not--automatically trust our own memories and that will always leave us open to disbelief and derision. It's a tough life, but so is everyone elses' in some way or other. The only sane response is to be assertive, polite and as truthful as we can be and trust that some people out there are listening to us.

LilyPat

edited to add: Just saw your post about Greer, hanshan--thank you. I'm looking forward to being able to have a peek into his book.

[streeb]

Alex Constantine on Martin Cannon, just FYI:

There was a verbal to-do with Martin Cannon, author of the Controllers, that some subscribers to the list may recall. It began when I arranged for the publication of his book. Cannon took a $3,000 advance from Adam Parfrey at Feral House, signed a contract, then reneged, kept the money, and made vague excuses regarding his default on the publishing agreement. When I began to talk and write about Cannon's contractual lapse and general ingratitude, he claimed I'd been "in a mental institution," and "take LSD." Well, neither claim is remotely true. Cannon sought to deflect attention from his theft and dishonesty by smearing me. My only mistake in this affair was recommending the book to Parfrey. Cannon is beneath contempt. I have seen him drive mind control victims to despair, and one nearly to suicide. I have been cleaning up his messes for years. I've collected a fat file from his former associates and mind control victims who have made the error of trusting him. So Cannon's "feud" is with me and a dozen others he has abused.

http://www.konformist.com/2000/alex-constantine.htm

[LilyPatToo]

So Cannon's a schmuck when it comes to personal ethics...well, then he's probably exceptionally well-suited to write on the intelligence community

LilyPat

[streeb]

For sure. I wasn't implying anything about The Controllers itself. I was just trying to fill some holes in the research going on here. If anything, I wonder why Constantine (who I admire very much) didn't cotton to Cannon's nature before he recommended him to Parfrey. At what point did he see him "drive mind control victims to despair"?

[Dreams End]

I'm not a big fan of most of Feral house's work. I actually found Cannon and got an email reply. He was very nice...and said it was personal interactions with folks he could never be sure were telling the truth (even if sincere.) He had slam dunk cases go bad. He did not disavow any of the actual stuff on MKULTRA and was not discouraging of my continuing to look into the topic. However when I wrote again asking for more specific takes on various things...no reply.

[Avalon]

Richard Hoagland and Mike Bara have a book supposedly coming out with Feral House this fall, but a search of the Feral House website does not bring up Hoagland. The title is said to be "Dark Mission – Book One: The Secret History of the National Aeronautics and Space Administration.”

Evidently the Star Trek "Data Head" article they did a while back will be one of the chapters.

It's like watching a train wreck.

[LilyPatToo]

streeb, I admire Constantine too Didn't realize that my tone would come across to you as any sort of criticism--that wasn't how I felt when I typed it. I guess my mood was disgust (with Cannon's actions), mainly. We need more and better emoticons, methinks

As for Cannon, I see so many, many confirmations of his information presented in "The Controllers" in my own story and--especially--in the posts made daily to the abductee boards that I'm unable to reject it. Not even if he himself turns out to be a shill for the Controllers he wrote about.

In that case, my guess at a likely scenario would be that he stumbled upon this highly-classified world as a young journalist and was eventually either "turned" or threatened/coerced into complicity by the sociopaths who run the programs. Just a guess, YMMV.

If I were a Controller and some sharp young man wrote an expose of my operation, I'd do my damnedest to see that it was never published, then give the neophyte muckraker an opportunity to redeem himself by disowning it publically....IF he was seen as being possibly useful in the future. After the deaths of other journalists or operatives who were prying into MC-related fields, to have eliminated Cannon would have been very risky. The last thing the Bad Guys want is a martyr.

LilyPat

[Joe Hillshoist]

Et in Arcadia Ego has a very interesting opinion of Greer and his connections to 2 other individuals with strange POVs, - Bearden and Craddock.

Bearden definitely seems like disinfo, just enough truth wrapped in a lie to keep you hooked. Has v spooky connections too.

[LilyPatToo]

Remember the odd coincidence of them turning out to located at the same address as an *oil company*?! I asked at multiple boards for more info on that, only to be met with deafening silence.

The fringe is so thick with spooks and spook-lovers that it's hard for me to trust anyone at this point. If it were simply that I still believed myself to be an alien abductee, I think that at this point, with what I've learned about the whole UFO field, I'd just throw up my hands in disgust and walk away from the whole infiltrated mess. But now that I know that some of these lying sociopaths literally did their damnedest to wreck my life, I want answers.

LilyPat

[marykmusic]

About Greer:

The last 100 pages or so, he devotes to the wonders of TM.
Not a meditator, so I just have to shuffle over the chapters.
Whatever turns your clock, I guess .

Reminds me of what a former poster here wrote to us not long ago, about people who are "blissed out" being so detached from the world that they're using their highly spiritual state to simply escape from the world. This seems to be a false premise. Escapism instead of activism.

And Lily, yes we do tend to be "a bit unnerving" for others to be around. Too much in-your-face truth, really. Just the vibe alone is hard enough for most folks to handle, even if we don't say anything. And when we do... eee-yow! --MaryK

[LilyPatToo]

This exact subject is being (contentiously) discussed right now at the Unknown Country board, where, unfortunately, I can only link to the Topic List -- http://www.unknowncountry.com/board/index.phtml?winmain=main -- But if you click on the "UFOs, UFOlogy & the Unknown" topic and then on 2 threads--The Contact Experience and When there are witness [sic]--and read at least the past couple of days' posts, you'll see what happens in a True Believer community when a couple of us wake up and smell the coffee and try to talk about it

Try to tell a bunch of terribly damaged people that you think you know who it was who victimized them and you're just asking for tantrums and mass denial. After all, most of them are there because they have reframed what happened to them as being Positive and Spiritual (and also fascinating and scary). Then a disruptive element like Onesmartrat comes to their little New Age oasis and starts talking about mind control programs that utilize implanted memories of alien abduction. And a few people, instead of flaming her, do some research and some searching through their own memories and Bingo! you have a classic confrontation between Belief and rationality.

The thing that keeps me posting there despite the pain is (a) the fact that I like a lot of the people there and (b) the fact that a growing number of them have shown themselves capable of questioning their belief systems and are reporting very similar life histories rife with confusing memories suggestive of exposure to mind control programs.

And another is my own longing to separate the dross from the gold. I still believe that somewhere in the deliberate tangle of lies, obfuscation and fantasy created by the Controllers are genuine truths about the inner nature of man. I suspect that it will be found in the truly other-dimensional experiences that people have had, but as long as the Controllers continue to dabble in social engineering/mind control via New Age/UFO religion, figuring out what is dross and what is gold is going to be very, very tricky.

LilyPat